Review RPG Codex Review: The Age of Decadence

[Darth Roxor]

yes which is why i will only communicate with him via hieroglyphics now, like Commissar Draco

 

[Delterius]

Question:

[what] niche CRPG offers in comparison with the mainstream

Answer:

skill checks that block/provide more or less conten

You need this and that to do that thing and if you don't have the other thing you can't

Seriously wtf?

Indeed.

 

[Jimmious]

Guys I did read it. At least the half part where you complain about Lore constantly and how it is more important than other skills. Am I wrong?

 

[Eyestabber]

I think that by "balance" he meant "balanced stat distribution" (hybrid). That's what I'm assuming at least...

 

[Jimmious]

No, I meant that Roxor claims that certain builds provide more content than others and in the review he implies that this is a bad thing about the game.
He constantly says how Lore and Crafting are super important and his Ninja dude couldn't do some stuff.
And I also do not like the fact that I know about all these choices before playing the game, but that's a different issue

 

[Eyestabber]

Hybrid builds experience more content than non-hybrids because content is tied to stats and skills as I stated above. That doesn't make them stronger because being a hybrid demands higher SP investment.

Roxor's complaint about lore is IMO a case of trying to turn a specific example into a general rule. The builds he posted all had high int/per and, therefore, could harvest the greatest benefit from the lore skill. A low int/per character with high lore doesn't get nearly as much benefit from the skill, certainly not enough to break even.

But that's all beside the point and I seriously doubt the considerations on the cost-effectiveness of the lore skill will affect your decision much.

 

[Darth Roxor]

Guys I did read it. At least the half part where you complain about Lore constantly and how it is more important than other skills. Am I wrong?

And this, according to you, is not legit criticism?

Also, I guess you conveniently skipped the part where I said that you can start over and build your character in a certain way just to see that one thing you've missed before and get away with it, or the part where I say that you need a whole bunch of playthroughs to put the backstory together, or all the other parts that carry messages similar to those.

No, I meant that Roxor claims that certain builds provide more content than others and in the review he implies that this is a bad thing about the game.

Because it is a bad thing, you twit. Lore is overrepresented. You only lose by skipping it. That's not bad? Please tell me how that is not bad. Are you also going to tell me that spells in Realms of Arkania 1 that had no functionalities were a good feature?

And I also do not like the fact that I know about all these choices before playing the game, but that's a different issue

Well all I can say is fuck you then. Go back to IGN if you want only vague generalities that aren't backed up by anything of substance.

 

[Darth Roxor]

Roxor's complaint about lore is IMO a case of trying to turn a specific example into a general rule. The builds he posted all had high int/per and, therefore, could harvest the greatest benefit from the lore skill. A low int/per character with high lore doesn't get nearly as much benefit from the skill, certainly not enough to break even.

False. I had an int 4/per 7 merc with Lore 9 (and craftung 10) and I would very rarely run into something I couldn't do with dat stack of lawr. Per hardly even matters in matters of lorecrafting, iirc.

 

[Eyestabber]

Roxor's complaint about lore is IMO a case of trying to turn a specific example into a general rule. The builds he posted all had high int/per and, therefore, could harvest the greatest benefit from the lore skill. A low int/per character with high lore doesn't get nearly as much benefit from the skill, certainly not enough to break even.

False. I had an int 4/per 7 merc with Lore 9 (and craftung 10) and I would very rarely run into something I couldn't do with dat stack of lawr. Per hardly even matters in matters of lorecrafting, iirc.

PER and INT are needed for the Abyss (7/7 with Feng's training, 8/7 w/o). And then you need Lore for the machines. INT is needed for the teleporter network, Lore alone doesn't cut it. And your build can't fix the Saross Machine (needs 15 INT + Crafting). Just off the top of my head.

"You only lose by skipping it" is only correct IF your build has the stats to back it up. My Ironman build with 4-4-4 on every non-combat skill would surely NOT benefit by adding lore into the mix. It would only syphon my precious SPs away from alchemy and crafting with no tangible benefit.

Lore is pretty strong, I agree. But it's not a "get it or your just gimping yourself!" skill, like you imply.

 

[MRY]

Because it is a bad thing, you twit. Lore is overrepresented. You only lose by skipping it. That's not bad? Please tell me how that is not bad. Are you also going to tell me that spells in Realms of Arkania 1 that had no functionalities were a good feature?

I agree with your reasoning, and I like your review (though it's not as fun as your destro-mode reviews), but I'm not entirely persuaded here. I think you're right that Lore is overpowered. But, in a single player game, overpowering something is not necessarily bad. Instead, it seems to me -- especially in a game like AOD -- the questions are: (1) is Lore so powerful that if you focus on Lore, the game breaks (like the harm spell or whatever it was in Arcanum); (2) are the rewards from Lore so great that the game is too easy if you focus on Lore (a slightly different question); and (3) is the game balanced in expectation of getting the Lore bonuses, such that not emphasizing Lore means that the game is too hard, or too circumscribed?

I've only played through one and a half times -- once without much Lore/Crafting, half with -- but I tentatively think the answer to all those questions is "no." You get a lot more skill points if you have Lore/Crafting, but the game is still plenty challenging. Without Lore, I did feel like significant portions were cut off (without counterbalancing extra opportunities), but the game wasn't impossible or hopelessly thin.

In some ways, I feel that the problem is that Lore/Crafting were usable to solve too many of the same obstacles that you could get around with speech skills or fighting, but speech skills and fighting could not be used to solve a lot of obstacles that were Lore/Crafting exclusive. The solution would probably be to reduce Lore/Crafting's use in "persuasion" situations, and to add a few more areas that are exclusively gated by high speech and/or fighting skills, analogous to the high lore/crafting gates. I don't think this is a fatal problem, though, because part of the fun of AOD is trying different build combinations and there are viable reasons not to take Lore. It's not a game that you play once trying to max content (as in PS:T, where Wis/Int/Cha are the Lore/Crafting analogues).

That's distinct from the "useless spells" problem in RoA1, I think.

 

[Cadmus]

Because it is a bad thing, you twit. Lore is overrepresented. You only lose by skipping it. That's not bad? Please tell me how that is not bad. Are you also going to tell me that spells in Realms of Arkania 1 that had no functionalities were a good feature?

And I also do not like the fact that I know about all these choices before playing the game, but that's a different issue

Well all I can say is fuck you then. Go back to IGN if you want only vague generalities that aren't backed up by anything of substance.

This is going full retard. Along with your favourite monastery quest.

 

[Jimmious]

Darth Roxor I can also just say "fuck you" but I preferred so far constructive criticism. If you can't take it then fuck you indeed.
Also fuck "over represented". Just because you think Lore shouldn't be so important it doesn't mean it has to be like that in AoD. Or Crafting or whatever skill you didn't pick in some build and couldn't see most of the content. It's important in AoD, deal with it.
MRY explains it better than me, I'm being offensive because you swear and pretend to be some kind of omnipotent being

 

[Infinitron]

I don't think this is a fatal problem, though

I doubt Roxor thinks it's "fatal" either, considering his review is ultimately a positive verdict...

 

[Xzylvador]

put a score and bullet point list of pros and cons at the end?

Yes please.

 

[Delterius]

It's important in AoD, deal with it.

Why do you hate underrepresented skills so much.

 

[Perkel]

Darth Roxor I can also just say "fuck you" but I preferred so far constructive criticism. If you can't take it then fuck you indeed.
Also fuck "over represented". Just because you think Lore shouldn't be so important it doesn't mean it has to be like that in AoD. Or Crafting or whatever skill you didn't pick in some build and couldn't see most of the content. It's important in AoD, deal with it.
MRY explains it better than me, I'm being offensive because you swear and pretend to be some kind of omnipotent being

And people said review wasn't edgy

 

[Jimmious]

It's important in AoD, deal with it.

Why do you hate underrepresented skills so much.

 

[Johannes]

The thing is, and I might not be making this clear with my posts, that AoD cuts off a lot of content depending on your character choices which is something different but Roxor bashes it because it doesn't support "balance", meaning all builds being equally viable.
That's what I got at least.

You should be more specific when using the word "balance". Nowadays it means anything. If you mean "combat balance", click on my sig link and read my post about it. It's all there.

As for the "cut content", it has nothing to do with your combat-related choices. You will experience content based on your choices of factions, stats and skills. AoD takes a REALLY strong stance against Mr. jack-of-all-trades. If you don't belong to Faction X, you won't be able to access Faction X's place of bling blings and friendship. It makes perfect in-setting and in-game sense, you're not really "stonewalled" or anything.

Basically, if you think being Grandmaster-of-all-guilds™ in great Todd-style is a good thing, AoD is not the game for you.

Jack of all trades is doable if you know the game, doing the same combat and lore stuff on any playthrough. Factions being mutually exclusive is not really related to that.

 

[Delterius]

It's important in AoD, deal with it.

Why do you hate underrepresented skills so much.

I agree. Adding more content for other skills that might infringe upon the discussed supremacy of Lore would be evil.

 

[Eyestabber]

It's important in AoD, deal with it.

Why do you hate underrepresented skills so much.

I agree. Adding more content for other skills that might infringe upon the discussed supremacy of Lore would be evil.

Check your lore privilege, shitlord.

 

[Jimmious]

I know Darth Roxor understands what I'm talking about. I'm not bashing just for the fun of it, I'm too old to be in arguments in the Codex.

 

[Johannes]

I know Darth Roxor understands what I'm talking about. I'm not bashing just for the fun of it, I'm too old to be in arguments in the Codex.

Darth Roxor doesn't even know what he knows.

 

[Irenaeus II]

Darth Roxor sent me to say he's gone for the day and see you tomorrow, fuckers.

 

[ERYFKRAD]

Darth Roxor sent me to say he's gone for the day and see you tomorrow, fuckers step into this alley should you need to communicate with him.

 

[Darth Roxor]

PER and INT are needed for the Abyss (7/7 with Feng's training, 8/7 w/o). And then you need Lore for the machines. INT is needed for the teleporter network, Lore alone doesn't cut it. And your build can't fix the Saross Machine (needs 15 INT + Crafting). Just off the top of my head.

Abyss is a bummer, yeah, but I'd say it's the only 'big' place that I was barred from in that playthrough. Teleporter network doesn't matter - every place it leads to can be reached in another way. Saross machine is also minor-ish.

there are viable reasons not to take Lore

I can't think of one.

They say that numbers don't lie, so here's a komprehensive komparison of a loreless (or at least sort of loreless, but I only started raising it very late when it no longer really made a difference) and a loreful guy.

I would say the difference is rather clear on first glance.

I'm being offensive because you swear and pretend to be some kind of omnipotent being

Because that's what I am. And since I am a generous god, allow me to come back to some of this Constructive Criticism (tm) of yours:

If a review with such high standards and amount of nitpicking was done for any recent "big" RPG release (Witcher 3 or whatever crap like that), the reviewer would go insane.

Please refer to any of the "big" RPG reviews in my signature (Risen series or PoE) and you will probably find the same level of detail and "nitpicking".

The whole review seems like a comparison of AoD with the perfect RPG in the mind of the reviewer

Yes, I remember all those times I compared it to Wizardry 8

contains way too many details to the point that it made me want to play the game less, just because I know so many mechanics already just by reading it.

So I spoiled the game for you by saying that you have lots of options in combat, that you get dual skill points and that sometimes you run into combined skillchecks?

Also skill checks that block/provide more or less content should not be analyzed to such an extent in a review. You need this and that to do that thing and if you don't have the other thing you can't... Seriously wtf? Is this a review or a feedback for a beta version?

This is a review that is meant both to act as a round-up of features directed to potential players to tell them what they might be going into and as feedback for the developers in relation to what they could take into consideration for future gaemz.

but this text was not a review that helped me decide if it's a good RPG or not

So, ultimately, I guess the joke’s on me. Age of Decadence is a good game

Age of Decadence is a good game

is a good game

UH?! DAFUK IT MEANZ???

the review fails to provide an insight to what the game actually offers

If there is one element of AoD that has greatly exceeded my expectations and, in fact, amazed me, it’s definitely the combat. Before playing it, I was absolutely certain that single-character turn-based combat that wouldn’t be very basic, very terrible or very random was unattainable.

A lot of fun can be had with skillchecks, as well. Not only do they often lead to different outcomes, but they also aren’t always binary, instead presenting you with degrees of success and failure.

secrets, this is another big strength of AoD in general.

you can just start another game solely with the intent to do that one thing you had to skip before and get away with it.

faction questlines all sport robust branching in each city, even up to the point that you can play the same organisation’s quest chain twice and achieve completely different results.

AoD’s dialogues and descriptions take many shortcuts where possible and apply a healthy dose of abstraction.

The replayability. While I haven’t gone through the game the proverbial seven times, I think it’s certainly possible (if extreme), and the four playthroughs I did never really got boring.

WHY YUO NO PROVIDE INSIGHT FAGGOT REVIEWER?!

I have to admit, I wasn't a fan of the PoE review either.

Ah, so you are a butthurt disciple of yet another church. Got it.

such games should get some extra focus on the features we've missed for many years.

Personally, I've really missed the tacticool combat and gunporn of Jagged Alliance 2 for many years now. I shall make the necessary arrangements and mention that next time.

It's just that your reviews consider them a given and then go on to judge the details.

Because if something was done right at least once already, then it means that it can and should be repeated. I don't care if the last time it was done right was 2, 5, 10 or 30 years ago, if your game does something wrong even though another one has shown that it is possible to do it right at some point in time, then you deserve detention and will not be getting lunch money for the next week, young man.

AoD cuts off a lot of content depending on your character choices but Roxor bashes it because it doesn't support "balance"

you can just start another game solely with the intent to do that one thing you had to skip before and get away with it.

WHY YUO SO BASHING OF GATED CONTENT, ROXOR?

At least the half part where you complain about Lore constantly and how it is more important than other skills.

Because it is.

And I also do not like the fact that I know about all these choices before playing the game

U SPOILAN DAT GAEM HAS SOMETHING BAD, NOW I WILL NEVER BE ABLE TO PLAY IT



Gee, all this looks very constructive and not at all pulled out of your ass, princess.