Pathfinder Pathfinder: Wrath of the Righteous - Game of the Year Edition

[Daidre]

What happens if you fail a perception test during this conversation?

You'd just lose a tiny bit of xp and access to to couple flavor-only dialogue options before you get their guy from under the rocks. They will spill their guts after you help him anyway.

 

[Cyberarmy]

The what now? Isn't that the standart one use?

I meant scene with thieflings, they give almost 3k xp, and we never get to see that tunnel with our own eyes. It is main story quest, impossible to miss.

Oh that one, I'd gone crazy thinking that I was missing some sweet early XP

 

[Efe]

Had some free time and wanted to play DLCs..
I seem unable to save the game on midnight isle. Anchor tries to save the game and shows savingerror.
if i quit, save is just not there.

Known bug or we just dont use sink or swim mode?

 

[Desiderius]

TIL that Reg's Morale Aura stacks with Heroism. Cam's crappy one doesn't. There is a Swift Hex Mythic in TTT that's pretty absurd with her. Had to finally give in and use the respec mod since Reg's starting skill points are so absurd. Maybe if they turned Inspect checks back on (they've been auto in Wrath since Alpha) if could make some sense? As a Gnome he's a natural to cover Knowledge (World) but all his skill pts are in Arcana (which is a prereq for HK at least) and Religion (?) which isn't even a class skill.

 

[Cyberarmy]

Had some free time and wanted to play DLCs..
I seem unable to save the game on midnight isle. Anchor tries to save the game and shows savingerror.
if i quit, save is just not there.

Known bug or we just dont use sink or swim mode?

Known bug but they did nothing since DLCs release, only added option to save anywhere in the DLC(in diffculty options?)
I had to play it like that at first, one save gives error but the other one won't. Just be aware of failed auto saves and you can manage at least.

 

[Lady Error]

Known bug but they did nothing since DLCs release

Sounds great. Was thinking of maybe getting this, but I think I'll wait.

 

[Haplo]

I could go into more detail on the math such as how critting more often but for less is better because we aren't fighting raid bosses with 10k hp but rather numerous small creatures, so rare & big crits aren't as valuable as the alternative

That said the flat increases to crit range from Trickster feats and the DLC belt do a lot to even out the balance between these weapons. Scythe could actually be the most powerful weapon for a Trickster. But then again, Grave Singer exists.

All true.
On the other hand, in case of classic Perception Trickster, without TableTop Tweaks Reworks mod, there's also the Law Domain Power - which kinda heavily favors the 18-20 crit weapons again...

 

[Haplo]

Glaives on the other hand are straight fucking fire, there are some really nice glaives in the game and you get free weapon training for the weapon type from a book which is just bonkers. (Edit: ok apparently it's not 'real' weapon training which is disappointing, it's just +1 to AB Untyped)

Death Pact

Glaive

This +5 unholy glaive deals additional 6d6 unholy damage on a successful charge. If this charge results in a killing blow, it summons one CR 19 gallu to fight alongside you for 1 minute.

This one is funny as fuck, the unholy damage is completely unresistable and the Gallu it summons is quite tanky and great for distracting the enemy. And you can get a bunch of them. I wonder if they are affected by summon feats, probably not worth it though.

Mutilated Angel

Glaive

This weapon is a +5 adamantine glaive. Whenever the wielder uses it to attack an evil creature, it grants a +5 bonus to the attack roll, and deals additionally 1d12 slashing damage on hit. Whenever this weapon lands a hit, it inflicts a -1 penalty to AC until the end of combat. This penalty stacks up to -5. The wielder takes a -3 penalty to their Charisma ability score.

Casual +5 to hit on almost every creature in the game lmao.

If Daidre hadn't made me really paranoid about the effectiveness of reach builds I would probably get my Skald using one of these. Although I guess the weapon training book only works on the MC so bleh.

Ok, so we have a Late Act 5 weapon and a late DLC3 weapon.
Guess Marching Terror's also really good when you get it early game.

What about mid-game, where most of the game happens, though? I guess Soulshear is serviceable, but... really feels weak next to a generic fauchard, not to mention Grave Singer or Wide Sweep if you don't care about reach much.

 

[Daidre]

What about mid-game, where most of the game happens, though? I guess Soulshear is serviceable, but... really feels weak next to a generic fauchard, not to mention Grave Singer or Wide Sweep if you don't care about reach much.

Imho, Glaive is bad weapon for professional melees, especially MC, but pretty solid for support-focused builds who can't really afford some parts of Improved Crit/Shatter/Outflank package.
Currently, I take Guided Hand (feat, STR > WIS for attack bonus on deity's favored weapon) from some mod on Sosiel and he is more than competent with Soulshear, if the sheer number of demons he spawns with it is something to judge him by.

 

[Rhobar121]

Glaives on the other hand are straight fucking fire, there are some really nice glaives in the game and you get free weapon training for the weapon type from a book which is just bonkers. (Edit: ok apparently it's not 'real' weapon training which is disappointing, it's just +1 to AB Untyped)

Death Pact

Glaive

This +5 unholy glaive deals additional 6d6 unholy damage on a successful charge. If this charge results in a killing blow, it summons one CR 19 gallu to fight alongside you for 1 minute.

This one is funny as fuck, the unholy damage is completely unresistable and the Gallu it summons is quite tanky and great for distracting the enemy. And you can get a bunch of them. I wonder if they are affected by summon feats, probably not worth it though.

Mutilated Angel

Glaive

This weapon is a +5 adamantine glaive. Whenever the wielder uses it to attack an evil creature, it grants a +5 bonus to the attack roll, and deals additionally 1d12 slashing damage on hit. Whenever this weapon lands a hit, it inflicts a -1 penalty to AC until the end of combat. This penalty stacks up to -5. The wielder takes a -3 penalty to their Charisma ability score.

Casual +5 to hit on almost every creature in the game lmao.

If Daidre hadn't made me really paranoid about the effectiveness of reach builds I would probably get my Skald using one of these. Although I guess the weapon training book only works on the MC so bleh.

Ok, so we have a Late Act 5 weapon and a late DLC3 weapon.
Guess Marching Terror's also really good when you get it early game.

What about mid-game, where most of the game happens, though? I guess Soulshear is serviceable, but... really feels weak next to a generic fauchard, not to mention Grave Singer or Wide Sweep if you don't care about reach much.

Reach weapon is always good. The problem with fauhard is that it requires you to spend a feat on it, unless you're playing sword saint.

 

[Haplo]

There is a Swift Hex Mythic in TTT that's pretty absurd with her.

I haven't seen such an ability in TTT?

 

[Daidre]

I haven't seen such an ability in TTT?

Because it is from Dark Codex.

 

[Yosharian]

What about mid-game, where most of the game happens, though? I guess Soulshear is serviceable, but... really feels weak next to a generic fauchard, not to mention Grave Singer or Wide Sweep if you don't care about reach much.

Imho, Glaive is bad weapon for professional melees, especially MC, but pretty solid for support-focused builds who can't really afford some parts of Improved Crit/Shatter/Outflank package.
Currently, I take Guided Hand (feat, STR > WIS for attack bonus on deity's favored weapon) from some mod on Sosiel and he is more than competent with Soulshear, if the sheer number of demons he spawns with it is something to judge him by.

Yeah that's where I was going with that, but I must admit I was very disappointed to find out that the weapon training thing isn't really weapon training

Still +5 to hit is a massive bonus

 

[Yosharian]

Daidre do you still think reach weapon users will get aggressively targeted by the AI?

 

[Daidre]

@Daidre do you still think reach weapon users will get aggressively targeted by the AI?

Yes, my current Primalist got like 15 feet reach and she still gets random whacks from time to time. She can shrug them off with Mirror Image and temp HP from Rage, but some cleric in her place would not be so lucky. It is especially noticeable in prologue, when Leopard tanks Water Elemental and boss always goes after my Enlarged backline with Glaives after ~3 rounds of missing.

It may be different depending on TB/RTwP, but from what I saw, enemies ignore high AC frontliners even more often in TB, when feature-complete AI is on.

 

[Desiderius]

What about mid-game, where most of the game happens, though? I guess Soulshear is serviceable, but... really feels weak next to a generic fauchard, not to mention Grave Singer or Wide Sweep if you don't care about reach much.

Imho, Glaive is bad weapon for professional melees, especially MC, but pretty solid for support-focused builds who can't really afford some parts of Improved Crit/Shatter/Outflank package.
Currently, I take Guided Hand (feat, STR > WIS for attack bonus on deity's favored weapon) from some mod on Sosiel and he is more than competent with Soulshear, if the sheer number of demons he spawns with it is something to judge him by.

Um, why not just buff his STR instead? Lol and use Enlarge effects? He *really* doesn't have room for Guided Hand when he can barely afford Outflank. (Mythic) Evo Focus for Archon's is a higher priority.

Glad you're finally admitting that he can be an offensive force. And yes it was the demon spawns that give it away. Can't believe the endgame theorycrafters are taking a Feat that gets completely obsoleted by Frightful Aspect.

@Daidre do you still think reach weapon users will get aggressively targeted by the AI?

Yes, my current Primalist got like 15 feet reach and she still gets random whacks from time to time. She can shrug them off with Mirror Image and temp HP from Rage, but some cleric in her place would not be so lucky. It is especially noticeable in prologue, when Leopard tanks Water Elemental and boss always goes after my Enlarged backline with Glaives after ~3 rounds of missing.

It may be different depending on TB/RTwP, but from what I saw, enemies ignore high AC frontliners even more often in TB, when feature-complete AI is on.

MC isn't Sos. My Primalist Demon MC got targeted a lot too, but maybe that was because I was teleporting into the frontlines a lot. Casting Prayer first round with Sos keeps him back then he closes and tank Seelah opening combat seems like she's got some kind of a taunt.

 

[Desiderius]

Glaives on the other hand are straight fucking fire, there are some really nice glaives in the game and you get free weapon training for the weapon type from a book which is just bonkers. (Edit: ok apparently it's not 'real' weapon training which is disappointing, it's just +1 to AB Untyped)

Death Pact

Glaive

This +5 unholy glaive deals additional 6d6 unholy damage on a successful charge. If this charge results in a killing blow, it summons one CR 19 gallu to fight alongside you for 1 minute.

This one is funny as fuck, the unholy damage is completely unresistable and the Gallu it summons is quite tanky and great for distracting the enemy. And you can get a bunch of them. I wonder if they are affected by summon feats, probably not worth it though.

Mutilated Angel

Glaive

This weapon is a +5 adamantine glaive. Whenever the wielder uses it to attack an evil creature, it grants a +5 bonus to the attack roll, and deals additionally 1d12 slashing damage on hit. Whenever this weapon lands a hit, it inflicts a -1 penalty to AC until the end of combat. This penalty stacks up to -5. The wielder takes a -3 penalty to their Charisma ability score.

Casual +5 to hit on almost every creature in the game lmao.

If Daidre hadn't made me really paranoid about the effectiveness of reach builds I would probably get my Skald using one of these. Although I guess the weapon training book only works on the MC so bleh.

Ok, so we have a Late Act 5 weapon and a late DLC3 weapon.
Guess Marching Terror's also really good when you get it early game.

What about mid-game, where most of the game happens, though? I guess Soulshear is serviceable, but... really feels weak next to a generic fauchard, not to mention Grave Singer or Wide Sweep if you don't care about reach much.

Terror isn't Cold Iron. Relic obviates that but it matters in Kenabres/Garrison. I've used a good bit of Bardiche on Martial MCs.

BTW, respecced Sos into a Disenchanter Warpriest (Aeon run) and.. it's different. Probably going to miss Channeling (though Seelah can Channel I guess).

 

[Haplo]

True, but there was another early game one for that. Dark Horn?

 

[Haplo]

What about mid-game, where most of the game happens, though? I guess Soulshear is serviceable, but... really feels weak next to a generic fauchard, not to mention Grave Singer or Wide Sweep if you don't care about reach much.

Imho, Glaive is bad weapon for professional melees, especially MC, but pretty solid for support-focused builds who can't really afford some parts of Improved Crit/Shatter/Outflank package.
Currently, I take Guided Hand (feat, STR > WIS for attack bonus on deity's favored weapon) from some mod on Sosiel and he is more than competent with Soulshear, if the sheer number of demons he spawns with it is something to judge him by.

Um, why not just buff his STR instead? Lol and use Enlarge effects? He *really* doesn't have room for Guided Hand when he can barely afford Outflank. (Mythic) Evo Focus for Archon's is a higher priority.

Uh, now that's tunnel vision...

 

[Daidre]

Um, why not just buff his STR instead? Lol and use Enlarge effects? He *really* doesn't have room for Guided Hand when he can barely afford Outflank. (Mythic) Evo Focus for Archon's is a higher priority.

Because he is respecced into 20 WIS 14 STR build with his natural WIS potentially going up to 32 with with +8 WIS capstone? And he gets Weapon Focus for free since he is Crusader.

I am like dozen complete runs past the point when it mattered for me what his original stat/feat setup looked like.

 

[Desiderius]

What about mid-game, where most of the game happens, though? I guess Soulshear is serviceable, but... really feels weak next to a generic fauchard, not to mention Grave Singer or Wide Sweep if you don't care about reach much.

Imho, Glaive is bad weapon for professional melees, especially MC, but pretty solid for support-focused builds who can't really afford some parts of Improved Crit/Shatter/Outflank package.
Currently, I take Guided Hand (feat, STR > WIS for attack bonus on deity's favored weapon) from some mod on Sosiel and he is more than competent with Soulshear, if the sheer number of demons he spawns with it is something to judge him by.

Um, why not just buff his STR instead? Lol and use Enlarge effects? He *really* doesn't have room for Guided Hand when he can barely afford Outflank. (Mythic) Evo Focus for Archon's is a higher priority.

Uh, now that's tunnel vision...

Not with his original setup where he starts with basically no Feats. Evo focus isn't just for Archon's. It turns on Sound Burst, which is a key tactical tool for Divine Casters, and later on Smite/Wrath and Stormbolts etc...

But yes Archon's is that good too.

And he gets Weapon Focus for free since he is Crusader.

Giving up a Domain and a spell slot for two relevant Feats is not a great trade (and Improved Crit is kind of meh on Glaive). It's something you have to do to Shield Bash, but not really for a regular Cleric.

 

[Haplo]

Outside of Archon's, he won't do much nuking/CC against demons until he can invest in Spell Penetration... if he does that.

In my parties he's working pretty much full time as a Domain Lord, so not much opportunity for such things. Though I guess I should maybe get Mythic Spell Pen for the Mad Touch.

 

[Desiderius]

Outside of Archon's, he won't do much nuking/CC against demons untill he can invest in Spell Penetration.

Burst is for (Human) casters and other low-Fort threats. I've been looking at Spell Pen for Prayer. One of motivations for Disenchanter Abjurer respec. TTT/Codex has Piercing Rods.

 

[FreeKaner]

It is really unfortunate how feast or famine offensive spell casting is because of spell resistance mechanic and how liberally it is used by Owlcat. It makes hybrid casters very unsatisfying even when they should be good in certain paths (like Demon which gives a lot of DC, save rerolls while also boosting your melee capabilities) because at the end of day you are either passing the spell resistance or you don't. Not saying that a hybrid should be as effective as a full caster but they could get something out of it if they invest, there are a lot of spells that do half-effect or reduced effect even on a save after all. Right now you either invest enough and you can pass the check or you don't and all that investment was for nothing and you were better off casting buffs.

 

[FreeKaner]

It's bizarre how easier the "optional" bosses makes the unoptional fight against Staunton so much more easier. In one of the earlier runs I didn't kill Zacharius because I didn't know if you broke the wand you can't even face him, Shivial because I didn't know where he was and during Drezen siege I didn't full clear the map because I didn't know where is what which meant I was 1 level behind at blightmaw, which meant killing him was basically impossible with my party composition which then set me back another level. While if you kill all those optional bosses you can get to Staunton at level 10, which is such a huge power difference compared to getting there at 8. Zacharius in particular gives such a huge XP boost that it makes no sense he becomes unavailable to fight if you break the wand (you get the broken wand when you kill him anyway). If you break the wand you should still be able to go see him but be forced to fight him.