KickStarter Kingdom Come: Deliverance - Dan Vavra's medieval chad simulator

[Lyric Suite]

Meh, mob is bugged, they can now do stab attacks from far away.

 

[DJOGamer PT]

The truth is that it is the "poor" who are the most villanous, literally, as the term "villain" was literally intended to describe peasants (the word comes from the Latin "villanus", which signified those who worked on the soil, I.E., peasants precisely) and is point in fact completely analogous to the "Shudra" of the Hindu caste system. The peasant is at the lowest level of spiritual development because his world revolves around sense experience and little else. His "values" are good food, family, friends, work, comfort, everything that pertains to the material and merely emotional side of human existence. The higher castes are superior precisely because their values are of a more "transcendent" kind. The values of the nobility were superior because those values were supra material. Chivalry, honor, sacrifice, the ability to both face death and deal death in battle. And as for the clergy and especially the monks, their values were the highest of them all, for their world revolved around seeking trascendence and cut ties with the material world entirely.

This stems from the notion that the material reality is meaningless and of no importance
This might be true in Hinduism, but it is false in Christianity
And trying to reconcile the philosophical distinctions between the two is stupid
They are not the same
If anything, the Western idea of superiority between the different classes rests on the responsibilities of their office

 

[The_Mask]

The game was not designed with "every type of character gets their own piece of content" in mind. You're not allowed to larp, it's a game where you play as a pre-defined character - Henry, and Henry is a fornicator, a drinker and a petty thief.

Not really. No one really forces you to sleep with women/cheat on Theresa. Neither does anyone force you to drink to lower lockpicking via the oh-so-awesome-perk. Same with gorging yourself with food... no questline forces you to over-eat. And obviously no one forces you to steal, ever.

The only part you might be right is the killing, but that is simply because the stronger you get, the easier it is to kill people in 1 swing. No joke.

 

[Lyric Suite]

The truth is that it is the "poor" who are the most villanous, literally, as the term "villain" was literally intended to describe peasants (the word comes from the Latin "villanus", which signified those who worked on the soil, I.E., peasants precisely) and is point in fact completely analogous to the "Shudra" of the Hindu caste system. The peasant is at the lowest level of spiritual development because his world revolves around sense experience and little else. His "values" are good food, family, friends, work, comfort, everything that pertains to the material and merely emotional side of human existence. The higher castes are superior precisely because their values are of a more "transcendent" kind. The values of the nobility were superior because those values were supra material. Chivalry, honor, sacrifice, the ability to both face death and deal death in battle. And as for the clergy and especially the monks, their values were the highest of them all, for their world revolved around seeking trascendence and cut ties with the material world entirely.

This stems from the notion that the material reality is meaningless and of no importance
This might be true in Hinduism, but it is false in Christianity
And trying to reconcile the philosophical distinctipns between the two cultures is stupid
They are not the same
If anything, the Western idea of superioty between the different classes rests on the responsibilities of their office

Nobody is saying that the material is meaningless and of no importance (which isn't even the Hindu stance anyway). You are just turning things around because what i'm arguing against is the idea anything BUT the material is meaningless and of no importance, which is clearly the perspective of the working class. I remember my grandfather used to tell me he would have gone to church only once he saw priests getting a job, which is clearly a materialist perspective who sees no value in invisible and trascendent realities.

Christianity preaches that the Kingdom of God is within, to hate "mother and father" for the sake of Christ etc. It's obvious that the relationship with material reality is a troubled one. The material world is "flesh". Christians are not Manicheans or Gnostics who claim the world is utterly evil and even the creation of the devil itself, but at the same time they obviously believe there's an higher reality and that to reach that reality one must give up the things of this world, to whatever degree one is capable of, with the highest level reserved for monks.

And as for "reconciling" Christianity and Hinduism, that's not the question at all. The fact of the matter is that it is an obvious reality that the Hindu notion of caste is true and that it is irrelevant whether Christianity aknowledges the existence of natural classes because those exist whether one is aware of them or not. Christianity doesn't take account of caste but caste exists reguardless and medieval people were fully aware of that fact. Hell, all you have to do is just look around you and observe the effect of caste in people all the time. And if you have ever been around children you can actually see the various typologies in action from an early stage.

 

[Lyric Suite]

The game was not designed with "every type of character gets their own piece of content" in mind. You're not allowed to larp, it's a game where you play as a pre-defined character - Henry, and Henry is a fornicator, a drinker and a petty thief.

Not really. No one really forces you to sleep with women/cheat on Theresa. Neither does anyone force you to drink to lower lockpicking via the oh-so-awesome-perk. Same with gorging yourself with food... no questline forces you to over-eat. And obviously no one forces you to steal, ever.

The only part you might be right is the killing, but that is simply because the stronger you get, the easier it is to kill people in 1 swing. No joke.

I think that's the issue though. The game doesn't aknowledges your character choices, you can simply chose not do something and the game doesn't react to that choice, you basically just skipped or lost content. Which i'm not saying its necessarely a bad thing but it's a bit one sided in this game. All the "moral" options makes you lose content. Play as an immoral scoundrel and you lose nothing.

 

[Lyric Suite]

Ok, so i did the tourney with the "lite" version of that mod.

The combat has definitely improved. I had to fight tooth and nail right from the first guy and i finally lost to the last dude on the third match. Of course, not having actually sparred for real ever since training master strikes (and not having sparred a whole lot to begin with since i can't kill anyone so open confrontations are usually something i have to avoid) i feel my understanding of how sparring works is limited. Usually, the way the fights went is that i try to hit them, find an opening etc while blocking their attacks and sometimes i manage to land a hit but then suddenly they start swinging with consecutive strikes and they basically wreck my shit. After a while i basically got into the habit of hitting them once than as soon as they blocked me just step back in a hurry to avoid them going on a flurry. Occationally, i managed to do the same to them but rarely so there's definitely something i gotta figure out here.

 

[cvv]

I think that's the issue though. The game doesn't aknowledges your character choices, you can simply chose not do something and the game doesn't react to that choice, you basically just skipped or lost content. Which i'm not saying its necessarely a bad thing but it's a bit one sided in this game. All the "moral" options makes you lose content. Play as an immoral scoundrel and you lose nothing.

Been years since I played this but do you really miss out on quests if you play it nice?

Can anyone confirm this?

 

[Gerrard]

Damn, Peshek now wants me to steal an illuminated book from Hanush. This is pushing it. Even though its just a stupid game my own moral fiber is screaming at the sacrilegious nature of this act. Since this was my first run i'm pretty much doing everything but come next play and i'll definintely go full paladin. No robbery, no thieving quests. And of course if i can get this stupid merciful achievement in this run, no stealth. Just full frontal combat, with combat mods on top of it.

I think cucking the guy who saved your life right at the start was already pushing it.

 

[The_Mask]

Been years since I played this but do you really miss out on quests if you play it nice?

Can anyone confirm this?

You miss out on "activities" such as when millers and beggars send you to steal or pickpocket items. But real quests? No.

 

[cvv]

Been years since I played this but do you really miss out on quests if you play it nice?

Can anyone confirm this?

You miss out on "activities" such as when millers and beggars send you to steal or pickpocket items. But real quests? No.

Ok.

What I do remember is there's a quest with an entire village struck with some sort of sickness. If you don't give a shit all those people die and the village gets abandoned. But if you help them you a) go through an interesting and complex quest and b) get a horse vendor with the best horses in the game.

So that's at least one example where playing it nice absolutely does pay off.

 

[Multidirectional]

Godwin is definitely what a fat bearded atheist who drinks too much beer would think is a "cool priest". I'm not just talking about Vavra, I've met guys like that in real life, and you can pretty much predict word for word what they would say on subject of churches and priests. At least they gave Godwin a background that is different from that of a usual priest. Guy is an ex-soldier, if I remember correctly. So his behavior can be chalked up to him not being able to let go of some of his old habits.

 

[cvv]

At least they gave Godwin a background that is different from that of a usual priest. Guy is an ex-soldier, if I remember correctly. So his behavior can be chalked up to him not being able to let go of some of his old habits.

And that's exactly it.

Godwin is not what a fat atheist thinks is a cool priest. He's a dude who was a hell-raiser, a skirt chaser and a drunk in his youth, but ultimately a good guy and a genuine believer. He brawled in pubs, joined the military, went through a few campaigns, finally calmed down and decided to make amends for his foolish youth in the service of the Church.

But even tho you can change some things about a man, you can't change everything so he still drinks, keeps a concubine plus a few mistresses on the side and is still a hell-raiser, in a way. But he really cares about his flock.

The Woman's Lot DLC is a good example of Warhorse having a balanced take on the clergy. They have depicted an inquisitor that, incredibly, is not the embodiment of fanatical, sadistic scumbag that we're used to from p. much every movie, TV show or a game ever made.

This dude is not exactly a genial, kindly Gandalf-like figure, but he's not a villain either. He's stern and serious but that's because he really believes his job - to protect the faith and the integrity of the Church - is important and beneficial for the society. He will sentence people to death if they're convicted but only if he sees no other solution. And IIRC he even has moments of understanding and empathy.

I was very surprised by this, I don't think I've ever seen an inquisitor being portrayed like this. Generally the entire quest is one of the best ever made for any RPG, easily on par with the Bloody Baron (if not better.)

 

[Multidirectional]

At least they gave Godwin a background that is different from that of a usual priest. Guy is an ex-soldier, if I remember correctly. So his behavior can be chalked up to him not being able to let go of some of his old habits.

And that's exactly it.

Godwin is not what a fat atheist thinks is a cool priest.

I think he still is regardless. Merely pointed out that character would've been worse if he was someone who was a priest his all life.

It's clear though that game wants you to see him and Henry being druken fools as lighthearted fun and it's meant to improve your opinion of the priest rather than diminish it. It's all in the tone with which it's portrayed.

 

[rusty_shackleford]

Not sure what i'm doing wrong.

nothing

 

[Lyric Suite]

The writing in this game is something in between Baldur's Gate and one of the better Mel Gibson movies.

As far as i understand it, Godwin is basically Hans Capon if he was forced into a clerical life by his famility. This did happen as powerful families would sometime force their children into clerical positions to gain influence, which was the case with St. Thomas Aquinas, who famiously got imprisoned by his family when he refused to play their politics within the church and his brothers even attempted to corrupt him sexually by sneaking a courtesan into his cell which he famously chased out with a burning log which he then used to draw a cross on the door.

The irony is that the celibacy of the priesthood was pushed hard not just becuase it was a recurring theological theme within the western Church (sort of like the infallibility of the Pope which became an issue on and off through out the centuries), but also as a response to this. Children of influencial families attempting to obtain clerical positions for power would have been greatly deterred by such an harsh disciplinary imposition.

 

[Lyric Suite]

Not sure what i'm doing wrong.

nothing

Mmmh, maybe someone who recommended this mod can chime in.

The clinch nerf is too much. I chugged a potion that gave me an extra 5 points to strenght and i can't still beat the first guy in a clinch. He actually pushed me in a corner and kept clinching me over and over and had to reload as i was basically stuck. I understand clinch could be abused but this is basically making a whole mechanic pointless.

 

[Multidirectional]

Gameplay mods that make a lot of changes always end up ruining games more than fixing them in my experience. That's why I never even wanted to try this one.

 

[Lyric Suite]

Well, i tried some cumans and it's not as bad as the tourney. I guess the mod threats the tournament as high level. Besides, my skills are actually pretty low. All my stats and combat abilities are just past 10, where as my highest weapon skill is longsword and its at level 7. If the mod rebalances things to make combat challening at max level i can't expect to just stomp anybody while my skills are this low.

I'll keep the lite version of the mod for a while and we'll see how it does. I think the mod does something to the targeting system too, or for some reason it doesn't seem as cancerous.

 

[Lyric Suite]

Ok, so you can actually alter the parameters of the mod:

https://forums.nexusmods.com/index.php?showtopic=6982701/#entry63520861

I think i'm going to try to make clinch easier to pull off (makes no sense you can't win in a clinch against a weaker opponent) and maybe reduce the chances the AI can do perfect blocks. As it is, the AI just seems too perfect i had a round in the tourney that lastest so long i leveled up my weapon skill twice. With so much combat in this game it feels it would take forever to finish the story line if every fight lasts 1 hour. Unless of course i'm not understanding something about how the combat works.

[EDIT] Nevermind the above post is about a differrent mod but i'm sure i can change the values of this one as well.

 

[The_Mask]

I think combat skills are meant to level up fast to 10. After 10 not so much. I'm getting towards the end of the game, and I just got around 15 with all of them. And I've been attending every tourney, and taking pretty much every fight.

 

[DJOGamer PT]

i'm arguing against is the idea anything BUT the material is meaningless and of no importance, which is clearly the perspective of the working class. I remember my grandfather used to tell me he would have gone to church only once he saw priests getting a job, which is clearly a materialist perspective who sees no value in invisible and trascendent realities.

Clearly is a very strong word
Have you done some kind of extensive study on the subject, or is simply the Italian working class insane?
Because even among irreligious people here, I've barely ever met anyone who holds such an extreme materialistic view

Also, it seems more to me that your grandfather just had a beef with the clergy, not he disbelieved in the immaterial
To also use a family example - my paternal great-grandmother stopped attending mass until her death, because she felt betrayed by her priest who broke the seal of confession to inform her husband

It's obvious that the relationship with material reality is a troubled one.

I would say the trouble arises when one puts primacy of the material over the immaterial and vice-versa - or worse rejects one, for the other
Christ's resurrection was both physical and spiritual and as far as I know, Christianity is the only major religion to believe in a physical form in the afterlife - as promised by Christ

it is an obvious reality that the Hindu notion of caste is true

Says you
History says that the caste system was one of the causes of Hindu decline

 

[Lyric Suite]

"History" says nothing of the like becuase there's no such thing as "history" in the first place. Everything is cyclical, "linear" progress or decline is a myth.

Beyond that, i'm not talking about the caste system as such, but the idea of "natural" castes which is an incontrovertible reality. People are "born" as Shudra, Kshatriya etc and no amount of social confusion is going to alter that fact, as seen in modern times where those "types" exist despite society pretending there is only one size fits all human "standard" that applies to all, which is clearly false on every level possible. And while there is no explicit notion of caste in Christianity, it's obvious that medieval people were aware of its existence:

Brahmin > Kshatriya > Vaishya/Shudra. Same exact structure, totally by coincidence i'm sure.

 

[DJOGamer PT]

"History" says nothing of the like becuase there's no such thing as "history" in the first place. Everything is cyclical, "linear" progress or decline is a myth.

Says you
And Hindus I guess...

Feudalism was born out the late Roman Empire and developed from there because it thrives on efficient stratification
It has nothing with whatever pretentious trite you read from Schuon

 

[Lyric Suite]

because it thrives on efficient stratification

Speaking of trite, not to mention meaningless gibberish.

 

[Lyric Suite]

Alright, those videos show the difference between high level Henry and low level Henry on the tourney:




So i wasn't doing anything wrong low skill level is the reason those fights took so long. It's amazing how broken masterstrikes were that i was able to just brush through the tourney with ease despite the fact my combat skills are still very low.