From Software Dark Souls 3

[Perkel]

One thing that was not in translated from japanese above thing:

Increased the damage of Poison and Toxic dealt by players, and shortened its duration.

poison will be working better ?
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You mean a full year since the launch they made completely useless features like heavy armor and frost slightly less useless?

Even with 1.0 they were never useless nor poise was useless. They simply switched off poise when you do not do anything and it only switches on when you attack with weapon.

Sure.

Those videos are wrong (not stats but assumptions taken from those stats). Poise indeed does matter and damage you receive is A LOT decreased if you actually focus into heavy armors (nor just wear heavy armor but also vitality buildup).

All armors do not give you straight up defense but % of damage reduction. Which means that the harder something hit you the more effective it is. Which automatically means that heavy armors work best on bosses who deal physical damage.

I play almost only heavy armor and great hammer because of how effective it is.

 

[DragoFireheart]

Dodging > Great Shields > Heavy Armor.

 

[Arnust]

Why take 5% less damage when you can just avoid it entirely?

 

[Perkel]

Why take 5% less damage when you can just avoid it entirely?

Why you should avoid damage when you can just force through it ?

I mean this is how i play. Get heavy armor and Greathamer.
Wait for someone to attack --> start your own pancake factory.

I even fatroll everywhere as i don't even use roll as i don't need it (aside from roll slash)

Works super well in both PvE and PvP. Especially in PvP as people are still believe R1 spam is effective.

 

[cvv]

Why take 5% less damage when you can just avoid it entirely?

Why you should avoid damage when you can just force through it ?

I mean this is how i play. Get heavy armor and Greathamer.
Wait for someone to attack --> start your own pancake factory.

I even fatroll everywhere as i don't even use roll as i don't need it (aside from roll slash)

Works super well in both PvE and PvP. Especially in PvP as people are still believe R1 spam is effective.

What SL are you?

 

[Hyperion]

Gotta love the Souls PvP community. DS1 comes, they cry and moan that heavy armor is ridiculously OP and broken because of how much defense and poise it gives. DS2 comes around, it's heavily nerfed but still functional, they still bitch about poise and how OP it is because it's better than their supposed rolll spam, MLG, pixel porn, dick stroking egofest. Fast forward to 2017 and they STILL can't understand why From has made heavy armor into a fucking joke and shadow of its former self. Mind boggling.

Whiny cunts.

 

[Elwro]

I don't know why poise exists as a visible stat in the game and only by experimentation you can learn that it doesn't do anything. And why this hasn't been patched so far... long after the release. The haphazard and kinda random state of DS3 made me return to DS1.

 

[Arnust]

Why take 5% less damage when you can just avoid it entirely?

Why you should avoid damage when you can just force through it ?

I mean this is how i play. Get heavy armor and Greathamer.
Wait for someone to attack --> start your own pancake factory.

I even fatroll everywhere as i don't even use roll as i don't need it (aside from roll slash)

Works super well in both PvE and PvP. Especially in PvP as people are still believe R1 spam is effective.

I know, my favourite build is a Fume UGS uberbadass dude. Feels like an actual Souls game, to count every move you do or else you're boned. That weapon is rich in Hyper Armor, plus its "block frames" not even accounting the maximun poise for that fashion. Doesn't mean that any katana or dual weapon has waay more DPS that this. And goodness me if any buffed weapon will sure match it.

Problem is; you still get stunlocked by rats. By fucking rats. Every time that any puny enemy stuns me first hit, I'm clutching the ragequit button. It just annoys me that wearing 60 units of weight is the same that a dress or some undies for that matter. It may be petty but feels like a kick in the teeth for me, I see Miyazaki's smug face of content every time that shit happens. I had to put down a Havel poster I had becouse now I see him stunned by a breeze of wind (kinda kidding).

 

[sullynathan]

No poise thing started with demons souls, since I'm playing the game now, it opens my eyes to why certain design choices might have been made for the later souls games. Perhaps they were trying to be like demons souls.

 

[Anthedon]

Why take 5% less damage when you can just avoid it entirely?

Why you should avoid damage when you can just force through it ?

I mean this is how i play. Get heavy armor and Greathamer.
Wait for someone to attack --> start your own pancake factory.

I even fatroll everywhere as i don't even use roll as i don't need it (aside from roll slash)

Works super well in both PvE and PvP. Especially in PvP as people are still believe R1 spam is effective.

So heavy armor is actually useful now? I only tried it with the release version and went back to using leather armor pretty quickly.

 

[cvv]

So heavy armor is actually useful now?

If you listen to Perkel then yes. If you listen to someone who made sense at least once in their life then no.

Problem with heavy armor is it mitigates tiny damage for very high stat investment. Basically, as you can see in the video, at SL 120 the difference between Havel's and the Painting Guardian Set is about 60 damage.

The system in DS1 was perfect (after all the balancing and patches), even DS2 was acceptable. DS3 fucked things up because it's a drab, disinterested moneygrabbing shovelware outsourced to god knows who, with Miyazaki's name glued on for more prestige.

 

[Arnust]

If you listen to Perkel then yes. If you listen to someone who made sense at least once in their life then no.

Problem with heavy armor is it mitigates tiny damage for very high stat investment. Basically, as you can see in the video, at SL 120 the difference between Havel's and the Painting Guardian Set is about 60 damage.

The system in DS1 was perfect (after all the balancing and patches), even DS2 was acceptable. DS3 fucked things up because it's a drab, disinterested moneygrabbing shovelware outsourced to god knows who, with Miyazaki's name glued on for more prestige.

Truth is, DS1 armor felt a bit on the too strong side for Endurance being a win-win stat and the brilliance of the FAP/Havel rings made wearing heavy armor a no-brainer unless you were specifically against it or are a very big fan of fastrolls.

I think it was smart to split the stat. Also, upgradeable armor ftw.

 

[cvv]

Truth is, DS1 armor felt a bit on the too strong side for Endurance being a win-win stat and the brilliance of the FAP/Havel rings made wearing heavy armor a no-brainer unless you were specifically against it or are a very big fan of fastrolls.

Who isn't a fan of fastrolls? It's not just fastrolls too, you entire movement is sluggish if over 25% burden, including swings, I found it especially annoying while moving around in PvE. That's why I ultimately ditched my pimped Paladin's Set and went back to the Crimson Set.

 

[Arnust]

Truth is, DS1 armor felt a bit on the too strong side for Endurance being a win-win stat and the brilliance of the FAP/Havel rings made wearing heavy armor a no-brainer unless you were specifically against it or are a very big fan of fastrolls.

Who isn't a fan of fastrolls? It's not just fastrolls too, you entire movement is sluggish if over 25% burden, including swings, I found it especially annoying while moving around in PvE. That's why I ultimately ditched my pimped Paladin's Set and went back to the Crimson Set.

Of course, me too. But minmax wise and for most newcomers, it's a win-win.

 

[Perkel]

So heavy armor is actually useful now? I only tried it with the release version and went back to using leather armor pretty quickly.

yes and it was useful even before poise patch.

Though it requires now skill to work. Unlike before where you just used passively h.armor now you need to change your fighting style to hyper aggressive one and properly utilize heavy attack and catch people by delaying those attacks. You need stop fearing getting hit and use enemy attacks as your change to hit, time your attacks like using pause before you do second light attack etc.

It is entirely different than before where you just YOLO through most of attacks and hit attack button and watch things die.

Heavy armor especially is powerful with FP attacks (which often are not used by people) as those usually get you additional damage reduction (something like additional 20-30%). If you combine it with high poise and high % damage reduction AND high damage output of Greatweapons FP attacks you can easily see that boss attack will be about 40-30% effective (which means low damage), most of the time won't stun you and at the same time you will dish a lot of damage AND you will have a chance to stun boss yourself which means additional damage.

Though like i said this requires skill now and timed attacks.

Naturally you can also be shrieking autist and complain that you can't YOLO anymore in heavy armor.

Problem is; you still get stunlocked by rats. By fucking rats. Every time that any puny enemy stuns me first hit, I'm clutching the ragequit button. It just annoys me that wearing 60 units of weight is the same that a dress or some undies for that matter. It may be petty but feels like a kick in the teeth for me, I see Miyazaki's smug face of content every time that shit happens. I had to put down a Havel poster I had becouse now I see him stunned by a breeze of wind (kinda kidding).

Yeah that is annoying but at the same time you can roll away or attack after second hit like that. I think that they should introduce some brake point like 20 pose where you can't get stunned by rats and lower type of shit. Though i don't remember many places with rats. (2 i think ? )

Why take 5% less damage when you can just avoid it entirely?

Why you should avoid damage when you can just force through it ?

I mean this is how i play. Get heavy armor and Greathamer.
Wait for someone to attack --> start your own pancake factory.

I even fatroll everywhere as i don't even use roll as i don't need it (aside from roll slash)

Works super well in both PvE and PvP. Especially in PvP as people are still believe R1 spam is effective.

What SL are you?

On my Greathammer guy sl100

 

[Perkel]

Why take 5% less damage when you can just avoid it entirely?

Why you should avoid damage when you can just force through it ?

I mean this is how i play. Get heavy armor and Greathamer.
Wait for someone to attack --> start your own pancake factory.

I even fatroll everywhere as i don't even use roll as i don't need it (aside from roll slash)

Works super well in both PvE and PvP. Especially in PvP as people are still believe R1 spam is effective.

What SL are you?

On my Greathammer guy sl100

 

[Perkel]

I don't play DS3 now ( i wait for expansion) but you should try people blessed builds.

I played half year ago and it was hilarious watching people freak out when they can't kill you and run out of their health items and you essentially have infinite health. Works especially well with poison daggers. Though battles last good amount of time.

Though in PvE it isn't that great due to massive amount of bonfires. Blessed would be great in DeS where you had one archstone per level. I wish they would make DeS2 with archstone design intact.

Who isn't a fan of fastrolls? It's not just fastrolls too, you entire movement is sluggish if over 25% burden, including swings, I found it especially annoying while moving around in PvE. That's why I ultimately ditched my pimped Paladin's Set and went back to the Crimson Set.

Comeone. Heavy Armor in DS1 was insane. Just stack poise and you could YOLO everything. Can't be more easy than that.

 

[Elwro]

Based on a few hundred PvP sessions in DS1, the most successful people are certainly not ones wearing heavy armor.

 

[sullynathan]

Based on a few hundred PvP sessions in DS1, the most successful people are certainly not ones wearing heavy armor.

yeah, they were the backstabbers, the hackers, the uber sorcery/miracle builds and the poise stabbers.

 

[Jokzore]

Based on a few hundred PvP sessions in DS1, the most successful people are certainly not ones wearing heavy armor.

yeah, they were the backstabbers, the hackers, the uber sorcery/miracle builds and the poise stabbers.

Don't forget katanas with twice the length and girth of their actual models , hitting you before the animation even finishes and sometimes after you've already dodged it.

 

[Perkel]

Based on a few hundred PvP sessions in DS1, the most successful people are certainly not ones wearing heavy armor.

Well everyone i talked about then generally didn't want to use heavy armor precisely because it was to cheap. Heavy armor and backstabing was broken when you fought with someone who don't use heavy armor.

 

[Elwro]

Actually I just PvP'd in New Londo Ruins. Against a guy in the Havel set; I was wearing the gold-hemmed set with Crown of Dork Sun and Ring of the Sun's Firstborn. 2,5 castings of Wrath of Gods was enough ;-)

Yes, it's just one case of course. But not using heavy armour is definitely viable.

 

[Makabb]

HOLY SHIT didn't know someone is making live action Dark Souls singing

 

[sullynathan]

Heavy armor and backstabing was broken when you fought with someone who don't use heavy armor.

not unless that person was using a 2 handed zweihander, or using the ninja flip ring, or using crystal soul spear

 

[TheHeroOfTime]

The system in DS1 was perfect (after all the balancing and patches).

Armor system in DS is a completely broken mess that even trivialices both PvE and PvP. Summarized, there's no logical reason (Besides Fashion souls of course) for not using full Havel armor with any build. Basically because with the minimum investment of 20 points on stamina, ring of favor and protection + Havel ring you can go full havel and still having mid-roll. Making your character a fucking inamovible damage sponge that can chug estus even in front bosses faces without any risk. Not matter if you're using a mage, or a dex build, or a strengt buidl. Just you go for that armor because as the system works is the better thing you can do with every build. It's ridiculous that in every build that I made recently on DS has ended with having this armor. That's the reason because From started to experiment with the armor and poise system DS2 and beyond. Because the system was broken, memes about it started to happen and they knew it. And now we reached the point where armors are near of being pure cosmetics and with the poise being relegated to hyper armor in some big weapons. Making DS3 the antitesis of DS: There's no fucking reason to use a heavy armor instead of a light armor, specially considering how the game relies more in dodging and having a stamina regn reduction is a negative thing. Because they're incapable of increasing the real defense that heavy armors give, and incapable of setting poise as hyper armor on every weapon but only in the attack animations, with no poise on neutral. Exactly as how Havel mob is in the game.

DS3 armor system being a mess doesn't make DS armor system good. Keep it in mind.