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Nioh 2

Suicidal

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It's not that the enemy variety is low, it's just the game is very big.

It's actually not that big if you don't go for side missions or NG+. I've seen people go through the entire game in 30-50 hours, with the DLC missions included, which is similar to the length of an average Souls game. The only thing you miss out on by ignoring side missions is the occasional "human samurai but with some unique magic" boss fight, or, in the case of the DLC areas, a couple of cool optional bosses like Ninja Gaiden man and the revamped ninja frog fight from Nioh 1.

DMC and Bayonetta are beat 'em ups, not action RPGs like Nioh. Not comparable. Raw numbers don't tell the whole story either, it doesn't matter if a game has 300 unique enemies if you fight a small number of those for the majority of the time.

Boss variety is a separate issue entirely, but Nioh and Nioh 2 are fine in this aspect. The bosses were the only thing keeping me playing Nioh 2 as long as I did until I finally got sick of the boring levels.

Nioh has a pretty similar gameplay structure to games like DMC and Bayonetta so I don't think you should dismiss the comparison just because in Nioh your numbers go up.

It's a mission based game, where you can replay any mission any number of times, not unlike DMC/Bayo. After you beat the game you unlock a new difficulty that not only makes the enemies stronger, but also changes enemy placements and gives them new moves, again, not unlike DMC. As you play through the missions, the game introduces new enemies, and then reuses those enemies in subsequent missions, similar to those games as well.

For example, you play DMC 5, in one of the missions you go through the level fighting mostly the bug enemies and the scythe and cleaver demons. Then you enter an abandoned library and the game introduces the ghost with scissors thing that flies through walls and you fight it in the library, and appropriate place for a mob like this. But afterwards the game will just keep reusing those ghosts in regular combat arenas together with the other mobs. Nioh games work exactly the same.

I also think it's not fair to say that you only fight a small part of those mobs on a regular basis. Other than the miniboss-tier enemies like the giant bull demons and dark magic birds, pretty much every single demon that has already been introduced gets encountered on a regular basis in almost every mission at least once or twice.
 
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Haplo

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Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire
since i had bough this game when it was on sale, because i enjoyed Nioh a lot, i started a new game to hopefully complete it this time, at least NG. What i can say? I just beat Enenra and already got bored. DK if i'm not in the mood to play it rn of the game is very boring in itself. It's weird because i had a lot of fun with Nioh, but here it seems everything is copypasted from first game with few ( bad) new gimmicks.
Story is less interesting than first one, same for characters . Levels have a lot of details but it's all wasted because there is no real exploration or rewards beside the kodama or the ocean of loot the game vomits at you of which 99% you 'll discard.
new weapons are ...ok i guess?
Skill tree is very dispersive and time consuming.
on top of all the yokai form is boring and an involution compared to living weapons. overall the game gives a feeling of déjà vu and it's not satisfying at all. i'll still try to complete the run only to see how the story goes and how weapons work with more skill points, but i don't have much hope the experience can improve drastically
My feelings exactly.
Derivative after Nioh 1, with demon gimmicks that further break the immersion, rather then actually enrich the system.
 

NJClaw

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Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture
I'm Ridin' with Biden I'm Ridin' with Biden
It's not that the enemy variety is low, it's just the game is very big.
I couldn't agree more. Considering the first one, Nioh 2 made giant leaps regarding enemy variety. However, the game is so huge and repetitive in its structure that I can see how one could get tired of the constant repetition of the same enemies over and over. Sure, DMC and Bayonetta may have fewer enemies, but those are what? 15-20 hours games? With Nioh (1 and 2), we're talking about completely different orders of magnitude.

The low number of enemy types was my main (and honestly only) complaint against the first game, and I feel like the sequel did enough to fix the issue, but the last DLC mission shows they could have improved things A LOT more with just a little more effort. In a single mission they throw at you four new enemies, which at a first glance seem just reskins of the usual suspects but in reality behave a lot differently and require new approaches from the player. With just a few changes, you get four new enemies they could have used to break the monotony of the base game, and the same could have been done for all the other base enemies (since they are basically reskins for the most part).

I get that they needed to hold off on revealing those "improved" versions to spice things up during the other dreams, but most people will never touch NG+. I enjoyed going all the way to Dream of the Nioh, but I feel like the game is long enough even without all those NG+ mechanics, and all those little improvements (new enemies, game-changing graces...) could have been introduced sooner without losing much.

It's actually not that big if you don't go for side missions or NG+. I've seen people go through the entire game in 30-50 hours, with the DLC missions included, which is similar to the length of an average Souls game. The only thing you miss out on by ignoring side missions is the occasional "human samurai but with some unique magic" boss fight, or, in the case of the DLC areas, a couple of cool optional bosses like Ninja Gaiden man and the revamped ninja frog fight from Nioh 1.
Sure, if you skip half the game you're less likely to experience enemies-repetition fatigue, but I don't think the people complaining about enemy variety are the kind of people who are skipping side content. Nioh 2 may have more enemies compared to similar games, but it's twice as long (if not more).
 
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Lambach

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Sounds a lot like I'm a dumbass for doing every side mission before even getting to NG+.

I did that too. Partly because of my completionist OCD, partly because I liked always being a couple levels ahead of what's suggested for the next Main Mission, but mostly because I enjoyed the game enough that Side Missions never felt like a chore but a welcome extension (until I got more than halfway through Dream of Demon anyway, some side content started being a bit too much at that point).
 
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Part of me wants to start skipping them to get to next difficulty and better loot faster but I'll probably end up doing them all anyway. Boss fight side missions have all been fun so far.
 
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Suicidal

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Sure, if you skip half the game you're less likely to experience enemies-repetition fatigue, but I don't think the people complaining about enemy variety are the kind of people who are skipping side content. Nioh 2 may have more enemies compared to similar games, but it's twice as long (if not more).

So can we agree that the reason people get burnt out on this game is not the enemy variety but all the useless copypasted side missions?

The way side missions are designed is one of my main complaints with the series. They're fine when it's just a small wave-based arena map or a unique boss but 90% of the time it's just the same exact level you've already beaten, but in reverse. Most of the time these side missions offer no new enemies or bosses, and if there is a boss it's the same boss you already fought, but wait there is a normal mob with him now too, not unlike all the dumb copypasted cave and crypt bosses in Elden Ring. What's worse is that they often lock you out of the actually interesting side missions until you do all the shitty ones.

I think that if devs removed all the side missions from the game (or at least, all the shitty ones) a lot more people would be able to enjoy the game.

Something tells me they're gonna do this shit again in Wo Long anyway.
 
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Did not expect some of Dojo missions to be actually tough. Just died 5 times to Hattori Hanzo in "The one who lives in the shadows" mission and had another one for the axe previously that also took few tries. This last one is actually tougher than most bosses in the game. :lol: I think I must be close to the end of NG at this point, 5th chapter started. Will be experimenting with other weapons in NG+, axe is nice enough but doesn't have enough moves to remain entertaining for several playthroughs. Giving how much I'm enjoying Ninjutsu I might respec into Dex build and try Kusarigama maybe.
 

Wunderbar

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Endgame dojo missions are indeed harder than anything in the base game because you are deprived of your usual tools.
 
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Wow Lady Osakabe. What an absolute dogshit fight. I thought the previous gimmick fight with that big stone beast was kinda lame but this is just utter garbage. I guess there had to be at least one really shitty boss.
 

Suicidal

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Every soulslike needs its bed of chaos.

Also remarkable that Okasabe is a worse version of a boss in Nioh 1 - the hydra (forgot the name). Basically the same fight, but the hydra had:
-More varied attacks
-A better designed, more gradual threat escalation during the fight (1 head -> 2 heads -> 5 heads -> 1 head that combines all the elements)
-Ways to damage it other than just whacking the heads whenever they got close to the edge of the arena (bait melee attacks into crystals which stuns them)
-Combat arena that changed as the fight went on
 
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Heh well at least it didn't take too many attempts, got it on 4th try. Turns out rushing to deal damage as fast as possible is a better strategy there than playing carefully and trying to dodge all the stupid projectiles and lasers.

The toughest fight in the game is still that lv 100 Ninjutsu training mission, until that one I died the most to first Enenra fight, in one of early missions. But back then I still was clueless about how a lot of stuff works in the game, didn't even know when to use burst counters.
 

Sjukob

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I feel like the second half of the main game is way worse than the first one. Gyuki, Daidara, Osakabe are all from the second half of the game and all of them are trash, in comparison, in the first half you have actual good boss battles like Enenra, Yatsu-no-Kami and Magara. Tatarimokke is shit, of course, but he's the sole exception. There are some average bosses here and there, but the point is that the first half of the game is good and okayish and the second half is bad and okayish, feels like only Shuten Doji is worth something, unlike other people I don't admire Ryomen either, I think that boss is meh at best.

Another thing is that I don't like that darkness and redness, and other yokai infested shit theme that is prevalent in the second half of the game, I really liked Mausoleum of evil though, because it has none of that. I took a long break from the game, because due to some personal things I couldn't access my computer for about a month, I stopped playing right before the second fight with Tokichiro, so I haven't fought Kashin Koji and Otakemaru yet, I might return to the game soon and see how it goes.
 

Suicidal

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I think second half has some pretty good bosses: Boar guy, Saika (rifle guy from Nioh 1 whom they considerably improved by giving him more moves and not making him fall down from his flying stance all the time), the wizard that clones himself, both fights with Tokichiro, Otakemaru. Shuten Doji is too easy but his design is awesome. Ryomen is ok. The only truely dogshit fights are the giant ones (what a surprise) with Okasabe being the clear winner here. I actually didn't mind the giant rock golem, as far as giant bosses go he's pretty inoffensive.

The DLCs have some excellent bosses too.
 
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Are armor set bonuses remain the same for all NG cycles? Most of those seem pretty underwhelming, making me wonder if I should even bother with sets. Or maybe there are just plain better sets that start appearing in later difficulties?
 

Sjukob

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Or maybe there are just plain better sets that start appearing in later difficulties?
Yes, in NG++ you start getting graces, which are very similar to sets, but they are not tied to specific gear pieces, so you can get them on any piece of gear, they are much stronger than regular sets too. And in NG+++ you unlock additional graces, hence why people recommend to not spend much time in NG+, because the actual end game itemization only starts in NG++.
 
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I am curious about something. That cute Okuni chick I saved in one of side missions appears in a main mission now, possibly the final one. Would she still be there even if I didn't save her?

I could tell she liked me right away!
D1B037560885960C7C011A89ABB76C6C8CEA775A

That's the same line real girls always use to hit on me.
 
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Final main mission boss done on first try and then I decided to try "Wave of terror" side mission. Holy shit this is hard, almost seems impossible. After a bunch of yokai not one but two fucking bosses and I don't even know if second is the last one. I might have to give up on this one.
 

Suicidal

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Main campaign final boss is weird. It's one of those enemies that "looks" hard and has a ton of different moves and magic spells that cover half the map but then you fight him and win on the 1st-2nd attempt. I don't know why it's like that.
 
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Nue in one of Tengu's Disciple DLC side missions is the hardest boss in the game so far for me. Died around 20 times to that annoying shit already.
 
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Switched back to Odachi after remodeling one to scale off Stamina. I was using this Groundquake skill on my block + strong attack slot before because I liked it back from Nioh 1. But after getting some more skill points decided to try this Moonlit Snow Redux and holy shit it's like I suddenly gained 50 levels over most enemies. This thing seems op as fuck. Not only deals great damage fast but is also a solid distance closer.

I have enough Stamina to wear full Tatenashi set at green load so time to stop leveling it for now. Blocking is pretty good at 376 Toughness already, probably time to actually increase Ki pool a little. Also got a really cool accessory drop with "Set requirements reduced by 1" bonus. So now I'm rocking full Tatenashi set bonus off only 4 pieces and using gloves from Greater Good armor to get that 2 piece + HP bonus from it. Also have Mataza spear on secondary weapon slot to get that speedup after enemy kill bonus, plus I tempered a speedup after full 3 Moonlit Snow attacks bonus on the Odachi. So I'm getting that speedup pretty often now. Build sperging is getting more addictive and I'm still not even in NG+, only second DLC so far.
 

Seethe

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"Nioh has no enemy variety" is such a fucking meme and I don't understand why people keep regurgitating it. Like I could see it if it if were talking about the first game, but they added so much new shit in Nioh 2 on top of taking enemies from the first game and giving them a graphical makeover + giving them new abilities.

Let's take a look at some facts, courtesy of the game's wiki:

Not counting the different varieties of units (like one legged demons with hammers or with swords), even though they have different movesets, cause I can't be bothered, Nioh 2 has 51 different normal enemy types, that, as I said, can also come in different variations (different weapons, different elements, big or small).

Let's compare this with some other generally beloved action games:

Devil May Cry 3: 20 enemy types
Devil May Cry 5: 19 enemy types
Bayonetta: 16 enemy types
Sekiro: 76 enemy types, but here I should note that the wiki lists the same peasants or soldiers as different enemies DEPENDING ON THE WEAPON THEY ARE USING, while Nioh's wiki does not (it just says stuff like Human Bandit, Human Samurai, etc.), so taking that into account, Sekiro's number of unique enemy types should be lower than Nioh 2's.

I could go on.

Also let's not forget that the average enemy in Nioh 2 has a much more complex moveset than enemies in most other games, including even bosses.

Speaking of bosses, according to the wiki Nioh 2 has 46 different UNIQUE bosses. That's almost as many as there are normal enemies. Sure, some of them were imported from the first game and some are just "Buffed samurai dude with some unique flair of magic", but that's still more bosses than in every single hack & slash like DMC and in every single Souls game except Elden Ring, which supposedly has over 200, but we all know that most of them are just re-skins or re-colors of previous bosses or trash mobs, so it's possible that the number of actually unique bosses would be close to how many Nioh 2 has.

It really makes me think that people who perpetuate the "no enemies xddd" bullshit haven't even played the game and just parrot whatever NPC opinion they saw on reddit or some other shithole.

I feel like Myiazaki poisoned people's brains. I can't believe I used to enjoy that mind numbing dodge twice - wait enemy to finish his move - attack once shit. All the new enemies in Myiazaki games are mostly reskins with extremely basic movesets.

The reason people say this about Nioh 2 is because they're soulsfags, plain and simple. And it's because games like Dark Souls give you the illusion of enemy variety by concentrating new enemies per zone. Whereas Nioh 2 introduces a new enemy per level, but also still uses all the older enemies all around. You know why? Because the enemies in Nioh 2 are fantastic and not fucking boring. Gakis can still be a threat if they eat another gaki or manage to grab you, but more importantly the weaker enemies are relegated to more supportive roles, ambushes, or taking advantage of their terrain. A skeleton with a handcannon? Pathetic. A skeleton with a handcannon on ramparts while you're fighting a revenant risen up by a Biwa Boku-Boku? A real danger that forces you to change your approach to certain encounters.

To not even mention the New Game + stuff that adds new movesets to bosses and enemies. Also, Nioh 2 bosses are by far my favorite of any game. I really love the Dark Realm system. it's like a phase system, without having to go through phase 1 a million times to slooooowly learn phase 2 of a boss. It's like an antithesis to Sekiro, where that shitty system was taken to the extreme. It's simply a well designed game with overall well designed enemies. I only disliked Lady Osokabe, the tree rock thing, and some human bosses like Maeda who is the most annoying one by far.
 
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Another fucking gamepad down. Drift in left stick just after few months of use. I will have to stop playing any games that require a pad for now, with these garbage gamepads it's getting way too expensive. I looked into which pads have more durable sticks, turns out all of them use the same shitty ones made by same company. Fuck this then. I would love to continue my NG+ run but I refuse to buy a new gamepad if it's just gonna start drifting again in few months. I remember I had xbox 360 pad that lasted me 6 years without any issues, those were good times..
 

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