Divinity Divinity: Original Sin - Enhanced Edition

[Grunker]

stuff.

DUDE. The skill system literally almost boils down to "buy extra skill slots or gain linear bonus to X combat stat." It's one of the most creatively devoid systems I've seen. The stats, meanwhile, boil down to four different class stats and then speed and constitution. See earlier AP-discussion for why those are fucked. The talent-system is the only interesting thing in the system, and it is severely limited. As is, there is barely any character customization within the system once you've chosen a path. You rarely spend a stat point and often buy some skill slots. Then once in a blue moon you receive the only interesting choice which is talents, and like I said that choice feels very limited.

All in all, character system is week. The content is awesome - magic/fighting shit feels great to use and all do shit very differently yet surprisingly equally effective - but those abilities could exist in any system really. They're not a function of the pretty boring trifecta of stats, abilities and talents.

EDIT: Actually the most interesting part of the character system is the one that develops during play - the traits.

Embellishing game systems for the sake of pretentiousness

I'm fine arguing about the finer points of D:OS' character system, but bullshit like this won't make the discussion last long for my part. No one here is arguing that D:OS' character system is bad because it's ugly.

 

[Clockwork Knight]

"I am a gamer. I have no time for nonsense."

 

[Nael]

I've been reading steam DOS forum for last two hours. What a retards, can't find shovels, skill books, dungeon entrances, some basic stuff. Now I've got brain cancer :/

 

[Mortmal]

This thing won't ever drop from fist place? Holy shit, how many days in a row?
(Prices in BRL, don't freak out.)

14 days now and there's no competition at all, Big releases are always in october to christmas, nothing in july wich is completely stupid.Publishers still think all gamers are kids waiting for christmas gifts.

 

[Raghar]

Publishers think people are on vacation in summer, and are swimming, or trying to catch exotic diseases in Thailand.

 

[Clockwork Knight]

14 days now and there's no competition at all, Big releases are always in october to christmas, nothing in july wich is completely stupid.Publishers still think all gamers are kids waiting for christmas gifts.

It's also partly because that's about the time of the year people have money on hand that they are willing to spend in silly things, since that's the proper and american thing to do. Only problem is that then you have to compete against tons of releases.

Those other games on that top chart are the ones currently on weekend sale / free weekend / ever popular multiplayer FPS, though. Means that DOS is doing really well.

 

[Nael]

stuff.

DUDE. The skill system literally almost boils down to "buy extra skill slots or gain linear bonus to X combat stat." It's one of the most creatively devoid systems I've seen. The stats, meanwhile, boil down to four different class stats and then speed and constitution. See earlier AP-discussion for why those are fucked. The talent-system is the only interesting thing in the system, and it is severely limited. As is, there is barely any character customization within the system once you've chosen a path. You rarely spend a stat point and often buy some skill slots. Then once in a blue moon you receive the only interesting choice which is talents, and like I said that choice feels very limited.

I'm the other way around. Most of the time I just hoard my skill points to max out one or two that I like. I completely agree on the talents though. There needs to be far more and better choices. Hell, it seems that about 75% of them have some sort of negative aspect to them that makes them not worth picking up. And Leech is stupidly overpowered. It almost makes 0 sense to not pick it unless you are lactose intolerant.

 

[Loriac]

stuff.

DUDE. The skill system literally almost boils down to "buy extra skill slots or gain linear bonus to X combat stat." It's one of the most creatively devoid systems I've seen. The stats, meanwhile, boil down to four different class stats and then speed and constitution. See earlier AP-discussion for why those are fucked. The talent-system is the only interesting thing in the system, and it is severely limited. As is, there is barely any character customization within the system once you've chosen a path. You rarely spend a stat point and often buy some skill slots. Then once in a blue moon you receive the only interesting choice which is talents, and like I said that choice feels very limited.

All in all, character system is week. The content is awesome - magic/fighting shit feels great to use and all do shit very differently yet surprisingly equally effective - but those abilities could exist in any system really. They're not a function of the pretty boring trifecta of stats, abilities and talents.

EDIT: Actually the most interesting part of the character system is the one that develops during play - the traits.

Ok, turning this around slightly, what would a more 'creative' character system open up in the game? The combat is based around the skills and talents with stats having some impact on e.g. chance to hit but nothing you can't otherwise work around. Its not clear to me if you'd gain anything extra from a more elaborate character system.

I think if the game was more plot-driven and character action-reliant, and had more choices-and-consequences gameplay, then a character system that opened up more in the way of social skills, a better way of conflict resolution etc would make sense. But given the context of the game, my argument would be that a more expanded character system might be overengineered. This is a tricky one to argue however, as I'm naturally someone drawn to more complexity rather than less, but I think you have to look at what the system does in the context of the game rather than treat it independently.

An example which I hate to bring up but which I think does (unfortunately) illustrate this is the Skyrim system. Under every measure you compare it with Oblivion, the Skyrim system simply works better for the game that it is. That isn't to say that its a great system in its own right, but it works for its intended purpose.

Embellishing game systems for the sake of pretentiousness

I'm fine arguing about the finer points of D:OS' character system, but bullshit like this won't make the discussion last long for my part. No one here is arguing that D:OS' character system is bad because it's ugly.

Ok, perhaps I could have phrased that differently, but I think your argument is in danger of boiling down to 'the DOS system is bad because its ugly' - its a functional system with no real style as such, but it gets the job done in the context of the combat system it enables.

 

[Onholyservicebound]

dead characters get no exp, which is fucking retarded.

Would you learn something if you are dead?

Kill yourself simulationist scum. Besides, you should get experience from doing the majority of damage to an enemy and taking all the blows you did shouldn't you?

But seriously, it's just a retarded game mechanic, what exactly is it supposed to achieve? It could be useful for preventing people from sacrificing characters, but I don't really see that as worthwhile. Anyway the workaround is just refraining from that final hit on enemies, I just wait a turn and res my companion then do it. Nothing of value was added by that, it was just retarded, just like whoever came up with that idea.

 

[Zorba the Hutt]

By "flop" I meant "be bad."

Oh, even then I said it'd probably have okay content with bad systems.

Yes, Roguey has actually been surprisingly supportive of this game from the very beginning (by his standards anyway).

[quick search of Roguey posts in DOS thread]

Larian should listen to me if they want to make a good RPG instead of a SPG (shit playing game).

You guys are getting way too excited for another generic-looking two-character "party"and cooldown- (I see those clock-wise-timers on the hotbar) based fantasy thing.

He withdrew his pledge before the campaign ended. Obviously saw the major, major problems Larian has when it comes to making fun games. The smart money knew when to back out, but I'm going to stick with this ship right through the iceberg for the laughs.

Man, there's just no way you're not going to love these guys if you're following their Kickstarter endeavor.

I dislike them but I'm buying their stupid game anyway.

If a Larian game saved your life you might as well kill yourself for being so worthless.

NPC schedules are gaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay-as-a-pejorative. I hope it blows up in their faces.

tl:dr version of why roguey hates D:OS?

hoverdog got it mostly right. It doesn't look like something Josh would make which is pretty much how I'm judging things these days. Joshliness is next to Godliness.

I'd be thrilled if they end up blacklisting it like retailers did with Beyonce's last album, but I doubt the reaction will be that extreme.

I'm expecting obnoxiousness from Larian, given their track record of doing things well.

I feel like they're being bad deliberately out of some sense of stubbornness and willful ignorance. Josh Sawyer has given two GDC talks about makin' RPGs, there's no excuse not to know about them if you're a RPG developer. So I become hostile because of my imagination.

10 points for persistence, but Larian are indeed fortunate that Roguey was looking forward to the content.

 

[Xeon]

But seriously, it's just a retarded game mechanic, what exactly is it supposed to achieve? It could be useful for preventing people from sacrificing characters, but I don't really see that as worthwhile. Anyway the workaround is just refraining from that final hit on enemies, I just wait a turn and res my companion then do it. Nothing of value was added by that, it was just retarded, just like whoever came up with that idea.

Don't most games do this? IIRC most CRPG that I have played makes it whomever gets killed dies most times permanently. NWN2 and probably NWN1 I think kinda made it if someone dies you get their share of the exp added to the ones remaining. JRPG also prevent the dead from receiving any exp IIRC.

 

[kris]

Publishers think people are on vacation in summer, and are swimming, or trying to catch exotic diseases in Thailand.

At least over where I live everyone go to Thailand in winter.

 

[RK47]

Welp. I'm done.
Post Cyseal the quality is just not there for co-op.
I can't be arsed to push on - sorry.
But for the $20 - Cyseal was worth it.
The drop in quality after the first area and my continued inability to 'follow the story' in co-op has evaporated the last drop of 'give a fuck' from my vial of patience.
I literally didn't care for the world.
I walk into Silverglen.
Talk to some guy in church. Answered questions and he was LIKE COME TO MY INITIATION BROTHA.
Walk into tavern. saw Hiver. HAHAHAHA SO FUNNY CODEX INSIDE JOKE.
Walk to smithy. Broseph start opening chests, looting stuff - opened a door, suddenly the smithy wanted to kill us.
I applaud your brilliant deduction skill that a trespass is worth risking your life over two armed source hunters.
Killed them and wondered wtf just happened.
10 Legionnares appeared outside store, unable to arrest, cause I murdered their jailers in Cyseal.
Brilliantly executed.
We went south, desperately looking for something to do , cause lvl 14 spiders up north was 30% to hit for me while Broseph can land all his spells with no problems whatsoever. That is balance. Truly. We can tank it with our own spider cause it's shooting blind and venom (both immune btw) over and over like a retard, but why bother wasting our time? It wasn't fun.

Then suddenly there was a riddle taking place off screne with the HUGE WAITING FOR OTHER PLAYER RESPONSE COVERING THE WHOLE RIDDLE SO I HAVE NO CONTEXT OF WTF IS GOING ON WITH THE GAME.

Do I really know the answer to a question I don't even know.
You don't know what you know you don't really know brah.
:plinkett:

I think I wasted 2 hour in that session. Like a Sim in Sims 3 I look at my fun meter. It's beyond red. It's DEEP red.
I'm not having fun at all.
And with that, I just walk into a trap, blew myself up and told Broseph this is the last co-op session. Adios buddy.
It wasn't your fault.
I just didn't care anymore.
Now, back to watching EVO2014 Top 8s

 

[Raghar]

Publishers think people are on vacation in summer, and are swimming, or trying to catch exotic diseases in Thailand.

At least over where I live everyone go to Thailand in winter.

Why not Canards, or Greece? It's much closer and Greek food is edible.

 

[Cadmus]

So guys has this been patched properly? Should I get it or wait more?

 

[Commissar Draco]

So guys has this been patched properly? Should I get it or wait more?

Wait for naked patches Loot and balance Mods Comrade but game is playable as it is.

 

[Raghar]

Can you imagine how easy would it be with selectable loot?

Better than reloading a chest opening cause all you got for beating a boss are vendor trash.

So first you are reloading before you open chest, and then you quit the game...

 

[Drowed]

Wait for naked patches

http://www.nexusmods.com/divinityoriginalsin/mods/2/?

No need to wait. (Holy shit, internet.)

 

[Excidium]

Still got some ways to go but updated my journal

So guys has this been patched properly? Should I get it or wait more?

Player AI and new companions will be patched in august I think

 

[Raghar]

Actually I have a question. Were there any non-white characters in DD? And what about D2?

Player AI and new companions will be patched in august I think

New companions are useless when you will not have 5 member - each lone wolf party.

 

[Shadowfang]

So guys has this been patched properly? Should I get it or wait more?

I sincerely advise you to try it before you play, if you have not already.
While i was waiting for the gog release i didn't remove it from the inventory to try it first.

I wanted to like it, i forced myself to keep going because i would get better latter but it never did.
Character creation is bland, i didn't care about the world or the story and, funny thing, neither did the devs.
The only thing i enjoyed was the elemental synergies but i bet that will wear off soon.

Scarlet casts rain
Zombie is now wet
Scarlet casts lightning bolt
Its super effective.

I simpatized with larian, since i enjoyed DD, which i find superior to D:OS in everything but the combat.
I am happy that they are selling well, good for them really, but i am even happier that i get to keep my money.

 

[Cadmus]

So guys has this been patched properly? Should I get it or wait more?

I sincerely advise you to try it before you play, if you have not already.
While i was waiting for the gog release i didn't remove it from the inventory to try it first.

I wanted to like it, i forced myself to keep going because i would get better latter but it never did.
Character creation is bland, i didn't care about the world or the story and, funny thing, neither did the devs.
The only thing i enjoyed was the elemental synergies but i bet that will wear off soon.

Scarlet casts rain
Zombie is now wet
Scarlet casts lightning bolt
Its super effective.

I simpatized with larian, since i enjoyed DD, which i find superior to D:OS in everything but the combat.
I am happy that they are selling well, good for them really, but i am even happier that i get to keep my money.

Thanks! I liked Div2 and DD so I think I'll be fine.

Still got some ways to go but updated my journal

So guys has this been patched properly? Should I get it or wait more?

Player AI and new companions will be patched in august I think

What do you mean player AI? I thought the 2nd character is played by the computer (or yourself? I have no idea) if youre not in coop. Is that correct? Or are they actually just now giving it an AI?

 

[Excidium]

Player AI and new companions will be patched in august I think

What do you mean player AI? I thought the 2nd character is played by the computer (or yourself? I have no idea) if youre not in coop. Is that correct? Or are they actually just now giving it an AI?

It's for the co-op dialogue in single player. The new AI will have personalities, right now all you can do is have the character always agree (Loyal), pick choices randomly (Random) or be completely under your control (No AI)

 

[Commissar Draco]

There's AI for dialogues but you play as 2-4 People party unlike Fallouts.

 

[Cadmus]

Player AI and new companions will be patched in august I think

What do you mean player AI? I thought the 2nd character is played by the computer (or yourself? I have no idea) if youre not in coop. Is that correct? Or are they actually just now giving it an AI?

It's for the co-op dialogue in single player. The new AI will have personalities, right now all you can do is have the character always agree (Loyal), pick choices randomly (Random) or be completely under your control (No AI)

Ah I see, that's a pity. Does it have direct LAN or do I have to multiplay through some server/Steam?
So if I understand correctly, I control everyone's actions just like in for example Icewind Dale, right? And in SP I'll lose the attribute driven arguing in dialogues.