Dragon Age Dragon Age: The Veilguard Pre-Release Thread [GAME RELEASED, GO TO NEW THREAD]

[Zeriel]

Male characters weren't hot in DA:I though. They were like weird pastiches of gay porn cliches.

Not sure what you're talking about. Cullen is conventionally gorgeous, Dorian is good looking too if you can get past the moustache.

Bro I'm sorry to do this to you but your heterosexual card is revoked.

 

[Nano]

Matt's direction is what brought us things like this, so maybe it's for the best.

 

[whydoibother]

Probably this dude will be the new lead:



Looks a bit like an alt-right caricature of what liberals are. He produced the Solas stuff though, which was nice.

Matt's direction is what brought us things like this, so maybe it's for the best.

But also the tarot cards aesthetic and interface, which I liked.

 

[Nano]

But also the tarot cards aesthetic and interface, which I liked.

But also Sera and Cassandra's faces, which are horrible.

 

[whydoibother]

But also the tarot cards aesthetic and interface, which I liked.

But also Sera and Cassandra's faces, which are horrible.

He was going for something artsy with Cassandra

Questionable results, but I didn't hate it in game. Sera I hated both visually, voice, and character. Some attempt at a mischievous forest spirit Puck thing or whatever, but failed, because it wasn't a lovable goof. Just an annoying autist.

 

[Maxie]

But also the tarot cards aesthetic and interface, which I liked.

But also Sera and Cassandra's faces, which are horrible.

He was going for something artsy with Cassandra

Questionable results, but I didn't hate it in game. Sera I hated both visually, voice, and character. Some attempt at a mischievous forest spirit Puck thing or whatever, but failed, because it wasn't a lovable goof. Just an annoying autist.

I suspect he was simply told by the board that his target audience desires unconventional portrayal of women in media, which in his mind translated directly into making the character look starkly mannish

 

[whydoibother]

I suspect he was simply told by the board that his target audience desires unconventional portrayal of women in media, which in his mind translated directly into making the character look starkly mannish

I think the goal wasn't to make Cassandra look like a dude. That was a side effect, and the actual goal was this geometric shapes wankery.
Knowing artistic people, he probably saw a YouTube video or read a blog post about this art style, and really wanted to do something with it, and ended up using it in a place it didn't necessarily fit. Some of the other characters also have very sharp faces, like Varric. It just looks less dumb on him, because we are already used to the trapezoid chin Uberchad from comics and cartoons.

 

[BruceVC]

Matt Goldman, Dragon Age's Senior Creative Director, Has Left BioWare

His departure was announced earlier today in an email sent to staff by BioWare studio GM Gary McKay:

Hi everyone,

I hope you are well. I’m writing to inform you all that Matt Goldman is leaving BioWare. We have mutually agreed to part ways, and his last day is today.

We understand that Matt’s departure has an impact on you, as well as the game’s development. Rest assured our commitment to a high-quality Dragon Age game has not waivered, and we will not ship a game that is not up to BioWare’s standards.

We, including EA’s executive team, have absolute confidence in the leadership here at the studio and the people working on this game to carry forward our vision.

Goldman first joined BioWare in 1998, and worked as an artist on everything from Baldur’s Gate to Jade Empire to the first few Dragon Age games. After a brief stint at Ensemble, where he worked on Halo Wars, in 2017 he took over as senior creative director on Dragon Age 4 after early work on the sequel was thrown out and the game’s direction rebooted.

https://kotaku.com/dragon-ages-senior-creative-director-has-left-bioware-1848114644

Its a relevant post but I am still confident we will see DA4 which I am excited about . People can leave a company....all companies need to be bigger and more sustainable than individuals and if people leave then the company must be able to continue with its vision and direction or its not a real company. For example Bioware must hire someone else to do the job of the person leaving because its not like there isn't talent out their ?

 

[whydoibother]

He was the art director for DA4, and the game has been in production for a while. His job on this project was done, and he left the company rather than starting on a new project.
So they don't need to replace him in a hurry, not for DA4 anyways. Maybe for whatever is their next game.

 

[BruceVC]

I suspect he was simply told by the board that his target audience desires unconventional portrayal of women in media, which in his mind translated directly into making the character look starkly mannish

I think the goal wasn't to make Cassandra look like a dude. That was a side effect, and the actual goal was this geometric shapes wankery.
Knowing artistic people, he probably saw a YouTube video or read a blog post about this art style, and really wanted to do something with it, and ended up using it in a place it didn't necessarily fit. Some of the other characters also have very sharp faces, like Varric. It just looks less dumb on him, because we are already used to the trapezoid chin Uberchad from comics and cartoons.

As long as we get beautiful female characters Im happy .Like Isabella, Morganna or Viconia....I just have an issue with the view " hot and attractive women somehow is offensive and objectifies women " ...we dont need anymore SJWism than we already have in Bioware games

 

[Wunderbar]

He was the art director for DA4

the article says he was a creative director.

 

[whydoibother]

He was the art director for DA4

the article says he was a creative director.

His website has a list of what he does:

You are right, its not just concept art. But half of it is stuff you do at the start of a project, and the other half is being a nanny. I still think that most of his work on this project would've been done already, creatives (other than texture and model monkeys) have their work frontloaded.

 

[Volourn]

I remember when BIO/Gaider claimed that DA was SO hardcore that ressurection was a no go no matter what, and once a character died they died.

The other posts in this thread about Lariana (or whatever her name) prvoes that was bullshit. Gaider's approach is likely trying to sound like he is being a creative bad ass standing by his creative decisions but comes across as,"We wanna and we don't care if it means all that other work we did no longer matters."

The thing I hate the most is when creators/developers/writes/caretakers (for those series taken over by others) don't care about what came before, don't care about timelines, don't care about that.

If you ain't gonna give a shit about the material (be it game, movie, book whether it is a remake, a continuation, reboot or whatever other bullshit term you come with), WHY THE FUKK SHOULD ANYONE ELSE!?!


DA2 was not perfect, and it changed some things, but DA3 went ridiculous over the top until its existence not only mocked people who played it, it mocked the actual material.


LMAO

 

[Nano]

Didn't Inquisition have SJW journalists acting as "consultants" for the dev team? I remember reading something about that.

 

[Cael]

Imagine needing journalists to be consultants. What did they consult about? How to lie?

 

[Zeriel]

But also the tarot cards aesthetic and interface, which I liked.

But also Sera and Cassandra's faces, which are horrible.

He was going for something artsy with Cassandra

Questionable results, but I didn't hate it in game. Sera I hated both visually, voice, and character. Some attempt at a mischievous forest spirit Puck thing or whatever, but failed, because it wasn't a lovable goof. Just an annoying autist.

A fundamental mistake with a lot of these "woke" characters is they have the confident, swaggering manners of someone who knows they are sexy--while not being sexy. It's like some fat slob wandering into a bar, picking fights, hitting on girls, all while seeming completely unaware that he is a repulsive outsider.

A lot of these characters would work better if not for the aggressive signalling of the visual style, but then they wouldn't be in the game at all if it didn't check those boxes, so...

Matt Goldman, Dragon Age's Senior Creative Director, Has Left BioWare

His departure was announced earlier today in an email sent to staff by BioWare studio GM Gary McKay:

Hi everyone,

I hope you are well. I’m writing to inform you all that Matt Goldman is leaving BioWare. We have mutually agreed to part ways, and his last day is today.

We understand that Matt’s departure has an impact on you, as well as the game’s development. Rest assured our commitment to a high-quality Dragon Age game has not waivered, and we will not ship a game that is not up to BioWare’s standards.

We, including EA’s executive team, have absolute confidence in the leadership here at the studio and the people working on this game to carry forward our vision.

Goldman first joined BioWare in 1998, and worked as an artist on everything from Baldur’s Gate to Jade Empire to the first few Dragon Age games. After a brief stint at Ensemble, where he worked on Halo Wars, in 2017 he took over as senior creative director on Dragon Age 4 after early work on the sequel was thrown out and the game’s direction rebooted.

https://kotaku.com/dragon-ages-senior-creative-director-has-left-bioware-1848114644

Its a relevant post but I am still confident we will see DA4 which I am excited about . People can leave a company....all companies need to be bigger and more sustainable than individuals and if people leave then the company must be able to continue with its vision and direction or its not a real company. For example Bioware must hire someone else to do the job of the person leaving because its not like there isn't talent out their ?

If you have any hopes for DA4 you're too dumb to live. It's going to be riddled with EA-mandated "live service" concessions. Basically anything in DA:I that came across as mandated corporate attempts to chase trends and make money, like the MMO/Skyrim-style zones, the tacked-on multiplayer with RMT, etc, expect all of that to be 10x more prevalent. On top of that, it'll be even more along the woke spectrum.

I guess if your favorite parts of DA:I were the virtue signalling and a guy in a suit rifling through your pockets you should be excited, but if you liked the parts of the game that were still vaguely reminscient of old Bioware you shouldn't be excited.

 

[whydoibother]

A fundamental mistake with a lot of these "woke" characters is they have the confident, swaggering manners of someone who knows they are sexy--while not being sexy. It's like some fat slob wandering into a bar, picking fights, hitting on girls, all while seeming completely unaware that he is a repulsive outsider.

I don't know if you've played the game you are criticizing here, but the character in the image is specifically made out to be shy and insecure, and outwardly projecting strength to cope. Cassandra isn't swaggering and knowing she's sexy or whatever, that has nothing to do with the character, and you are projecting pretty hard, my dude.

Anyways, to get back on topic, this guy apparently doesn't work at Bioware anymore. He was one of the people posting on social media that Dragon Age 4 is being worked on, progress is being made, etc.

 

[Zeriel]

A fundamental mistake with a lot of these "woke" characters is they have the confident, swaggering manners of someone who knows they are sexy--while not being sexy. It's like some fat slob wandering into a bar, picking fights, hitting on girls, all while seeming completely unaware that he is a repulsive outsider.

I don't know if you've played the game you are criticizing here, but the character in the image is specifically made out to be shy and insecure, and outwardly projecting strength to cope. Cassandra isn't swaggering and knowing she's sexy or whatever, that has nothing to do with the character, and you are projecting pretty hard, my dude.

Anyways, to get back on topic, this guy apparently doesn't work at Bioware anymore. He was one of the people posting on social media that Dragon Age 4 is being worked on, progress is being made, etc.

I've played every Bioware game, including DA:I. I'm speaking from experience. If you don't see it that way it's fine, but these characters don't come across pleasantly.

For what it's worth I wasn't talking about Cassandra. I think she's the least offensive character in DA:I (and was a holdover from DA2).

 

[whydoibother]

If you don't see it that way it's fine, but these characters don't come across pleasantly.

See it what way? The portrayal of Cassandra you wrote is literally the opposite of her character in the game. If you see it that way, go get your eyes checked.
And yes, some characters come off as very unpleasant. For some it may be intentional, but for others (notably Sera) they were clearly meant to be likable, and just failed. I am not saying all characters are great, etc, I am saying your post is garbage. The thing you wrote just isn't the thing that's in the game.

 

[Zeriel]

Yes, that's exactly what I was saying. I was referring to Sera, because she's characterized that way, and is the one being named there. But I feel the same goes for almost every new character in DA:I (which Cassandra isn't). Dorian, Iron Bull, all the dumb french characters, etc, they all come across in that "witty" "I am too cool for you, but also you must love me" standoffish way.

 

[whydoibother]

I was referring to Sera

Alright, I thought you meant Cassandra, since its a picture of her in the post you quoted. Sera is (I think) an attempt at a childish playful woodland spirit or something, like a Peter Pan, and not a sexy femme fatale. I haven't played with her character much, because I dislike everything about her presentation and writing, but she does come off as a spoiled child more than as a girlboss trope. Dorian is just an old fashioned flamboyant fruit queer trope, you can find the same character in 1960s movies. Iron Bull is just a bad power fantasy, the kind of character your friends bring to a D&D campaign. I dislike all three, but not for the same reasons, and I am not sure its the same people who designed and wrote them all.

 

[Zeriel]

The commonality I see with this kind of character in recent games (and it is a problem in DA:I) too, is there is very rarely a choice to tell them their shit stinks. Most of the choices are positive. DA:I has some snarky sarcastic responses occasionally thrown in there, but there's no "fuck up their relationship beyond all repair" choice, or, to go even further, the arch example in original Dragon Age of killing Leliana. Ironically, they partially retcon that in DA:I to being... she was killed, but somehow, miraculously, she's fine. It's the hand of the writer coming down and saying, "No that was a wrong choice, this character is too special to be treated this way."

More broadly that's my issue whenever these characters pop up in other games, it's a huge dissonance and narrative break when suddenly all your replies are polite and nice to this one character, whereas with some other NPC that isn't the case, and the genre's whole selling point is often the different and sometimes awful choices you can make in interacting with people.

 

[Camel]

That won't stop them from making the next game's characters intentionally ugly.

Only the female characters. Male characters will probably still be hot.

Will they be able to top this?

Do BioWare even have any good writers left?

 

[Ryzer]

 

[thesoup]

Bioware was always shit.