Pathfinder Pathfinder: Wrath of the Righteous Pre-DLC Thread [GO TO NEW THREAD]

[Haplo]

I've learned a fun fact about Sohei Flurry. If you have Weapon Training from Fighter levels, you can flurry with any weapon you have Training in. So essentially a 1 level dip in Sohei gives Fighter multiclasses an extra Full-BAB attack (and extra feat + other monk goodies, such as Wis-to-AC). And I wanted to eventually take some levels in Mutation Warrior anyway. Guess I'm respeccing my Sohei to a Sohei-dip. Won't be that cheap though, 3 levels should be nice (2 bonus feats, Evasion, extra full BAB attack on demand a few times per day). My AC will be one level behind (and I need a few hundred xp for it to become mountable), but... I guess I can live with it. Particularly with respec... don't know if I would want to actually play trough 7 levels with unmountable AC the normal way.

Thing is, glaives are cool and all, but... at this early point in the game don't really come close to the awesomeness of scythes and falchions I can casually buy at the camp. Plus using reach weapons mounted is very buggy in Turn Based. GUI shows the enemy is clearly in attack range, but you cannot attack. You move 5-ft and now you can attack indeed - but your mount still doesn't, even though you seem to be literally rubbing against the enemy....

Another tough decision, though. Scythes or falchions? Specifically Wide Sweep vs Jinx? After fighting the gargoyle hordes attacking Regill's forces, I'm kinda leaning toward Wide Sweep... Though Jinx also looks real nice... and particularly with Mythic Improved Critical it should be very good indeed. Though would basically force me to take Ember (or Cam) everywhere all the time.

There also seem to be a great greatclub and warhammer for chargers... but in Act 4.. so kinda late... meh. The effect of the warhammer does sound truely awesome, though.

Maybe leave scythes for a Trickster playtrough? Or get the mod that binds specialization feats to weapon Training groups, rather then individual weapon types and use both... I rather dislike the tight specialization of DnD/Pathfinder systems.

Anyway, what do you Guys and Gals think, which is better: Jinx or Wide Sweep (probably won't use Cleave though).

 

[Daidre]

Only a bit. But Might & Magic(not heroes) VII - for blood and honor was my first RPG ever. And yes, when you get into high levels, the game throws armies of titans, dragons and other high level mobs. But a lich in M&M is not the same of a lich in Pathfinder/D&D. Liches in PF/D&D are much more powerful. Liches & Greater Liches in M&M VI has a "skill level"(equivalent to PF caster level) of 10. You can find liches at lv 20 in a game where gold dragons are lv 100.

Well, M&M 9 had it share of problems (but maybe NWC just was a bit ahead of its time, looking at game's state at release), but I've loved how obscure Lich promotion quest was in there comparing to other classes, what a cool dungeon Lich's laboratory was and a that huge payoff of gathering all those juicy GMs, when your shitty, almost a dead-weight, Scholar was reaching his Lichdom at last.

 

[Mauman]

I've learned a fun fact about Sohei Flurry. If you have Weapon Training from Fighter levels, you can flurry with any weapon you have Training in. So essentially a 1 level dip in Sohei gives Fighter multiclasses an extra Full-BAB attack (and extra feat + other monk goodies, such as Wis-to-AC). And I wanted to eventually take some levels in Mutation Warrior anyway. Guess I'm respeccing my Sohei to a Sohei-dip. Won't be that cheap though, 3 levels should be nice (2 bonus feats, Evasion, extra full BAB attack on demand a few times per day). My AC will be one level behind (and I need a few hundred xp for it to become mountable), but... I guess I can live with it. Particularly with respec... don't know if I would want to actually play trough 7 levels with unmountable AC the normal way.

Thing is, glaives are cool and all, but... at this early point in the game don't really come close to the awesomeness of scythes and falchions I can casually buy at the camp. Plus using reach weapons mounted is very buggy in Turn Based. GUI shows the enemy is clearly in attack range, but you cannot attack. You move 5-ft and now you can attack indeed - but your mount still doesn't, even though you seem to be literally rubbing against the enemy....

Another tough decision, though. Scythes or falchions? Specifically Wide Sweep vs Jinx? After fighting the gargoyle hordes attacking Regill's forces, I'm kinda leaning toward Wide Sweep... Though Jinx also looks real nice... and particularly with Mythic Improved Critical it should be very good indeed. Though would basically force me to take Ember (or Cam) everywhere all the time.

There also seem to be a great greatclub and warhammer for chargers... but in Act 4.. so kinda late... meh. The effect of the warhammer does sound truely awesome, though.

Maybe leave scythes for a Trickster playtrough? Or get the mod that binds specialization feats to weapon Training groups, rather then individual weapon types and use both... I rather dislike the tight specialization of DnD/Pathfinder systems.

Anyway, what do you Guys and Gals think, which is better: Jinx or Wide Sweep (probably won't use Cleave though).

You think that's fun? Sohei's specialized in throwing weapons can stack flurry, rapid shot, and two weapon fighting (which, far as I'm aware, is not something you can do in tabletop). You end up with so many attacks you bug out the character screen.

Alternatively to glaives, falchions, and scythes....consider great axes. There's a greataxe you can get in early chapter 3 that has an 18-20 crit range (with the normal x3 damage) and cures you of various ailments if you get afflicted with them. Combined with the trickster feats it goes down to 11-20 x4 (x5 with mythic crit). Great for a Vital strike build. It's one of the Rovagug relics.

 

[volklore]

I've learned a fun fact about Sohei Flurry. If you have Weapon Training from Fighter levels, you can flurry with any weapon you have Training in. So essentially a 1 level dip in Sohei gives Fighter multiclasses an extra Full-BAB attack (and extra feat + other monk goodies, such as Wis-to-AC). And I wanted to eventually take some levels in Mutation Warrior anyway. Guess I'm respeccing my Sohei to a Sohei-dip. Won't be that cheap though, 3 levels should be nice (2 bonus feats, Evasion, extra full BAB attack on demand a few times per day). My AC will be one level behind (and I need a few hundred xp for it to become mountable), but... I guess I can live with it. Particularly with respec... don't know if I would want to actually play trough 7 levels with unmountable AC the normal way.

Thing is, glaives are cool and all, but... at this early point in the game don't really come close to the awesomeness of scythes and falchions I can casually buy at the camp. Plus using reach weapons mounted is very buggy in Turn Based. GUI shows the enemy is clearly in attack range, but you cannot attack. You move 5-ft and now you can attack indeed - but your mount still doesn't, even though you seem to be literally rubbing against the enemy....

Another tough decision, though. Scythes or falchions? Specifically Wide Sweep vs Jinx? After fighting the gargoyle hordes attacking Regill's forces, I'm kinda leaning toward Wide Sweep... Though Jinx also looks real nice... and particularly with Mythic Improved Critical it should be very good indeed. Though would basically force me to take Ember (or Cam) everywhere all the time.

There also seem to be a great greatclub and warhammer for chargers... but in Act 4.. so kinda late... meh. The effect of the warhammer does sound truely awesome, though.

Maybe leave scythes for a Trickster playtrough? Or get the mod that binds specialization feats to weapon Training groups, rather then individual weapon types and use both... I rather dislike the tight specialization of DnD/Pathfinder systems.

Anyway, what do you Guys and Gals think, which is better: Jinx or Wide Sweep (probably won't use Cleave though).

Probably Jinx, I actually think you never replace it, unless some falchions are really insane, the dmg from the effect is just too good. Personally, I don't think I would go scythe unless I also get trickster Imp. Imp. critical line so Jinx is the more well rounded consistently strong one for me. And yeah this sohei trick is great, Throws some shade on the full class though

 

[mediocrepoet]

I've learned a fun fact about Sohei Flurry. If you have Weapon Training from Fighter levels, you can flurry with any weapon you have Training in. So essentially a 1 level dip in Sohei gives Fighter multiclasses an extra Full-BAB attack (and extra feat + other monk goodies, such as Wis-to-AC).

Anyway, what do you Guys and Gals think, which is better: Jinx or Wide Sweep (probably won't use Cleave though).

I'd probably go for Jinx since it's better at melting single targets and has more consistent crits. Wide Sweep is more for clearing mobs, but you're probably exploding those pretty handily anyway. It's not a bad weapon by any stretch, just lacks application for the things that are more likely to challenge you.

 

[Haplo]

You think that's fun? Sohei's specialized in throwing weapons can stack flurry, rapid shot, and two weapon fighting (which, far as I'm aware, is not something you can do in tabletop). You end up with so many attacks you bug out the character screen.

Alternatively to glaives, falchions, and scythes....consider great axes. There's a greataxe you can get in early chapter 3 that has an 18-20 crit range (with the normal x3 damage) and cures you of various ailments if you get afflicted with them. Combined with the trickster feats it goes down to 11-20 x4 (x5 with mythic crit). Great for a Vital strike build. It's one of the Rovagug relics.

Yeah, read about (ab)using Sohei to spam throwing axes. Do not doubt that's very effective (even moreso with Bane damage bonuses). But not a great fan of ranged combat. Prefer a little less but stronger hits (really like building for Charge... though hate how much its bugged in Turn Based mode... started switching to Real Time to execute Charges).

The axe sounds strong indeed. Not too surprised after Vanquisher... But I want to try something else now and really like the special effects on those 2, surprisingly early and easy to get, weapons.

 

[cw8]

I respect this streamer. Didn't even know you could stack all the Blade Barriers like this. I wonder if you could put Grease on top of it. Looks so fun.

 

[Haplo]

That's how Farnirras used to prematurely leave this world in my Kingmaker games...

 

[volklore]

What about that +4 fauchard that gives you an extra attack on the 5th consecutive hit .

 

[Mauman]

Soooooo......

A brown fur arcanist can polymorph a Smiloden.....into a Smiloden, adding another +4 (+6 with powerful change, +8 with capstone) strength.

This is a well programmed game



edit - oh, and +4 additional nature armor and -2 to dex as well I guess.

 

[Haplo]

What about that +4 fauchard that gives you an extra attack on the 5th consecutive hit .

Sounds really nice. But I don't think its available early? Plus its up to like +20% more damage (provided that you keep landing hits). Jinx has a condition that's easy to ensure (no save Hexes and Hexes that last 1 round on successful save.... + Cackle) and then it can potentially add maybe like +50% damage output (depending on crit rate - the added hits can't crit - potentially up to +100% if you cannot land crits).

Then there is the matter of reach weapons still being buggy in Turn Based when mounted.

 

[Mauman]

What about that +4 fauchard that gives you an extra attack on the 5th consecutive hit .

Sounds really nice. But I don't think its available early? Plus its up to like +20% more damage (provided that you keep landing hits). Jinx has a condition that's easy to ensure (no save Hexes and Hexes that last 1 round on successful save.... + Cackle) and then it can potentially add maybe like +50% damage output (depending on crit rate - the added hits can't crit).

Then there is the matter of reach weapons still being buggy in Turn Based.

I've been using glaives in turn based mode and haven't noticed anything really weird.

Maybe I'm just getting lucky.

 

[Haplo]

What about that +4 fauchard that gives you an extra attack on the 5th consecutive hit .

Sounds really nice. But I don't think its available early? Plus its up to like +20% more damage (provided that you keep landing hits). Jinx has a condition that's easy to ensure (no save Hexes and Hexes that last 1 round on successful save.... + Cackle) and then it can potentially add maybe like +50% damage output (depending on crit rate - the added hits can't crit).

Then there is the matter of reach weapons still being buggy in Turn Based.

I've been using glaives in turn based mode and haven't noticed anything really weird.

Maybe I'm just getting lucky.

Should have added "when mounted". I'm adding this.
The issue is that when mounted and outside of charges, often the GUI indicates that you're clearly in (reach) attack range, but you cannot execute the attack. So you take a 5ft step, start to basically rub against the enemy and now the game will allow you to attack, but usually your mount will still not attack together with you...

 

[Mauman]

Should have added "when mounted". I'm adding this.
The issue is that when mounted and outside of charges, often the GUI indicates that you're clearly in (reach) attack range, but you cannot execute the attack. So you take a 5ft step, start to basically rub against the enemy and now the game will allow you to attack, but usually your mount will not attack together with you...

Oh, gotcha. I don't use mounted combat for various reasons.

Anyways, I just realized something related to brown fur polymorph thing I just mentioned.

Polymorphing someone into smiloden gives them pounce and the infamous 5 attacks.

There's NO reason to pick smiloden as your pet now. I'm thinking either Triceratops with powerful charge or dog/wolf for the free trip attempts.




edit - technically, dragon form would be the best usage here, but it's too damn big to have on all the time.

 

[volklore]

What about that +4 fauchard that gives you an extra attack on the 5th consecutive hit .

Sounds really nice. But I don't think its available early? Plus its up to like +20% more damage (provided that you keep landing hits). Jinx has a condition that's easy to ensure (no save Hexes and Hexes that last 1 round on successful save.... + Cackle) and then it can potentially add maybe like +50% damage output (depending on crit rate - the added hits can't crit - potentially up to +100% if you cannot land crits).

Then there is the matter of reach weapons still being buggy in Turn Based when mounted.

Yeah it's much later. Jinx is definitely the best weapon available early no contest.

Unrelated but can I say I absolutely hate those goddamn mutated demons that need to go down twice... They get down, become untargettable, and then immediately get a full fucking round when they get back up. That bridge fight in Ivory sanctum gave me an anneurism when that mythic Galzebru (literrally last thing I had to kill) got up and double natural 20 cleave a bunch on my frontline... I really need to buy more raise dead scrolls so I don't have to reload as much on these 'lucky' moments. This fight is the one type of encounter I really dislike in RPGs, you are dropped in it right after a cutscene and have 0 maneuverability.
It was also much harder on turn based - I am switching a bunch between the two depending on my mood and it's a lot easier to make enemies stick to tanks in RTwP (because of simultaneous movement) when losing initiative. In general while I enjoy turn-based more, I would say RtwP is easier just because losing initiative isn't as big of a deal.
Anybody knows the best ways to increase initiative? My main has the feat (+4), the pickpocket background(+2) and I constantly buff with cat's grace (+4 dex) but I still seldomly win it.

 

[Haplo]

...or horse and skip complications of starting with a special mount class.

Do tell though, do polymorphed animal companions keep their special equipment? Barding?

 

[Haplo]

What about that +4 fauchard that gives you an extra attack on the 5th consecutive hit .

Sounds really nice. But I don't think its available early? Plus its up to like +20% more damage (provided that you keep landing hits). Jinx has a condition that's easy to ensure (no save Hexes and Hexes that last 1 round on successful save.... + Cackle) and then it can potentially add maybe like +50% damage output (depending on crit rate - the added hits can't crit - potentially up to +100% if you cannot land crits).

Then there is the matter of reach weapons still being buggy in Turn Based when mounted.

Yeah it's much later. Jinx is definitely the best weapon available early no contest.

Unrelated but can I say I absolutely hate those goddamn mutated demons that need to go down twice... They get down, become untargettable, and then immediately get a full fucking round when they get back up. That bridge fight in Ivory sanctum gave me an anneurism when that mythic Galzebru (literrally last thing I had to kill) got up and double natural 20 cleave a bunch on my frontline... I really need to buy more raise dead scrolls so I don't have to reload as much on these 'lucky' moments. This fight is the one type of encounter I really dislike in RPGs, you are dropped in it right after a cutscene and have 0 maneuverability.
It was also much harder on turn based - I am switching a bunch between the two depending on my mood and it's a lot easier to make enemies stick to tanks in RTwP (because of simultaneous movement) when losing initiative. In general while I enjoy turn-based more, I would say RtwP is easier just because losing initiative isn't as big of a deal.
Anybody knows the best ways to increase initiative? My main has the feat (+4), the pickpocket background(+2) and I constantly buff with cat's grace (+4 dex) but I still seldomly win it.

Buffing Initiative.. other then leveling the special classes with bonuses (Sword Saint, Inquisitor, Sohei, Instinctual Warrior), there are Mythic feats: Mythic Improved Initiative and Inspirational Leader.

 

[Mauman]

In general while I enjoy turn-based more, I would say RtwP is easier just because losing initiative isn't as big of a deal.
Anybody knows the best ways to increase initiative? My main has the feat (+4), the pickpocket background(+2) and I constantly buff with cat's grace (+4 dex) but I still seldomly win it.

One level dip in instinctual warrior gives wisdom to initiative. Two levels in inquisitor does the same (the instinctual warrior dip is the superior one here unless you're going hard into inquisitor).

Certain magus classes (at least sword saint) can get int to initiative.

Other classes get an inherent bonus to initiative (Sohei for instance).

Wizards/Sorcs/witches can take the hare familiar (+4 to initiative).

There's a helmet in Wintersun (I think, it's early chapter 3 at least) that adds +4.

Classes that get talents (rogues and slayers at least, I think bards too) can also take a hare familiar around level 10.

...or horse and skip complications of starting with a special mount class.

Do tell though, do polymorphed animal companions keep their special equipment? Barding?

I don't use barding since for most animals buffed dex plus spell armor will give better millage (unless abusing magic vestment bug) without burning feats. And since I'm a trickster, my pets NEED those extra feats for the crit line.

I do know that certain items like amulets of natural fists work. I'm still figuring out the details with the rest.

 

[LannTheStupid]

I wonder.

AFAIK, Wrath is not a true 3D game, at least judging by the stairs in the Shield Maze. It is impossible to have 2 acessible routes separated by elevation only.

The question is: is it possible to implement proper mounted combat on a 2.5D engine? When a rider and a mount are in 2 different layers with different heights, and - ideally - their attacks should be in the same position on the main surface, but on 2 different elevations? May be the current engine cannot do it at all?

 

[volklore]

Wizards/Sorcs/witches can take the hare familiar (+4 to initiative).

Yeah I should have taken hare familiar alright... I did not know abundant casting existed and did not know the game was more lenient than kingmaker with resting so I went bonded object, I don't think it did me much good. Mistakes, mistakes! Tbh the more I play the more I question abundant casting even (on control focused sorc). Having one guy with high lore religion really limits the impact of corruption, and without timed kingdom management lose conditions like in kingmaker, you get a lot more rests. I did Ivory sanctum with a single rest so that would be probably 1 extra rest without abundant casting, I would still not even get close to 1st stage corruption, and it would free up 2(!!) mythic feats.

Buffing Initiative.. other then leveling the special classes with bonuses (Sword Saint, Inquisitor, Sohei, Instinctual Warrior), there are Mythic feats: Mythic Improved Initiative and Inspirational Leader.

Inspirational leader sounds absolutely great for the bard, thanks - I was a bit too focused on making it tanky since it's my main frontline so I kind of glossed over that one!

 

[Lagole Gon]

Playing Wrath (and Troubleshooter earlier this year) finally made me realize that I got old and grew out of being a storyfag.

Lmao. You would return to storyfaggotry if exposed to semi-decent immersive writing.

Which is not going to happen.

 

[smaug]

Playing Wrath (and Troubleshooter earlier this year) finally made me realize that I got old and grew out of being a storyfag. I'm only capable of enjoying buildporn and combat in games now, and I don't really give a shit about anything else.

Wrath definitely delivers on buildporn, not so much on combat, but still was well worth the price. It also probably ruined majority of cRPGs for me forever, because now I can't even think of playing anything that doesn't have 25 classes that can be freely mixed, with 150 archetypes, hundreds of feats and 10 mythics to choose from. I miss the times when I was still able to enjoy RPGs where dualclassing Kensai into a Mage and picking right weapon proficiencies was considered advanced powerbuilding.

This posts embodies the codex now it seems and explains how pathfinder wins the GOTY lists over everything else. Might as well just play table top simulator.

 

[thesheeep]

Playing Wrath (and Troubleshooter earlier this year) finally made me realize that I got old and grew out of being a storyfag. I'm only capable of enjoying buildporn and combat in games now, and I don't really give a shit about anything else.

Wrath definitely delivers on buildporn, not so much on combat, but still was well worth the price. It also probably ruined majority of cRPGs for me forever, because now I can't even think of playing anything that doesn't have 25 classes that can be freely mixed, with 150 archetypes, hundreds of feats and 10 mythics to choose from. I miss the times when I was still able to enjoy RPGs where dualclassing Kensai into a Mage and picking right weapon proficiencies was considered advanced powerbuilding.

This posts embodies the codex now it seems and explains how pathfinder wins the GOTY lists over everything else. Might as well just play table top simulator.

TTS doesn't offer anything in terms of campaigns with encounters, etc. though.

You gotta have something to drop your build porn into.

 

[Fedora Master]

Any sane group would murder the kind of DMs that Owlcat seem to be.

 

[Mortmal]

Looks like ice prison DC still bugged. Aborting my Azata cryomancer run till it gets fixed

Yet they made azlanti challenge strreams as if everything is fine, there's so many broken stuff between dc stuff and invulnerable enemies .