Pathfinder Pathfinder: Kingmaker - Enhanced Plus Edition - now with turn-based combat

[Nerevar]

Level 9 arcane spells and medium BAB not bad.

 

[Xamenos]

Level 9 arcane spells and medium BAB not bad.

Sorcerer gets 9th level spells at caster level 18 instead of the wizard's 17.

 

[Nerevar]

So if it dropped the 2nd sorc level for a full BAB class will that add a 4th base attack?

 

[Pink Eye]

Couple things: You have him get both Exotic Weapon Proficiency and Martial Weapon Proficiency. Why?

Grease at L9, Stinking Cloud at L12, Cloudkill at L13, Spell Focus Conjuration. Why? The DC will be way too low for them to be worth the action.

Maxing Knowledge Arcana is iffy, unless it's the only character that has it available. The lack of INT means he'll always be second best at the party, and that's not very useful. I'd prefer max persuasion and either athletics or perception with the leftover points.

That last level of Sorcerer is also debatable. It will be the 17th caster level, which doesn't offer much compared to the 16th to be worth the loss of BAB. Why not a second Monk level?

>You have him get both Exotic Weapon Proficiency and Martial Weapon Proficiency. Why?
Eldritch Knight requirement is martial weapon proficiency. Exotic Weapon Proficiency gives you bastard sword, which allows you to wield a CHA based bastard sword later in the game.

>Grease at L9, Stinking Cloud at L12, Cloudkill at L13, Spell Focus Conjuration. Why?
Have to waste the spell slots at something. This build isn't for unfair, I'm sure the DC checks are more generous at the lower difficulties. At least, anon never said anything about playing on unfair. Anyways, stinking cloud and cloud kill were picked as soon as they were available. If you spam enough of them, the enemy will eventually fail their roll check.

>The lack of INT means he'll always be second best at the party
The game gives you other party members that can make up for your weakness.

>Maxing Knowledge Arcana is iffy,
You need at least 5 for DD. You also need 3 ranks into mobility for crane style. After that, you're free to waste them in wherever. I don't really place much emphasis on skills, except for persuasion and perception.

 

[amurath]

Here's a similar but slightly more optimized build from InEffect: https://af.gog.com/forum/pathfinder_kingmaker/ineffects_guide_v2/post41?as=1649904300
I'm still not sure whether the EK build is better than, say, Sorc 13/DD 4/Monk 1/Paladin 2, though.

 

[Pink Eye]

I see he want for the dazzling build. While I went for AoO stacking build.

 

[Daidre]

I'm still not sure whether the EK build is better than, say, Sorc 13/DD 4/Monk 1/Paladin 2, though.

With 12 BAB and 16 Caster Level this one will be lacking at melee and spells both. Kinda pointless.

 

[Pink Eye]

I'm still not sure whether the EK build is better than, say, Sorc 13/DD 4/Monk 1/Paladin 2, though.

With 12 BAB and 16 Caster Level this one will be lacking at melee and spells both. Kinda pointless.

I wouldn't say its pointless. Anon wanted a good build. And I tried my best to do just that. Maybe I shouldn't have given build advice. Idk.

 

[Daidre]

I'm still not sure whether the EK build is better than, say, Sorc 13/DD 4/Monk 1/Paladin 2, though.

With 12 BAB and 16 Caster Level this one will be lacking at melee and spells both. Kinda pointless.

I wouldn't say its pointless. Anon wanted a good build. And I tried my best to do just that. Maybe I shouldn't have given build advice. Idk.

Your build is 16BAB + 17CL. It is completely ok, if a bit slow on low levels. Bog standard gish.

 

[Pink Eye]

I'm still not sure whether the EK build is better than, say, Sorc 13/DD 4/Monk 1/Paladin 2, though.

With 12 BAB and 16 Caster Level this one will be lacking at melee and spells both. Kinda pointless.

I wouldn't say its pointless. Anon wanted a good build. And I tried my best to do just that. Maybe I shouldn't have given build advice. Idk.

Your build is 16BAB + 17CL. It is completely ok, if a bit slow on low levels. Bog standard gish.

Ok! See anons, I DO know how to make builds.

 

[VentilatorOfDoom]

a particular combo of the Kineticist ability is EXTREMELY powerful when you reach that lvl, the guide should tell you when you get Deadly Earth as soon as possible

He gets it at level 14? The hard difficulty is a bit not hard so I want to try unfair.

Spoiler

Unfair Kineticist.

Race: Human

Alignment: Any

Stats:
Str: 7
Dex: 19 > 24
Con: 16
Int: 7
Wis: 10
Cha: 16

Main skills: Persuasion(Max)
Suggested secondary skills: Trickery if you want to abuse not sharing exp for skill checks. Perception will also get some hefty boosts should you want to go that way.

Final Build: Kineticist 19 / Rogue(Thug) 1

Detailed leveling breakdown:
Lvl 1: Kineticist - Point-Blank Shot // Precise Shot // Fire / Extra Range
Lvl 2: Kineticist - Fire > Dazzling Display
Lvl 3: Rogue - Accomplished Sneak Attacker
Lvl 4: Kineticist - Fan of Flames
Lvl 5: Kineticist - Weapon Focus: Kinetic Blast // Fire > Dreadful Carnage
Lvl 6: Kineticist - Burning Infusion*
Lvl 7: Kineticist - Skill Focus: Persuasion // Fire’s Fury
Lvl 8: Kineticist - Earth
Lvl 9: Kineticist - Shatter Defences // Earth > Trip
Lvl 10: Kineticist - Bowling Infusion
Lvl 11: Kineticist - Fury’s Fall // Earth > Greater Trip
Lvl 12: Kineticist - Wall
Lvl 13: Kineticist - Agile Maneuvers // Enduring Earth
Lvl 14: Kineticist - Deadly Earth
Lvl 15: Kineticist - Persuasive // Elemental Whispers - Centipede**
Lvl 16: Kineticist - Water > Water
Lvl 17: Kineticist - Blind Fight // Expanded Defence > Flesh of Stone
Lvl 18: Kineticist - Fragmentation
Lvl 19: Kineticist - Toughness // Fire > Iron Will
Lvl 20: Kineticist - Cloud // Metakinesis: Empowered
*Doesn't matter much which infusion we take here. Dazzling that works once a blue moon or d6 DoT that doesn't really matter.
**Hare would be a valid alternative, but initiative doesn’t really matter for this one. If we get focused we will die flat-footed or not.

Gear: +Stat belts and hats. The rest hardly matters. Some Persuasion and/or CMD bonuses would be welcome.

Very abusive build. Deals tons of damage and controls everything from level 3 pretty much. Don’t be shy to use dazzling manually for control. That dreadful might not pop soon enough, but it’s there and will keep everything reasonably terrified of your existence. Primarily an unfair build where you can’t afford to wait for good things and AC doesn’t matter as much - you either have tons of it or none.

Use Gather Power to reduce the burn. Especially low one is a godsend(it’s not liek we plan to move much anyways)

That’s about it. Very simple and abusive build fit for unfair. No fun allowed. Thought I need to represent this one as the other kineticist is designed more for comfortable late-game play on hard than anything.

Edit: This class is actually pretty cool. Reminds me of the warlock from NWN2 but better.

Tried this in the dungeon DLC.
lvl7 take Persuasive instead of Skill Focus Persuasion
lvl13 take Skill Focus Persuasion instead of Enduring Earth (nothing survives the normal duration, it's pointless to make the duration longer)
lvl15 Blind fight instead of Persuasive which you already have
lvl 17 improved precise shot
it's possible I took different stuff for elemental whispers and expanded defense at lvl15 and 17 as well, don't remember. You definitely don't need Fragmentation either, so just take whatever you feel like, saving throw increasing feats won't hurt.

It works reasonably well, the biggest problem with this build is how boring it is. Wall->Cloud->Deadly Earth, ggwp you've won the game. How many encounters will you clear effortlessly like that though before it stops being fun?

NWN2 warlock is much better, not as broken but much more interesting to play.

 

[Nerevar]

Nice improvement to the build. Good justification I'll use those changes.

 

[Zurat-Yarkuch]

Man I can't believe the types of enemies this game throws at you early on.

Spoiler

I'm playing on modified normal difficulty with critical hits enabled, damage at 100%, and enemy stats at normal. This guy was insane for my level 3 party to take on. Had to buff the crap out of everyone and pray to god my rolls were awesome. I'm amazed I was able to survive without anyone dying. I better get a ton of experience for this.

Edit: Finally got the image link working. Have to insert as media not image. Confusing.

 

[NJClaw]

Man I can't believe the types of enemies this game throws at you early on.

Grarrukh stats are insane and he is a level 7 enemy.

I'm playing on modified normal difficulty with critical hits enabled, damage at 100%, and enemy stats at normal. This guy was insane for my level 3 party to take on. Had to buff the crap out of everyone and pray to god my rolls were awesome. I'm amazed I was able to survive without anyone dying. I better get a ton of experience for this.

Here's your pic man, you need to right click -> copy image address and then use that as the link for the image:

Spoiler

That guy is not easy, but usually I have no problem with at least two arcane casters (Linzi leveled up as a Sylvan Sorcerer and Octavia) spamming Magic Missile/Scorching Ray and a couple of animal companions or summons to keep him busy.

 

[Mr. Magniloquent]

All the moaning about buffing is misplaced. Shortly after beating the stag lord, you should only really be casting good hope,communal resist energy, and communal delay poison.

Beyind that, its going to be mostly situational spells. Buffing takes me maybe 10 seconds, if I even do it. If you curtain your party in protections, you're either wasting spells which wont stack and/or, you've created very poor builds and should consider respec.

 

[LannTheStupid]

Mr. Magniloquent I would say that Heroism is quite universal buff. The only question is whom to buff, but not whether to buff or not.

 

[Grampy_Bone]

Man I can't believe the types of enemies this game throws at you early on. Show Spoiler
I'm playing on modified normal difficulty with critical hits enabled, damage at 100%, and enemy stats at normal. This guy was insane for my level 3 party to take on. Had to buff the crap out of everyone and pray to god my rolls were awesome. I'm amazed I was able to survive without anyone dying. I better get a ton of experience for this.

Edit: Finally got the image link working. Have to insert as media not image. Confusing.

Biggest problem is the gimpy companions. They almost feel like they were made for a different game. Plus the game is balanced around the normal difficulty which debuffs the enemies. I don't know why Owlcat did it that way but a lot of players did what you did and put the enemies on normal with normal damage and then wondered why it was so tough. In many cases they doubled or even tripled the base monster damage, then applied a -2 roll difficulty penalty and a 75% damage nerf. So bizarre. Just make normal the baseline and scale up, doofuses.

 

[NJClaw]

All the moaning about buffing is misplaced. Shortly after beating the stag lord, you should only really be casting good hope,communal resist energy, and communal delay poison.

Beyind that, its going to be mostly situational spells. Buffing takes me maybe 10 seconds, if I even do it. If you curtain your party in protections, you're either wasting spells which wont stack and/or, you've created very poor builds and should consider respec.

How are spells that buff your AC, attack bonus, ST and abilities "situational"?

And what difficulty are you playing on without the need for a single buff?

 

[Pink Eye]

Ha. Unfair makes that worg stupidly strong. I usually hold off until I'm around level 5.

 

[Grampy_Bone]

How are spells that buff your AC, attack bonus, ST and abilities "situational"?

min/max builds usually forgo permanent natural AC and deflection in favor of short term buffs from barkskin and shield of faith. If you have rings and amulets equipped they do nothing or provide minor benefit. Likewise none of the stat boosting spells stack with items. Generally you should be transitioning away from spells and towards items for efficiency purposes, especially in a game that discourages resting as much as this one.

 

[NJClaw]

How are spells that buff your AC, attack bonus, ST and abilities "situational"?

min/max builds usually forgo permanent natural AC and deflection in favor of short term buffs from barkskin and shield of faith. If you have rings and amulets equipped they do nothing or provide minor benefit. Likewise none of the stat boosting spells stack with items. Generally you should be transitioning away from spells and towards items for efficiency purposes, especially in a game that discourages resting as much as this one.

I 100% agree with you. Of course I am not casting Cat's Grace on a character that already has an enhancement bonus to Dexterity. However:
- in Beneath the Stolen Lands, for the first 20-25 levels, you don't have that many good ability boosting items;
- animal companions will never benefit from those items and will always need spell buffs.

 

[MicoSelva]

I got this game from Codex fundraiser, and bought the season pass when it was on sale, but have not gotten around to it playing it yet.
Recently my bro started a playthrough and after some initial high praise (really high for him, he's picky) he reported getting swarmed in bugs, including some game-breaking ones (like NPCs not spawning). Is this true? Is this game still a buggy mess? I thought it was mostly fixed after over 9000 patches and supposedly "enhanced" since June?

 

[Lawntoilet]

I got this game from Codex fundraiser, and bought the season pass when it was on sale, but have not gotten around to it playing it yet.
Recently my bro started a playthrough and after some initial high praise (really high for him, he's picky) he reported getting swarmed in bugs, including some game-breaking ones (like NPCs not spawning). Is this true? Is this game still a buggy mess? I thought it was mostly fixed after over 9000 patches and supposedly "enhanced" since June?

I just started playing again since the EE came out but I haven't encountered anything. I beat it without too many issues a couple months after it came out though.

 

[Grampy_Bone]

I haven't had any severe bugs with it, no.

 

[Nerevar]

Cleaning out the boggards this is going well Valerie is tanking with blur, ensmallen humanoid and defensive fighting with crane style. I sure hope nothing bad happens.

Spoiler

Well...