Incline Elminage Gothic (former Japan only dungeon crawler)

[gman42]

Anybody know what kind of Bishop levels are required to start identifying the rarer items as you reach end/post game? I've been using the Bishop in town and have been taking him out to grind levels here and there, currently at level 14 he still gets hit with fear infuriatingly often. I see there's an "Identify Level" column in the item spreadsheet here but not sure about the mechanics of it, I'm sure it's not something like straight-up Bishop level required, but maybe it's the level to guarantee successful ID, like with a certain % chance to fail/touch on each attempt for every level below it?

Might not be a huge deal, as I've done my class changing and splurging on XP purchases, and breaking even on item ID isn't the end of the world. Wouldn't mind being able to grind out some extra gold for a bit longer just so I'm comfortable though.

 

[gman42]

Main game is done.

Took a bunch of tries to beat Cyclanos. I didn't really want to resort to using Miracle to cheese it, but I could never get enough buffs off early on to keep my front row from getting pincushioned by him. Finally the RNG decided to put two rows of enemies in front of him which gave me plenty of time to bring my AC way down and slow the hell out of everybody before he was in range to beat on me. Managed to put him to sleep for two rounds shortly after that, and we were good to go.

I still have the last three floor masters to kill (no summoner so I dgaf about keeping em around), thinking of cleaning them up now so I can do the task that raises rare item drop rate before I start the postgame. Anybody know big the effect is? Like does it put the rare stuff for a given floor right in the same pool as everything else? Or are we talking about raising it from like...1% to 2% or some nonsense. Kinda want to head back to the volcano and try to snag a Muramasa, but not if I still have to farm the bottom floor for hours.

 

[Dorarnae]

didn't know that in gothic you could raise % of rare drop. I thought that was only in elminage 1-2-3 when going new game +. I wouldn't be too concerned, considering you'll need the experience anyway, belial and others will murder you

 

[gman42]

didn't know that in gothic you could raise % of rare drop. I thought that was only in elminage 1-2-3 when going new game +. I wouldn't be too concerned, considering you'll need the experience anyway, belial and others will murder you

Yup, after defeating all main game floor masters, some mysterious dude at the Tavern will give you the key item "Hero's Book of Secrets", then you have to pray at the temple and get a prompt to raise the rare drop rate.

I did a quick run through BF4 of the Volcano, got some Crystal Armor which was new to me, no dice on the Muramasa though (I keep getting that "we have Muramasa at home!" version that's like -10 to hit instead, lol). I know it'll show up later and I think there are eventually even better katanas, so I'll probably just move on.

 

[venneram]

Anybody know what kind of Bishop levels are required to start identifying the rarer items as you reach end/post game?

I think once you hit lvl 32 it happens less often but there's always a chance of getting feared. I used to identify items only if I was close to the elevator.

so I can do the task that raises rare item drop rate before I start the postgame. Anybody know big the effect is?

As far as I can remember, I started to get an insane amount of rare items outside of ibag's, at least half of the items I hauled back home were rare. Cant recall if it has any effect in the tower but its not like you'd normally disable it given the desperate need for items.

In a different topic, did anyone figure out how to use custom portraits with PPSSPP, android ver? I need to replay this game and might as well use fancy portraits since the game apparently supports it.

 

[gman42]

Anybody know what kind of Bishop levels are required to start identifying the rarer items as you reach end/post game?

I think once you hit lvl 32 it happens less often but there's always a chance of getting feared. I used to identify items only if I was close to the elevator.

Yeah I had the town bishop sit in on some Lesser Demon battles and got him up to like 35, he did OK but every identifying session in town was still this stupid dance where he'd have to nap at the inn half a dozen times. By the time I finished Soldier of the Giant Gods, I finally had a reality check and saw that every member of my party was carrying over 1 million GP and realized this was stupid. I just use the shop now.

 

[gman42]

Just bought the Aura Punch on the bottom floor of CotA, didn't realize the default was X (no damage) to all enemy types. So does this mean if I wanna use it as an actual weapon, I have to either cast Harias every battle, or forge it for double damage on whatever monster types I can (which won't be many, that shit costs 15AP each)?

My alchemist in the back was hoping to get in on the fun doing some real damage once in a while, but I guess not.

 

[Dorarnae]

Just bought the Aura Punch on the bottom floor of CotA, didn't realize the default was X (no damage) to all enemy types. So does this mean if I wanna use it as an actual weapon, I have to either cast Harias every battle, or forge it for double damage on whatever monster types I can (which won't be many, that shit costs 15AP each)?

My alchemist in the back was hoping to get in on the fun doing some real damage once in a while, but I guess not.

yeah. its only use is for harvesting ore in the Ibag tower. I think the psp version had a bug where you could use it without losing it? On the 3ds it's a single use so it's pretty much useless.

 

[gman42]

yeah. its only use is for harvesting ore in the Ibag tower. I think the psp version had a bug where you could use it without losing it? On the 3ds it's a single use so it's pretty much useless.

Figured as much, I mean I guess it could be worth forging it to hit a few troublesome enemy types and throwing some status effects on it (since it's pretty much guaranteed to hit 10x), and then save it for specific battles. Right now I have my alchy dual-wielding Thunder God Whips forged for unlimited range, it's not much but the -2AC each is nice.

And yeah I happen to have a Ninja with Replica skill, already confirmed the bug works fine on the PC version. Resisting the urge to totally cheese the game by just filling up the warehouse non-stop until I have a bunch of 50AP ores lol. Although this fucker is hard enough that I might just need that, just hit floor 6 and got introduced to the Archer Polete that makes a pincushion out of my party before I can breathe in the first round.

 

[Grunker]

Considering finally getting around to this, got any opinions on this starting party? I'll be playing with a map mod (decline-rate this post please) but otherwise nothing else:

Werebeast Brawler with Stronghold
Dwarf Valkeryie with Brace
Dragonnewt Thief with Find Treasure (swap for Ninja at some point)
Human Mage (--> Summoner upon gaining Diomente) with Spirit Contract
Gnome Cleric (--> Bishop at some point) with Song of Healing
Human Alchemist (---> Hunter at some point) with Mysterious Bag

 

[Vic]

it doesn't have the Puzzle tag on steam, so I take it there are no puzzles in this game?

 

[Dorateen]

The dungeons themselves are a puzzle, particularly the Ice location, and the one with the blowholes

 

[gman42]

Considering finally getting around to this, got any opinions on this starting party? I'll be playing with a map mod (decline-rate this post please) but otherwise nothing else:

Werebeast Brawler with Stronghold
Dwarf Valkeryie with Brace
Dragonnewt Thief with Find Treasure (swap for Ninja at some point)
Human Mage (--> Summoner upon gaining Diomente) with Spirit Contract
Gnome Cleric (--> Bishop at some point) with Song of Healing
Human Alchemist (---> Hunter at some point) with Mysterious Bag

Not too bad. Couple of things to consider:

--Not having an alchemist for the long run might be tough, forging is super super important for survivability in the late/postgame, and you'll lose your forging abilities completely even though you keep all your alchy casts upon becoming a hunter. I would up doing Alc-->Hunter with one of my back row guys and Mage-->Alc with another, just to keep the forging skill in my party. Having an alchemist in town is a reasonable option, but even then you're gonna want him to be level 26+ for the disassemble skill, otherwise anything you forge onto an item is stuck on there unless you sell it and buy it back (and then the ore is gone). The "high purity synthesis" that makes the ores even stronger than their face value is another nice benefit to an active, leveling alchemist, but just be warned it goes up glacially (like .1-.2% per level).

--Finishing with a Summoner and a Bishop gives you two very squishy guys in your back row that can't wear/wield shit, which will suck late game. I'd strongly consider running the Gnome through other spell schools and then ending as Cleric. They have solid HP, they can wear all the heavy armor you find throughout most of the main game (although not the uber post game stuff), and actually earn extra swings (albeit slowly) unlike Bishops etc., which makes them reasonably useful in combat, wielding a pair of maces or a nice hammer (can forge it for medium range when you eventually park him in the back and put ninja up front). I always used the Bishop in town to identify stuff, although I did have to take him out and level him up occasionally to keep him useful at it.

--I picked Find Treasure for one of my characters and kinda regret it, as it turns out like 90+% of encounters in this game are fixed ones where you get a chest anyway. Having this helps for extra $$ early on, maybe saving up for training donation after class changes, but long term it's not worth it. Of course if you're gonna CC to Ninja you can change your Ex skill to Replica or something else at that point.

 

[Grunker]

Considering finally getting around to this, got any opinions on this starting party? I'll be playing with a map mod (decline-rate this post please) but otherwise nothing else:

Werebeast Brawler with Stronghold
Dwarf Valkeryie with Brace
Dragonnewt Thief with Find Treasure (swap for Ninja at some point)
Human Mage (--> Summoner upon gaining Diomente) with Spirit Contract
Gnome Cleric (--> Bishop at some point) with Song of Healing
Human Alchemist (---> Hunter at some point) with Mysterious Bag

Not too bad. Couple of things to consider:

--Not having an alchemist for the long run might be tough, forging is super super important for survivability in the late/postgame, and you'll lose your forging abilities completely even though you keep all your alchy casts upon becoming a hunter. I would up doing Alc-->Hunter with one of my back row guys and Mage-->Alc with another, just to keep the forging skill in my party. Having an alchemist in town is a reasonable option, but even then you're gonna want him to be level 26+ for the disassemble skill, otherwise anything you forge onto an item is stuck on there unless you sell it and buy it back (and then the ore is gone). The "high purity synthesis" that makes the ores even stronger than their face value is another nice benefit to an active, leveling alchemist, but just be warned it goes up glacially (like .1-.2% per level).

--Finishing with a Summoner and a Bishop gives you two very squishy guys in your back row that can't wear/wield shit, which will suck late game. I'd strongly consider running the Gnome through other spell schools and then ending as Cleric. They have solid HP, they can wear all the heavy armor you find throughout most of the main game (although not the uber post game stuff), and actually earn extra swings (albeit slowly) unlike Bishops etc., which makes them reasonably useful in combat, wielding a pair of maces or a nice hammer (can forge it for medium range when you eventually park him in the back and put ninja up front). I always used the Bishop in town to identify stuff, although I did have to take him out and level him up occasionally to keep him useful at it.

--I picked Find Treasure for one of my characters and kinda regret it, as it turns out like 90+% of encounters in this game are fixed ones where you get a chest anyway. Having this helps for extra $$ early on, maybe saving up for training donation after class changes, but long term it's not worth it. Of course if you're gonna CC to Ninja you can change your Ex skill to Replica or something else at that point.

Thanks mate What would you suggest doing before Cleric?

 

[gman42]

My goal was to have at least two characters who can cast from each spell school, so if you go with your original plan, it might be smart to run him through both mage and alchemist first (if you play your cards right, you might have enough gold to just buy 10 levels or so of EXP for each class change and make it less painful. Also don't forget that as soon as you learn one level 7 spell you're fine to go ahead and CC, you'll learn the others along the way).

 

[Grunker]

My goal was to have at least two characters who can cast from each spell school, so if you go with your original plan, it might be smart to run him through both mage and alchemist first (if you play your cards right, you might have enough gold to just buy 10 levels or so of EXP for each class change and make it less painful. Also don't forget that as soon as you learn one level 7 spell you're fine to go ahead and CC, you'll learn the others along the way).

Won't I be missing healing spells early?

 

[gman42]

Won't I be missing healing spells early?

Good point. Your Valkyrie would have to handle that, and I honestly don't remember at what level she learns her first spells. If you stick to the first level of the first dungeon for a bit, there is a health fountain there (one of only two in the game) that could get you by. You'll also find plenty of health potions in chests early in the game.

 

[Grunker]

Okay, new take after reading up on some stuff. Welcome to the party, folks.

Spoiler

Dorateen the Valkyrie

Spoiler

aweigh the Brawler

Spoiler

Deuce Traveler the Thief

Spoiler

NJClaw the (upcoming) Cleric

Spoiler

Haplo the Alchemist

Spoiler

Crooked Bee the (upcoming) Summoner

Spoiler

Apologies for the genderswaps (very #currentyear), entirely decided on which portraits I liked the most


Summary:

Dwarf Valkyrie with Stronghold
Werebeast Brawler with Swallow Killer
Dragonnewt Thief with Mysterious Bag (swap out with Ninja at some point)
Gnome Alchemist (--> Mage on first 7-cast --> Cleric on first 7-cast) with Song of Healing [Change to High Magic Source at some point]
Human Alchemist with Divination
Elf Mage (--> Cleric upon gaining Diomente --> Summoner on first 7-cast ) with Tackle [change to Spirit Pact]

Town heroes:
Bishop with Divination for identification
More?

 

[gman42]

Tackle was a good Ex Skill choice, that's definitely one I would have taken if I could go back in time. Nothing worse than beating an enemy down to a few HP (or having him Brace and being one lousy hit away from a kill) and then having him regen like 800 at the end of the round.

Stronghold is solid too but Draw hasn't bothered me *that* much, at least up to halfway through Ibag Tower where I am now. Seems like the AI is goofy and half the time an enemy uses Draw, they wind up using it a 2nd time and swap your rows back again in the same round.

Some people swear by Swallow Killer, but I hate the fact that it's an active skill that you have to waste a SP on. I think in the 3DS version they made it passive where the character with the skill can just attack with impunity.

Also I never messed around with summoners, but IIRC you don't have to give Spirit Pact to your active summoner, you can just create a new summoner with that skill and leave him in town. That saves you a slot for a more exciting skill if you want (or maybe they can become the Mysterious Bag guy if you want to use something cooler like Replica on your eventual ninja. Hard to do away with Mysterious Bag completely, as you'll eventually be able to only gather like 6 items on an expedition before filling up).

 

[Grunker]

Thanks my dude. A couple of questions so far:

1) Is there a way to equip slings or something on my backline? Right now they just defend, and they can't use any of the ranged weapons including "Stone"

2) How do you resolve quests like the Soldier asking you to release a trap? Haven't found a way to interact with anything (and I also met a party that wanted out which I also couldn't interact with)

 

[gman42]

For back row magic users, whips are gonna be your only early option for medium+ range weaponry (and yeah they kinda suck). You'll eventually find a few better options but not a ton better. Obviously martial characters in the back will eventually have a ton of weapon choices.

Most quests in this game are pretty passive, usually a matter of visiting person X that wants a thing, then finding said thing and returning to them. Some have more flavor than others, but they're mostly a way to earn a goodie here and there and to force you to visit every spot on the map if you're a completionist. If there are any options for doing/giving something to a character you'll be prompted, there's almost never anything special you have to know. (Don't recall the specifics of the quest you mentioned so I can't give more detail.)

BTW if you haven't seen it yet, a list of open and resolved quests can be seen on one of the tabs when you're in World Map (or hit PgDn a couple of times).

 

[Grunker]

Ah should have bought whips then! Will do that on return

 

[Grunker]

So what are some forge bonuses you guys like? There's a lot of options, but honestly I'm wondering whether I shouldn't just put everything into AC at this early stage.

 

[Dorarnae]

So what are some forge bonuses you guys like? There's a lot of options, but honestly I'm wondering whether I shouldn't just put everything into AC at this early stage.

one item with hp regen, pretty much the only thing you need in the beginning.

As for your party, I guess anything can work, I never tried a thief dragonewt, probably useful at first for the breath attack but for the post game you might prefer to hide and have higher agility. also dragonewt require a bit more exp than standard race and the ability from the ninja that lower AC depending on your level which is very good in the post game...
your valkyrie I'd maybe put hand of kindness it's called I think? it increase healing magic effectiveness otherwise their heal (except the single full restore) are ass.(post game that is)

 

[Grunker]

What's going on with the damage rolls in this game lol? My Dragon Breath deals everything from 1 to 46 damage on the same enemy (so resists prob don't explain it - and on the first turn, so it's not the scaling of that ability).

So what are some forge bonuses you guys like? There's a lot of options, but honestly I'm wondering whether I shouldn't just put everything into AC at this early stage.

one item with hp regen, pretty much the only thing you need in the beginning.

Thanks! Now I feel silly for picking Song of Healing, lol. It's definetely going out if I can switch skills on class change?