Morrowind is utter tripe

[mogwaimon]

I got your point, I just thought it was idiotic. 'if game was not like game it would be worse than game 2' is just a dumb argument, IMO.

So you really didn't get it at all.

My point is that Morrowind's strengths overwhelmingly consist of non-gameplay elements, whereas the opposite is true for Gothic. I am sorry that you are so asshurt that you misconstrued this as an attempt to prove that Morrowind is altogether better/worse (whatever the fuck you thought) than Gothic.

Again, I know. But the core of the argument you made was 'if Morrowind didn't have some of its main draws it'd wouldn't hold a candle to Gothic' which, no shit. The people who enjoy Morrowind mostly acknowledge that it has some pretty flawed systems and the combat isn't the best, I don't think anyone but the most enraptured Bethesda fanboys would argue that. Moreover, the things you mentioned do in fact contribute to the quality of the gameplay, if Morrowind had a shitty boring world then it would of course lose any draws that it had and no one would want to play it, you've got to judge the game for what it IS rather than what it isn't or what it could be, otherwise you might as well bring fucking mods into the picture.

 

[Zombra]

lol. Let's look at the actual arguments.

Problem #1: Morrowind has a low NPC population count.

So good RPGs always simulate realistic NPC populations? Not off to a great start here.

Problem #2: Writing is bland.

So good RPGs always have brilliant, well-written NPC dialogue? Ahaha, yeah, right.

Problem #3: The real-time combat is simplistic.

Uhhh, so good RPGs always have smooth, complex, and engaging action combat? Oh my god.

And .... that's it. Everything else is just "I bibn't like it" with no real critique.

It took you 6 years to build up the courage to make this triumphant display of your worth among the deep thinkers of the Codex. You've got the unearned arrogance and narrow-mindedness down, but it takes more than that. Keep reading and try again in another 6 years.

 

[Can't handle the bacon]

But the core of the argument you made was 'if Morrowind didn't have some of its main draws it'd wouldn't hold a candle to Gothic' which, no shit

No it isn't. The core of the argument is "if we were to equalize non-gameplay elements between Morrowind and Gothic by making them equally bland, on gameplay alone Morrowind would look like a broken piece of garbage that no one in their right mind would want to play".

Then again, if Gothic had gameplay that was as bad as Morrowind's, no one would want to play it for its thrilling premise of being a prison-camp simulator, or the virtually non-existent story and bog-standard grimdark fantasy lore.

The people who enjoy Morrowind mostly acknowledge that it has some pretty flawed systems and the combat isn't the best, I don't think anyone but the most enraptured Bethesda fanboys would argue that.

Yes, so you're agreeing with me here that Morrowind's strength is not its gameplay.

Moreover, the things you mentioned do in fact contribute to the quality of the gameplay, if Morrowind had a shitty boring world then it would of course lose any draws that it had and no one would want to play it

"Morrowind's non-gameplay elements make the game interesting to play, therefore its gameplay is also good".

You fail logic every time.

 

[JDR13]

What's with all these tard-created threads lately?

 

[Can't handle the bacon]

What's with people who registered six years ago, and made a total of 21 posts in that entire time, most of them in the past few days? How did you even remember your email and/or password after so many years?

 

[mogwaimon]

Level (world) design IS a gameplay element, though. If you've got a bunch of shitty levels in a game even if it has top tier mechanics then no one's going to want to play it. Moreover, you're confusing the term 'gameplay' for 'mechanics' I think.

In fact, many people would argue that Gothic's world design is one of its main strengths as well, I can barely dip my toes in General RPG Discussion without someone calling a games world design shit because it can't stand up to Gothic on that front. It's not just about the setting itself, which you're boiling down to a 'prison camp simulator', world design also accounts for encounter placement, item placement, and other factors. Which one can argue that Gothic is stronger than Morrowind on that front as well and in fact I think it definitely is, but if you're saying that Morrowind is nothing without the world design then you ALSO have to apply that to Gothic; if Gothic didn't have such a strong world design then the game wouldn't be as interesting to play either. You'd just have, what, a half-baked fantasy combat simulator, while Morrowind stripped of its world design would be what, a quarter-baked fantasy sandbox?

 

[ProphetSword]

I'm sorry, but any poster that starts off by trashing Morrowind, but includes "Oblivion" in their list of top-notch games is either a serious troll or a class-A retard.

 

[Sigourn]

It's not just about the setting itself, which you're boiling down to a 'prison camp simulator', world design also accounts for encounter placement, item placement, and other factors.

And this is where I remind people that:

• Compared to Gothic, Morrowind has nearly no item placement in the overworld.
  
• Compared to Gothic, Morrowind has nearly no human (i.e. non-monster) encounters in the overworld. Notable exceptions are ashlander/mabrigash camps, and (if you will) enemy encounters on the surface of Daedric Ruins and Strongholds.

Imagine my surprise when I found a chest in the overworld that wasn't guarded by ashlanders. It was like I had struck gold, only figuratively, as the chest contained nothing inside. Probably associated with a quest I didn't activate.

 

[Sreggin Etah I]

To elaborate on why i dislike Morrowind music, it's not about the music quality itself but how it was implemented.

Morrowind has 2 types of music, one plays in battles and the other plays during everything else, and it's really odd. The game doesn't have themes for dungeons, cities or anything. it just play 7 random relaxing tracks on loop even when you're in a dungeon. The music in Morrowind does not add any atmosphere into the game imo, the opposite, it takes atmosphere from the game. So much that people made mods trying to fix it:

https://www.nexusmods.com/morrowind/mods/46312

Gothic however, does music right, the soundtrack in Gothic adds a lot of atmosphere to the game.

Khorinis wouldn't be as great without the Khorinis theme:



Valley of Mines wouldn't not be as atmospheric without this theme:

 

[jackofshadows]

I mean... it's made by Bethesda. Why even waste words?

 

[alyvain]

Morrowind had many flaws, many of which can be fixed with mods. But the biggest flaw - the utterly static gameworld where only the player moves - is not fixable.

It's not a flaw.

 

[eli]

Firstly, I am a longtime RPG veteran. Having played games, such as. Fallout 1, Fallout 2, Arcanum, Fallout New Vegas, Oblivion and of course system shock. So when I say I am fairly well versed in the quality and merits of what makes a GOOD "rpg". Rather then, what make an RPG infact utter tripe.

When I was a young lad. I played this game that has henceforth been known as Morrowind. Firstly I was shocked, apalled, nay, even dsigusted by the lack of role playing experience in this game. The whole of the game seemed to assume, that as an educated gamer and RPG veteran. I would be content with simply traversing the barren hellscape of the land known as morrowind. At first as I stepped off the boat and realized there was no true RPG system in this game. I was disgusted. Nevertheless I decided to press onward through the opening city. However, Every settlement I happened across had almost no population. The world was completely static and desolate.

Each character I encountered had so artistic soul or creativity into their personality. They were simply empty shells there for text exposition. Nevertheless I pushed forward into this "game" of sorts. When I happened upon a chance combat encounter. I quickly discovered to my horror how awful the combat system truly was. You simply spam your right click! Of course how genius!. This coupled with the general poor skill system, coupled with the absolutely dreary world. In my expert opinion this game is clearly of poor quality and value.

In conclusion; I find it extremely fitting that the game world is covered in giant mushrooms. Mushrooms of course grow in shit, if anyone is unaware of this. Is there perhaps anyone willing to debate or challenge this game based upon its true virtues? Or are Morrowind fans only capable of reacting with emoji's. It's quite comincal indeed that this absolute tripe of a game has such a simple minded following.

As I have said before; Morrowind is UTTER Tripe.

Firstly, I am a longtime RPG veteran. Having read reviews on games, such as. Fallout 1, Fallout 2, Arcanum, Fallout New Vegas, Oblivion and of course system shock. So when I say I am fairly well versed in the quality and merits of what makes a GOOD "rpg" thread. Rather then, what make a review infact utter tripe.

around ten minutes ago I read this OP that has henceforth deemed Morrowind as utter tripe. Firstly I was shocked, appalled, nay, even disgusted by the lack of good arguments in this post. The entire post seems to assume, that as an educated gamer and RPG veteran, I would be content with simply reading the anecdote of a 2 hours experience of the game known as Morrowind. At first, as I saw the amount of the negative emojis on the OP, and realized there might be a lot of shit argumentation in this post. I was disgusted. Nevertheless, I decided to press onward through the dazzling writing. However, Every paragraph I read had almost no thought put into it. The OP was completely static and desolate.

Each sentence I encountered had sense into it. the OP was simply writing empty words there to express his shit understanding of the game. Nevertheless, I pushed forward into this "review" of sorts. When I happened upon a grammar mistake. I quickly discovered to my horror how awful the OP English skills were. it simply wrote without a second thought Of course how genius!. This coupled with the OP's general poor grammar skills, coupled with the absolutely dreary amount of typos. In my expert opinion, this post is of poor quality and value.

In conclusion; I find it extremely fitting that this thread is covered with a big amount of the "shit" icon. "shit" icon of course grows in shitty codex threads if anyone is unaware of this. Is there perhaps anyone willing to come up with good arguments whether is Morrowind good or bad? Or is the codex doomed to have a yearly post about how good/ bad Morrowind is?

As I have said before; stop with these Morrowind posts.

 

[Psquit]

Never liked the Wikipedia style for the conversations, it's boring. The atmosphere of Morrowind and the lore it's top-notch.

 

[Carrion]

Wikipedia NPCs are fine, just treat them like you would an actual person on the street. Talk if there's something to talk about, ignore otherwise. It helps the game world feel more real when you can talk to anyone about anything, even if it's mostly copypasta.

 

[Beans00]

Wikipedia NPCs are fine, just treat them like you would an actual person on the street. Talk if there's something to talk about, ignore otherwise. It helps the game world feel more real when you can talk to anyone about anything, even if it's mostly copypasta.

No it doesn't.

 

[Can't handle the bacon]

That's a great copy-pasta. Saved in a text fle.

Level (world) design IS a gameplay element, though.

I was talking about the visual style of clothes, items, buildings, settlements, wilderness areas, biomes, etc.

 

[mogwaimon]

that's art design

 

[Can't handle the bacon]

Whatever you want to call it, it is not a gameplay element.

 

[Harthwain]

Wikipedia NPCs are fine, just treat them like you would an actual person on the street. Talk if there's something to talk about, ignore otherwise. It helps the game world feel more real when you can talk to anyone about anything, even if it's mostly copypasta.

NPCs are more like Google Search engine than anything else. That's not exactly what I'd call a conversation, nor makes the game world feel more real. Daggerfall has very similar system to Morrowind, but the conversations feel much better - in my opinion - because despite the similar system in Daggerfall there are questions and answers, while in Morrowind you feel like you're reading an encyclopedia (or wikipedia).

 

[Derringer]

Wikipedia NPCs are fine, just treat them like you would an actual person on the street. Talk if there's something to talk about, ignore otherwise. It helps the game world feel more real when you can talk to anyone about anything, even if it's mostly copypasta.

NPCs are more like Google Search engine than anything else. That's not exactly what I'd call a conversation, nor makes the game world feel more real. Daggerfall has very similar system to Morrowind, but the conversations feel much better - in my opinion - because despite the similar system in Daggerfall there are questions and answers, while in Morrowind you feel like you're reading an encyclopedia (or wikipedia).

I've found a lot of interesting things looking through encyclopedia britannica 11th edition.

 

[rusty_shackleford]

main problem with morrowind dialogue was the lack of being able to directly respond to NPC dialogue in traditional dialogue tree structure
it existed, but was extremely underused

 

[Eirinjas]

 

[Eirinjas]

 

[Eirinjas]

 

[Vladimuar]

too much cringy pseudo-ironic faggotry in the thread about masculine anti-cliffracer struggle