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Fallout Fallout 3 isn’t as bad as you think...

Cael

Dumbfuck!
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It is one thing to venerate the way the Roman legions were set up and emulate them. It is another to waste resources forging Roman legion armour when you are facing NCR guns...
 

Sigourn

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The way it's presented straight up. It has to have a certain goofy edge to it, like FO1.

To be 100% honest, the only goofy element about the Legion (that I can think of) is Vulpes Inculta's edgy persona in Nipton. Really, that's it. I prefer to believe Vulpes is intentionally edgy to cause terror.

Nothing suggests something like the Legion could have developed.

Why not? You have the Followers of the Apocalypse. Then you have the NCR in Fallout 2, and become aware of how corrupt of a government it is. There's enough elements to make the character of Edward Sallow believable.

There are no two tones in FO1. The darker parts like Khans kidnapping people was mixed with them being dumbfucks and believing in ghosts.

Being superstitious is not being "a dumbfuck", or better said, being superstitious isn't something to laugh about in the same way, say, Fisto is in New Vegas. The actual joke is that you happen to be mistaken by the father of Garl, but not that they are superstitious.

Either way, the game expects us to find the threat of Super Mutants and The Master seriously, even though they are extremely outlandish elements in an otherwise "grounded" setting (which is what I was getting at). Even ghouls could pass up as exaggerated versions of the Hiroshima and Nagasaki burn victims, a reminder of what was but no longer is. But Super Mutants? A telephatic blob? It's silliness at its finest.

I personally think Caesar's Legion is much more serious and believable than Super Mutants and The Master can ever hope to be. The only thing against them is the awkward outfits.
 

Master

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Being superstitious is not being "a dumbfuck", or better said, being superstitious isn't something to laugh about in the same way, say, Fisto is in New Vegas. The actual joke is that you happen to be mistaken by the father of Garl, but not that they are superstitious.

Good point. But the rest of your post misunderstands; everything (vaults, water chip, Mutants, Master) is supposed to be half serious. That's the essential tone of Fallout. Hell, I would say even F3 was unintentionally closer to 1s tone than NV.
 

Sigourn

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Good point. But the rest of your post misunderstands; everything (vaults, water chip, Mutants, Master) is supposed to be half serious. That's the essential tone of Fallout. Hell, I would say even F3 was unintentionally closer to 1s tone than NV.

Eh, I really can't say I agree. To me, there's the Vault and the water chip. And then there's the Super Mutants and the Master. I can take the first one seriously, but not the latter (as a concept, not as a threat; we all know getting torn apart by Super Mutants is no laughing matter, as the fake ending shows).
 

Master

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Well ok. Let's agree to disagree then. There are some good points about NV though probably weren't intended by the devs. One is how after Goodsprings you're directed to Primm, town with a rollercoaster. I like to think this is a secret jab at Bethesda theme park approach.
 
Unwanted

Meme Knight

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Come on, I thought the "but Bethesda didn't want to make a bad Fallout game" to be fairly original, or at least not overused.
What, can't you forgive them for not getting what they were doing and enjoying their purulent vomit regardless? Why are you such a meanie?

So, you judge an argument based on how overused & original it is? rather than how well constructed it is? that's really weird.
Also, you criticize FNV for how it used "4 main factions" but you never mention the problem with it besides "fallout was never about that" as if the core fundements of NV was "factions" even though their just a solid bonus and especially with how well fleshed-out they are, the factions are only important if you complete the main story, and of course plenty of main factions have tons of quests to build up your reputation with them, and actually has well written and mostly well developed quests besides faction ones.
Fallout 3 only has a scant 18 side quests which are mostly just fetch quests, granted all of these games had kill quests, but they didn't dominate the available list of quests to the degree they do in Fallout 3.
because with quests like "Rescue from paradise" & "Nuka-cola Challenge" "Reily's Rangers" "Power of the atom" etc, are examples of the quests being awful, especially compared to other fallout games.
and especially apparent with how bethesda was more concerned with the gunplay (seriously, they even admitted in an interview that they had an entire build around guns and that's what they focused on in that thing at 6:10) and failed miserably with how massive the gun spread is and the lack of iron-sights.
 

Sigourn

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We here at the Codex we turn our noses at Fallout 3 but that whacky humor did vibe with a lot of people because of the same way some people find Adam Sandle funny while others are Dave Chapelle fans, one is aimed at low brow tits and farts jokes while the other parodies modern trends and issues through comedy... it is not that one is bad and the other is good, it is simply that they have different audiences

I came to this conclusion recently. In my own words, though: it's not that Bethesda failed to deliver "Fallout". It's just that they didn't care about Fallout as a whole, only part of it (the goofiness).

And it's clear their idea of Fallout has a major audience. I remember one person saying classic Fallout was "Mad Max" and thus boring, unimaginative, generic. I resisted the urge to call them a retard, but it goes to show that Bethesda knew exactly what they were doing when they flanderized the 50s aspect and goofiness of the franchise.
 

His Dudeness

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How do you know what I think about Fallout 3? This thread title is straight out of buzzfeed.
 

Wayward Son

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Fallout 3 is genuinely the worst Bethesda game out there.
 

Cael

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Wayward Son

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Honestly I don’t see how they could top fallout 3. There isn’t a single redeeming feature of that mess
 

Cael

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Honestly I don’t see how they could top fallout 3. There isn’t a single redeeming feature of that mess
I saw the trailer for Starfield. Let's just say my money is on Bethesda screwing it up so hard, Fallout 76 is going to look like a gem.
 

Red7

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fallout 3 wasnt retarded for comedic purpose (just like core fallout 4 writing), they just literally made their game world/writing that incoherent, cause its fucking easy contrary to making coherent one. they just lumped bunch of retarded ideas together like child with down syndrom.

u can make things whacky, but still sensible in its own rule set btw.

also fallout 4 is superior to 3. while writing is trash, its less retarded and vastly better game loop.
 

MajorMace

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I'm Ridin' with Biden I'm Ridin' with Biden
Problem with F3 is that everything you do feels inconsequential, and it's the same issue with almost every game from this company.
The whacky and zany humour is but a detail, compared to this fundamental flaw.
 

__scribbles__

Novice
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Jul 5, 2022
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New Vegas is the best Fallout game so make an argument if you think differently and please no “gamebryo fps sucks”
-Legion is cartoonishly evil and underdeveloped
-Pay-to-Win pre-order DLC
-Game is unbalanced beyond belief(ironic, isn't it), Speech 100 at level 4 and you'll have a solution to almost all quests in the game, plus OP perks and weapons are everywhere, especially in Lonesome Road where you can just go in at a low level, grab the loot and book it out of there with game-breakers
-Click click click combat
-Completely broken and inflated economy, if you sell guns & ammo you're not using at all times you'll get well over 7k caps when you reach Novac
-Nonsensical suddenly political plot halfway through for no reason
-Massive side-quest bloat, NCR got everything while Legion got 7-ish, and that's being generous
-Compressed world to the point where Legion-controlled HELIOS One and NCR-controlled Substation and 188 Trading and NCR-Friendly Novac are right around the corner yet refuse to attack each other at all. In fact, Legionary Assassins can spawn in on the Dry Lake approaching from the NCR Substation.
-Second half is just "hey, go here and take care of [small group that doesn't really do anything] and come back." "hey, kimball assassination, you should probably help"
-World is insanely static, nothing happens even if in-game years pass
The game's still all right at points, but it's not the holy grail of pseudo-intellectual game journalism for no reason
 

Sigourn

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-Legion is cartoonishly evil and underdeveloped

What's cartoonish about a slaver, pillaging faction? I don't think you would call it cartoonish much if you were up in one of their crosses.

-Pay-to-Win pre-order DLC

More like "pay-to-make-the-beginning-a-joke". The game is easy enough without the pre-order DLC.

-Nonsensical suddenly political plot halfway through for no reason

How? The reason you get shot in the head is literally because of the political plot (i.e. Benny looking to take over New Vegas, much like you can do later in the game).

-World is insanely static, nothing happens even if in-game years pass

Like classic Fallout's is much different. It's literally just a timer set to game over/towns die.

I agree with everything else, which is either a problem already present in classic Fallout or carried over from Fallout 3/GameBryo. But these points you bring up are pretty tardy.
 

KateMicucci

Arcane
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Sep 2, 2017
Messages
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Even expecting nothing but oblivion with guns, fallout 3 was a disappointment. Oblivion at least had a ton of quests. In fallout 3 there was only about one quest per location anywhere outside of megaton.
 

Jaesun

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May 14, 2004
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Torment: Tides of Numenera Divinity: Original Sin 2 BattleTech
Fallout 3 was complete fucking shit, in comparison to Fallout 1/2 from a game design perspective. Period. Obsidian Entertainment however, took this horrible game design and at least *tried* to do a more "Fallout" game with New Vegas, based on the horrible game design Bethesda did with Fallout 3.
 
Unwanted
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Jan 14, 2018
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50,711
Codex Year of the Donut
Fallout 3 and Oblivion aren't even comparable in their issues because one has problems that are largely systems related and the other is simply a bad game.

Many of the things Oblivion gets knocked for can be fixed with mods. Fo3 cannot be fixed with mods without making an entirely new game.
 

Jack Of Owls

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May 23, 2014
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Massachusettes
I loved the eyebots in FO3/FNV, and in different flavors. Can't remember if they were in Fallout 1/2.
 

Zed Duke of Banville

Dungeon Master
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Oct 3, 2015
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Many of the things Oblivion gets knocked for can be fixed with mods. Fo3 cannot be fixed with mods without making an entirely new game.
Much of the Codex is of the opinion that Fallout 3 can be fixed with an overhaul mod:

202898-fallout-new-vegas-windows-front-cover.jpg
 

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