Wasteland The Wasteland 2 Beta Release Thread [GAME RELEASED, GO TO NEW THREAD]

[Excidium]

PS. you guys are much better than the wasteland forums, they complain about how they miss their list based inventory.

Go away

 

[hiver]

Don't lie, we all know you pressed the "+" button, all ignorers do this. The temptation is too much.

Spoiler

Sorry, no i havent. It isnt really difficult to guess when these dumbasses are just spinning in same fucking stupid-logic loop all the bloody time.
I can do this ten times and guess and be correct ten times. Its nothing special really.

Its like a lottery that has only five numbers in it and you have to guess five numbers. (using example with number ten would be praising the imbeciles too much, - see?)

Same as outguessing you.
For example, there is a very high probability that this is just your cunning attempt to bait me, for something youre imagining.
And its not any sort of temptation, thats what you like to think because it makes your ego feel better. Same as you all think trolling is some kind of super intelligence process.
I use ignore to simply filter humongous amounts of stupid shit that is posted here, and when i do check something its for specific purposes, like giving someone a second or third chance or to see what some other poster reply is referring to.

I dont care much about all of it, except preventing all that crap to pollute my mind and you could - should appreciate that i could have trolled him and you until your brains ran out through your noses - if i wanted to. Which i dont.
Because thats just entropy - and i dont feed on shit.

is that all or do i have to put you back on ignore too?

PS. you guys are much better than the wasteland forums, they complain about how they miss their list based inventory.

What is it that makes them worse?

 

[Jedi Master Radek]

So how did reactivity improved in this build?

 

[Shadenuat]

Is early access supposed to be so overpriced?

 

[hiver]

They are just keeping the price on the levels that kickstarter backers payed for beta.

Although, in the future it would be the best to adopt Larian way of doing it.

 

[Zombra]

Is early access supposed to be so overpriced?

Actually, yes. Quick and dirty: Kickstarter backers paid almost that much two years ago for exclusive early access to a product that didn't even exist. Selling Early Access for less to every Joe Blow now would be a black eye for Kickstarter exclusives, and inXile doesn't want to give KS a bad name. It's not ideal and it may seem unreasonable, but weirdly this is them trying to do the right thing for the people who supported them back when nobody knew if this would work at all.

 

[felipepepe]

Quick and dirty: Kickstarter backers paid almost that much two years ago for exclusive early access to a product that didn't even exist. Selling Early Access for less to every Joe Blow now would be a black eye for Kickstarter exclusives, and inXile doesn't want to give KS a bad name.

By that logic, inXile is not only breaking their word about EXCLUSIVE access, but also making a mad profit over it.

Better answer would be that keeping the price high means that only people that are into the game will buy it, instead of someone waltzing in from nowhere and getting butthurt that it is a beta.

 

[hiver]

The original option of giving beta at high price was a mistake itself, looking at it in hindsight. Though not from making some bucks angle. But it did create this less then optimal steam solution.


Larian way is the best way to go about it.
Alpha and Beta should not be high tier rewards, but given away at lowest tiers, as free choices to pick up or not. Which would allow setting up reasonable prices for steam early access. less money but much clearer and more acceptable - "clean mind" situation.

 

[Athelas]

Selling the Early Access at a lower price to non-backers would make the backers who pledged for beta acess realize that they essentially paid for the 'privilege' of bug-testing a game. And that's not exactly a pleasant realization.

 

[Eyeball]

Is early access supposed to be so overpriced?

Yes, because the devs are faggots who cannot into business.

 

[felipepepe]

Selling the Early Access at a lower price to non-backers would make the backers who pledged for beta acess realize that they essentially paid for the 'privilege' 'of bug-testing a game. And that's not exactly a pleasant realization.

Well, that's the main issue, isn't it? How kickstarter turned beta testing from something that companies would give to consumers to a privilege sold at high prices.

 

[Zetor]

Making superfans believe that they can actually influence the development of their beloved game probably works as a motivator...

... the first two or three times.

 

[sea]

Well, that's the main issue, isn't it? How kickstarter turned beta testing from something that companies would give to consumers to a privilege sold at high prices.

Was there really any precedent for it previously? Beta access was never really a widespread thing for single-player games at all, and preordering or buying the collector's edition to get beta access, usually for multiplayer, has been around for several years now. I'm not sure Kickstarter was the start of this trend.

That said I think in the future, devs (not just inXile) should be more careful about how they handle reward tiers and more consequential bonuses like beta access.

 

[felipepepe]

A precedent for selling access to beta & alpha builds of single-player games? I really can't think of any. At most you had "demos" as bonus inside the cd of another game, or on those CD-ROM Magazines... those demos were probably beta builds, but before the internet era selling access & gathering the feedback from thousand of players wasn't' really viable...

Kickstarter and Early Access are really the ones to "blame" here. KS showed that people wanted to play those, and Steam EA made distributing and constant patching of beta easy.

 

[Zombra]

Quick and dirty: Kickstarter backers paid almost that much two years ago for exclusive early access to a product that didn't even exist. Selling Early Access for less to every Joe Blow now would be a black eye for Kickstarter exclusives, and inXile doesn't want to give KS a bad name.

By that logic, inXile is not only breaking their word about EXCLUSIVE access, but also making a mad profit over it.

Well ... no to both conclusions.

Charging more for johnny-come-latelies just means that the early backers got a "deal", relatively speaking ... beta was never actually advertised as exclusive; my previous post was labelled the quick & dirty version for a reason.

As to 'mad profit' ... really? Come on, they'd sell 5x as many if they dropped it to $20 for Early Access and everyone knows it, so, no, they didn't cynically decide on a high price as a sheer cash grab.

If we really really need the long version of the answer, we can pick apart their KS page and go through interviews and so forth where they describe exactly why they chose the high price point for non-backers. The SHORT version is: to not screw backers while still meeting the demand of newcomers. As I also said earlier, it's not the ideal solution, but this rationale does hold up under scrutiny. I just don't see a need to dissect it for 20 pages.

Kickstarter and Early Access are really the ones to "blame" here.

Totally agreed. I think Kickstarter is great, but Early Access has had a pretty toxic effect on game releases, and the combination of the two is a Frankenstein of bad business.

 

[Country_Gravy]

This game needs more tits. Then it's perfect

 

[Brother None]

When Kickstarter started, Steam Early Access didn't exist. With SEAG becoming a settled thing, we'll see how that impacts future Kickstarters.

But for us it's not too complex: late backer store was open right up until the beta, and open again now, and Early Access digital deluxe was $55 (it would have been part of the general price bump of the late backer store now). Since you can only offer one price tier on SEAG, they are essentially the same: late backers who buy in at the higher, digital deluxe tier. I'm not particularly concerned about price complaints since looking at any Steam forum, people always complain about the price. It's not about the money anyway (though it's nice that our SEAG sold as well as it did, it was a decent success which certainly doesn't hurt), if it was we wouldn't offer that $10 WL2 beta-only add-on to backers, which to my mind is a good golden middle to compensate backers who want in without screwing over the thousands who paid extra to either add it on, up their pledge or picked a higher tier originally just for the beta.

The combat is fine, can be a bit easy on Seasoned difficulty but considering how it is just the first few hours/areas I think it's good.

I think the difficulties still aren't fully implemented. Those settings don't do much.

So how did reactivity improved in this build?

It's certainly improving, but I too am curious to learn how much people found. Highpool for instance has been expanded a lot, with different outcomes and consequences to the main election quest, and of course there's the whole you can let AC/HP both die which opens up an entirely new radio tower quest. There's also been a lot of side-events and small things added. Still work to do, but I think it does show you can make jumps in reactivity at this stage of design.

 

[tuluse]

Selling the Early Access at a lower price to non-backers would make the backers who pledged for beta acess realize that they essentially paid for the 'privilege' of bug-testing a game. And that's not exactly a pleasant realization.

I remember people buying games just to get a demo of another game (Zone of the Enders - Metal Gear Solid 2 was a big one). Sneak peaks and early access in general has always been a premium with video games.

I really don't get the complaints though. Just wait for the full release and you'll get it cheaper and have a better experience.

The point of kickstarter is that people can pay different levels depending on how valuable a project is to them and how much money they have. Beta access was just a little perk for those who paid more. It's not supposed to be a value equivalent transaction.

 

[Athelas]

I wasn't complaining (I think it's great that InXile is getting extra funds), just commenting on Kickstarter psychology 101. The beta access tiers get people to pledge, so they certainly don't see it as just a 'little perk'.

 

[tuluse]

The complaining comment wasn't directed at you. Sorry, I started to ramble.

 

[Decado]

The point of kickstarter is that people can pay different levels depending on how valuable a project is to them and how much money they have. Beta access was just a little perk for those who paid more. It's not supposed to be a value equivalent transaction.

The most annoying thing about the whole Kickstarter/Beta-buy-in brouhaha has been the backers who, because they paid more, feel like they are entitled to more. It is one of the reasons I stay far away from the WL2 forums. I think the it gets lost on some people that they are not buying influence, and that beyond a certain point (presumably the cost of the game itself) you are basically donating your dough to a cause. Sure, you might get some extras but you're essentially buying into the vision.

 

[t]

I actually really like inXile's tactics with the very much overpriced beta on steam right now. It really should yield the most in the long run, because the sales will be here in a couple of months and everyone who would've purchased W2 for $20, and even $10 in a year or so will be able to. If the price had been $20 or whatever from the beginning, everyone who would've paid $55 (and there seems to be a lot of those guys with W2 jumping in and out of top10 steam early access games) would've just grabbed the game for $20 and that would be it.

Stellar work. Also, please, give as much of this dirty steam money to CmcC and allow him to make a game to be remembered.

 

[Infinitron]

Brother None Didn't Blackguards have several price points while it was still in Early Access? I seem to remember there being both a "Deluxe Edition" and a "Contributor Edition" even before it was released.

 

[felipepepe]

Brother None Didn't Blackguards have several price points while it was still in Early Access? I seem to remember there being both a "Deluxe Edition" and a "Contributor Edition" even before it was released.

Yes, it had. IIRC, the cheapest gave you the game at a pre-order discounted price, the other one costed like $10 more and gave access to the beta, and the big one gave it all + extra stuffies and your name in the credits or something like that.

 

[Brother None]

Brother None Didn't Blackguards have several price points while it was still in Early Access? I seem to remember there being both a "Deluxe Edition" and a "Contributor Edition" even before it was released.

Yeah, I meant "can't sell a non-early access version". As in we can't list a pre-order addition along with it like we offer on our store.

You're right tho, I went for the highest option. Name in the credits!