Official RPG Codex Discord Server

  1. Welcome to rpgcodex.net, a site dedicated to discussing computer based role-playing games in a free and open fashion. We're less strict than other forums, but please refer to the rules.

    "This message is awaiting moderator approval": All new users must pass through our moderation queue before they will be able to post normally. Until your account has "passed" your posts will only be visible to yourself (and moderators) until they are approved. Give us a week to get around to approving / deleting / ignoring your mundane opinion on crap before hassling us about it. Once you have passed the moderation period (think of it as a test), you will be able to post normally, just like all the other retards.
    Dismiss Notice

Grimoire Thread

Discussion in 'Golden Era Games' started by LESS T_T, Aug 4, 2017.

  1. Cleveland Mark Blakemore Golden Era Games Übermensch Developer Sad Loser

    Cleveland Mark Blakemore
    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2008
    Messages:
    9,026
    Location:
    Red Chinese Prison Colony (Australia)
    If you choose a class that does not require multiplier bonus, your bonus points will be equal to original bonus - attribute points needed to make that class. If you choose a class with multiplier advantage, you still need to deduct that same amount of points * multiplier from bonus for that character.

    Destiny was not modifiable in 1.0, as of 2.0 you are allowed to add points there. That can be a lot of fun to make some characters (even weak ones) nearly impossible to kill for a short while after starting.
     
    • Brofist Brofist x 1
    • Informative Informative x 1
    • Racist Racist x 1
    ^ Top  
  2. Cleveland Mark Blakemore Golden Era Games Übermensch Developer Sad Loser

    Cleveland Mark Blakemore
    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2008
    Messages:
    9,026
    Location:
    Red Chinese Prison Colony (Australia)
    I wanted the Jesters to be a rare and decisive class that is infrequently seen and very hard to attain. I added Chuckles so that even people who went the whole game without ever making it to that class could still experience having them as a party member. My regret is I ran out of integers at 1024 and could not add more Jester-specific items that could only be equipped and used by them. I especially miss having Jester specific armor with colorful item pics and descriptions like you would see in Mardi Gras or a Harlequin festival etc. just ran out of item slots to create them in.

    The Jester class was also part of adding more elements to the game like those common in anime and weird fantasy. I would like to do an RPG some day with nothing but clowns and harlequins as characters. I got some design documents here from 1996 that went into great detail about the Jester class with a ton of features I was never able to add.
     
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2021
    • Brofist x 4
    • honk honk! x 4
    • Prestigious x 3
    • Friendly x 3
    • Informative x 2
    • Funny x 1
    • Yes x 1
    • Racist x 1
    ^ Top  
  3. Cael Dumbfuck! Dumbfuck

    Cael
    Joined:
    Nov 1, 2017
    Messages:
    16,096
    Chuckles ran into a spectacular death in Ultima7.

     
    • Funny Funny x 1
    • honk honk! honk honk! x 1
    ^ Top  
  4. Reapa Doom Preacher

    Reapa
    Joined:
    Jul 10, 2009
    Messages:
    2,298
    Location:
    Germany
    Hello Again,

    here's an error in the wiki:

    NEW: GET THROUGH 14 OUT OF 15 CLASSES AND END ON A JESTER

    You can definitely get through 14 classes and still leave Jester for last. I arranged these, looking at stat minimums, to try and minimize the extra points needed to spend. In no case will you have to spend more bonus points to class change than you can get from random (non > save > scummed) level ups in the new class. This is what I used for Diamond Jack:

    (Barrower) Thau > Wiz > Necro > Sage > Cleric > Templar > Warrior > Bers > Ranger > Pirate > Assassin > Thief > Bard > Jester

    Ranger to Pirate is more costly but actually gets you three classes:

    Problem is rangers can't be pirates. nor can pirates be rangers. so, yeah...

    Outgoing class changes allowed:
    Ranger: Warrior, Thief, Assassin
    Pirate: Thief, Berseker, Assassin

    this is what i used for diamond jack??? what diamond jack? how can you pretend this is tested and works?
     
    Last edited: Jun 6, 2021
    • Thanks! Thanks! x 1
    • /facepalm/ /facepalm/ x 1
    • (autism) (autism) x 1
    ^ Top  
  5. Reapa Doom Preacher

    Reapa
    Joined:
    Jul 10, 2009
    Messages:
    2,298
    Location:
    Germany
    maybe remove some of the stupid items in the game like the parchment that tells you where to burry Mistral and doesn't disapear after reading. if you haven't figuered out where his bones need to get burried without the parchment, maybe you don't deserve to continue playing. this item could be easily replaced by just a journal entry.
     
    • (autism) (autism) x 1
    ^ Top  
  6. Lady Error █▓▒░ ░▒▓█ Patron

    Lady Error
    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2021
    Messages:
    3,465
    Strap Yourselves In
    Yeah, Berserker and Ranger need to be switched.
     
    • Participation Award Participation Award x 2
    ^ Top  
  7. Dorateen Arcane

    Dorateen
    Joined:
    Aug 30, 2012
    Messages:
    3,777
    Location:
    The Crystal Mist Mountains
    Rangers can transition to Pirates. I had one in our party.
     
    • Brofist x 2
    • Informative x 1
    • Friendly x 1
    • +20 Social Credit x 1
    • :M x 1
    ^ Top  
  8. Cleveland Mark Blakemore Golden Era Games Übermensch Developer Sad Loser

    Cleveland Mark Blakemore
    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2008
    Messages:
    9,026
    Location:
    Red Chinese Prison Colony (Australia)
    That's a particularly good upgrade path for a ranger. That was kind of how I thought of Pirates, as super elite ranger class. With cutlasses and puffy shirts.

    It's very cool to reach tenth level and then begin a new career as a pirate. That was the original Grimoire. As a result of user feedback the class changing was reduced drastically in levels and it turned out better than anything I could have thought of, with class changing becoming almost unique for a blobber to shift between professions. When I was testing 2.0 I thought it was really fun to switch professions and continue with new skills and abilities after only three or four level-ups.
     
    • Brofist x 5
    • Agree x 1
    • Prestigious x 1
    • Interesting x 1
    • Racist x 1
    ^ Top  
  9. Reapa Doom Preacher

    Reapa
    Joined:
    Jul 10, 2009
    Messages:
    2,298
    Location:
    Germany
    so these retarded npcs like Argosyre attack me, i kill them and then everyone is angry with me... none can be reasoned with even at 100 diplomacy. good AI bro
     
    ^ Top  
  10. Generic-Giant-Spider Arcane

    Generic-Giant-Spider
    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2018
    Messages:
    5,716
    Location:
    Every fantasy game ever.
    Any chance we could read some of these ideas?

    takes out tracing paper
     
    • Funny Funny x 1
    ^ Top  
  11. Lady Error █▓▒░ ░▒▓█ Patron

    Lady Error
    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2021
    Messages:
    3,465
    Strap Yourselves In
    I guess even the AI knows you're an asshole.
    :incline:

    If you search for his name, you will find that this particular instance has been discussed and explained before.
     
    • Funny Funny x 2
    ^ Top  
  12. Reapa Doom Preacher

    Reapa
    Joined:
    Jul 10, 2009
    Messages:
    2,298
    Location:
    Germany
    can't seem to find the discussion. i searched for argosyre.
    and it's not just argosyre. ahrimen or whatever his name was also wanted the tablet and attacked me for not giving it to him. then a merchant was furious because i killed him and attacked me.
    i was able to bribe the dwarf merchant in crowl into liking me again, but if there is no other way of explainig to him that i was attacked and argosyre made human sacrifices to some demon, the whole interaction with npcs is kinda poor.
    and when a merchant is furious you can't even try to talk to him without negotiatig first. and negotiation looks kinda retared to me. charm and 100 diplomacy sometimes making the npc just a little less furious and most of the time more.
    also raghilda did nothing after me having found her sister sacrificed to a demon. like it was no big deal.
     
    ^ Top  
  13. Lady Error █▓▒░ ░▒▓█ Patron

    Lady Error
    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2021
    Messages:
    3,465
    Strap Yourselves In
    If you search for it not just in this thread, you will find:

     
    • Makes you think... Makes you think... x 1
    ^ Top  
  14. Reapa Doom Preacher

    Reapa
    Joined:
    Jul 10, 2009
    Messages:
    2,298
    Location:
    Germany
    ok, so they're all in on it, even raghilda...
    though mistral only warned me about the "monastery/church" leader.
    maybe mindread should be a little more fleshed out. it's not really mind reading if you only get fed what people are willing to talk about and not what you could ask them to talk about even with the risk of angering them. even just a line about the "murder/sacrifice" that gets answered with "i don't believe you" would do a good enough job of explaining what is really happening.
    diplomacy is still brocken as it does basically nothing. you can bribe without it.
     
    ^ Top  
  15. mondblut Arcane

    mondblut
    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2005
    Messages:
    19,733
    Location:
    Ingrija
    Imagine, people believing a lifelong priest of their parish over a bunch of murderhobos who came out of nowhere and accused him of demon worship. Unfathomable.
     
    • Brofist Brofist x 6
    • Makes you think... Makes you think... x 1
    • :M :M x 1
    ^ Top  
  16. Reapa Doom Preacher

    Reapa
    Joined:
    Jul 10, 2009
    Messages:
    2,298
    Location:
    Germany
    not quite.
    not necessarily murder hobos. not quite out of nowhere. you do start to build trust. maybe even prestige as a group of heroes. remember you get rid of hobknob and the black lich. there's even acknowledgement from the vanguard for killing the black lich, avenging the expedition and finding their remains. there's acknowledgement from gorlo i believe for at least finding mistral and returning the book of spiders. acknowledgement from smithers for finding proof of his father's story. solving the case of the missing sister clara...
    you'd think such news would spread fast especially in such a little community. as it actually does when you kill argosyre. even though he ambushes you in the baths and confesses his crime plus the intention to just murder you right there for attacking his deamon. surely if somebody is in the baths and survives to tell the story he would also hear argosyre's threats and confession.
    only explanation would be they are all in on the little secret. and all the good you did doesn't make up for ruining their deal with the deamon.
    and that's actually a good thing, because otherwise it would mean no actual thought was put into the story at all and npc attitude towards the player's party is just a badly implemented and poorly designed rpg feature in a dungeon crawler.
     
    Last edited: Jun 10, 2021
    ^ Top  
  17. GandGolf Savant

    GandGolf
    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2013
    Messages:
    800
    Location:
    Rivendell
    Has the bug with the tabernacle of music ever been fixed?
     
    ^ Top  
  18. Butter Arcane

    Butter
    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2018
    Messages:
    4,335
    Literally just walk out.
     
    • Brofist Brofist x 1
    ^ Top  
  19. Fowyr Prestigious Gentleman Arcane

    Fowyr
    Joined:
    Mar 29, 2009
    Messages:
    6,763
    Fucking what. I finished this game. I have more than 300 hours in it. All bugs, sans a small txt with the abnormal ACME vending machines, that I have found I told to Cleve and they were fixed.
     
    • Brofist x 4
    • Participation Award x 1
    • nice x 1
    • Salute x 1
    • Racist x 1
    • retadred x 1
    ^ Top  
  20. Fowyr Prestigious Gentleman Arcane

    Fowyr
    Joined:
    Mar 29, 2009
    Messages:
    6,763
    You can finish Grimoire without any class changing, but it somewhat helps. I started my game in the release version, gone through several patches and finished it in 2.X-something. Not only game worked with my old saves (thanks, Cleve, I really understand how hard that sort of compability is), it properly re-calculated needed XP for the next level when I hit it.

    For fuck's sake, Reapa, that wiki was made for the fucking release version, when even crafting was useless and half-implemented and you had a very limited inventory space. Man, I just took a plain old standard party.
    If you want to submit a bug report, at least properly confirm and test your issue.
     
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2021
    • Brofist Brofist x 2
    • nice nice x 1
    • Racist Racist x 1
    • retadred retadred x 1
    ^ Top  
  21. sorinmask Just like Yves, I chase tales. Patron

    sorinmask
    Joined:
    May 3, 2018
    Messages:
    3,235
    Location:
    The land of ice and snow.
    Strap Yourselves In Pathfinder: Kingmaker
    I was always curious of this. So you can 100% beat the game in the same class as you started? Are there any drawbacks that I'm not aware of?
     
    ^ Top  
  22. Fowyr Prestigious Gentleman Arcane

    Fowyr
    Joined:
    Mar 29, 2009
    Messages:
    6,763
    Yep, these alien catchers were a pain in the ass, but I beat them and mapped everything.
    Dunno, my party was surely subpar, I could make it a lot stronger with some save/loading and the proper party creation, but it was doable and very fun walkthrough. Will play again some time for sure. After all, I replay, for example, Wiz7 every 5-7 years.
     
    • Brofist x 2
    • Thanks! x 1
    • Prestigious x 1
    • Racist x 1
    • retadred x 1
    ^ Top  
  23. Lady Error █▓▒░ ░▒▓█ Patron

    Lady Error
    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2021
    Messages:
    3,465
    Strap Yourselves In
    I got the itch for it again and I played it only a couple years ago the last time. I think I still need to forget more again to properly enjoy it.

    There is something magical about Wizardry 7 that is hard to describe.
     
    • Brofist Brofist x 3
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • Yes Yes x 1
    • Prestigious Prestigious x 1
    ^ Top  
  24. Fowyr Prestigious Gentleman Arcane

    Fowyr
    Joined:
    Mar 29, 2009
    Messages:
    6,763
    Yep, I love Wiz7 to bits. It has so perfect balance of combat, exploration, story, atmosphere and the purple prose that is just feels right. Indeed, truly magical game. I always can close my eyes and recall the haunting sound of wind passing through the Nyctalinth's empty streets or just a feel of accomplisment when you find a hidden chest or a new area.
    That's why Grimoire is so good, Cleve was the only man who could capture this elusive balance.

    Citing myself from 2017:
    BTW, stealth and music are rising now, it was just a growing pains. Can't remember about throwing.
     
    Last edited: Jun 14, 2021
    • Brofist x 6
    • nice x 1
    • incline x 1
    • Salute x 1
    • Friendly x 1
    • Racist x 1
    • retadred x 1
    ^ Top  
  25. Cleveland Mark Blakemore Golden Era Games Übermensch Developer Sad Loser

    Cleveland Mark Blakemore
    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2008
    Messages:
    9,026
    Location:
    Red Chinese Prison Colony (Australia)
    Darkest Dungeon is so amazingly complex and nuanced in the combat I can only sit there in envy. I hope with the help of the FUDGE system my next RPG is that well balanced.

    The guys who did Darkest Dungeon did such an incredible job on the game. They tweaked it to perfection. The combat is so difficult even on the easiest setting it remains challenging at any level.

    The character classes are so much better than typical D&D inspired clones. Every RPG should try to learn from this game.

    The balance of bandages, torches and no healing outside of camping and combat makes this game tough even when you have improved your characters.
     
    • Brofist x 7
    • Informative x 3
    • nice x 1
    • incline x 1
    • Yes x 1
    • Friendly x 1
    • Fabulously Optimistic x 1
    • Racist x 1
    ^ Top  

As an Amazon Associate, rpgcodex.net earns from qualifying purchases.