Pathfinder Pathfinder: Kingmaker Builds and Strats Thread

[anvi]

I need to get some of this stuff:

https://old.reddit.com/r/Pathfinder_Kingmaker/comments/9o5kkh/artisan_specific_items_list/

Tired of using +2 swords.

 

[Incendax]

Hmm, I gotta try this. Which spell is that?

Beast Shape or Polymorph.
Smilodon is Viv 16 or friendly Wiz 13.
Leopard is Viv 10 or friendly Wiz 7.
Feral Mutagen until then.

I personally prefer using a friendly wizard, since they have many slots and I like to save my Viv slots for Legendary + Transformation. A legendary smilodon is hilarious.

 

[Haplo]

Beast Shape? Isn't it personal though?

 

[lukaszek]

deterministic system > RNG

 

[Cael]

not really interested in monk/pally splash. It can have be superior ac/saves but im chaotic, always. Sine I did not pay for tiefling, I will go with reach biting orc.
Quite sad as in the end im not changing much about current build, just adding feral goods: +2 intimidate along with single extra attack with trip

I am not sure how bugmaker handles reach, but your bite shouldn't have reach...

enlarge gives you natural reach 10. If you got reach wpn with enlarge you will still be forced to come closer few steps to bite but it can be executed from 2nd line anyway.
Enlarge is crucial for my build not because of reach bonus(which is obviously nice) but due to str and size bonuses to intimidate.

speaking of reach, anyone tried to use those magical reach daggers? Didnt try reach weapon on small creature, I wonder if friendly goblin would be able to attack from backrow with them.
Speaking of goblin, how does exactly critical hit and sneak dmg work? Im trying to understand values of keen kukris in a game where I find so cool daggers. If only base wpn dmg gets multiplied, it seem meh on tiny knife master. Obviously its different story on my enlarged str power attack fauchard vivi/thug. Also crits give extra edge for my melee based party with teamwork feats.

No. If you use a reach weapon when enlarged, the threat area for the reach weapon is between 10 and 20 ft. The area between you and 10ft is an unthreatened area.

In other words, reach weapons and and normal weapons (in terms of reach) should never overlap unless it is one of those special reach weapons (e.g., spiked chains, kusarigama, etc.).

 

[Incendax]

Beast Shape? Isn't it personal though?

Beast Shape is on the Viv list.
For all your slavering lycanthrope needs.

 

[lukaszek]

deterministic system > RNG

 

[Simple Simon]

Beast Shape is on the Viv list.
For all your slavering lycanthrope needs.

I think Haplo was asking how a wizard could cast it on you if it is personal. But I think the response is in your original post, which is that the wizard would cast polymorph.

 

[Cael]

No. If you use a reach weapon when enlarged, the threat area for the reach weapon is between 10 and 20 ft. The area between you and 10ft is an unthreatened area.

In other words, reach weapons and and normal weapons (in terms of reach) should never overlap unless it is one of those special reach weapons (e.g., spiked chains, kusarigama, etc.).

there is no 'doughnut hole' in kingmaker

They just made the Glaive the most powerful weapon in the game. Nice.

 

[Haplo]

Not really. Glaive is 20/x3, which is not particularly good for melee combos (and sick chains are possible here), causing AoOs and critical effects.
Fauchard on the other hand...

 

[anvi]

Just got an "oversized" bow on my Ranger and it is crazy how strong it is! He is one shotting trolls. And it contains acid too so I don't even need to do that afterwards.

 

[Incendax]

Just got an "oversized" bow on my Ranger and it is crazy how strong it is! He is one shotting trolls. And it contains acid too so I don't even need to do that afterwards.

Welcome to the Ekun Pain Train.
Express Route to Genocide Town for all your Lawful Good needs.

 

[Cael]

Not really. Glaive is 20/x3, which is not particularly good for melee combos (and sick chains are possible here), causing AoOs and critical effects.
Fauchard on the other hand...

Oh, I was just thinking of a machinegun tripper using a reach martial weapon that most characters of that type would be profficient in from the start. Most people do not want to use a normal reach weapon because of the doughnut effect. Take that out and reach weapons become a thing.

The glaive was actually a weapon that was suggested to mages and usually non-profficient/non-melee combatants at low levels for the free trip attempt as the enemy rushes in. The -4 to-hit for non-profficiency doesn't matter as much as tripping is a touch attack. The other weapon suggested to mages is the scythe, to be used in combo with the Sleep spell. Coup de grace doesn't need an attack roll.

 

[Haplo]

Cael, you really need to play the game before making too many comments.

Tripping is a standard action in Kingmaker (so to do that you give up iterative attacks/casting) and normally you can't reflex trip on AoOs. Only exceptions that allow for mixing attacks and trips are unarmed monk with Leg Sweep and/or Pummeling Style, cloak of winter wolf with bite/aspect of the wolf/some form of animal polymorphing.

Although it MAY be possible to spend AoO attempts on trips (not entirely sure, but I guess that might have been what my main char was doing during a fight with a certain nasty lich, could explain how he managed to keep him pinned for a long time despite non-obvious odds), if you right-click toggle trip. But then you're spending all your normal actions and all AoOs to keep someone down - as you obviously can't trip someone who is already prone.

But generally if you play correctly, your caster (particularly a non-proficient one) should not get rushed. Tanking is a thing in Kingmaker.

Sleep falls off rather fast. Wizards can afford it, I suppose, spontaneous casters should not.

 

[Cael]

Cael, you really need to play the game before making too many comments.

Tripping is a standard action in Kingmaker (so to do that you give up iterative attacks/casting) and normally you can't reflex trip on AoOs. Only exceptions that allow for mixing attacks and trips are unarmed monk with Leg Sweep and/or Pummeling Style, cloak of winter wolf with bite/aspect of the wolf/some form of animal polymorphing.

Although it MAY be possible to spend AoO attempts on trips (not entirely sure, but I guess that might have been what my main char was doing during a fight with a certain nasty lich, could explain how he managed to keep him pinned for a long time despite non-obvious odds), if you right-click toggle trip. But then you're spending all your normal actions and all AoOs to keep someone down - as you obviously can't trip someone who is already prone.

But generally if you play correctly, your caster (particularly a non-proficient one) should not get rushed. Tanking is a thing in Kingmaker.

Sleep falls off rather fast. Wizards can afford it, I suppose, spontaneous casters should not.

Not really. I don't give a shit about the game thanks to rabid fanbois. Motherfuckers make me lose interest in games faster than cuckdog's logo on the cover.

I just point out its flaws and stupid rules changes for my own amusement.

The idea of tripping as a wizard is as a backup in case things goes wrong. Tanks are a thing in PnP also, you know. It is not unique to bugmaker. The difference is that there is no reload in PnP, so you have backups on backups to keep your squishy arcane casters alive.

The machinegun tripper is all about keeping multiple people down. They charge in, they get tripped and hit thanks to Improved Trip. Of course, if the game is so stupid as to nerf the already limited fighter combat options, then I suppose they have no choice but to replace that with bloated nummbers and sneak attack gimmicks.

 

[lukaszek]

deterministic system > RNG

 

[Haplo]

I believe double weapons are 2 weapon fighting tools. Where the offhand "side" is considered light (-2/-2 instead of -4/-4 penalty with Two-Weapon Fighting), despite deling same base damage as standard sized one-handed weapons.

 

[Althorion]

If the game implements the PNP system well, it’s a double weapon—a full-attack action gives its user an extra attack as if a light weapon was used (so with a reduced penalty). That said, it’s still quite a penalty—-4/-8 without a feat and -2/-2 with it.

 

[Yosharian]

If the game implements the PNP system well, it’s a double weapon—a full-attack action gives its user an extra attack as if a light weapon was used (so with a reduced penalty). That said, it’s still quite a penalty—-4/-8 without a feat and -2/-2 with it.

-2 to attack in exchange for up to 3 extra attacks is a great investment.

 

[lukaszek]

deterministic system > RNG

 

[Yosharian]

also,is it a bug that orc doesnt get exotic orcish double axe prof?

Orc should get that weapon as a martial weapon.

Weapon Familiarity: Orcs are always proficient with greataxes and falchions, and treat any weapon with the word “orc” in its name as a martial weapon.

 

[lukaszek]

deterministic system > RNG

 

[Yosharian]

actually... whats the point of spending exotic prof on double weapon if you need full twf line to utilize it?
Is the difference in having 1.5 str offhand as opposed to 0.5 str light?

I think so... personally I'd rather just wield two weapons.

 

[lukaszek]

deterministic system > RNG

 

[Yosharian]

on the other hand... if i shape shift into smilodon or draconic as 6 lvl alchemical spell, both with 5 natural attacks, each get full 1.0 str without any feats right? Or is there a way to get 1.5 on natural attacks? Ive finally realized that with my ultra high str those things start to matter

Uhhh natural attacks are funny, I'm not sure how it works with the Smilodon attacks, but some get 1.0x (primary) and some get 0.5x (secondary)

Don't think you can get 1.5x but not sure