Pathfinder Pathfinder: Wrath of the Righteous Pre-DLC Thread [GO TO NEW THREAD]

[NJClaw]

I have mythic spell penetration, plus the normal and greater one feats, magicians rings which adds 2DC for illusion spells and the mythic shadows that boosts it by 20% and the DC for nenio’s phantasmal web and killer are about 25, enemies have+18-20 normally to save.

There's something wrong here... my Nenio isn't specced for illusion spells and yet her Phantasmal Web save is 31: 10 + 5 (spell level) + 9 (Intelligence) + 1 (spell focus) + 2 (Magician's Ring) + 2 (Quarterstaff of the War Mage) + 2 (Glass Amulet of Clarity). It can go up to 33 if I use Heighten Spell with a 7th level slot.

On core enemies also normally don't have +20 to saves, so maybe turn down the difficulty. And even with a +20, with Evil Eye and Dirge of Doom, enemies will fail their save most of the times, especially if you add Persistent Spell.

I don’t any amulet of clarity and war mage staff doesn’t stack with magicians ring. DC is 26 (all the things I mentioned before) and as I said they have +18-20 on saves. I don’t know what crack your smoking but nenio is useless besides having greater heroism and being able to summon elementals for temporary damage sponges.

If you don't have the Amulet of Clarity, it means either that (a) you didn't check the vendors' inventories or (b) you checked them and you decided not to buy an item that boosts DCs by 2 so you should be immediately put in jail.

Magician's Ring and Quarterstaff of the War Mage get the "non-stacking bonus" because of the competence bonus to Use Magic Device skill checks, but their +2 to DCs stack. Try to put them on at the same time and you'll see that they stack.

And if your DC is that low, it means that either (a) you didn't improve her Intelligence at level up or (b) you didn't give her your best Int-boosting item (you should have a +6 by now, but you can also use the profane +2 from Draven's Hat plus a Fox's Cunning).

These are my DCs for a standard and a 7th level Phantasmal Web, on a Nenio specialized in Conjuration/Evocation and not Illusion:

Spoiler

And, as I said, with DC 31, you can easily beat a +20 save thanks to Evil Eye and Dirge of Doom, especially if you use Persistent Spell. If you throw in also Archon's Aura (that you should have active on as many characters as possible to force multiple saves), it's another -2.

I suppose I could respect and get a metamagic feat but it’s only 1 and next feat is level 14 I think. Also how are you getting ember’s hexes to work, her DC is fucking 22 and there aren’t any feats I found to boost hexes, how do you even hex anything?

Smaug, you don't care about Ember's Hex DC, because Evil Eye affects the enemy regardless of the result of his saving throw. You start the combat with Evil Eye (saving throws) + Cackle, then the next turn you use Evil Eye (armor class) and Cackle again, so from that point the enemy has -4 to AC and saves as long as you keep cackling.

 

[Parabalus]

I don’t any amulet of clarity and war mage staff doesn’t stack with magicians ring. DC is 26 (all the things I mentioned before) and as I said they have +18-20 on saves. I don’t know what crack your smoking but nenio is useless besides having greater heroism and being able to summon elementals for temporary damage sponges.

It stacks. All the +DC stacks. I have 40+ DC on enchantment spells on Nenio, around lvl 15 rn, and I think around 38 on illusion. With persistent metamagic pretty much nothing saves against my control spells on core.

It says it doesn’t stack so if it does it’s a bug.

You sure it's not referring to the +UMD on the rings?

 

[Shaki]

I don’t any amulet of clarity and war mage staff doesn’t stack with magicians ring. DC is 26 (all the things I mentioned before) and as I said they have +18-20 on saves. I don’t know what crack your smoking but nenio is useless besides having greater heroism and being able to summon elementals for temporary damage sponges.

It stacks. All the +DC stacks. I have 40+ DC on enchantment spells on Nenio, around lvl 15 rn, and I think around 38 on illusion. With persistent metamagic pretty much nothing saves against my control spells on core.

It says it doesn’t stack so if it does it’s a bug.

It says doesn't stack, because both items have + UMD, and that's the part that doesn't stack. DC bonus stacks.

 

[Tacgnol]

Yeah the "non stacking bonus" alert doesn't necessarily mean all the bonuses on the item don't stack, it often just means part of it doesn't.

 

[volklore]

I don’t any amulet of clarity and war mage staff doesn’t stack with magicians ring. DC is 26 (all the things I mentioned before) and as I said they have +18-20 on saves. I don’t know what crack your smoking but nenio is useless besides having greater heroism and being able to summon elementals for temporary damage sponges.

It stacks. All the +DC stacks. I have 40+ DC on enchantment spells on Nenio, around lvl 15 rn, and I think around 38 on illusion. With persistent metamagic pretty much nothing saves against my control spells on core.

It says it doesn’t stack so if it does it’s a bug.

It says doesn't stack, because both items have + UMD, and that's the part that doesn't stack. DC bonus stacks.

Yes but same sources don't stack (two items of the same name). I got 2 magician's ring from chapter two but they do not stack to +4 illusion DC sadly.

On another note, it seems you can't pick favorite metamagic persistent... Reeeee game!

 

[Delterius]

DC bonus stacks.

yeah if you can stack seventeen different sources of intelligence to AC you should be able to stack DC bonuses in a game where the average slime monster has 67 Paladin Levels for saving throw purposes

 

[LannTheStupid]

After reading NJClaw post:

1. Reading is hard.
2. Desiderius died for our sins.

 

[ArchAngel]

I don't know what you are talking about here, I used Wail of Banshee for first time yesterday in Dragon Cave, 5 out of 6 Spiders died instantly. +1 to DC from Cruomancer and +1 to DC for death spells from book helped. Also having Mythic Skill Focus into Necro spells. And necro spells don't have a bunch of OP items for DC so far.

 

[Heroic Liberator]

Desiderius died for our sins.

Have faith, oh Thomas. He shall rise after the symbolic passing of his original ban at the end of this month.

 

[Delterius]

what this game needs is the shadow enchantment and shadow necromancy lines of spells so i can fuck around with a wizard who uses fake quasi magic exclusively

 

[ArchAngel]

what this game needs is the shadow enchantment and shadow necromancy lines of spells so i can fuck around with a wizard who uses fake quasi magic exclusively

Get Metamagic and you can have them on most spell levels.

 

[Delterius]

what this game needs is the shadow enchantment and shadow necromancy lines of spells so i can fuck around with a wizard who uses fake quasi magic exclusively

Get Metamagic and you can have them on most spell levels.

shadow conjuration and shadow evocation, but i wanna cast shadow hideous laughter (dark comedy) and shadow animate dead (spookiest skeleton) too

shadows all the way down

 

[smaug]

I have mythic spell penetration, plus the normal and greater one feats, magicians rings which adds 2DC for illusion spells and the mythic shadows that boosts it by 20% and the DC for nenio’s phantasmal web and killer are about 25, enemies have+18-20 normally to save.

There's something wrong here... my Nenio isn't specced for illusion spells and yet her Phantasmal Web save is 31: 10 + 5 (spell level) + 9 (Intelligence) + 1 (spell focus) + 2 (Magician's Ring) + 2 (Quarterstaff of the War Mage) + 2 (Glass Amulet of Clarity). It can go up to 33 if I use Heighten Spell with a 7th level slot.

On core enemies also normally don't have +20 to saves, so maybe turn down the difficulty. And even with a +20, with Evil Eye and Dirge of Doom, enemies will fail their save most of the times, especially if you add Persistent Spell.

I don’t any amulet of clarity and war mage staff doesn’t stack with magicians ring. DC is 26 (all the things I mentioned before) and as I said they have +18-20 on saves. I don’t know what crack your smoking but nenio is useless besides having greater heroism and being able to summon elementals for temporary damage sponges.

If you don't have the Amulet of Clarity, it means either that (a) you didn't check the vendors' inventories or (b) you checked them and you decided not to buy an item that boosts DCs by 2 so you should be immediately put in jail.

Magician's Ring and Quarterstaff of the War Mage get the "non-stacking bonus" because of the competence bonus to Use Magic Device skill checks, but their +2 to DCs stack. Try to put them on at the same time and you'll see that they stack.

And if your DC is that low, it means that either (a) you didn't improve her Intelligence at level up or (b) you didn't give her your best Int-boosting item (you should have a +6 by now, but you can also use the profane +2 from Draven's Hat plus a Fox's Cunning).

These are my DCs for a standard and a 7th level Phantasmal Web, on a Nenio specialized in Conjuration/Evocation and not Illusion:

Spoiler

And, as I said, with DC 31, you can easily beat a +20 save thanks to Evil Eye and Dirge of Doom, especially if you use Persistent Spell. If you throw in also Archon's Aura (that you should have active on as many characters as possible to force multiple saves), it's another -2.

I suppose I could respect and get a metamagic feat but it’s only 1 and next feat is level 14 I think. Also how are you getting ember’s hexes to work, her DC is fucking 22 and there aren’t any feats I found to boost hexes, how do you even hex anything?

Smaug, you don't care about Ember's Hex DC, because Evil Eye affects the enemy regardless of the result of his saving throw. You start the combat with Evil Eye (saving throws) + Cackle, then the next turn you use Evil Eye (armor class) and Cackle again, so from that point the enemy has -4 to AC and saves as long as you keep cackling.

So every other hex besides evil eye and cackle are worthless? ‘k

 

[LannTheStupid]

So every other hex besides evil eye and cackle are worthless? ‘k

"Reading is hard" (C) I, the greatest.

 

[Shaki]

Btw, fun fact time: idk if they fixed it yet, but last time I tested it, Expanded Arsenal mythic was broken, and would let you pump DC to insane levels, since it gives you bonuses from all other schools you gave feats in, as long as you don't have that feat in the school you choose with Expanded Arsenal.

Eg.

School focus: Conjuration +1
Greater school focus: Conjuration +1
Mythic focus: Conjuration +2

= +4 to DC for Conjuration

Same feats for Evocation

= +4 DC for Evocation

Now when you apply Expanded Arsenal: Enchantment, you get +8 to Enchantment DC, because you get bonuses from both Conjuration and Evocation applied to it. But it works only if you don't have SF/GSF in Enchantment, otherwise they replace the bonuses you would get from Expanded Arsenal and you end up with actually lower DC than when not having these feats.

 

[Delterius]

Btw, fun fact time: idk if they fixed it yet, but last time I tested it, Expanded Arsenal mythic was broken, and would let you pump DC to insane levels, since it gives you bonuses from all other schools you gave feats in, as long as you don't have that feat in the school you choose with Expanded Arsenal.

Something else that is less likely to be unintended is that Expanded Arsenal counts Arcane Bloodline's +2 to DCs as a school focus feat. And you can grab another +2 from being a Sage Sorcerer with second bloodline: Arcane.

 

[ArchAngel]

I have mythic spell penetration, plus the normal and greater one feats, magicians rings which adds 2DC for illusion spells and the mythic shadows that boosts it by 20% and the DC for nenio’s phantasmal web and killer are about 25, enemies have+18-20 normally to save.

There's something wrong here... my Nenio isn't specced for illusion spells and yet her Phantasmal Web save is 31: 10 + 5 (spell level) + 9 (Intelligence) + 1 (spell focus) + 2 (Magician's Ring) + 2 (Quarterstaff of the War Mage) + 2 (Glass Amulet of Clarity). It can go up to 33 if I use Heighten Spell with a 7th level slot.

On core enemies also normally don't have +20 to saves, so maybe turn down the difficulty. And even with a +20, with Evil Eye and Dirge of Doom, enemies will fail their save most of the times, especially if you add Persistent Spell.

I don’t any amulet of clarity and war mage staff doesn’t stack with magicians ring. DC is 26 (all the things I mentioned before) and as I said they have +18-20 on saves. I don’t know what crack your smoking but nenio is useless besides having greater heroism and being able to summon elementals for temporary damage sponges.

If you don't have the Amulet of Clarity, it means either that (a) you didn't check the vendors' inventories or (b) you checked them and you decided not to buy an item that boosts DCs by 2 so you should be immediately put in jail.

Magician's Ring and Quarterstaff of the War Mage get the "non-stacking bonus" because of the competence bonus to Use Magic Device skill checks, but their +2 to DCs stack. Try to put them on at the same time and you'll see that they stack.

And if your DC is that low, it means that either (a) you didn't improve her Intelligence at level up or (b) you didn't give her your best Int-boosting item (you should have a +6 by now, but you can also use the profane +2 from Draven's Hat plus a Fox's Cunning).

These are my DCs for a standard and a 7th level Phantasmal Web, on a Nenio specialized in Conjuration/Evocation and not Illusion:

Spoiler

And, as I said, with DC 31, you can easily beat a +20 save thanks to Evil Eye and Dirge of Doom, especially if you use Persistent Spell. If you throw in also Archon's Aura (that you should have active on as many characters as possible to force multiple saves), it's another -2.

I suppose I could respect and get a metamagic feat but it’s only 1 and next feat is level 14 I think. Also how are you getting ember’s hexes to work, her DC is fucking 22 and there aren’t any feats I found to boost hexes, how do you even hex anything?

Smaug, you don't care about Ember's Hex DC, because Evil Eye affects the enemy regardless of the result of his saving throw. You start the combat with Evil Eye (saving throws) + Cackle, then the next turn you use Evil Eye (armor class) and Cackle again, so from that point the enemy has -4 to AC and saves as long as you keep cackling.

So every other hex besides evil eye and cackle are worthless? ‘k

Luck is awesome and so is Protective barrier. Game lacks good Greater Hexes, but there should be some decent Grand Hexes.

 

[NJClaw]

So every other hex besides evil eye and cackle are worthless? ‘k

I'm starting to think there might be no hope for you, smaug. Yes, not everything is perfectly viable on HARD MODE, what an unacceptable revelation!

Playing on Core, enough enemies in late chapter 3 have low enough Will saves that I'm still able to put them to sleep with Slumber. You also have many hexes that target your allies (Protective Luck and Fortune are the ones I'm using), so you don't have to care about the DC. Moreover, Evil Eye isn't the only Hex that still affects the enemy even on a successful save.

But I feel like I'm wasting my time here, since you seem completely unwilling to try and just want to whine about how hard the enemies are in this game (not surprising, since you're playing on HARD in a game based on a system that you don't seem very familiar with).

 

[Parabalus]

You can instakill enemies with Nenio Weird even in A6, which is very useful since all of them have more than 1500 HP.

 

[<3sRichardSimmons]

So the latest patch broke the Cleaner Mod and has completely tanked my performance. I've gone from 60 to 10-20 FPS during the siege of Drezen. Guess I'll put this aside for the moment and wait for a few more patches. Oh well. Really enjoying it so far, but I can wait.

 

[LannTheStupid]

You can instakill enemies with Nenio Weird even in A6, which is very useful since all of them have more than 1500 HP.

Is it on Hard? So Nenio can be buffed to successfully go through 2 different saves? Amazing, if so.

I was not very successful with Weird in Kingmaker. Probably, I was not reading well enough.

So the latest patch broke the Cleaner Mod and has completely tanked my performance. I've gone from 60 to 10-20 FPS during the siege of Drezen. Guess I'll put this aside for the moment and wait for a few more patches. Oh well. Really enjoying it so far, but I can wait.

I read about going to %AppData\LocalLow\Owlcat Games% folder and deleting log files from there.

 

[Delterius]

So every other hex besides evil eye and cackle are worthless? ‘k

You dare come to me with this? Die.

There must always be a Desiderius.

 

[Infinitron]

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/owlcatgames/pathfinder-wrath-of-the-righteous/posts/3312710

Physical Rewards Shipping Has Begun!

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Please check the shipping address in your preorder portal account, in the Physical Rewards tab. As soon as your reward is shipped, the tracking code will appear in your personal account under the same Physical Rewards tab and will be sent in an email from media@owlcatgames.com. If you encounter any issues with your pledge or you have any questions, please email us at team@owlcatgames.com, or write a direct message on Kickstarter, and we will help!

We appreciate your support and apologize for the delay and inconvenience.

To arms!

 

[Blutwurstritter]

They really should add a test lab to the game, where you can check builds and items in the current game engine. Its often opaque how things will actually stack or how they interact. The same goes for dispelling effects. I often have no clue if a protective spell will protect against a spell or not or if items are doing what the description says.

 

[smaug]

So every other hex besides evil eye and cackle are worthless? ‘k

I'm starting to think there might be no hope for you, smaug. Yes, not everything is perfectly viable on HARD MODE, what an unacceptable revelation!

Playing on Core, enough enemies in late chapter 3 have low enough Will saves that I'm still able to put them to sleep with Slumber. You also have many hexes that target your allies (Protective Luck and Fortune are the ones I'm using), so you don't have to care about the DC. Moreover, Evil Eye isn't the only Hex that still affects the enemy even on a successful save.

But I feel like I'm wasting my time here, since you seem completely unwilling to try and just want to whine about how hard the enemies are in this game (not surprising, since you're playing on HARD in a game based on a system that you don't seem very familiar with).

I’m playing on hard because core is too easy, you just auto attack stuff on core, that’s boring.