From Software Elden Ring - From Software's new game with writing by GRRM

[mediocrepoet]

If those attacks had connected, he'd be posting the same shit bitching about how From made bosses kill him for making contact with his big toe.

No, because as I stated, I never tried jumping any of that shit. It looks ridiculous- 4 feet off the ground is not a fucking 'low sweep' and I'm not autistic enough to try jumping over hundreds of different fucking attacks to see which ones have crap hitboxes. Or look it up online to pretend I figured it out myself. OTOH, I'm sure you'd be defending it either way. Who cares if a crucible knight just rammed his entire body through your guts? You can barely even notice because of all the particle effects and the fact he was moving at Mach 7.

Yep, that's me and not a figment of your butthurt imagination spraying all over the entire thread.

 

[Ravielsk]

I think it's a petty nitpick.

Then you are simply wrong.
A mechanic that the dev expects the player to consistently use needs consistent feedback. It could be visual or auditory but it has to be there and it has to be consistent. The only reason you know that the lower half of your body is disabled it because the community quite literary hacked the game to see what this is happening and how it actually works.

With any other game this is simply unacceptable and clearly deemed to be bullshit. The only reason why Fromstans like you get to larp that this is not a problem is because of how hard to community carries this mangled mess of mechanics with its guides. The fact that there are multiple YT videos(each with 1mil.+ views) explaining how a mechanic that is supposed to be a normal part of your moveset alone is proof enough that something here isn't in order.

 

[Lyric Suite]

Guides lmao.

Nothing proves that this is just a skill issue you guys are having than this idea there's no way to figure this stuff out without guides.

News flash, i never used a guide in all the years i've been playing FromSoft games with the exception of Malenia's Waterfowl.

It's one of the reasons i don't follow any of the big players, including Ongbal whom i almost never watch precisely because i want to figure this stuff out on my own.

Yet, somehow, i never had an issue understanding attacks or figure out counters. It's almost like all the problems you are having are completely imaginary.

 

[ferratilis]

Says the guy who couldn't beat Radahn pre-nerf.

 

[Lyric Suite]

I'm actually living proof that the lady doth protest a bit too much here.

After all, i'm just some random boomer on some obscure forum. If i can do it, it cannot possibly be that hard. The "git gud" meme exists for a reason, because you can actually get good.

 

[Ravielsk]

Nothing proves that this is just a skill issue you guys are having than this idea there's no way to figure this stuff out without guides.

Well Lyric obviously it has to be possible to figure out for a guide to be written. The problem is how much and what kind of effort needs to go into said "figuring out". If the game literary needs to be hacked for the community to confirm how the jump mechanic works then how is it reasonable to expect the player to know this?
This is yet again that From software double standard where for example Skyrim is shit because it does not tell you axes apply a bleed DoT but when elden ring does not bother explaining how jump as a dodge mechanic works that is OK. Just because something is possible that does not make it a good design decision and simultaneously you do not need to suck at a game to notice its problems.

i never used a guide

Blatant lie as you would otherwise have no idea that the jump disables the players lower body.

 

[Lyric Suite]

If the game literary needs to be hacked for the community to confirm how the jump mechanic works

We don't need to know how the mechanic works under the hood to understand how it functions in the game and how to use it.

Blatant lie as you would otherwise have no idea that the jump disables the players lower body.

I mean i never consulted a guide to tell me how the boss moveset. Nobody cares about the technical stuff. I think i saw a video once where it mentioned how the jump mechanic works right on the thumbnail. Didn't bother watching the actual video as i didn't particularly care. It's not even that useful as a piece of knowledge.

 

[Damned Registrations]

I absolutely give a shit about the technical stuff. It's the particulars of whether or not standing at 6 meters away, 12 degrees 16 minutes SSW of the tree nearest the boss' spawn point tricks it into whiffing every attack for 30 seconds so you can plow it in the ass without a real fight that I don't give a shit about. I play games to engage with them, to figure things out on the fly by applying general knowledge to emergent situations. You can't do that if you're effectively blindfolded because the mechanics are are black box of retardation. If I've finished a boss off by doing the exact same shit that worked (or didn't work) the last time, I've already lost all interest in it, because a fucking script could do the same thing. Paint by numbers doesn't become some sort of grand intellectual pursuit if instead of the book telling you what paint to use it just erases what you've done until you guess correctly. Especially when it insists the sky is orange and changes it's mind every 10 minutes.

The taurus demon in DS1 has an attack that is bugged. When it slams the axe down, the extra large hitbox it creates is delayed. It functionally creates an invisible, silent explosion a quarter second later than the position of the weapon, the sound effects, and the dust cloud would all indicate. You can figure out how to kill the boss by hugging it's crotch, dodging late and staying well away from the janky ass axe (or various other means) but you'll never understand why you're doing the things you're doing until someone hacks the game years later and shows you that a programmer fucked up while entering timings on hitboxes.

 

[Lyric Suite]

Never needed to know any of that shit myself. I just relied on instinct and i pretty much learned everything "on the fly", as you say, and it has worked for me perfectly fine until now, and i've been play FromSoft games for over 10 years i think.

I still don't even see how knowing any of that actually helps anyway. If you are a pitcher in a baseball game, do you suppose knowing the science behind the forces involved in making the ball travel the distance help you make better throws?

Once you experience something in the game, you basically already "know" all there is to know. Learning about what's going on under the hood just seems like a pointless complication.

 

[Damned Registrations]

You're equating 'I noticed a thing happened so I repeated it' with 'I predicted something would happen and it worked every time.' It's the difference between memorizing answers to a test vs understanding how to create the answers. It looks the same if you only observe the end result, but the process is entirely different.

And yeah, knowing the science behind the forces involved does help a pitcher. Not as much as practice and muscles obviously, but proper throwing technique, diet, and specific exercises are important. So is understanding how to avoid injuries. He may not need to know particle physics, but he certainly needs to be taught many things that he'd never understand through simple practice or experimentation. Things that, for example, a doctor or engineer would be able to figure out through pre existing knowledge that a lawyer would not.

This seems like a fairly simple concept to me. 'What have I got in my pockets?' is not a fair riddle, regardless of the fact that you can figure out the answer after enough guesses and the ability to rule out things too big to fit. In the same way, 'when will this attack hit?' is not a fair gameplay element when the attack has no flow to it and is designed purely as a trap for people reacting to what they see.

 

[Spike]

sounds like a lot of "git gud" syndrome to me idk

 

[Nathir]

You're equating 'I noticed a thing happened so I repeated it' with 'I predicted something would happen and it worked every time.' It's the difference between memorizing answers to a test vs understanding how to create the answers. It looks the same if you only observe the end result, but the process is entirely different.

And yeah, knowing the science behind the forces involved does help a pitcher. Not as much as practice and muscles obviously, but proper throwing technique, diet, and specific exercises are important. So is understanding how to avoid injuries. He may not need to know particle physics, but he certainly needs to be taught many things that he'd never understand through simple practice or experimentation. Things that, for example, a doctor or engineer would be able to figure out through pre existing knowledge that a lawyer would not.

This seems like a fairly simple concept to me. 'What have I got in my pockets?' is not a fair riddle, regardless of the fact that you can figure out the answer after enough guesses and the ability to rule out things too big to fit. In the same way, 'when will this attack hit?' is not a fair gameplay element when the attack has no flow to it and is designed purely as a trap for people reacting to what they see.

95% of attacks have flow to them and can be reacted to by what you see.

 

[Damned Registrations]

You're equating 'I noticed a thing happened so I repeated it' with 'I predicted something would happen and it worked every time.' It's the difference between memorizing answers to a test vs understanding how to create the answers. It looks the same if you only observe the end result, but the process is entirely different.

And yeah, knowing the science behind the forces involved does help a pitcher. Not as much as practice and muscles obviously, but proper throwing technique, diet, and specific exercises are important. So is understanding how to avoid injuries. He may not need to know particle physics, but he certainly needs to be taught many things that he'd never understand through simple practice or experimentation. Things that, for example, a doctor or engineer would be able to figure out through pre existing knowledge that a lawyer would not.

This seems like a fairly simple concept to me. 'What have I got in my pockets?' is not a fair riddle, regardless of the fact that you can figure out the answer after enough guesses and the ability to rule out things too big to fit. In the same way, 'when will this attack hit?' is not a fair gameplay element when the attack has no flow to it and is designed purely as a trap for people reacting to what they see.

95% of attacks have flow to them and can be reacted to by what you see.

If we were talking about DS1 I'd agree. By the time you hit ER it's more like 2/3rds. How many enemies do a leap attack where they inexplicably hang in mid air? Or raise their weapon overhead and pause for some random amount of time before slamming down like a mouse trap on a swivel? Feels like practically all the bosses do that shit.

 

[Lyric Suite]

No, it's true for Elden Ring as well. The only difference between ER and DS1 is that ER is more complex. Still not impossible to just learn and adapt.

 

[abija]

sounds like a lot of "git gud" syndrome to me idk

Not even, just unwarranted elitist attitude and expectance they can pick up any game and instantly be more than decent at it. If it doesn't happen, game does something wrong.

 

[Damned Registrations]

Or maybe we don't like playing Calvinball after being sold on a gritty, believable combat system.

 

[Silverfish]

Or maybe we don't like playing Calvinball after being sold on a gritty, believable combat system.

The real issue is that ER makes the heaviest use of tutorials in series history, but still manages to miss basic information.

 

[Mauman]

Or maybe we don't like playing Calvinball after being sold on a gritty, believable combat system.

I've never played a souls game in my life (not because I didn't want to, the genre just passed me by), and I had very little issue on grasping Elden Ring's systems.

 

[Damned Registrations]

Do tell then. Explain to me what system it is employing that justifies why someone jumping through the air pauses midway? How did you see that coming, exactly?

 

[Odoryuk]

Explain to me what system it is employing that justifies why someone jumping through the air pauses midway?

 

[ERYFKRAD]

Do tell then. Explain to me what system it is employing that justifies why someone jumping through the air pauses midway? How did you see that coming, exactly?

Bruh they hitting the npc glass ceiling