Owlcat's next game is an AAA title that will need full voice acting to compete with BG3

[Decado]

The idea of anyone making "The Next Baldur's Gate 3" is ridiculous. It's symptomatic of the recency bias that infects the modern game business.

There will not be another "Baldur's Gate 3" because that game was a unique mix of timing, opportunity, budget, and marketing savvy. It is the type of situation that you cannot create on purpose. It entered the fringes (just the fringes, mind!) of the zeitgeist and was hugely successful at 10 million units sold . . . but Hogwarts sold 24 million. Call of Duty Vanguard, considered to be one of the weakest entries in the series, sold over 30 million in 2021.

There are many people who played BG3 that will never again play another RPG, no matter how much voice acting it contains. It was a once-in-a-lifetime event for many players, and will not be replicated. And this is not rare, by the way. Everyone can think of that one game they really enjoyed in a genre they don't normally play and will never play again, even if another great game in that genre comes along.

Owlcat should just focus on making good RPGs. Anyone who refuses to play an RPG because there's too much text and not enough cutscenes is not an audience group you can successfully court anyway.

 

[Infinitron]

The idea of anyone making "The Next Baldur's Gate 3" is ridiculous. It's symptomatic of the recency bias that infects the modern game business.

There will not be another "Baldur's Gate 3" because that game was a unique mix of timing, opportunity, budget, and marketing savvy. It is the type of situation that you cannot create on purpose. It entered the fringes (just the fringes, mind!) of the zeitgeist and was hugely successful at 10 million units sold . . . but Hogwarts sold 24 million. Call of Duty Vanguard, considered to be one of the weakest entries in the series, sold over 30 million in 2021.

There are many people who played BG3 that will never again play another RPG, no matter how much voice acting it contains. It was a once-in-a-lifetime event for many players, and will not be replicated. And this is not rare, by the way. Everyone can think of that one game they really enjoyed in a genre they don't normally play and will never play again, even if another great game in that genre comes along.

Owlcat should just focus on making good RPGs. Anyone who refuses to play an RPG because there's too much text and not enough cutscenes is not an audience group you can successfully court anyway.

Keep in mind that it's not clear they're actually making a straight-up "BG3 clone" here. Roguey believes this game is a Mass Effect-like action-RPG. Shpilchevskiy's talking about production quality, not genre.

 

[luj1]

I told you they would take the wrong lessons from BG3.

You never take the right lessons mate. It's just not the way it works.

Morrowind saved Bethesda from bankruptcy. And what did they do with Oblivion? Everything opposite.

 

[luj1]

Owlcat should just focus on making good RPGs.

You know they will never gave up on their modus operandi, right? For Owlcat it's using minigames and system bloat to compensate for the lack of traditional RPG gameplay (because it saves time and money plus artificially prolongs game hours). Voila.

 

[mondblut]

Keep in mind that it's not clear they're actually making a straight-up "BG3 clone" here. Roguey believes this game is a Mass Effect-like action-RPG. Shpilchevskiy's talking about production quality, not genre.

So it's aiming to be crap in two ways, not just one.

Goodbye, Owlcat, we hardly knew ye.

 

[Infinitron]

Roguey could also be wrong. Time will tell.

 

[Tyranicon]

Owlcat games

Writing: bad
Characters: cringe
Combat: balancing nightmare
Minigames: awful
Bugs: Starship Troopers quantity

Analysis: Need to put more money into VO

 

[Jaedar]

I told you they would take the wrong lessons from BG3.

You never take the right lessons mate. It's just not the way it works.

Morrowind saved Bethesda from bankruptcy. And what did they do with Oblivion? Everything opposite.

This is only sorta true. The lesson todd took from MW was that the current direction of the company almost killed it, and developing MW was a traumatic experience for many involved. I think oblivion accomplished exactly what they set out to do: a safe game that will have broad appeal and sell lots of copies. It might not be the lesson we would have liked them to learn, but it was not an incorrect lesson.

Owlcat do seem basically incapable of learning from their own games, so expecting them to learn from other people's games seems pretty optimistic. There's probably a market for a mass effect like, but I doubt there's one for a clone with owlcat production values and polish.

 

[luj1]

The lesson Todd took from MW was that the current direction of the company almost killed it...

Because of ESA: Redguard, nothing to do with Morrowind.

... and developing MW was a traumatic experience...

When developing games is not traumatic, you get shit games.

I think Oblivion accomplished exactly what they set out to do: a safe game that will have broad appeal and sell lots of copies.

Morrowind had broad appeal too and sold a lot of copies. The only people who believe that unorthodox art direction is risky, are retards, like Todd Howard and Pete Hines.

 

[La vie sexuelle]

Did Owlcat catch Western Brain Cancer completely? Does freedom really deprive people of the ability to basic logical thinking?

Owlcat is studio for a rather niche, older rather than younger group of players. I would also say rather conservative, they finally seemed to understand that despite their misrecognition of the own fanbase in WotR.

BG3 is a game for the masses, it is only one bar lower than CoD or Battlefield. Or FIFA. Mainly queer zoomers, blue-haired millennials, and leftist Gen-Xers. Some Owlcat players play BG3, but it's a small percentage IMHO.

Instead of writing nonsense, Owlcat should focus on what they are really good at: ugly, absurdly mechanical RPGs, and they will survive.

 

[Saark]

Yeah, that's also not true. Nier Automata didn't have full voice acting. And like I said, Nintendo games don't have full voice acting either.

While I agree with you in general, Automata had fully voiced protagonists and most side-characters were also fully voiced. It was actually lauded for its strong VA, same as the original Nier. In this day and age, getting certain VA for your games is actually a reason for people to buy your games, especially in Japan where the VA scene is obviously quite a bit stronger due to Anime.

The big mistake the western developers continue to make, is taking actual movie/tv actors for their games to mo-cap and voice-act, and those are almost exclusively worse and more expensive than actual industry professionals.

Like someone else said, once you reach a certain budget and try to bring people into your genre that aren't already going to buy your game on the premise of its setting, franchise, style of game or dev star-power, having a fully voiced game is very helpful. Is it required? Of course not. But let's not kid ourselves that offering 4k textures and fully voicing your game doesn't help improve its mass appeal. And mass appeal is what you need when you not only want to break even, but actually turn a reasonable profit in AA and AAA development. The grognards on the dex aint enough to pay the bills.

 

[Mortmal]

BG3 is a game for the masses, it is only one bar lower than CoD or Battlefield. Or FIFA. Mainly queer zoomers, blue-haired millennials, and leftist Gen-Xers. Some Owlcat players play BG3, but it's a small percentage IMHO.

BG3 is mainstream, much like "Lord of the Rings" is in the realm of literature. It's the video game equivalent, boasting great interactivity and extensive character creation, allowing players to craft any kind of character they want to identify with. Alongside this, it features excellent tactical combat and memorable characters, regardless of personal preference. It's a highly sophisticated game of extreme quality, thanks to its extensive budget and large development team. Furthermore, it runs smoothly on various hardware setups, unlike Starfield or likely the upcoming Dragon's Dogma 2. Larian Studios got the formula right, and Owlcat Games could benefit from engaging with us more to better understand it.

 

[Axioms]

So many people are simply incapable of understanding why entertainment products that hit it big are able to do so. You can't just clone BG3 and make anywhere near as much money as BG3 did. Studios need to invest in games that are budget/revenue targeted for the *average* of the genre profits wise.

Hogwarts: Legacy using any IP but HP doesn't do near as well. Same for Baldur's Gate 3. If this had been just an actual Divinity game it wouldn't have had near the level of popularity and profit.

Fancy graphics and extensive voice acting put you in the AAA realm but they don't insure lightning in a bottle profits.

Owlcat will *never* play on the level of Larian, even with strong IPs like Rogue Trader or Pathfinder regardless. Sure getting rid of the genre mashups from the gimmicky Pathfinder modules they use will help. Maybe a 40% increase in sales total. But they still won't be playing on the level of Larian.

 

[luj1]

If they are competing with BG3 they already lost, tbh.

 

[Roguey]

While I agree with you in general, Automata had fully voiced protagonists and most side-characters were also fully voiced. It was actually lauded for its strong VA, same as the original Nier. In this day and age, getting certain VA for your games is actually a reason for people to buy your games, especially in Japan where the VA scene is obviously quite a bit stronger due to Anime.

The big mistake the western developers continue to make, is taking actual movie/tv actors for their games to mo-cap and voice-act, and those are almost exclusively worse and more expensive than actual industry professionals.

Like someone else said, once you reach a certain budget and try to bring people into your genre that aren't already going to buy your game on the premise of its setting, franchise, style of game or dev star-power, having a fully voiced game is very helpful. Is it required? Of course not. But let's not kid ourselves that offering 4k textures and fully voicing your game doesn't help improve its mass appeal. And mass appeal is what you need when you not only want to break even, but actually turn a reasonable profit in AA and AAA development. The grognards on the dex aint enough to pay the bills.

Tears of the Kingdom: Released in 2023, sold 10 million in three days, eventually sold over 20 million.

It does have some voiced cinematics but for the most part it's like this:

 

[BrotherFrank]

To whoever used the monkeypaw to wish yrliet would have more voicelines to reflect her changing relationship with charname instead of calling you monkeigh all the time: kindly neck yourself.

 

[Ryzer]

Can't they just use AI for voice-over? I mean it does a decent job at mimicking voices nowadays.

 

[lycanwarrior]

Can't they just use AI for voice-over? I mean it does a decent job at mimicking voices nowadays.

That's probably what a lot of gaming companies in the future will start doing. Especially for the less important NPCs I would think.

 

[Gregz]

Can machine learning apply a lisp to VA actors yet? They'll save a lot of money that way.

 

[BosanskiSeljak]

They're both shit

 

[Morality Games]

The idea of anyone making "The Next Baldur's Gate 3" is ridiculous. It's symptomatic of the recency bias that infects the modern game business.

There will not be another "Baldur's Gate 3" because that game was a unique mix of timing, opportunity, budget, and marketing savvy. It is the type of situation that you cannot create on purpose. It entered the fringes (just the fringes, mind!) of the zeitgeist and was hugely successful at 10 million units sold . . . but Hogwarts sold 24 million. Call of Duty Vanguard, considered to be one of the weakest entries in the series, sold over 30 million in 2021.

There are many people who played BG3 that will never again play another RPG, no matter how much voice acting it contains. It was a once-in-a-lifetime event for many players, and will not be replicated. And this is not rare, by the way. Everyone can think of that one game they really enjoyed in a genre they don't normally play and will never play again, even if another great game in that genre comes along.

Owlcat should just focus on making good RPGs. Anyone who refuses to play an RPG because there's too much text and not enough cutscenes is not an audience group you can successfully court anyway.

Keep in mind that it's not clear they're actually making a straight-up "BG3 clone" here. Roguey believes this game is a Mass Effect-like action-RPG. Shpilchevskiy's talking about production quality, not genre.

It certainly (probably?) was in the past, but BG3's success may spur them to pivot to different mechanics.

 

[Cat Headed Eagle]

Can't they just use AI for voice-over? I mean it does a decent job at mimicking voices nowadays.

Even korean gacha aimed at permacoomers get thrown to the flames when it's found out that they used AI. Apologies are written and AI stuff is replaced by man made materials. Imagine what would happen if a dev with AA 1/2 aspirations gets caught using AI.

 

[InD_ImaginE]

They gonna release an AAA budget games with RT level of bug on release, game will bomb because blue danger hairs care not about Eeastern Europe jank shit while their older fanbase will not buy it because it is designed for Critical Role crowd (WOTR already is, RT is one step back in correct direction with its own massive problem namely BAD gameplay)

Bam, bankruptcy

Calling it now

 

[Saark]

Tears of the Kingdom: Released in 2023, sold 10 million in three days, eventually sold over 20 million.

Okay and? Like I said, it's certainly possible to still have huge success without providing a fully voiced or massively cinematic experience. But it's not a question of whether it's possible, it's a question of whether or not you, your company, your investors or shareholders believe it's in the best interest to risk it.

When the vast majority of the industry do things a certain way, going against the grain carries some inherent risk. That risk can pay off, but do you wanna take that chance when fully voicing your game isn't that big of an expendiute anymore once you're stepping into 40-50mil production budgets? I'd say it's a stupid risk to take. Fully voicing games is a bigger part of the budget, when you're on a small budget, but seeing how Owlcats next game has a much larger team (and likely budget), fully voicing the game seems like more of an afterthought than something that is going to take away desperately needed resources. If the game ends up being shit, it's not because they blew a few hundred k on VA.

 

[King Crispy]

Solasta has full VO and spent a fraction of what Owlcat spent on WotR (I think).

It can be done, but if you want the best actors it's obviously going to cost a fortune.

If I were in charge at Owlcat I'd actually call up Tactical Adventures and inquire about a merger. They're not going to take down Swen any time soon but they could make a much better RPG than he ever did.