Game News Project Eternity Kickstarter Update #2: Stretch Goals Revealed

[Vault Dweller]

...and the stretch goals are a disappointment. Not just the "player house". They make the game sound really small in scope. Double the money and get eight companions in total? It doesn't have to be a bad thing, but they presented it really badly.

Well said. Considering that the pitch contained zero details, the first glimpse of the game (i.e. the most important part of the presentation) is given to us in the stretch goals. Thus, the very first thing we learn (which may not even be true) is that the game is small in scope - which would rub BG-lovers the wrong way - and might have a house where your companions will "chillax".

If the pitch was "we're making this awesome game", the first update changed it to "we're making this awesome game; it's small in scope but has a house your character can idle at". Hopefully, they will fix it asap.

 

[kaizoku]

There's some serious amount of retardation going on in this thread.
It's not just butthurt, it's plain retardation.
Some of you are really asking for some serious bitch slapping with cock.

(keeping it SFW)​

Did you really expect for them to make BG2 sized game for 1 million?

EP 1.1 millions:
3 races
5 classes
5 companions

EP 2.2 millions:
5 races
7 classes
8 companions

also:
a new major storyline along with new quests, locations, NPCs, and unique loot (special histories everyone?)
a new Region, a new Faction (This adds new NPCs, quests, magic items, and hours of gameplay.)

BG2:
7 races
11 classes (how many of these were shit or somewhat duplicates? besides, classes suck, complex skill system with perks is superior)
17 companions

It's pretty obvious the game needs 3 or 4 millions to have the size that we wish for it to have.
Codexing and withdrawing pledges isn't going to make that happen.
+2 races, +1 or +2 classes, and +5 or +6 companions should be possible with 3 millions.
Ask for it on their forums and KS page.

Yeah, some can argue they can do wonders with 1 million.
That may be right, but they're not Obsidian.
Put a game out first, and then we talk again.


how many classes and races does W2 has?
how many classes and races does KotC has? (yeah it's TB, but that's not my point)

If the skill system in PE is shit, then I may somewhat concede to your bitching, but meanwhile I'll just slap you again.

 

[oldmanpaco]

If the pitch was "we're making this awesome game", the first update changed it to "we're making this awesome game; it's small in scope but has a house your character can idle at". Hopefully, they will fix it asap.

Yes that right there is my problem. Apparently after another 12,000 posts I'll be able to articulate my thoughts clearly.

 

[nihil]

If the pitch was "we're making this awesome game", the first update changed it to "we're making this awesome game; it's small in scope but has a house your character can idle at". Hopefully, they will fix it asap.

Yes that right there is my problem. Apparently after another 12,000 posts I'll be able to articulate my thoughts clearly.

Practice makes perfect. :D

 

[Deleted member 7219]

I'm glad they're focusing on the important stuff, like player houses and additional player races.

I mean, fuck. The best RPGs these guys have made were where such cosmetic bullshit didn't factor in, because nobody thought they mattered. Planescape Torment, KOTOR 2, Fallout New Vegas etc.

I'm considering cancelling my donation too, but my love for Chris Avellone, Tim Cain and J.E. Sawyer is keeping my finger off the left mouse button. I hope they weren't the ones who came up with those stretch goals, and that they are raging just as hard as we are right now.

 

[General Maxson]

Yeah, I just don't get their avoidance of direct answers. They are too fucking vague. And you can be butthurt all you want, but Fargo at least clearly stated what he is trying to make with W2 in his kickstarter. Not a peep from Obsidian though, just 2 sucky updates. It would benefit them to get to fucking work and say something about the game. Hur dur Baldur's Gate hur dur...

 

[Infinitron]

It's the weekend now. Let's give them a few more days to redeem themselves.

 

[Tigranes]

Did he, though? I may be wrong, but from memory all I got was "remember Wasteland? Well let's make a turn based isometric party-based RPG with C&C and maturity".... for the first week at least. And of course there was no shortage of fist-pumping and sentimentality.

Well, here, we have "remember IE games? Well let's make a RTwP isometric party-based RPG with C&C and maturity"... plus a set of stretch goals revealing certain scope details - some of which are good (regions etc), some of which are OK (new classes, races), some of which are shit (houses).

Anyway, as kaizoku says, expecting any more scope for 1.1 million is kind of nonsensical. They need to give more details about big things like engine, and they need to work on their presentation, but "5 COMPANIONS OMG BG2 HAD 20 YOU FUCKING SUCK" is just derp.

Edit: how are races purely cosmetic? Is playing a half-ogre in Arcanum purely cosmetic?

 

[Brother None]

I think Sawyer has pretty openly stated they've been caught flatfooted. Which is pretty bad prep, I mean, they had all the time in the world to prepare, and they've been working on this game to some extent for months if not longer (who knows how long Sawyer's been playing with concepts).

Still, vagueness isn't a bad thing from a getting money perspective. But it can be disingenuous. I somehow doubt that they intend to clearly outline design much further than they have. It's kind of hard to, in a way, it's not like the character system is finalized now.

As for small in scope...wouldn't that be a good thing? I prefer my RPGs small in scope.

 

[Razz]

So it seems like the Codex is assaulting Sawyer's Formspring. Guys, if you want him to pay attention to you at least leave out Codex lingo or memes like "feminazidom" and "LARP-fest". Ask a question like a civilized person, jesus christ.

And please, criticize all you want. You SHOULD. Just don't be a retard and actually put some effort into properly explaining yourself.

I will continue to be sceptical about this project until I hear more about it. I'm quite surprised so many people are now cancelling their over-excited (sometimes MASSIVE) pledges because the tiniest of details have emerged. Seems a bit fickle, to say the least.

 

[TwinkieGorilla]

Every time I read that fucking "chillax" sentence I go into a silent rage.

 

[FeelTheRads]

I'm quite surprised so many people are now cancelling their over-excited (sometimes MASSIVE) pledges because the tiniest of details have emerged.

How/where can you see who or how much they withdrew?

 

[Frusciante]

I dont know if you're allowed to talk about your budget, but what kind of budget are you working with for Chaos Chronicles? Can you give a rough estimate? Is it like a big kickstart project budget (around 3 million), or 3-10 million, or even 10-20 million?

It's close to the budget that Obsidian already got pledged for Eternity. But it's not a secret, that all veteran U.S. developers are very expensive in production. They have to pay many people in management who don't contribute anything to the actual game. And all those elder developers already have families and therefore they don't work more than 40 hours/week - even for their dream project.

Thats actually a lot lower then I would have guessed based on the screenshots/concept. This gives me hope for kickstarter projects like Wasteland 2 and PE. With 2-3 million they should be able to make a pretty big game.

 

[Vault Dweller]

Brother None

Whether it's good or bad, depends on the design and context. I prefer Fallout to Fallout 2, but there is a huge difference between Fallout and, say, ToEE, or between IWD and IWD2. Implying that it's small in scope without clarifying was a tactical mistake.

 

[hoverdog]

I'm quite surprised so many people are now cancelling their over-excited (sometimes MASSIVE) pledges because the tiniest of details have emerged.

How/where can you see who or how much they withdrew?

I think FTR is hinting at Josh's formspring question

I'm sorry but the latest Kickstarter update made me cancel my $280 pledge.

much butthurt there

 

[General Maxson]

Did he, though? I may be wrong, but from memory all I got was "remember Wasteland? Well let's make a turn based isometric party-based RPG with C&C and maturity".... for the first week at least. And of course there was no shortage of fist-pumping and sentimentality.

Well, here, we have "remember IE games? Well let's make a RTwP isometric party-based RPG with C&C and maturity"... plus a set of stretch goals revealing certain scope details - some of which are good (regions etc), some of which are OK (new classes, races), some of which are shit (houses).

Anyway, as kaizoku says, expecting any more scope for 1.1 million is kind of nonsensical. They need to give more details about big things like engine, and they need to work on their presentation, but "5 COMPANIONS OMG BG2 HAD 20 YOU FUCKING SUCK" is just derp.

Edit: how are races purely cosmetic? Is playing a half-ogre in Arcanum purely cosmetic?

Bro watch his pitch video again.

And after all, you know that you will be playing as human in W2, and that it will have attributes and skills and shit, it surely won't be class based D&D. On the other hand Obsidian says they have awesome setting and system, and they can't say anything about it?

But anyway, I'm just saying how it is. I will probably still support it in hopes of getting a good crpg game, I would rather get another Icewind Dale (here I do not mean that IWD is a bad game, it's great, but it's rather action-y and shallow as far as crpgs go) then 100s popamoles we have today.

 

[Wise Emperor]

Anyway, as kaizoku says, expecting any more scope for 1.1 million is kind of nonsensical. They need to give more details about big things like engine, and they need to work on their presentation, but "5 COMPANIONS OMG BG2 HAD 20 YOU FUCKING SUCK" is just derp.

So why even bother? If they try to dive into nostalgic nerds wallets, why giving them halfbaked product? They could said in video "With 1,1mln $ in 18 months, we can create game 1/3 the size of bg2 with 5 distinct character, which 2 of them you can always tag along". I would be perfectly fine with that, but no, they didn't said that, instead they pumped fan expectations.

 

[nihil]

As for small in scope...wouldn't that be a good thing? I prefer my RPGs small in scope.

The problem is they name dropped BG2 and then presented stretch goals that shrunk the whole thing in people's minds (as discussed above). Nothing about the game is necessarily bad, but I think the way they presented it will discourage people from donating, which is bad.

 

[FeelTheRads]

Also, there's always people withdrawing pledges for retarded reasons*. The fact that they have shit you don't like in the game is not really retarded. You could argue that it's retarded to expect too much, but maybe expecting it to be free of Bioware derp wasn't too much, for example.

*In the SpaceVenture Kickstarter there were people who withdrew (or claimed they did) pledges because they thought they had too many updates which spammed their very important email boxes.

 

[Sordid MCA/Prosper Hybryd]

Joking apart...

Obsidian-guyz aren't too bright. Really good thing for stretch goal is making game modable. They should propose some kind of toolset. It will please biodrones & bethesdawhores who will use it for LARPing shit, horse armor and bettersexpositions. But at the same time it will please cool codex crowd who will use it for making their own hardcore modules and other good stuff.

and I'm sure Prosper will be pleased too!

 

[kaizoku]

This was a very badly handled Kickstarter. It started out great with the countdown and hysteria, but they had the goal set too low, and the stretch goals are a disappointment. Not just the "player house". They make the game sound really small in scope. Double the money and get eight companions in total? It doesn't have to be a bad thing, but they presented it really badly. I can't see anyone getting very excited for these stretch goals, and it seems that way on the graph, too. They should've put their energy into one or two exciting goals at $2M and $3M, and presented them in a way that draws attention to the positive aspects of the game, not to the fact that it's a small scale game.

Talk is cheap.
Now we know that. And so do they.

But have any previous KS project do that?

How many KS projects asked 2 million or more from the start?

How many have done 1 million stretch goals?

 

[Deleted member 7219]

Edit: how are races purely cosmetic? Is playing a half-ogre in Arcanum purely cosmetic?

That was tied directly into the gameplay, but offering additional races as stretch goals looks like a bonus. Maybe they will matter in terms of actual roleplaying, and not Elder Scrolls-style LARPing, but Obsidian could have phrased it better.

The house seems to be the most cosmetic stretch goal to me, coming so soon after the Skyrim Hearthfire DLC. If it is a stronghold with quests and interaction on the level of, say, Crossroads Keep in NWN2 then I'll be happy. But like races, throwing it in as a stretch goal makes me worry it might be superficial.

And anyone who's sending abusing stuff to J.E. Sawyer is a fucktard.

 

[Vault Dweller]

Wise Emperor
So, unless it's a BG2-like game, it's half-baked by default?

 

[HobGoblin42]

New stretch goal: $6 mio and the game will be complete when it's released

That's the estimated budget of 'Baldur's Gate II' back then (inflation included)

 

[Tigranes]

Wise Emperor
Wait, so it's a half-baked product if it has 5 companions, without knowing anything about it? How is it anyone else's fault but your own if you looked at 1.1m, the pitch video and thought "OMG THIS WILL BE JUST AS BIG AS BG2"? It sounds like you trolled yourself more than anything.

Ironically, BG2 is the only IE game with more than 5 properly fleshed out companions; in fact, Arcanum and FO1/2 wouldn't qualify either. Without more detail about the system as a whole '5 companions' means very little, except that it won't be a BG2. Duh.

As Brother None says, where they did fuck up is failing to give that detail about the system first; a consequence probably of rushing to put the stretch goals up, but they should have been prepared.