Might and Magic Might & Magic X - Legacy

[Excidium]

That's just in the beginning, the majority of the world is closed off but I don't see it as a big deal, you wouldn't get far beyond the bridge by the castle anyway. But I grant you the mountains should open up sooner and not require you to get the air shard first, which is relatively high-level stuff.

Act 2 is hardly just the beginning. And the whole game should be open from the getgo, the main quest and blessings should involve rewards not be used as means to gate content and artificially restrict exploration.

I don't know any game that opens up completely for the exploration from the get go, not Wizardries, not Krondor and certainly not MM 6-8. There's always a starting area, always some artificial barrier (remember the field of fragrant flowers in W7?). In Krondor the game flat out tells you that you're not supposed to go that far yet and is done with it.

3-5 were certainly much more open than this. Just look at their maps.

 

[Crooked Bee]

I think we thought that was some kind of mistake by the previewer?

Yeah, most likely. I may be mistaken, but I think that preview's the only one ever mentioning something like that.

 

[sser]

With the exception of the end content, the game isn't railroaded at all. I missed the path to the Lost City and ended up clearing out pretty much the entire map doing most of the quests available aside from those that required the water/air shards. A railroaded game typically won't let you become demigods and two-shot what were supposed to be difficult bosses. If you wanna be a dumbfuck like me and blunder around the world way before you're supposed to, you can do it. I also don't feel like "certain spells don't work all the time" is a particularly good argument to be making. Of course certain enemies are going to be resistant to certain things. When has that ever not been the case in a solid, balanced RPG? Your party is like a toolkit and just cause you got a hammer doesn't mean every enemy has to be a nail. Also the Defender can taunt most basic enemies, but even when he can't there's an ability to intercept damage against your softer characters. I feel like the notion that one strictly physical, melee character should cover all your bases for protecting the party from a very diverse cast of enemies is way too MMORPG thinking for my tastes.

 

[Abelian]

That's from 2011 and it's about Heroes...

Sorry, about that, didn't read the page in detail.

However, I found these:
Exhibit A
Exhibit B
I rest my case
In Exhibit A, you quoted the same article as CB did above.

 

[cvv]

I'm in Act 2 and it gets better and better.

Question: if a monster is shown to be immune to Mind manipulation, what are the spells that are mind-related. I know for example that the "time stop" kind of spell is one of them, but is there a complete list?

Also it seems that some descriptions are not 100% accurate. For example the "Unstoppable Assault" says it always hits and ignores blocking, but I had several instances when it was blocked. Or for a dual wield, it only works for the main hand and the other hand is just a regular attack?

I think the game's a bit broken in this regard. Some bosses can be taunted, some can't, most can be skullcracked.

Also spells and abilities dealing with the block mechanics are clearly bugged, for example the "Radiant Weapon" spell should stop the mob from blocking but it works only sometimes, on some mobs. Flawless Assault (an awesome GM Warfare skill) works without a hitch though.

 

[Eyeball]

Eugh, I forgot how the game worked and wasted literally hours fighting content way too hard for me. Ran into a mob in the forest while looking for the hideout of the rebel leader, it kicked my ass heartily. I then assumed the leader would be somewhere beyond the mob and went all over the continent trying to get strong enough to beat it. Once I did, I found out they were just guarding some halfway decent treasure and that the actual rebel leader was hiding in a part of the forest I'd missed exploring so far. I then steamrolled the dungeon with my overleveled party without having to rest once. Funny how the "this enemy is too hard for you, you probably don't need to go here yet" mechanic of the game seems to be taken straight out of the HOMM series.

Has anyone played ranger until they got their point-blank skill? Is that skill enough to make rangers some kind of bow-and-arrow shotgun close quarters combat machine or does it suck for the entirity of the game?

 

[Lhynn]

"I like MMX despite numerous design flaws and will completely dismiss your criticism as opinion/L2P issues"

vs

"I hate MMX because of numerous design flaws and will make use of hyperbole and limited impressions to make them sound much worse than they really are"

I see what you're getting at, but I don't think that it's a correct representation. No one was arguing that the game was perfect. People were reacting on the notion that the game's flaws completely condemned it.

Meh... I'll rejoin when I'm done.

who is that deleted user?

And yeah, no one is saying the game is perfect, far from it, but its really cool for what it is, it literally surpassed my expectations (which i admit weren't that high to begin with). Its a fun game with challenging mechanics that start getting old about the time they are not needed anymore (when you are past midgame).

Id say it has a shitty beginning that shows promise (not in the combat but in the fact that it doesnt let you explore the world), a very good mid game that is fun, challenging and pretty interesting to explore and an endgame that i havent experienced yet, but i heard is piss easy.

I do feel the boss immunities are cheap as fuck, that the maze like design of most outdoor areas is shit, and that spell casting and ranged combat both need an overhaul, but all in all i expect it to be fixed in the sequel (please, let there be one). Because that particular thing felt lazy.
That said, im impressed with what did with the elements they had, they just need to work a lot to polish it.

 

[Visperas]

I think I've already burnt this game. I might come back to it but right now I don't feel like playing anymore. M&MX feels too simple and limited. In the first hours it's fun to discover what your characters and their abilities do, the magic items and the relics, etc.. but after a while (I've got the earth and water shard, and recently entered Karthal) it feels repetitive. Only magic users get some variety of different spells to play with tactics but, as others have said, against bosses you can only buff yourself and deal damage. For me greatest problem is that there's little else except not so good combat, exploration is not very rewarding due to poor itemization, social interaction and C&C are non-existant...
I guess it's time to try Blackguards and maybe come back for more M&MX later on...

 

[Eyeball]

This game is roughly a trillion times better than Blackguards.

 

[Grunker]

What is it with all the Blackguads-haters who find this thread with the sole purpose of continuing their Blackguards-rant here? Every 300 posts there's a "dis more gud than Blackguards"-post, shit's really bizarre

 

[Excidium]

What is it with all the Blackguads-haters who find this thread with the sole purpose of continuing their Blackguards-rant here? Every 300 posts there's a "dis more gud than Blackguards"-post, shit's really bizarre

Probably to piss Roxor off.

 

[Clockwork Knight]

Rivalries are healthy.

If you want to enjoy them, you should play games first and then read the Codex, never the reverse.

I just got used to the fact some people are really sensitive and what I would consider a minor problem can be a RUINED FOREVER issue for them. Maybe their point of view is just as valid as mine, but I can keep things separate.

Still, I'm so happy I played FO2 before coming here. I was able to mostly ignore San Francisco as a boring area, now all I can see is Tom Cruise dragging me to a chair so I can watch an educational scientology movie (at least I get +2 Luck from it).

 

[Arkeus]

I also think some people's complaints might come from not looking at what differing abilities do both thereotically and in practicals.

There are a TONS of different ways to deal with creatures depending on their immunities, and this is why Warfare/multiple magic schools are so importants: no monsters, no bosses, are immune to more than a third of them.

Killing the cyclope with a level 6 party just after leaving the lighthouse because of clever use of Skullcrack is one of the moments that make you go :D and realize that maybe you should be more careful about your abilities. Then jumping right then against the shadow dragon and killing it via abuse of the basic water spells make you go :D :D.

Different enemies are all not-immune to stuff (even boss wises), so make sure you master the system, and not just try always the same tactic of 'hit first with challenge when the enemy has all his blocks left'/'hit skullcracks on casters only'/'use mana surge on wizards only'.

Those spells/abilities are much more eclectic than that.

 

[Damned Registrations]

Good luck skull cracking the cyclops without a bladedancer. My party is level 12 and that thing still rapes me. It just blocks skull crack half the time and wipes most of my party.

I played enough to get a little into act 2 where the game supposedly opens up and gets good before stopping. It's just not enjoyable. All the loot is banal boring shit. I was pleasantly surprised once so far while playing, when I got those relic boots. The surprise wore off rapidly when I realized how little those boots actually mattered after they leveled twice and still had basically no impact at all despite clearly being the best the game had to offer item wise. Every other drop, literally dozens upon dozens of items, was either vendor trash or a miniscule incremental upgrade. I never even got a sizable chunk of gold in one place. Or experience bonus. So why the fuck would I care to crawl around through a corridor forest fighting wolves that take 10 turns a head to kill in an ugly, slow paced combat slog?

Fuck, you don't even get the satisfaction of feeling like you properly explored a place, because enemies just pop up out of thin air from spots you already explored. Why the fuck even have a map if it doesn't matter where I've been or where I'm going, I'm just going to run into random shit and gain small increments of gold and experience over and over again anyways. Even when I killed something massively outleveling me (one of my favourite things to do in MM3-5 that gave me a real sense of triumph) rewarded me with basically nothing. A pittance of xp and a shit item not worth equipping that sold for about as much as the potions I burned would have. It wasn't a tactical or exciting fight either. Just potion spam to win a war of attrition through healing magic.

Compare this to playing through MM3-5. Just clearing the shittiest entry level dungeon will probably reward me with a weapon that doubles my damage output for a character. Exploring even moderately will give me chunks of loot or huge exp rewards that massively outstrip what you'd expect from them on occasion. Fighting past exceptional enemies would often grant access to loot stashes that utterly dwarfed anything you'd found before, or barrels with permanent stat bonuses that would boost a characters max hp by 60%, instead of this +1% resist to one element of magic bullshit. I was constantly excited to find out what was around the next corner playing those games. I couldn't care less for this game. Its not even worth the fucking loading time, let along the combat slog or the slow ass backtracking to town through empty fields so I can navigate the fucking maze town just to repair one fucking weapon or buy food or one spell or upgrade a single fucking skill. Fuck the pace of this game. If every item I ever found had been replaced with it's value in gold as vendor trash, it would actually improve the experience by not making me sell the shit myself. How pathetic is that.

 

[Gozma]

Good God they pull quoted the Codex in the trailer, the fuck is the world coming to

 

[Arkeus]

Good luck skull cracking the cyclops without a bladedancer. My party is level 12 and that thing still rapes me. It just blocks skull crack half the time and wipes most of my party.

Don't hit with the skullcrack with your first character. As long as you don't have three mages with Magical Foci in your party, you should be able to hit the cyclope with someone else first. Whether that hit is blocked or not it uses up the cyclope's block attempt, which means your skullcrack will always go through. From then on, it's just a matter of making sure to mitigate the damages you take and whittling him down. Very feasible with a level 6 party without a bladedancer.

I played enough to get a little into act 2 where the game supposedly opens up and gets good before stopping. It's just not enjoyable. All the loot is banal boring shit. I was pleasantly surprised once so far while playing, when I got those relic boots. The surprise wore off rapidly when I realized how little those boots actually mattered after they leveled twice and still had basically no impact at all despite clearly being the best the game had to offer item wise. Every other drop, literally dozens upon dozens of items, was either vendor trash or a miniscule incremental upgrade. I never even got a sizable chunk of gold in one place. Or experience bonus. So why the fuck would I care to crawl around through a corridor forest fighting wolves that take 10 turns a head to kill in an ugly, slow paced combat slog?

Because:
a°) The combat is fun
b°) you rarely get the item you want, but when you do it's a complete gamechanger. This is a game where you know quickly what kind of items to shoot for, so while 99% of them are not useful with your builds, the best items are usually not relics but random drops that fit what you want.
C°) ANY upgrade change everything.

Fuck, you don't even get the satisfaction of feeling like you properly explored a place, because enemies just pop up out of thin air from spots you already explored.

Wat.

Why the fuck even have a map if it doesn't matter where I've been or where I'm going, I'm just going to run into random shit and gain small increments of gold and experience over and over again anyways. Even when I killed something massively outleveling me (one of my favourite things to do in MM3-5 that gave me a real sense of triumph) rewarded me with basically nothing. A pittance of xp and a shit item not worth equipping that sold for about as much as the potions I burned would have. It wasn't a tactical or exciting fight either. Just potion spam to win a war of attrition through healing magic.

Wat. You want an awesome button too?

Compare this to playing through MM3-5. Just clearing the shittiest entry level dungeon will probably reward me with a weapon that doubles my damage output for a character. Exploring even moderately will give me chunks of loot or huge exp rewards that massively outstrip what you'd expect from them on occasion. Fighting past exceptional enemies would often grant access to loot stashes that utterly dwarfed anything you'd found before, or barrels with permanent stat bonuses that would boost a characters max hp by 60%, instead of this +1% resist to one element of magic bullshit. I was constantly excited to find out what was around the next corner playing those games. I couldn't care less for this game. Its not even worth the fucking loading time, let along the combat slog or the slow ass backtracking to town through empty fields so I can navigate the fucking maze town just to repair one fucking weapon or buy food or one spell or upgrade a single fucking skill. Fuck the pace of this game. If every item I ever found had been replaced with it's value in gold as vendor trash, it would actually improve the experience by not making me sell the shit myself. How pathetic is that.

Hahahahahahahahah

 

[fastjack]

Good luck skull cracking the cyclops without a bladedancer. My party is level 12 and that thing still rapes me. It just blocks skull crack half the time and wipes most of my party.

Don't hit with the skullcrack with your first character. As long as you don't have three mages with Magical Foci in your party, you should be able to hit the cyclope with someone else first. Whether that hit is blocked or not it uses up the cyclope's block attempt, which means your skullcrack will always go through. From then on, it's just a matter of making sure to mitigate the damages you take and whittling him down. Very feasible with a level 6 party without a bladedancer.

I played enough to get a little into act 2 where the game supposedly opens up and gets good before stopping. It's just not enjoyable. All the loot is banal boring shit. I was pleasantly surprised once so far while playing, when I got those relic boots. The surprise wore off rapidly when I realized how little those boots actually mattered after they leveled twice and still had basically no impact at all despite clearly being the best the game had to offer item wise. Every other drop, literally dozens upon dozens of items, was either vendor trash or a miniscule incremental upgrade. I never even got a sizable chunk of gold in one place. Or experience bonus. So why the fuck would I care to crawl around through a corridor forest fighting wolves that take 10 turns a head to kill in an ugly, slow paced combat slog?

Because:
a°) The combat is fun
b°) you rarely get the item you want, but when you do it's a complete gamechanger. This is a game where you know quickly what kind of items to shoot for, so while 99% of them are not useful with your builds, the best items are usually not relics but random drops that fit what you want.
C°) ANY upgrade change everything.

Fuck, you don't even get the satisfaction of feeling like you properly explored a place, because enemies just pop up out of thin air from spots you already explored.

Wat.

Why the fuck even have a map if it doesn't matter where I've been or where I'm going, I'm just going to run into random shit and gain small increments of gold and experience over and over again anyways. Even when I killed something massively outleveling me (one of my favourite things to do in MM3-5 that gave me a real sense of triumph) rewarded me with basically nothing. A pittance of xp and a shit item not worth equipping that sold for about as much as the potions I burned would have. It wasn't a tactical or exciting fight either. Just potion spam to win a war of attrition through healing magic.

Wat. You want an awesome button too?

Compare this to playing through MM3-5. Just clearing the shittiest entry level dungeon will probably reward me with a weapon that doubles my damage output for a character. Exploring even moderately will give me chunks of loot or huge exp rewards that massively outstrip what you'd expect from them on occasion. Fighting past exceptional enemies would often grant access to loot stashes that utterly dwarfed anything you'd found before, or barrels with permanent stat bonuses that would boost a characters max hp by 60%, instead of this +1% resist to one element of magic bullshit. I was constantly excited to find out what was around the next corner playing those games. I couldn't care less for this game. Its not even worth the fucking loading time, let along the combat slog or the slow ass backtracking to town through empty fields so I can navigate the fucking maze town just to repair one fucking weapon or buy food or one spell or upgrade a single fucking skill. Fuck the pace of this game. If every item I ever found had been replaced with it's value in gold as vendor trash, it would actually improve the experience by not making me sell the shit myself. How pathetic is that.

Hahahahahahahahah

The game is boring bro, but on the bright side I reinstalled Wiz8. Even with the level-scaling at least there are fun bits in that game.

 

[Bubbles]

It's now fallen to rank 50 in Steam sales, so I guess the public hath spoken. Uplay is probably playing a part in this as well.

 

[Clockwork Knight]

Was it really necessary to quote the entire post directly before yours to reply with an unrelated one liner

 

[Sceptic]

I was pleasantly surprised once so far while playing, when I got those relic boots. The surprise wore off rapidly when I realized how little those boots actually mattered after they leveled twice and still had basically no impact at all despite clearly being the best the game had to offer item wise.

Relics are not the most powerful items in the game, and the ones you find early in particular are not mean to last you all the way to the end. My freemage has already found 2 foci that together are better than the relic staff she's using. I'm nearing the end of act 3 and still using those sandals though, they're quite good.

miniscule incremental upgrade.

The upgrades may look small on paper, but even +5 to damage ends up being a rather sizable boost, after you factor in skills and whatnot. All in all the itemization isn't too bad, and if you really want to you can game it and keep reloading at chests until you get stuff you want (though I personally would never do it because fuck it, load times are bad enough as it is)

I think during today's session I've finally reached the point where I'm used to the game's quirks, gotten over the disappointment with outdoor exploration, and it seems like I've firmly settled into the "I"m actually enjoying this" camp. Let's hope tomorrow confirms this. Load times still need to die in a fire though.

 

[Greatness]

Yeah, the relics in general were pretty poor compared to the items in shops/drops.

I ended up ditchign it all just for items that gave +x dmg to each enemy in the group on successfull attack. Combine those with my blademaster who got 9 attacks per turn and Mandate of Heaven, each autoattack was doing probably 4k+ damage (combat log couldn't scroll that much) with nothing in the game surviving the 1hit which mean't perma cleave.

 

[Arkeus]

Yeah, the relics in general were pretty poor compared to the items in shops/drops.

I ended up ditchign it all just for items that gave +x dmg to each enemy in the group on successfull attack. Combine those with my blademaster who got 9 attacks per turn and Mandate of Heaven, each autoattack was doing probably 4k+ damage (combat log couldn't scroll that much) with nothing in the game surviving the 1hit which mean't perma cleave.

On my mages, i tend to try to spec for a lot of agical Focus until i get sometihng like 50~ chance to crit, and then i go for +'schoolofchoice'.
On my Blademaster i mostly try and go for +dagger and +dodge, though i want mana leech so that i can use the AoE all day long.
I am also really looking to get a highest tier relentless sword with my sword guy, and +sword stuff.

 

[Hobo Elf]

I dunno, a lot of the relics I've found are real good and will probably last me for the rest of the game. My Bladedancer has a relic chest that gives +6 dodge, +6 dual wield and +22 Evade and the Black Fang Gauntlets that give quite a nice sum of Attack value and Titan leggings for extra damage, immune to paralysis and a lot of armor. My Pala has the Starsilver Blade that does 9 damage of all magical types, which really adds up to being quite a lot, the base damage of the weapon itself is good, and the relic shield from Kilburn that gives a lot of armor and more block chances. The Sandals are good, of course. I also just got a rice hat for my Mage that gives Arcane Discipline and Spirit. It's not level 4 yet but already the values are quite good.

 

[BlackAdderBG]

"Might & Magic 10: Legacy feels like a pleasant throwback to dungeon crawls of decades past, but its limited scope and combat-heavy focus might put off those pining for the freedom afforded by the more recent Elder Scrolls games, or the wordy character interaction of a Dragon Age."

The Mighty has spoken folks,we can go home now.

Spoiler

 

[Arkeus]

"Might & Magic 10: Legacy feels like a pleasant throwback to dungeon crawls of decades past, but its limited scope and combat-heavy focus might put off those pining for the freedom afforded by the more recent Elder Scrolls games, or the wordy character interaction of a Dragon Age."

The Mighty has spoken folks,we can go home now.

Spoiler

I do think the game wouldn't lose anything (and gain quite a bit) by not blocking the road early on. I can understand why they did it in EA, but i really think it would give a much greater sense of freedom without that block.