[LP CYOA] 傳

[Azira]

Funny, nobody but Azira voted for stabbing Rong Jr with a dagger when our life immediately depended on it, and now we are ready to slaughter innocent women left and right because it would coincide with our current goals.

That's because, deep down, I'm a cold-hearted bastard.

 

[Nevill]

Again, how is it in our interest to be known as another maniac, not to mention actually become one?

Last time I checked the plan, we intended for the challenges to be non-lethal. What happened to that?

This wasn't the question you initially asked: your question was how it was in our interests to kill her, and I provided a pretty good answer. Nobody said anything about the challenges being non-lethal:

This is just a poor formatting on my part. The non-lethal part was supposed to be a separate point.
I wanted to say that it is not in our interests to go around making enemies out of every sect we come across. We already have Songfend and Emei, no reason to expand this list needlessly.

I already proposed an alternative if we could still duel: enter her room right now with the intent of terrifying her, then challenge her to a duel in the morning. But perhaps there are other options: treave, could we prick Song Lingshu with some Three Poisons Powder while she sleeps? Enough to make her feel nauseous and dizzy for most of the day. When morning comes, we can challenge her to a duel under the following terms: she is allowed to kill us, but we are not allowed to kill her. However, if she yields, she must free Yao and Cao'er. If we manage to poison her without her noticing, I think that we could pull it off, despite the fact that we're handicapped with our unorthodox style.

I am completely against your plan.

You won't explain anything to her. You essentially would be threatening her to let go of her ideals, step on her familial pride, forego justice, and let her father's murderer walk free for no other reason than just to save her life. For an upright orthodox character that we suppose she is, this would actually be worse than death. You might as well murder her right now and spare her the agony of choosing between her honor and her life. Would be kinder.

If you really want her, and not Emei, to free Yao and cancel her personal vendetta against him, A2 is the only choice. She will not let the matter slide out of fear, but she might be reasoned with.

 

[Baltika9]

A dudebro would go through with Yao's plan completely just to pay off his debt and be done with it, and not care as to what happens to the old geezer afterwards.
A true bro would make sure both of them get out alive, unharmed and never pull this dumb shit again. Not because he owes them, but because they are his bros.

There's also the matter of C1 trying to do too much at once: nab Cao'er and assassinate the heiress all in two hours' time and then sneak away? That's just pushing it, pick one or the other.

 

[Nevill]

There's also the matter of C1 trying to do too much at once: nab Cao'er and assassinate the heiress all in two hours' time and then sneak away? That's just pushing it, pick one or the other.

Don't forget putting a bloody graffiti all over the walls.

A true bro would make sure both of them get out alive, unharmed and never pull this dumb shit again. Not because he owes them, but because they are his bros.

Then why did you go with an option that lets him attempt this dumb shit after he is free?

 

[treave]

It should take all of ten minutes to slit her throat while she sleeps and write with her blood. You're not an uneducated farmer, it's not like you're going to spend an hour rubbing off the words then trying to get them right over and over.

 

[Baltika9]

Because we're the absolute worst person to mediate between him and the Emei. In fact, we just might fuck things up even more. It is without doubt that Yao cares about Cao'er, so he will come and see her for his parting words/whatever, and that's when we settle this shit once and for all: what's going to happen to Cao'er, what's going to happen with him and where we stand. Right now, priority number one is getting the two of them outta here and he has a plan to do that, provided we make Cao'er disappear. I'm rolling with that, Yao is a smart dude.

And I don't know about fostering her with the Ashina, Yunzi strikes me as a very territorial girl.

How long till the poll closes?

 

[Smashing Axe]

It should take all of ten minutes to slit her throat while she sleeps and write with her blood. You're not an uneducated farmer, it's not like you're going to spend an hour rubbing off the words then trying to get them right over and over.

If only we had more ranks in artistic expression, we could really do some nifty calligraphy with her entrails.

 

[treave]

How long till the poll closes?

Unless there are some pressing arguments to work out, perhaps in 5 or 6 hours.

 

[Nevill]

Because we're the absolute worst person to mediate between him and the Emei. In fact, we just might fuck things up even more. It is without doubt that Yao cares about Cao'er, so he will come and see her for his parting words/whatever, and that's when we settle this shit once and for all: what's going to happen to Cao'er, what's going to happen with him and where we stand. Right now, priority number one is getting the two of them outta here and he has a plan to do that, provided we make Cao'er disappear. I'm rolling with that, Yao is a smart dude.

Why would we mediate between him and Emei? I want this shit done ASAP exactly because I want to get out of here before Emei come. I am going to maintain a very safe distance from them while we have Cao'er with us.

Yao cares for Cao'er, but he cares about his pride just the same. The conflict is tearing the old man apart. If we take Cao'er off his hands, there will be no more doubts left.

Do you think he'll try go for Lingshu's head, or don't you? Because I definitely do.

And I don't know about fostering her with the Ashina, Yunzi strikes me as a very territorial girl.

And Cao'er strikes me as a very unpretentious and modest girl. She isn't going to steal the young princess' popularity or step on her toes any time soon. They'll get agong just fine, since their interests should not intersect in any way.

Oh, and A2>B3. I may not be around when the votes close.

 

[Azira]

Oi guys? Honor, you know, right? The thing the orthodox is real keen on? Well, the assassinated leader of this sect here, he shat right and profoundly on honor, twice. Two times he refused to pay the price he knew he had to pay.

If I'm not mistaken, that reflects poorly on the entire sect, as he was the leader.
The new leader, if she takes honor seriously, would have to pay the price or lose face.
Thing is, Zhang wants her to lose face. But he also wants her humiliated by us proving we're better than her in combat, so we can't just have her up and admit she's a terrible, terrible person and daughter of an honorless prick, we need to defeat her first.

Simplest thing would be to kill her to claim the price, then write the reason with blood on the walls, signed by Xu Jing.
A more complicated solution would be to challenge her in the open, citing the above reason, and then maul her. We don't, per se, need to kill her, it's just the simpler way about this.

 

[Baltika9]

Hm, I kinda want to complete Zhang's challenge without killing anyone, bonus for not maiming anyone either. Just to see the look on his face.

 

[Azira]

It would differentiate Jing from the Maniac, that's true.

 

[Baltika9]

Naw, I was thinking of whether or not that would be a good toll on our part:
"Master Zhang, I accomplished your task and defeated all of my "peers" in single combat... without killing or maiming a single one of them. Something you are too much of a wuss to do. U mad, bro?" Overloading the Wudang Student's qi system with our own Warpstuff is pretty tempting, though.

On a more serious note, would he even care if we did that, or would he only care about us accomplishing his task? We definitely need to get some info on him at our earliest convenience, this secrecy frustrates me heavily.

 

[Nevill]

If I'm not mistaken, that reflects poorly on the entire sect, as he was the leader.

You are not mistaken.

The new leader, if she takes honor seriously, would have to pay the price or lose face.

That's right. She can pay the price by trading her life for Yao's. But she might not know the circumstances behind this case.
This is why I insist on talking to her.

Thing is, Zhang wants her to lose face.

I don't think Zhang cares one bit about that, or anything else for this matter. It would amuse him. It would also amuse him if you did your challenge non-violently.

What he cares for is to make you the ultimate weapon of destruction, a warrior without peers, a living monument to his teachings. The details do not concern him.

 

[Baltika9]

What are his teachings, though? We haven't received a single bit of philosophical instruction:

“Vessels are useless,” he said. “All you need to do is to unshackle your qi from the narrow channels that constrain it. Your qi has transcended the need for a path. The harmony of the Way is heresy to your being. Let your strength flow freely; embrace the discord and chaos, and you will become more powerful than you can ever imagine.”

Just month after grueling month of physical training. I doubt Zhang is that focused on the physical that he forgets the philosophical and intellectual, he is a Fellow of the Manor, has an extensive library on his island and is an extremely intelligent man, a genius almost (something even tells me he may have had the same problem as us, or something close to it, his knowledge of the underlying principles and subject certainly suggest it). And yet, if he wants us to be the monument of his teachings, what are they?
"Chaos is freedom?" or "Harmony is for pussies?"
Edit: is he Chaos made manifest?

 

[Nevill]

Isn't he just a social darwinist/survivalist that places the utmost importance on personal power, and not on some moral conduct or whatever philosophical mumbo-jumbo?

He does appear to me that way. He acts as if the weak have no place in his world unless they entertain him. If there is a higher idea behind his teachings, it haven't manifested itself yet.

Why do you think there is more to him than meets the eye, anyway? Apart from that you really want this to be the case.

 

[Jester]

Hm, I kinda want to complete Zhang's challenge without killing anyone, bonus for not maiming anyone either. Just to see the look on his face.

I hope that we can pull this off. Reaction on this approach would be as funny as tiger befriending.

Isn't he just a social darwinist/survivalist that places the utmost importance on personal power, and not on some moral conduct or whatever philosophical mumbo-jumbo?

He does appear to me that way. He acts as if the weak have no place in his world unless they entertain him. If there is a higher idea behind his teachings, it haven't manifested itself yet.

Why do you think there is more to him than meets the eye, anyway? Apart from that you really want this to be the case.

It sound like Jade Empire closed fist road to me, hope i am wrong. Guess he posses interesting sense of humor?

 

[Grimgravy]

I'd go for B1 if I didn't have a feeling our target will be awake, or be awoken as we make our way to her, for one reason or another. Things have gone too smoothly thus far and our luck can't hold out. I doubt we'll have time to kill her and save Cao'er. It wouldn't take much delay for the dawn to screw us.

 

[TOME]

I would vote B1 if we had more time till dawn. We have a debt to Yao but I think Cao'er's safety comes first. B3. Yao can do as he pleases after that.

 

[Nevill]

I am appalled by the number of people that are willing to murder innocents just because the guy we really respect says so. Guess we aren't sliding off Shun's cock anytime soon.

Wouldn't it be funny if Cao'er, being the kind and compassionate girl that she is, asked you to stop this bloody feud and save them both? In fact, what if she is a guest, rather then the prisoner, here, trying to persuade Lingshu to spare her master's life?

 

[Esquilax]

Nevill is right that saving Cao'er will mean that Yao has nothing holding him back if he decides to kill Lingshu. I think she's going to die by his hand if we don't kill her anyways.

I am completely against your plan.

You won't explain anything to her. You essentially would be threatening her to let go of her ideals, step on her familial pride, forego justice, and let her father's murderer walk free for no other reason than just to save her life. For an upright orthodox character that we suppose she is, this would actually be worse than death. You might as well murder her right now and spare her the agony of choosing between honor and her life. Would be kinder.

If you really want her, and not Emei, to free Yao and cancel her personal vendetta against him, A2 is the only choice. She will not let the matter slide out of fear, but she might be reasoned with.

Okay dude, what exactly do you expect here? We are on a mission to humiliate the orthodox sects by any means necessary as the Southern Maniac's apprentice, now we have to worry about everybody's feelings along the way? Not saying you are wrong in this assessment, but don't expect to succeed in Zhang's mission if you don't like stepping on a few toes. We have to go through eight people by the end of this, and a few of them are probably going to die.

I am appalled by the number of people that are willing to murder innocents just because the guy we really respect says so. Guess we aren't sliding off Shun's cock anytime soon.

You mean Shun, our dearest and closest friend, who protected us after we attacked the woman-in-black? The guy who stood by for us even though our actions led to him getting hurt? That guy? If there is anyone we ought to be loyal to, it's Shun. Every indication that we've been given tells us that Shun is an awesome guy, why would we go against him? Freedom may have changed Jing's ideas a bit, but I don't understand this reaction against Shun, when he's been the most trustworthy person that we've ever known.

Oi guys? Honor, you know, right? The thing the orthodox is real keen on? Well, the assassinated leader of this sect here, he shat right and profoundly on honor, twice. Two times he refused to pay the price he knew he had to pay.

If I'm not mistaken, that reflects poorly on the entire sect, as he was the leader.
The new leader, if she takes honor seriously, would have to pay the price or lose face.
Thing is, Zhang wants her to lose face. But he also wants her humiliated by us proving we're better than her in combat, so we can't just have her up and admit she's a terrible, terrible person and daughter of an honorless prick, we need to defeat her first.

Simplest thing would be to kill her to claim the price, then write the reason with blood on the walls, signed by Xu Jing.
A more complicated solution would be to challenge her in the open, citing the above reason, and then maul her. We don't, per se, need to kill her, it's just the simpler way about this.

Absolutely. I think we're making the mistake of confusing the idea of honor in this setting with doing the right thing (i.e. the moral thing), when honor actually means doing the proper thing (i.e. keeping your word, paying your debts). A lot of the time honor means being a good guy, but a lot of the time it also means doing what's appropriate, even if it happens to be distasteful. Yao may have acted recklessly and put Cao'er in needless danger, but the man was well within his rights to claim the debt on Song Jiangke, who reneged on the deal twice. The Qingcheng sect head wanted to have his cake and eat it too. Killing Song Lingshu isn't the right thing, but it's certainly the proper thing according to the established honor code here.

As for why I'd challenge her out in the open, slaying Song Lingshu in that matter would mean that we don't become sworn enemies of the Qingcheng since we took her out fair and square. Assassinating her, then writing our signature with her entrails, as awesome as it is, pretty much ensures that the sect will hunt us for the rest of our lives. Y'know... once they decide on a new leader after both the father and the daughter were wiped out.

However, an open challenge poses problems in and of itself. A lot of people would see our fighting style in action before the tournament, so if we decide to compete incognito as a masked martial artist, someone will figure out who we really are based on our fighting style. Another alternative might be to kill Song Lingshu anonymously. Sure, we wouldn't get Zhang's credit for it, but it'd fulfill Yao's debt just fine.

I am on the fence here, I could flop to B1 soon.

Fuck it, flopped to B1. Using our newfound rep, I say we go to the competition openly, as the Southern Maniac's apprentice. We'll remind our competitors that even if they win, we might pay them a visit too like we did to Qingcheng.

 

[treave]

As for why I'd challenge her out in the open, slaying Song Lingshu in that matter would mean that we don't become sworn enemies of the Qingcheng since we took her out fair and square.

Hm, not that clear cut, no. You're not supposed to kill or maim in a challenge, as far as the orthodox sects are concerned. Zhang doesn't give a shit if you turn the whole world into your enemy, but do not expect to make friends amongst the orthodox sects if you injure or kill any of them without good reason (i.e in a situation where they were clearly in the wrong, and you can prove that you had just cause to do so. Challenging them to prove your superiority is not a good reason.).

Something regarding the challenge; Zhang's wording isn't as straightforward as it initially seems. But we'll get to Jing's thoughts on the matter when we begin the challenges proper.

Now, let's return to the Qingcheng case.

What happened in Songfeng was a different situation where Cao'er had just saved Rong Sr's life and you demanded the death price, allowing for a duel in lieu of Rong Jr. kneeling down and handing his own head over. Master Rong, the person you had saved, agreed to accept the result no matter what happens, as long as it is conducted honourably. That is why Songfeng hasn't put out a bounty on your head.

With Qingcheng, you will have to fulfil these criteria for such a scenario to play out again in exactly the same way:
a) Since Song Lingshu is the new head of the sect, she must agree to the challenge herself.
b) Song Lingshu and Qingcheng must be aware that you are fighting to claim Yao's death price.
c) Song Lingshu must make it clear that no matter what happens to her, no vengeance should be taken.
d) The newest head of Qingcheng and the sect members must be willing to listen to those directions should you succeed in killing her.

 

[Kipeci]

How will they go about picking a new leader?

 

[treave]

The most senior surviving disciple will take over in the absence of any other contingencies set by the previous head. Song Lingshu only got the job because she was designated as heir, and she is also considered to be rather talented for her age. But this is rare; in the other seven of the Eight Sects, the position is not hereditary - the previous head usually picks the disciple he or she think best suited to be the next leader. They are not small family schools. It wasn't hereditary here either before Song Jiangke named his daughter as successor.

But do not read this brief post and immediately jump to the conclusion that you know all about internal politics in Qingcheng already and attempt to assume things like, "Oh they won't be mad if we kill her!".

They might be. They might not be. At this point you don't have the information to know for sure.

 

[Kipeci]

How much time is left until dawn, anyway? You said that we could probably do the deed in about ten minutes, so how much time would that leave us with?