Pathfinder Pathfinder: Kingmaker - Enhanced Plus Edition - now with turn-based combat

[Average Manatee]

I didn't know this. Cut content restoration mod when?

 

[Jarpie]

Wrong game, that was in Wrath of the Righteous, not Kingmaker.

 

[CthuluIsSpy]

How do you survive challenging? I'm trying to do roguelike mode on that difficulty (after successfully killing the Captor on normal) and I found that there's a ridiculous difficulty increase. Not only do enemies hit harder they have higher AC too, and level 1 adventurers can't hit worth of shit. It took my paladin and druid like 20 seconds to kill a single goblin once, and this is with buffs on.

 

[Litmanen]

How do you survive challenging? I'm trying to do roguelike mode on that difficulty (after successfully killing the Captor on normal) and I found that there's a ridiculous difficulty increase. Not only do enemies hit harder they have higher AC too, and level 1 adventurers can't hit worth of shit. It took my paladin and druid like 20 seconds to kill a single goblin once, and this is with buffs on.

Look, I played on Hard mode (anyway, the one just before Unfair) and did it. Nothing was impossible.

And if I managed to do it, you can too. I'm weak and shit at games. SO you can do it. Use more buffs and things like these. At the beginning I hated Linzi but, to be honest, her spells and chants are the most buffing thing in the game. They are game changing.

Anyway, generally speaking, on Hard/challenging mode, you need to level up before you can do some quests. You cannot just run here and there and do whatever you want to do as you can in other games/difficulty mode. But it's absolutely doable, trust me

 

[Haplo]

How do you survive challenging? I'm trying to do roguelike mode on that difficulty (after successfully killing the Captor on normal) and I found that there's a ridiculous difficulty increase. Not only do enemies hit harder they have higher AC too, and level 1 adventurers can't hit worth of shit. It took my paladin and druid like 20 seconds to kill a single goblin once, and this is with buffs on.

You need to learn to buff. It makes all the difference in the world. However at level 1 your options are somewhat limited. A druid should have a meatshield, though. A leopard makes a solid tank for example.

 

[Yosharian]

How do you survive challenging? I'm trying to do roguelike mode on that difficulty (after successfully killing the Captor on normal) and I found that there's a ridiculous difficulty increase. Not only do enemies hit harder they have higher AC too, and level 1 adventurers can't hit worth of shit. It took my paladin and druid like 20 seconds to kill a single goblin once, and this is with buffs on.

Roguelike?

 

[CthuluIsSpy]

How do you survive challenging? I'm trying to do roguelike mode on that difficulty (after successfully killing the Captor on normal) and I found that there's a ridiculous difficulty increase. Not only do enemies hit harder they have higher AC too, and level 1 adventurers can't hit worth of shit. It took my paladin and druid like 20 seconds to kill a single goblin once, and this is with buffs on.

Roguelike?

Beneath the Stolen Lands standalone mode. I'm pretty sure it's called roguelike mode in game. I found it's good for trying out various builds, so instead of playing a shitty build for 100+ hours in the story mode I only have to play a shitty build for about 6 hours, assuming I get that far.

Here's what I noticed so far -
Invincible Rager was pretty fun except you still need an actual tank.

Thassolonian Specialist Necromancer into Eldritch knight is kind of bad? You still can't melee because you're squishy so you're in the back line, so you're basically just a somewhat decent bowmen with spells. I didn't see any feats that remove the arcane penalty for armour for EK (like what magus has) so you still can't wear armour and even if you take Arcane armour feat it's only a -10% failure chance, which is lame. Magus is just better as a gish mage-warrior type.

Eldritch Archer on the other hand is amazing. Early game feels a bit mediocre but late game, holy shit you deal so much damage with arcane enhancement, arcane bane enhancement and other steroids. He actually out damaged the vivisectionist I made for the team, and ranged vivis are also pretty damn good too.

Aldori Swordlord is a really good frontliner and is surprisingly tanky due to the AC bonuses that class gets and the dex modifier. Like an idjit though I didn't give her enough int to take disarm, which is a bit part of the swordlord's kit.

Fey bloodline sorcerer is pretty fun. Probably should'nt have gone gnome and illusionist though, because as a fey sorc you want to take enchantment which like illusion affects will, and going too heavy on a save type is a problem when you run into things like other fey or undead.

Herald Caller isn't bad, actually. Good if you want some extra ranged DPS and being able to just churn out summons is fun.

Sensei is just overpowered. Holy shit he provides so much utility and damage. The first successful run I had used him, and the aforementioned Vivisectionist, EA, Swordlord, Fey and Herald and for most of the run they just mulched through floors. This was on normal difficulty though.

 

[CthuluIsSpy]

How do you survive challenging? I'm trying to do roguelike mode on that difficulty (after successfully killing the Captor on normal) and I found that there's a ridiculous difficulty increase. Not only do enemies hit harder they have higher AC too, and level 1 adventurers can't hit worth of shit. It took my paladin and druid like 20 seconds to kill a single goblin once, and this is with buffs on.

Look, I played on Hard mode (anyway, the one just before Unfair) and did it. Nothing was impossible.

And if I managed to do it, you can too. I'm weak and shit at games. SO you can do it. Use more buffs and things like these. At the beginning I hated Linzi but, to be honest, her spells and chants are the most buffing thing in the game. They are game changing.

Anyway, generally speaking, on Hard/challenging mode, you need to level up before you can do some quests. You cannot just run here and there and do whatever you want to do as you can in other games/difficulty mode. But it's absolutely doable, trust me

I don't like Linzi either, but that's what mercs are for. It's probably better to take a sensei merc anyway as opposed to a bard, because he is pretty ridiculous with what he can provide.
In my last Roguelike run I had a sensei in my party and here's a brief list of the shit he can get up to :
- Give everyone barkskin
- Give everyone immediately to reflex partial effects
- Give everyone Disease immunity
- Give everyone poison immunity
- Give everyone spell resistance that scales with his level + 10
- Bard buff song

Sensei's are basically better bards who can melee. It's pretty ridiculous.

 

[CthuluIsSpy]

How do you survive challenging? I'm trying to do roguelike mode on that difficulty (after successfully killing the Captor on normal) and I found that there's a ridiculous difficulty increase. Not only do enemies hit harder they have higher AC too, and level 1 adventurers can't hit worth of shit. It took my paladin and druid like 20 seconds to kill a single goblin once, and this is with buffs on.

You need to learn to buff. It makes all the difference in the world. However at level 1 your options are somewhat limited. A druid should have a meatshield, though. A leopard makes a solid tank for example.

I'm running blight druid, so no companion.
After I got another 2 party members and another level it got a lot easier though, it's just that the first floor was a pain in the arse because you have no buffs, no damage and poor hit chances.
I'm actually a bit perplexed with how I'm supposed to use druids.
They have wild shape and medium BAB, which would imply they are supposed to be used in melee, but apparently you shouldn't take weapon finesse on them even though they're going to have natural attacks and I don't even know if they should have dex or strength.

 

[Haplo]

I don't know either? I guess they'll suck in martial combat regardless, unless you do some serious multiclassing.
Loosing their main asset sounds kind of bad TBH.

 

[Yosharian]

Oh that

 

[CthuluIsSpy]

I don't know either? I guess they'll suck in martial combat regardless, unless you do some serious multiclassing.
Loosing their main asset sounds kind of bad TBH.

Well, Blight Druids do get a miasma ability to compensate, which inflicts debuffs on anyone who's adjacent to him. So I guess he's supposed to be in melee? Problem is though is that it also seems to affect allies...unless it's a paladin, who's immune to disease and sickened. I'll see how it goes, I just don't know if dex or strength is better for him. I'm going to assume dex with finesse so he can use the dex AC bonus and can actually hit things, but I really don't know.
Druids don't even have that many armour options; whilst they can wear armour due to being divine casters, they can't wear metal armour so you're basically stuck with hide armour, as I don't think there's a non-metal heavy armour in the game.

 

[scytheavatar]

How do you survive challenging? I'm trying to do roguelike mode on that difficulty (after successfully killing the Captor on normal) and I found that there's a ridiculous difficulty increase. Not only do enemies hit harder they have higher AC too, and level 1 adventurers can't hit worth of shit. It took my paladin and druid like 20 seconds to kill a single goblin once, and this is with buffs on.

Look, I played on Hard mode (anyway, the one just before Unfair) and did it. Nothing was impossible.

And if I managed to do it, you can too. I'm weak and shit at games. SO you can do it. Use more buffs and things like these. At the beginning I hated Linzi but, to be honest, her spells and chants are the most buffing thing in the game. They are game changing.

Anyway, generally speaking, on Hard/challenging mode, you need to level up before you can do some quests. You cannot just run here and there and do whatever you want to do as you can in other games/difficulty mode. But it's absolutely doable, trust me

I don't like Linzi either, but that's what mercs are for. It's probably better to take a sensei merc anyway as opposed to a bard, because he is pretty ridiculous with what he can provide.
In my last Roguelike run I had a sensei in my party and here's a brief list of the shit he can get up to :
- Give everyone barkskin
- Give everyone immediately to reflex partial effects
- Give everyone Disease immunity
- Give everyone poison immunity
- Give everyone spell resistance that scales with his level + 10
- Bard buff song

Sensei's are basically better bards who can melee. It's pretty ridiculous.

Bards have access to Dirge of Doom. You want Bards for that cause Shatter Defense is king in Kingmaker. And something every character needs to have ASAP. Having it makes your characters actually able to hit people.

Bards also have access to heroism and haste which will help you a lot.

 

[CthuluIsSpy]

Oh maybe. Don't you need dazzling display first? Throwing dazzling display on bowmen and mages feel weird for me.
Anyway, I've been trying a vivi-wiz-trickster character in my current roguelike party.
He's...kind of scuffed.
I took bomb buffing discoveries because I was originally going to take arcane bomber...only to discover that ABs take 4 opposition schools. I'm not even sure if the arcane bombs actually scale too.
Alchemists do not count as arcane casters, so the spellbook is a mess. I'm not even sure AT spell progression will go all the way to level 9. I basically lost about 4 levels getting the stats for it. Apparently there's a way to get sneak attack 2 with just a level of vivi, but I didn't see any way to do that.

That said, cognatogen could be an interesting tool to have due to the int boost.

 

[Cael]

Oh maybe. Don't you need dazzling display first? Throwing dazzling display on bowmen and mages feel weird for me.
Anyway, I've been trying a vivi-wiz-trickster character in my current roguelike party.
He's...kind of scuffed.
I took bomb buffing discoveries because I was originally going to take arcane bomber...only to discover that ABs take 4 opposition schools. I'm not even sure if the arcane bombs actually scale too.
Alchemists do not count as arcane casters, so the spellbook is a mess. I'm not even sure AT spell progression will go all the way to level 9. I basically lost about 4 levels getting the stats for it. Apparently there's a way to get sneak attack 2 with just a level of vivi, but I didn't see any way to do that.

That said, cognatogen could be an interesting tool to have due to the int boost.

You take 1 level of Vivi, then 5 levels of Wizard, then 10 levels of Trickster and finish off with more Wizard levels. You get 19 levels of Wizard spellcasting, so you easily get 9th level spells. However, given the limited number of spells available, it is arguable that you can use Arcana Sorcerer instead, which when coupled with elf gives you +4 to spell penetration checks and stacks with the feats. Basically makes spell resistance useless against you, and you still get 9th level spells.

There is a feat that improves your Sneak Attack by 1 step, which is the trick there. The rest is pure skill point allocation.

 

[CthuluIsSpy]

Oh maybe. Don't you need dazzling display first? Throwing dazzling display on bowmen and mages feel weird for me.
Anyway, I've been trying a vivi-wiz-trickster character in my current roguelike party.
He's...kind of scuffed.
I took bomb buffing discoveries because I was originally going to take arcane bomber...only to discover that ABs take 4 opposition schools. I'm not even sure if the arcane bombs actually scale too.
Alchemists do not count as arcane casters, so the spellbook is a mess. I'm not even sure AT spell progression will go all the way to level 9. I basically lost about 4 levels getting the stats for it. Apparently there's a way to get sneak attack 2 with just a level of vivi, but I didn't see any way to do that.

That said, cognatogen could be an interesting tool to have due to the int boost.

You take 1 level of Vivi, then 5 levels of Wizard, then 10 levels of Trickster and finish off with more Wizard levels. You get 19 levels of Wizard spellcasting, so you easily get 9th level spells. However, given the limited number of spells available, it is arguable that you can use Arcana Sorcerer instead, which when coupled with elf gives you +4 to spell penetration checks and stacks with the feats. Basically makes spell resistance useless against you, and you still get 9th level spells.

There is a feat that improves your Sneak Attack by 1 step, which is the trick there. The rest is pure skill point allocation.

That's what I read, but I couldn't find that feat. All I could find was Accomplished Sneak attacker, and that wasn't it.

I also have a kine in my party but I'm having trouble picking feats for her. Apparently she does benefit from spell pen (I would see spell resistance checks in the log), but the game is telling me that it's not advisable for some reason.

 

[Desiderius]

I don't know either? I guess they'll suck in martial combat regardless, unless you do some serious multiclassing.
Loosing their main asset sounds kind of bad TBH.

Blight Druid and Arcane Bomber were Dixon Cider's* two favorite classes.

* - Steam's best Unfair poaster

 

[Desiderius]

Kinnie needs Spell Pen for Energy Blasts (that target Touch AC) but not Physical Blasts (that target regular AC).

I wouldn't recommend Kinnie until you get a better feel for the game.

 

[Cael]

Oh maybe. Don't you need dazzling display first? Throwing dazzling display on bowmen and mages feel weird for me.
Anyway, I've been trying a vivi-wiz-trickster character in my current roguelike party.
He's...kind of scuffed.
I took bomb buffing discoveries because I was originally going to take arcane bomber...only to discover that ABs take 4 opposition schools. I'm not even sure if the arcane bombs actually scale too.
Alchemists do not count as arcane casters, so the spellbook is a mess. I'm not even sure AT spell progression will go all the way to level 9. I basically lost about 4 levels getting the stats for it. Apparently there's a way to get sneak attack 2 with just a level of vivi, but I didn't see any way to do that.

That said, cognatogen could be an interesting tool to have due to the int boost.

You take 1 level of Vivi, then 5 levels of Wizard, then 10 levels of Trickster and finish off with more Wizard levels. You get 19 levels of Wizard spellcasting, so you easily get 9th level spells. However, given the limited number of spells available, it is arguable that you can use Arcana Sorcerer instead, which when coupled with elf gives you +4 to spell penetration checks and stacks with the feats. Basically makes spell resistance useless against you, and you still get 9th level spells.

There is a feat that improves your Sneak Attack by 1 step, which is the trick there. The rest is pure skill point allocation.

That's what I read, but I couldn't find that feat. All I could find was Accomplished Sneak attacker, and that wasn't it.

I also have a kine in my party but I'm having trouble picking feats for her. Apparently she does benefit from spell pen (I would see spell resistance checks in the log), but the game is telling me that it's not advisable for some reason.

It is Accomplished Sneak Attacker. Just remember that it doesn't take effect until character level 3.

 

[CthuluIsSpy]

Kinnie needs Spell Pen for Energy Blasts (that target Touch AC) but not Physical Blasts (that target regular AC).

I wouldn't recommend Kinnie until you get a better feel for the game.

I dunno, she seems to be doing good work on challenging in the roguelike mode, so I guess I'm doing something right? Its the dark elementalist subtype too.

 

[CthuluIsSpy]

Oh maybe. Don't you need dazzling display first? Throwing dazzling display on bowmen and mages feel weird for me.
Anyway, I've been trying a vivi-wiz-trickster character in my current roguelike party.
He's...kind of scuffed.
I took bomb buffing discoveries because I was originally going to take arcane bomber...only to discover that ABs take 4 opposition schools. I'm not even sure if the arcane bombs actually scale too.
Alchemists do not count as arcane casters, so the spellbook is a mess. I'm not even sure AT spell progression will go all the way to level 9. I basically lost about 4 levels getting the stats for it. Apparently there's a way to get sneak attack 2 with just a level of vivi, but I didn't see any way to do that.

That said, cognatogen could be an interesting tool to have due to the int boost.

You take 1 level of Vivi, then 5 levels of Wizard, then 10 levels of Trickster and finish off with more Wizard levels. You get 19 levels of Wizard spellcasting, so you easily get 9th level spells. However, given the limited number of spells available, it is arguable that you can use Arcana Sorcerer instead, which when coupled with elf gives you +4 to spell penetration checks and stacks with the feats. Basically makes spell resistance useless against you, and you still get 9th level spells.

There is a feat that improves your Sneak Attack by 1 step, which is the trick there. The rest is pure skill point allocation.

That's what I read, but I couldn't find that feat. All I could find was Accomplished Sneak attacker, and that wasn't it.

I also have a kine in my party but I'm having trouble picking feats for her. Apparently she does benefit from spell pen (I would see spell resistance checks in the log), but the game is telling me that it's not advisable for some reason.

I think it is Accomplished Sneak Attacker.

Yeah I took that, still had to level Vivi up to like 3 to meet that criteria for AT.

 

[Cael]

Oh maybe. Don't you need dazzling display first? Throwing dazzling display on bowmen and mages feel weird for me.
Anyway, I've been trying a vivi-wiz-trickster character in my current roguelike party.
He's...kind of scuffed.
I took bomb buffing discoveries because I was originally going to take arcane bomber...only to discover that ABs take 4 opposition schools. I'm not even sure if the arcane bombs actually scale too.
Alchemists do not count as arcane casters, so the spellbook is a mess. I'm not even sure AT spell progression will go all the way to level 9. I basically lost about 4 levels getting the stats for it. Apparently there's a way to get sneak attack 2 with just a level of vivi, but I didn't see any way to do that.

That said, cognatogen could be an interesting tool to have due to the int boost.

You take 1 level of Vivi, then 5 levels of Wizard, then 10 levels of Trickster and finish off with more Wizard levels. You get 19 levels of Wizard spellcasting, so you easily get 9th level spells. However, given the limited number of spells available, it is arguable that you can use Arcana Sorcerer instead, which when coupled with elf gives you +4 to spell penetration checks and stacks with the feats. Basically makes spell resistance useless against you, and you still get 9th level spells.

There is a feat that improves your Sneak Attack by 1 step, which is the trick there. The rest is pure skill point allocation.

That's what I read, but I couldn't find that feat. All I could find was Accomplished Sneak attacker, and that wasn't it.

I also have a kine in my party but I'm having trouble picking feats for her. Apparently she does benefit from spell pen (I would see spell resistance checks in the log), but the game is telling me that it's not advisable for some reason.

I think it is Accomplished Sneak Attacker.

Yeah I took that, still had to level Vivi up to like 3 to meet that criteria for AT.

Mate, wait till level 3 to take it. Just go Vivi 1/Wiz or Sorc 2 then take ASA. It is half character level, rounded up, so it doesn't take effect at level 1 and 2.

 

[CthuluIsSpy]

I don't know either? I guess they'll suck in martial combat regardless, unless you do some serious multiclassing.
Loosing their main asset sounds kind of bad TBH.

Blight Druid and Arcane Bomber were Dixon Cider's* two favorite classes.

* - Steam's best Unfair poaster

Ok but how though? I kind of understand blight druid because of miasma and all of the aspects and self-buffs you can throw onto him (I'm using him now and while early on he's not great he gets a lot better when you start getting aspects and miasma), but arcane bomber seems pretty bad? Per the feature descriptions arcane bomb damage doesn't seem to scale with levels and you have to sacrifice spells to buff them.

 

[Mr. Magniloquent]

I think it is Accomplished Sneak Attacker.

Yeah I took that, still had to level Vivi up to like 3 to meet that criteria for AT.

Why in the nine hells are you mixing Vivisectionist and Arcane Trickster?

 

[Cael]

I think it is Accomplished Sneak Attacker.

Yeah I took that, still had to level Vivi up to like 3 to meet that criteria for AT.

Why in the nine hells are you mixing Vivisectionist and Arcane Trickster?

Sneak Attack at level 1. It is one of two classes that give it, the other being Rogue.