Magic the Gathering Arena

[new fucking guy]

It's the historic update day. Got any exciting brews?
I'll be jamming nexus cause I loved that deck. Kinda scared of QB. I though about it for a bit and I think the best decks will be red aggro and kethis combo. There's not that many decks using graveyard so sideboarding against it is a bitch too.

 

[anvi]

If you are looking for a deck to grind Jeskai Fires is a solid choice, unless new meta turns out to be filled with UW control or Simic Flash (it struggles vs counterspells). The build you posted is kinda outdated though - nowadays Fires decks don't pack the planeswalkers package opting to run Cavaliers and Returned King instead. They play more like a combo one turn kill deck now. Here, have a sample list:

https://www.mtggoldfish.com/deck/2510389#paper

Thanks! Do you think that is the best version of Fires? I kinda left a Fires deck as my last resort because it looks a bit boring to play. But if all else fails (and it did), I will give that a try. I don't mind playing that if it wins a lot, I'll use that for standard event and ranked, and then a fun deck I can play just for fun.

 

[you know what time it is]

Simic flash is the gayest shit ever, I don't like playing bo3, but bo1 is infested with it, so I might have to switch with my Grixis Fires. One asshole topdecked 4 frilled mystics in a row, the archetype is like a typical anti-fun blue cranked up to eleven, superaids.

 

[lukaszek]

deterministic system > RNG

 

[anvi]

I haven't tried a single brawl yet. I don't like the idea of paying gold to try it out. I'll probably suck until I get the hang of it which seems like a big waste of gold.

 

[Multi-headed Cow]

Simic flash is the gayest shit ever, I don't like playing bo3, but bo1 is infested with it, so I might have to switch with my Grixis Fires. One asshole topdecked 4 frilled mystics in a row, the archetype is like a typical anti-fun blue cranked up to eleven, superaids.

Fires isn't what you want to fight simic flash, since your only hope is to sneak a 3feri down under a counterspell. Aggro decks typically give flash a harder time since they can multispell and get stuff past counters, whereas slower stuff like fires often isn't running their own counterspells (Since fires fucks that anyway) and usually just drop one threat a turn unless fires resolves.

I haven't tried a single brawl yet. I don't like the idea of paying gold to try it out. I'll probably suck until I get the hang of it which seems like a big waste of gold.

Brawl's free. It was only like 3,000 gold and that was just in October, throughout November it's just a free event for fun on Wednesday.

 

[anvi]

Oh cool thanks I'll try it. I just got done beating a guy and I feel bad about it All he played all game was some little junk things that I nuked, and Midnight Clock which he painstakingly built up over several turns, close to 12 counters, then I stole it and used it myself... Then he played another clock, built up again, got as high as 10 counters, and I stole it again :/ I mean... I had to. I didn't even know what his deck was supposed to do but I didn't want to lose to find out.

 

[Scruffy]

So, a friend and I are tinkering with this, and it's a lot of fun:

Spoiler

Deck
4 Risen Reef (M20) 217
1 Rakdos Guildgate (RNA) 255
1 Swamp (ANA) 58
4 Golos, Tireless Pilgrim (M20) 226
3 Deathsprout (WAR) 189
1 Boros Guildgate (GRN) 243
2 Circuitous Route (GRN) 125
4 Growth Spiral (RNA) 178
4 Assassin's Trophy (GRN) 152
3 Casualties of War (WAR) 187
2 Ugin, the Ineffable (WAR) 2
4 Gates Ablaze (RNA) 102
4 Golgari Guildgate (GRN) 249
2 Chandra, Awakened Inferno (M20) 127
1 Fae of Wishes (ELD) 44
4 Plaza of Harmony (RNA) 254
3 Gateway Plaza (WAR) 246
1 Izzet Guildgate (GRN) 252
1 Gruul Guildgate (RNA) 249
4 Simic Guildgate (RNA) 257
1 Island (ANA) 57
4 Dimir Guildgate (GRN) 245
1 Mountain (ANA) 59
1 Forest (ANA) 60

Sideboard
1 Nicol Bolas, Dragon-God (WAR) 207
1 Thought Distortion (M20) 117
1 Kaya's Wrath (RNA) 187
1 God-Pharaoh's Statue (WAR) 238
1 Planar Cleansing (M20) 33
1 Deafening Clarion (GRN) 165
1 Casualties of War (WAR) 187
1 Chandra, Awakened Inferno (M20) 127
1 Liliana, Dreadhorde General (WAR) 97

 

[anvi]

That looks so much like a deck I have! But yours is better because it uses the gates. I really need that because I ended up wasting Assassin's Trophy / Deathsprout / even the Casualties of War on crappy little token creatures that were nibbling me to death. I put Ritual of Soot in the deck which helps but then it doesn't hit bigger things... Gates Ablaze solves that! Nuke all the small shit and then use the big spells on the big cards. I'll try that now.

I lost my Plat 2 tonight, too many fires decks and they kick my ass so much. I can generally kill their first few Bolas and Liliana, and even Chandra. But the chandra always gets the spell off first which means I am taking 1 damage every turn, and with multiple chandras... and maybe 1 turn waiting for removal, that always ends up being about 4 damage per turn. I can't survive that for long. Also even when I kill several of the PWs, there are always more that come out... So harsh.

 

[Multi-headed Cow]

Have to say it's a little fun to play the historic event and get matched against people playing non-stop Once Upon a Time/questing beast/Oko/Nissa and then you shit all over them with esper control. Azcanta and T5feri take me away~
(If they were maindecking veil they wouldn't be in this situation, but whatcha gonna do)

Probably not going to craft the rares for the historic pack, but I'm a little tempted by hyppy just because I like him. Even though he's inexplicably a rare now. Still, since I play fuck-all historic it'd be silly. The event just made me curious to play some pain in the ass esper. I was genuinely shocked that I didn't see a single Orzhov vampire deck since that was massively dominant before rotation, but I ended up going 5-1 so I might've just dodged 'em. Most common was green decks using the recently banned stuff for some reason. No mono blue tempo either.

 

[spectre]

My 5 cents about the deck:

1) Get a fast win condition in there. Pinging a guy to death with Chandra, or manually ultimating Lilly and Bolo takes forever. At least add a Planewide Celebration, or maybe Karn's Bastion. Hydroid Krasis fits in and solves a number of issues in one go.
2) Not sure what the Risen Reef does without copy effects, bounce or other elementals. If you want accelleration, at least you get some beef on Beanstalk Giant.
3) You don't have any draw. Any control deck will have a field day with you, and it's super difficult to re-use Fae if you need to draw those two cards manually (and if you're running one, it'll be doing a lot of bouncing).
If you're low on deck space, the only way to tuck extra draw is the black castle in the mana base, together with the blue castle for filtering.
4) I'd try a Karn, Great Creator in there. It lets you expand the wishboard and tuck in shit like Gate Collossus.
5) Teferi + Agent is bonkers in a deck like this.

 

[Dawkinsfan69]

Playing goofy decks in unranked and literally only run into either:

• Fires
• Cavalcade
• Mono-green (questing beast/pelt etc..)

yup think it's about time to uninstall cyaaaa

 

[Multi-headed Cow]

Playing goofy decks in unranked and literally only run into either:

• Fires
• Cavalcade
• Mono-green (questing beast/pelt etc..)

yup think it's about time to uninstall cyaaaa

Just place historic bro, I got a deck for you.

Spoiler

Deck
1 Jace, Wielder of Mysteries (WAR) 54
55 Island (ANA) 62
4 Treasure Hunt (WWK) 42

 

[Dawkinsfan69]

Playing goofy decks in unranked and literally only run into either:

• Fires
• Cavalcade
• Mono-green (questing beast/pelt etc..)

yup think it's about time to uninstall cyaaaa

Just place historic bro, I got a deck for you.

Spoiler

Deck
1 Jace, Wielder of Mysteries (WAR) 54
55 Island (ANA) 62
4 Treasure Hunt (WWK) 42

Lol that's funny. I just tried it real quick in unranked historic and guess what deck I was matched vs?

Spoiler

FoTD

 

[anvi]

Playing goofy decks in unranked and literally only run into either:

• Fires
• Cavalcade
• Mono-green (questing beast/pelt etc..)

yup think it's about time to uninstall cyaaaa

Yeah it is really shit. I can understand people wanting to try out their deck once before taking it to a competitive mode, but endless net decks in unranked just sucks. I think they should do something about it, and they should also improve sparky. I always play against her when I first make a new deck, but she is really shit. I wish there was a difficulty setting because she makes mistakes on purpose which is patronizing but also doesn't help when I want to test my deck.

 

[spectre]

I made a few threads on the official forums on how to improve sparky, didn't get much traction. Seems like the devs don't really want to spend resources on this feature and no major chunk of the players is really interested.
The AI is only really useful for extremely basic goldfishing, checking how consistent is the combo/kill, is the mana all right. There must be something seriously wrong with your deck if you struggle with it.

I actually had a good experience in historic today. The event was nothing special, being Bo1, I ran through it with vamps, which as as efficient as ever in putting FotD in its place. Then I went Bo3 ranked, which is the only mode that makes sense for historic play, imo.
Didn't play a lot, but neither game was an obvious netdeck. Recreated my esper control from memory and had a good time toying with big teferi and settle the wreckage. I forgot how I missed playing with those cards.

 

[anvi]

I've never lost to Sparky even once, I am saying it is too easy to be useful for testing new decks, which means that people have to test their new (competitive) decks in unranked which is not fair on people who want to play casual homebrews.

 

[spectre]

The problem with unranked is that it still counts wins, and when the progress is all about wins, you get shit like this. I haven't played unranked in ages, but wasn't there supposed to be some kind of deck strength pairing involved? Or perhaps people are trying to drop their MMR on purpose by conceding a bunch?

I think the AI could easily handle something simplistic, where you just proceed to dump your hand, say mono red or mono white aggro. If there was a way to update the decks it has (they're quite terrible, even for a practice opponent, 50% land, mana curve stops at three - it pretty much stops playing things past a certain turn mark, not sure if that's intentional). If it had, say a competitive, pre-rotation mono white deck, you could test if your deck is viable and the AI would be useful past NPE. I've only really played with it when I wanted to see a combo through, and it involved so many clicks, there's no way a human opponent would let me.

 

[anvi]

Damn I was up to Plat 2 and today I dropped to the bottom of Plat 4 :/ I think Simic Flash did it to me, there were a lot of those today and it screws my deck good. I think control is just so screwed against it because I only really have 1 spell per turn until late game, and they counter everything so I never make it to late game.

 

[you know what time it is]

Flash just made me quit again, it's just so boring to play against and it's all over bo3 now too, saw multiple variations of it, not just simic. With cats being quite dominant as well, it's basically go aggro or go home, even oko was better than this trash.

 

[anvi]

Yeah, I used to do quite well against Oko. With the cat decks it depends on my draw, I can win if I get enough lands to use my Agent on his ovens or fae of wishes an Ethereal Absolution, or use Assassin's Trophy on them or whatever. Half the time I don't make it in time but at least I have a chance. Simic Flash is just no chance for me... They can easily counter my first several spells which is usually enough to win the game before I play anything. I have a few Murderous Riders in most of my decks which at least lets me nuke one of their creatures after they flash it into play at the end of my turn, but they always have another and the creature that counters a spell as it enters is enough to finish me off too. Harsh deck... :/

I planned to make a Fires deck but it seems pointless while Simic Flash is so rampant.

 

[you know what time it is]

Yeah, I used to do quite well against Oko. With the cat decks it depends on my draw, I can win if I get enough lands to use my Agent on his ovens or fae of wishes an Ethereal Absolution, or use Assassin's Trophy on them or whatever. Half the time I don't make it in time but at least I have a chance. Simic Flash is just no chance for me... They can easily counter my first several spells which is usually enough to win the game before I play anything. I have a few Murderous Riders in most of my decks which at least lets me nuke one of their creatures after they flash it into play at the end of my turn, but they always have another and the creature that counters a spell as it enters is enough to finish me off too. Harsh deck... :/

I planned to make a Fires deck but it seems pointless while Simic Flash is so rampant.

Aye cats are mostly manageable (spyglass or leyline do them in), the mechanic implementation in Arena itself is just tedious to sit through. Flash just bothers me from a design perspective, it's so painfully unfun to play against, It's like giving someone reclamation on turn 1 + an ability to cast creatures on opponents turn. I don't mind aggro decks, don't mind control (nexus and double teferis aside), since against both you have a window of opportunity and they don't cancel out entire archetypes, but that flash shit just makes my blood boil, such a pussy way to play the game.

 

[anvi]

Exactly, cats is annoying, I spend 99% of the game alt tabbed while they do their stupid back and forth. But at least I have a chance. Flash is just un-fun shit. I felt the same way about Field of the Dead. They need to be more careful about these sorts of things. The game is supposed to be broad enough to let you build an aggro deck, combo, or control. If something like Flash becomes too strong it means aggro is the only viable option which is boring. It is partly that why I quit MTG Online over 10 years ago and never went back. I spent all this time playing free versions because I didn't want to support them on principle. Now I'm giving them money again which feels bad :/ But I do enjoy it most of the time

I was happy today because I whooped a Fires deck. He played Bolas and I Murderous Ridered it. Then I wished for a Ego and I removed all his Bolas. Then he played a Chandra and gave me the 1 damage per turn curse, and I played an Agent and stole it. He had nothing to remove PWs so every turn I gave him another curse. At about 5 damage per turn he quit. Feels good, beating Fires by turning his own evil against him

 

[Dawkinsfan69]

In my view, aggro decks along with simic flash maximize the rng element of the game. First, the plays you make as or against those decks are always obvious, and second, since they aim to close out the game by turn 5 or 6, you have very restricted ability to make decisions beyond "just play what you can and hope for the best".

Simic flash is particularly annoying because they basically just don't let you play the game (if they draw right), but all of those aggro decks just want to play out their hand and hope you draw bad for the matchup. Winning against an aggro deck, especially in BO1, basically just means drawing correctly and it's a flip of a coin whether you do or don't. So those matches are like on the extreme side of the spectrum where the outcomes are entirely dependent on RNG.

Problem is, despite possibly having a lower win rate than other T1 decks, aggro decks are the fastest way to get wins. And since the game rewards wins with both daily rewards and rank in competitive, lots of people just queue up with an aggro deck to churn out 3 or 4 wins in 15 minutes then log out. So basically, you end up playing a whole lot of 'non-games' of magic because the reward structure of the game incentivizes playing aggro.

 

[spectre]

The problem comes directly from the nature of Bo1, and I don't think there's any going around it. The mode inherently favors linear strategies like this, because all it takes is to win the coin toss to play first, and you already at a significant advantage.
The rest is about mulliganning away the horrible hands, and the deck more or less plays itself. So, you will always have a lot of aggro, and if the meta shifts towards control (as it happens now), people will play the "control killer" deck, i.e. Flash, or some kind of UB disruption.

Not sure how they could fix this without inviting exploits and retardation (I've seen suggestions to count time spent in game as a way to calculate rewards, which opens another can of worms). They could give additional benefits to playing Bo3 to steer people in that direction.
And speaking of Bo3, I was having quite a good time forcing concession after concession when their Field of the Dead got Ego'd.