Gothic Gothic remake from THQ Nordic

[Alphard]

I'll play the devil's advocate, and say they wanted to avoid the omnipresent "shades of brown" colouration that has been a plague on the gaming industry for most of the last two decades.

A penal colony should not be like Disney.

But the fact that they got so many things wrong doing stuff on their own is not very promising, don't you agree? If they need the fanbase to tell them what to do, and what not to, I don't think they are capable enough as a team to do this project. Also whenever i hear "modernization", I immediately knot they sre gonna ruin stuff ( they already got a dialog wheel in). They went the Ass Effect route, instead of implementing clqssic dialog mechanic that works on every occasion. Even Skyrim got that right.

I don't know why developers love this fallout 4 dialog. The most popular FL4 mod literally replaces this BS with the classic dialog system

Having a subtraction system defenses absolutely ruin the immersion.
I smack this high level goblin head with my mace: 0 damage because my attack is lower than his defenses. That is absolutely right, right?

No, makes PERFECTLY SENSE. Your goblin example is wrong because goblins has poor armor.
If you swing you sword in a high armored NPC, it will deals no damage and makes sense.
If the damage reduction is by percentage, then a KITCHEN KNIFE WIELDED BY A LV 0 PLAYER AND A WARHAMMER WIELDED BY A 2.5M TALL ORC WILL BE EQUALLY EFFECTIVE VS PLATE ARMOR. Plate will just reduce X percent of the damage. Golems in any gothic game are far more susceptible to take damage from hammers than swords and it makes perfectly sense.

Your example of Dragon's Dogma is silly because in DD has much gear dependency.

Why you assuming the damage formula of a system different than subtraction will not take into account attacker stats?
Ofc a low level with rusty sword should do less damage than lv 999 with black sword of burning death.
On the other hand, doing literally 0 damage because you are below a certain treeshold feels artificial af. Unless it's some sort of magic, like a magic shield against an element, an attack should alway do damage, even if very little.

 

[Cryomancer]

On the other hand, doing literally 0 damage because you are below a certain treeshold feels artificial af. Unless it's some sort of magic, like a magic shield against an element, an attack should alway do damage, even if very little.
.

The number is lower, but 50% is 50% from 2 or 2 billion. Homogenizing armor. And no, this is not artificial. A 9mm bullet can't pierce a Panzer III armor but a 14.5x114mm can not only pierce but also one shot a crew member. A shortbow with broadhead arrow can deal no damage to someone at plate armor because the arrow is deflected and a heavy warbow with bodkin arrow + poison can one shot him.

Dragon's Dogma, most enemies has weakspots with no armor. Snipe a cyclops eye and will deal a lot of damage. Or use explosive arrow.
But there are a huge difference between DD and Gothic. Gear dependency.
100 STR + the best axe(Lares' Axe) = 165 damage
100 STR + The weakest axe(Handaxe) = 109 damage.

The damage difference is not that significant but if the enemy has 100 armor, then the best axe start to deal way more damage. With 120 armor, you with the weakest axe, only do damage in a critical. It makes sense. On Dragon's Dogma, 95% of your power is your gear. Diablo 3 is 99,99999999999% of your power your gear, has %damage reduction and the same problem.

 

[Alphard]

On the other hand, doing literally 0 damage because you are below a certain treeshold feels artificial af. Unless it's some sort of magic, like a magic shield against an element, an attack should alway do damage, even if very little.
.

The number is lower, but 50% is 50% from 2 or 2 billion. Homogenizing armor. And no, this is not artificial. A 9mm bullet can't pierce a Panzer III armor but a 14.5x114mm can not only pierce but also one shot a crew member. A shortbow with broadhead arrow can deal no damage to someone at plate armor because the arrow is deflected and a heavy warbow with bodkin arrow + poison can one shot him.

Dragon's Dogma, most enemies has weakspots with no armor. Snipe a cyclops eye and will deal a lot of damage. Or use explosive arrow.
But there are a huge difference between DD and Gothic. Gear dependency.
100 STR + the best axe(Lares' Axe) = 165 damage
100 STR + The weakest axe(Handaxe) = 109 damage.

The damage difference is not that significant but if the enemy has 100 armor, then the best axe start to deal way more damage. With 120 armor, you with the weakest axe, only do damage in a critical. It makes sense. On Dragon's Dogma, 95% of your power is your gear. Diablo 3 is 99,99999999999% of your power your gear, has %damage reduction and the same problem.

If you are going for realism then even a bullet will do damage to a panzer. An invisible, trascurable damage but damage nonetheless.
Even an armored guy will get some contusion from a axe/ mace / greatsword hit.
This could thought as ( example) 10 hp on 1000 hp of the dude
Doing 0 hp of damage means the dude has some sort of magic that prevent the hit from landing

 

[Cryomancer]

If you are going for realism then even a bullet will do damage to a panzer. An invisible, trascurable damage but damage nonetheless.
Even an armored guy will get some contusion from a axe/ mace / greatsword hit.
This could thought as ( example) 10 hp on 1000 hp of the dude
Doing 0 hp of damage means the dude has some sort of magic that prevent the hit from landing

The question is that is so little damage that the game doesn't even need to take it into account. And armor preventing weapons from dealing any damage makes perfectly sense.

At 0:55 on the video Mobility in Medieval Plate armor ( https://youtu.be/qzTwBQniLSc?t=47 )

You can see that the sword hit dealt absolutely no damage to the plate armor. Now lock to the Warhammer, at 0:55



This high grade armor exists only among the Old Camp Elite. But i don't wanna see lv 0 guys with a rust sword or even a axe dealing damage to Gomez and his elite man, or using swords on the bridge golem....

 

[baud]

English is not my native language(you can see by my awful grammar in many posts), but when i write a review about Gothic, i try to write in English because i believe that will have more impact. I imagine that eastern europeans who din't liked the game are doing the same.

Talking about Spanish, i can understand a little of Rioplatense Spanish(not Mexican Spanish) but the Spanish option is the European Spanis, Argentine Spanish or Mexican Spanish?

For the Spanish, it was the Spanish - Spain option. The other option is Spanish - South America and there was 2 reviews, so I didn't include them in the post.

 

[Murk]

So replayed this demo a bit more to snoop around and see what I missed (more like, pissed) and I was paying attention to the combat more.

The hit detection is really shit. At first I assumed I was too far to hit the enemies with the broken sword, but this time I used a normal one and quite often my sword just clips through an enemy and does no damage. I can't tell if they're in some i-frames, if I'm "just barely missing the hitbox", or if it's just busted.

I'm leaning toward the last but who knows.

 

[Cryomancer]

For the Spanish, it was the Spanish - Spain option. The other option is Spanish - South America and there was 2 reviews, so I didn't include them in the post.

I never understood this stores who uses the Mexican Spanish for a entire continent. I mean, the distance between Mexico City and Ushuaia(ARG) is almost 5 times greater than London to Istanbul. Since i plan to visit Buenos Aires in January, i really wish that products purchased there will not be region locked with Spanish or worse, Mexican Spanish only language.

a video explaining the difference focused on Uruguayan Spanish

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Other thing. I would love to see Gothic 1 on Risen 1 engine with Risen 1 graphics, or a remaster, not a remake but THQ Nordic believes that a remaster will not work...

I mean, the intro of the woman being send to the colony as a product would create massive butthurt but i don't see any problems with risen style UI and risen style combat.

 

[JDR13]

Dude, Dark Souls Prepare To Die Edition was removed from the Steam store the day the 'Remastered' version was out...

When I checked, it looked like it was still there. Regardless, it's irrelevant to the point I made which is that a remake from a different developer is not going to affect the original Gothic in any way.

 

[baud]

Dude, Dark Souls Prepare To Die Edition was removed from the Steam store the day the 'Remastered' version was out...

When I checked, it looked like it was still there. Regardless, it's irrelevant to the point I made which is that a remake from a different developer is not going to affect the original Gothic in any way.

It's still there, but you can't buy it anymore, you can only buy the Remastered one.

 

[JDR13]

It's still there, but you can't buy it anymore, you can only buy the Remastered one.

Ah ok. Since I already own it on Steam, there would be no buy button for me anyways. That's why I couldn't tell it had been removed.

 

[Tito Anic]

As a fan of Gothic 2 & a few other PB games too, I've never got more than around 1/3rd of the way into the first Gothic due to bugs & crashes.

 

[Alphard]

If you are going for realism then even a bullet will do damage to a panzer. An invisible, trascurable damage but damage nonetheless.
Even an armored guy will get some contusion from a axe/ mace / greatsword hit.
This could thought as ( example) 10 hp on 1000 hp of the dude
Doing 0 hp of damage means the dude has some sort of magic that prevent the hit from landing

The question is that is so little damage that the game doesn't even need to take it into account. And armor preventing weapons from dealing any damage makes perfectly sense.

At 0:55 on the video Mobility in Medieval Plate armor ( https://youtu.be/qzTwBQniLSc?t=47 )

You can see that the sword hit dealt absolutely no damage to the plate armor. Now lock to the Warhammer, at 0:55



This high grade armor exists only among the Old Camp Elite. But i don't wanna see lv 0 guys with a rust sword or even a axe dealing damage to Gomez and his elite man, or using swords on the bridge golem....

Ok, the sword is not very effective against armor, but then if you go by this logic end game sword should also deal no damage to the knight, and low level blunt weapons should deal damage, if you want to be realistic.
And even then, that would only make sense against heavy phisical / magical protection. Most rpg also have high level unprotected/ exposing soft points enemies. If they are treated like high levels and have flat reduction, you will not damage them even if it doesnt make sense. For example let's say you hit with a sword an unarmored ogre, you cut its skin, so even if you dont do considerable damage you still injury him, be even a scratch. By applying subtraction damage formula you have a scenario where you slash and cut the enemy infinitely, and still do 0 damage

 

[biggestboss]

Jonathan Blow throwing shade at the Gothic Reemake developers

 

[fantadomat]

If you are going for realism then even a bullet will do damage to a panzer. An invisible, trascurable damage but damage nonetheless.
Even an armored guy will get some contusion from a axe/ mace / greatsword hit.
This could thought as ( example) 10 hp on 1000 hp of the dude
Doing 0 hp of damage means the dude has some sort of magic that prevent the hit from landing

The question is that is so little damage that the game doesn't even need to take it into account. And armor preventing weapons from dealing any damage makes perfectly sense.

At 0:55 on the video Mobility in Medieval Plate armor ( https://youtu.be/qzTwBQniLSc?t=47 )

You can see that the sword hit dealt absolutely no damage to the plate armor. Now lock to the Warhammer, at 0:55



This high grade armor exists only among the Old Camp Elite. But i don't wanna see lv 0 guys with a rust sword or even a axe dealing damage to Gomez and his elite man, or using swords on the bridge golem....

Nigga that is not how you use a sword to kill a guy in a armour,or at all. You try and aim at the gaps and use it as a spike or use the handle as a hammer,not lump it at the enemy lol. You could also go fro cutting of limps if you are strong enough. Also the guy with the hammer is an idiot too.

 

[Alphard]

If you are going for realism then even a bullet will do damage to a panzer. An invisible, trascurable damage but damage nonetheless.
Even an armored guy will get some contusion from a axe/ mace / greatsword hit.
This could thought as ( example) 10 hp on 1000 hp of the dude
Doing 0 hp of damage means the dude has some sort of magic that prevent the hit from landing

The question is that is so little damage that the game doesn't even need to take it into account. And armor preventing weapons from dealing any damage makes perfectly sense.

At 0:55 on the video Mobility in Medieval Plate armor ( https://youtu.be/qzTwBQniLSc?t=47 )

You can see that the sword hit dealt absolutely no damage to the plate armor. Now lock to the Warhammer, at 0:55



This high grade armor exists only among the Old Camp Elite. But i don't wanna see lv 0 guys with a rust sword or even a axe dealing damage to Gomez and his elite man, or using swords on the bridge golem....

Nigga that is not how you use a sword to kill a guy in a armour,or at all. You try and aim at the gaps and use it as a spike or use the handle as a hammer,not lump it at the enemy lol. You could also go fro cutting of limps if you are strong enough. Also the guy with the hammer is an idiot too.

Btw i can see how he could counterargue that a lv 1 char is an ine perienced weak idiot, and does not use weapons effectively

 

[Cryomancer]

By applying subtraction damage formula you have a scenario where you slash and cut the enemy infinitely, and still do 0 damage

. You try and aim at the gaps and use it as a spike or use the handle as a hammer,not lump it at the enemy lol. You could also go fro cutting of limps if you are strong enough. Also the guy with the hammer is an idiot too.

Hitting in the unarmored part of the neck is already in the game. Is called CRITICAL

But most hits will deal no damage, or do you think that hit the gaps vs a trained opponent is something easy and likely?

Btw i can see how he could counterargue that a lv 1 char is an ine perienced weak idiot, and does not use weapons effectively

Yep. My point is not that a master of sword fighting with superhuman STR and uriziel should be forced to use a hammer vs plate armored guys(only vs golem who is pure rock - no gaps), only that a poorly armored guy with non training should have virtually no chance of dealing any game on a plate armored guy.

And when you get better armor and become a master on weapon fighting itself, the same applies to you. Poor untrained peasants should run from you if you try to kill him.

-------------------------------------------------------

My point is. You with 5 STR/Starting weapon should not be able to damage a snapper, let alone survive 8 bites from a snapper.

 

[fantadomat]

If you are going for realism then even a bullet will do damage to a panzer. An invisible, trascurable damage but damage nonetheless.
Even an armored guy will get some contusion from a axe/ mace / greatsword hit.
This could thought as ( example) 10 hp on 1000 hp of the dude
Doing 0 hp of damage means the dude has some sort of magic that prevent the hit from landing

The question is that is so little damage that the game doesn't even need to take it into account. And armor preventing weapons from dealing any damage makes perfectly sense.

At 0:55 on the video Mobility in Medieval Plate armor ( https://youtu.be/qzTwBQniLSc?t=47 )

You can see that the sword hit dealt absolutely no damage to the plate armor. Now lock to the Warhammer, at 0:55



This high grade armor exists only among the Old Camp Elite. But i don't wanna see lv 0 guys with a rust sword or even a axe dealing damage to Gomez and his elite man, or using swords on the bridge golem....

Nigga that is not how you use a sword to kill a guy in a armour,or at all. You try and aim at the gaps and use it as a spike or use the handle as a hammer,not lump it at the enemy lol. You could also go fro cutting of limps if you are strong enough. Also the guy with the hammer is an idiot too.

Btw i can see how he could counterargue that a lv 1 char is an ine perienced weak idiot, and does not use weapons effectively

Ahh it is a game,the whole argument line is pointless to be honest. There is no point in bringing realism in to a game discussion.

 

[Outlander]

It's still there, but you can't buy it anymore, you can only buy the Remastered one.

Ah ok. Since I already own it on Steam, there would be no buy button for me anyways. That's why I couldn't tell it had been removed.

It's irrelevant if you already own the game on steam or not. The buy button doesn't go away unless the game has been removed.

 

[Cryomancer]

Ahh it is a game,the whole argument line is pointless to be honest. There is no point in bringing realism in to a game discussion.

When the greatest thing about Gothic is the immersion, realism is a thing to take into account. Not be perfectly realistic BUT guns on FNV are amazing compared to outer worlds by a reason. Ammo and armor works in a phenomenal way on FNV.

Gothic 1 - Starting player die quickly to wild animal packs and have no chance vs heavily armored enemies.
Gothic 2 - Starting player die quickly to wild animal packs and have no chance vs heavily armored enemies.
Gothic 3- Starting player die quickly to wild animal packs and have no chance vs heavily armored enemies.
Gothic 4- ArcaniA - MMO BS ultra long boring fights, char DNA 100% tied to gear, wow style armor, cooldown on rune magic that shouldn't exist, etc.
Gothic 1 remake - ??????

 

[Alphard]

By applying subtraction damage formula you have a scenario where you slash and cut the enemy infinitely, and still do 0 damage

. You try and aim at the gaps and use it as a spike or use the handle as a hammer,not lump it at the enemy lol. You could also go fro cutting of limps if you are strong enough. Also the guy with the hammer is an idiot too.

Hitting in the unarmored part of the neck is already in the game. Is called CRITICAL

But most hits will deal no damage, or do you think that hit the gaps vs a trained opponent is something easy and likely?

Btw i can see how he could counterargue that a lv 1 char is an ine perienced weak idiot, and does not use weapons effectively

Yep. My point is not that a master of sword fighting with superhuman STR and uriziel should be forced to use a hammer vs plate armored guys(only vs golem who is pure rock - no gaps), only that a poorly armored guy with non training should have virtually no chance of dealing any game on a plate armored guy.

And when you get better armor and become a master on weapon fighting itself, the same applies to you. Poor untrained peasants should run from you if you try to kill him.

-------------------------------------------------------

My point is. You with 5 STR/Starting weapon should not be able to damage a snapper, let alone survive 8 bits from a snapper.

What about the ogre perizoma wearing scenario i described above. What about the generic leather covered bandits you find in every game? Why sword thrust, even of level 1 char, would make no damage at all to them?
No matter how you see, this system makes no sense.
In dark souls as a beginner if you take the wrong path you will not end well.
Take for example graveyard skeletons. As a newb they will annhilate you.
But if, you, as a player, are skilled, with patience you can kill them even with beginner weapon. They are made of bones after all.
You don't need stupid flat reduction defense to make high level enemies threatening.
Would you have preferred in dark souls the skeletons to be immune to all damage if you have a <+5 weapon?

 

[Cryomancer]

Would you have preferred in dark souls the skeletons to be immune to all damage if you have a <+5 weapon?

No, but skeletons should have a flat DR vs slashing and the player should need to have a much harder time mainly if he is unprepared to face then. But Dark Souls is more about the Player Skill than the char skill. Gothic is more 70% char and 30% player.

But see a low level guy killing the golems, a lv 9 guildless with preparation can kill end game enemies on Gothic. Repare how his non cric attacks deal little damage vs stone golem and how his crits deal a lot

 

[Alphard]

If you are going for realism then even a bullet will do damage to a panzer. An invisible, trascurable damage but damage nonetheless.
Even an armored guy will get some contusion from a axe/ mace / greatsword hit.
This could thought as ( example) 10 hp on 1000 hp of the dude
Doing 0 hp of damage means the dude has some sort of magic that prevent the hit from landing

The question is that is so little damage that the game doesn't even need to take it into account. And armor preventing weapons from dealing any damage makes perfectly sense.

At 0:55 on the video Mobility in Medieval Plate armor ( https://youtu.be/qzTwBQniLSc?t=47 )

You can see that the sword hit dealt absolutely no damage to the plate armor. Now lock to the Warhammer, at 0:55



This high grade armor exists only among the Old Camp Elite. But i don't wanna see lv 0 guys with a rust sword or even a axe dealing damage to Gomez and his elite man, or using swords on the bridge golem....

Nigga that is not how you use a sword to kill a guy in a armour,or at all. You try and aim at the gaps and use it as a spike or use the handle as a hammer,not lump it at the enemy lol. You could also go fro cutting of limps if you are strong enough. Also the guy with the hammer is an idiot too.

Btw i can see how he could counterargue that a lv 1 char is an ine perienced weak idiot, and does not use weapons effectively

Ahh it is a game,the whole argument line is pointless to be honest. There is no point in bringing realism in to a game discussion.

But if you can make a game more realistic AND fun ( where fun has the priority) it is much better, and in some case realism contributes to the fun because immersion

 

[zwanzig_zwoelf]

bro u know i played the game and loved it bro i wonder if i can romance diego bro i dunno why are you so pissy about a game made in 2019 being improved to modern standards bro its not 1981 bro learn some tact

 

[Alphard]

Would you have preferred in dark souls the skeletons to be immune to all damage if you have a <+5 weapon?

No, but skeletons should have a flat DR vs slashing and the player should need to have a much harder time mainly if he is unprepared to face then. But Dark Souls is more about the Player Skill than the char skill. Gothic is more 70% char and 30% player.

But see a low level guy killing the golems, a lv 9 guildless with preparation can kill end game enemies on Gothic. Repare how his non cric attacks deal little damage vs stone golem and how his crits deal a lot

They are already much stronger vs thrusts and weaker vs blunt ( blunt weapons actually crush them into pieces)
The point is is much more reasonable for them to take little amount of damage, than no damage at all.
About your video, it seems how it should be
But if at any point enemies are magically invincible just because numbers, that's not fun and not immersive in any way

 

[fantadomat]

If you are going for realism then even a bullet will do damage to a panzer. An invisible, trascurable damage but damage nonetheless.
Even an armored guy will get some contusion from a axe/ mace / greatsword hit.
This could thought as ( example) 10 hp on 1000 hp of the dude
Doing 0 hp of damage means the dude has some sort of magic that prevent the hit from landing

The question is that is so little damage that the game doesn't even need to take it into account. And armor preventing weapons from dealing any damage makes perfectly sense.

At 0:55 on the video Mobility in Medieval Plate armor ( https://youtu.be/qzTwBQniLSc?t=47 )

You can see that the sword hit dealt absolutely no damage to the plate armor. Now lock to the Warhammer, at 0:55



This high grade armor exists only among the Old Camp Elite. But i don't wanna see lv 0 guys with a rust sword or even a axe dealing damage to Gomez and his elite man, or using swords on the bridge golem....

Nigga that is not how you use a sword to kill a guy in a armour,or at all. You try and aim at the gaps and use it as a spike or use the handle as a hammer,not lump it at the enemy lol. You could also go fro cutting of limps if you are strong enough. Also the guy with the hammer is an idiot too.

Btw i can see how he could counterargue that a lv 1 char is an ine perienced weak idiot, and does not use weapons effectively

Ahh it is a game,the whole argument line is pointless to be honest. There is no point in bringing realism in to a game discussion.

But if you can make a game more realistic AND fun ( where fun has the priority) it is much better, and in some case realism contributes to the fun because immersion

Sure,but that is not gothic,they are already made games,and arguing about that shit makes no sense. If you want realism you play kingdom come deliverance. OB games are about realistic environment and level design and fun mechanics. In reality you don't have infinite inventory or just sleep an hour and heal. The games are not realistic,but the world is.