The Witcher 2 Enhanced Edition

[DraQ]

Witcher 2 is not a sandbox game, but a storyfag one with storyfag C&C.

I don't necessarily agree with this paradigm, as I prefer simulationist sandboxes with rich mechanics and emergent C&C, but within storyfag paradigm TW2 with it's storyfag style CYOA C&C is reasonably close to the best you can get.

 

[toro]

Witcher 2 is not a sandbox game, but a storyfag one with storyfag C&C.

I don't necessarily agree with this paradigm, as I prefer simulationist sandboxes with rich mechanics and emergent C&C, but within storyfag paradigm TW2 with it's storyfag style CYOA C&C is reasonably close to the best you can get.

This is a simplistic, but correct description of the different types of C&C that I've tried to differentiate.

I remember I couldn't kill that big guy in the power armour in Fallout 2 when I first met him. Really spoiled the game for me.
Come to think of it, couldn't kill the Overseer in Fallout 1 (except for right at the very end). Damn. Just wasn't allowed.

Nice try. I don't remember Fallout coercing you in a fight with the power armor guy or the overseer (!?)
There is no way to avoid fighting with Letho, which implies that a combat resolution is possible on the spot. But is not, because the script says NO.

Otoh, expecting to kill a major antagonist in the first battle (why not right there in the intro?) is unrealistic in a heavily story-centric game like this where he clearly still has a role to play.

It is not so unrealistic. Basically if the game forces you to fight with someone, it should allow you to win as a natural resolution of combat. And at that moment the player has no clue on what will follow, if Letho will appear again or not, unless he has external information. And I agree that is a stupid thing to kill a major if not the main antagonist, but Letho is underused anyway.

This is a situation where the puppeteer strings are clearly visible. Because the natural resolution of the fight would be that the player flees the scene, not the other way around. Basically you have beaten your nemesis and the rest of the game is a pointless chase. And if they wanted to signal that the game is no longer about finding Letho, it's a clumsy way to do it. And is obvious that not all the players will embrace the change in scope.

(and thanks for the props in the previous phrase)

Carrion, Fader: Ok, I was wrong. It seems that there are *some* references to the first game. Obscure as shit, but nevertheless they exist.
I played the default path (no savegame from the previous game).

 

[Heresiarch]

I've been playing on Ioverth's path this time. This time, I've threw away all the biases on the Scoia'taels, and read carefully through the conversations with Ioverth...and this time, when I reached the choice at the end of chapter 1, I realized it makes perfect sense to follow Ioverth. On a metagame thought, it seems playing on Vergen's side is more interesting too, with the chance to meet more interesting characters, like Saskia, Philippa, and all the dwarves. But damn I feel bad leaving (and in some sense betraying) Roche in such a way.

 

[DraQ]

It is not so unrealistic. Basically if the game forces you to fight with someone, it should allow you to win as a natural resolution of combat. And at that moment the player has no clue on what will follow, if Letho will appear again or not, unless he has external information. And I agree that is a stupid thing to kill a major if not the main antagonist, but Letho is underused anyway.

My main problem with this battle is that it ends in "teehee! I win anyway!" manner, no matter your performance.

If it worked like it does in game if you just lasted enough time without damaging Letho too much, but if you gave him sound beating he'd, for example aard something on the ceiling while knocked down and use falling piece of ceiling to gain advantage and flee it would be much better, if only cosmetic difference between outcomes.

 

[Carrion]

It's kind of weird that they fucked up the Letho fight so badly since already in TW1 you had to lose to Azar Javed early in the game and it didn't feel like the game just slapped you in the face. Hearing Letho boast about sparing Geralt's life later in the game is just a bit too much since you know that you actually won him in a fair fight before the game made you lose. They really could've fixed this in the EE, for example like DraQ suggested. A simpler (although somewhat lame) option would've been to just make Letho so strong that you could barely scratch him. Being forced to lose to an invincible boss worked alright with Desann in Jedi Outcast and Gunther in Deus Ex and it might've worked here as well. It kind of sucks, but it doesn't feel like a kick in the balls.

 

[Carrion]

So, do you prefer Roche's or Iorveth's path?

I'm playing through Iorveth's path for the second time (already finished Roche's path twice) and just reached the second chapter. It feels like this is the only part of the game where they really got the pacing right. Roche's path suffers a bit from a huge info dump at the beginning of the second chapter which just leaves you with a long checklist. Do everything on that list and you're railroaded straight to the ending part of the chapter without the game asking for your permission. On Iorveth's path things are explained a bit better and in a more natural way through numerous smaller conversations and quests at the start of the chapter, which works better than Roche's path's exposition-heavy "there's a curse here, get these items to lift it" opening. I wish that chapter would've had some small investigation phase at the beginning or something. One of the things TW1 got right was how in every chapter it gave you a few leads you could investigate and gradually got more open before neatly wrapping things up at the end of each chapter. It encouraged you to talk to everyone, do side quests for people and in general take as much time with the game as you wanted to. On the other hand, in TW2 the chapter structure is something like

1) a railroaded beginning full of cutscenes that dump tons of info on the player and introduces the important characters,
2) a part in the middle where you have time to do side quests and some exploration on your own (very short in Chapters 1 and 3), and
3) a straightforward ending part where things are resolved in a violent fashion.

The Vergen part breaks that mold a bit and its structure is closer to TW1's chapters. There's more room for exploration and more time for playing dice poker and ploughing women, which is good.

I think Roche's path is more solid story-wise, though, as it's probably more in line with the rest of the game with all the political backstabbing, uneasy alliances and assassination attempts. Even though Vergen is really damn fun and reminds me of Vizima in many ways, it doesn't have any characters you could hate as much as Henselt, Dethmold or Shilard Fitz-Oesterlen (or even Síle). Prince Penis is an asshole but he's a lower league player. Also, you're a total prick if you abandon Roche.

I'll still have to see how the Enhanced third chapter on Iorveth's path turns out before making up my mind. Can't remember all the details from my last Iorveth playthrough either so maybe I'll notice something I've missed before. I think my last playthrough a few days ago was overall the most fun so far (going full BROche from start to finish) and it might be hard to top that, even with all the lesbomancy.

 

[made]

My fondest memory of Roche's path is this bit:


The worst part was the final ghost battle that annoyed me to no end, but I assume it's the same on both paths which is one reason why I still haven't done a second playthrough.

 

[Comrade Goby]

is this game playable without having played the first?

I tried downloading many versions of it and I just couldn't get it to work. And since one was the GOG version I don't want to drop 10 dolla to get a version that might not even start up.

I think the STEAM version has the same problem.

 

[made]

is this game playable without having played the first?

I tried downloading many versions of it and I just couldn't get it to work.

It checks if you have TW1 installed, otherwise it doesn't start.

 

[Comrade Goby]

is this game playable without having played the first?

I tried downloading many versions of it and I just couldn't get it to work.

It checks if you have TW1 installed, otherwise it doesn't start.

You are one cheeky kunt mate

 

[made]

You ran right into that one, mate

 

[Kitako]

is this game playable without having played the first?

I tried downloading many versions of it and I just couldn't get it to work. And since one was the GOG version I don't want to drop 10 dolla to get a version that might not even start up.

I think the STEAM version has the same problem.

All the main characters are new in TW2. "Companions" and sidecharacters are known from TW1, but not central to story in neither game. I'd say you can safely play the 2 without knowing the 1.

In TW2 there are many reference to the past of Geralt (is actually the secondary main quest), but those facts happened before even TW1, so no real tie.

 

[Carrion]

is this game playable without having played the first?

I tried downloading many versions of it and I just couldn't get it to work. And since one was the GOG version I don't want to drop 10 dolla to get a version that might not even start up.

I think the STEAM version has the same problem.

What exactly is the problem? My EE launcher got stuck and I had to download an unofficial fix for it. Might be the same problem.

 

[Mrowak]

It's kind of weird that they fucked up the Letho fight so badly since already in TW1 you had to lose to Azar Javed early in the game and it didn't feel like the game just slapped you in the face. Hearing Letho boast about sparing Geralt's life later in the game is just a bit too much since you know that you actually won him in a fair fight before the game made you lose. They really could've fixed this in the EE, for example like DraQ suggested. A simpler (although somewhat lame) option would've been to just make Letho so strong that you could barely scratch him. Being forced to lose to an invincible boss worked alright with Desann in Jedi Outcast and Gunther in Deus Ex and it might've worked here as well. It kind of sucks, but it doesn't feel like a kick in the balls.

Yeah, I've been arguing this issue on TW bords since forever. Unfortunately, storyfags like what happened, because 'it showed how awesome Letho is'. Cheap.

 

[Carrion]

And whilst Desaan is a pretty good example, Gunther is absolutely not. Were he not invulvnerable, few players would have the slightest problem taking him out.

True, but he's also got loads of UNATCO soldiers and bots on his side and clearly has the upper hand from the start. Even though the plasma rifle is pretty shit in the game, the first time I fought Gunther I thought he had some kind of an overpowered doomsday weapon, which made the fight feel even more impossible, so defeat felt acceptable. On the other hand Letho doesn't seem to have any kind of an advantage over Geralt. He just wins the fight because the game says so, and it feels like shit.

 

[Ivory Samoan]

What's The Wither 2? Is it about a place where all the life rots away? If so, I'm in. How can I get Wither 1?

Drink a shit ton of Vodka, paint yourself in honey and run around Time Square with your cock out.

That'll get you at least the DLC content of the original Wither.

 

[aris]

It's kind of weird that they fucked up the Letho fight so badly since already in TW1 you had to lose to Azar Javed early in the game and it didn't feel like the game just slapped you in the face. Hearing Letho boast about sparing Geralt's life later in the game is just a bit too much since you know that you actually won him in a fair fight before the game made you lose. They really could've fixed this in the EE, for example like DraQ suggested. A simpler (although somewhat lame) option would've been to just make Letho so strong that you could barely scratch him. Being forced to lose to an invincible boss worked alright with Desann in Jedi Outcast and Gunther in Deus Ex and it might've worked here as well. It kind of sucks, but it doesn't feel like a kick in the balls.

Yeah, I've been arguing this issue on TW bords since forever. Unfortunately, storyfags like what happened, because 'it showed how awesome Letho is'. Cheap.

As a storyfag, I must point out to you that you are projecting so hard that you could point yourself to walls and show powerpoint presentations (yeah, I stole that joke from yathzee). I don't even know what the hell you are talking about: In a real world, with believable characters that have egos or really, any real person, it's not unusual that a person will claim they let you win (in order to save your life, of for whatever reason), when he merely lost outright, if you have any friends you might have done this yourself, or have experienced that one of your friends has done this, "the hubris of the defeated" as it is often called. Why is it even important that letho gives you credit for beating him? is the self-esteem of you guys really that low, that you need acknowledgment for your awesome skills by a fictional characters, and get all pissed at "storfyfags" when you don't get it?

 

[Phelot]

My main problem with this battle is that it ends in "teehee! I win anyway!" manner, no matter your performance.

If it worked like it does in game if you just lasted enough time without damaging Letho too much, but if you gave him sound beating he'd, for example aard something on the ceiling while knocked down and use falling piece of ceiling to gain advantage and flee it would be much better, if only cosmetic difference between outcomes.

I've always hated this. It's like a retarded gimmick taken from bad action movies and it feels even worse in video games when you know you've got an enemy, but the game just won't let you win. I'd say this is something to avoid even if you're looking to make a story driven game like TW2.

So, do you prefer Roche's or Iorveth's path?

Definitely BROche. The first time I played and saw Iorveth playing that fruity flute I was like "Yeah, fuck that guy."

I did replay with his path though, which is where I started to realize how limited the C&C really is.

In any case, Roche is an enjoyable character.

My fondest memory of Roche's path is this bit:

Oh God no.... You liked this? The tedium! I completed it just to shut those morons up from screaming that guys name.

 

[evdk]

^

The best part is when you do the whole thing without saving and then fuck up the dialogue choices

DO. NOT. REMIND. ME.

 

[Admiral jimbob]

^

The best part is when you do the whole thing without saving and then fuck up the dialogue choices

don't fucking remind me

 

[made]

Oh God no.... You liked this?

Hell yeah; it was hilarious. The part where Odrin goes NIETOPERZY STADA! AAAARHH ZABIERZCIE JEEE! cracked me up so hard I reloaded like 5 time to watch it again.

Ofc gameplay-wise it sucked balls akin to Heavy Rain but what can you do.

 

[Phelot]

Perhaps its charm was lost in the translation.

 

[made]

No doubt. I watched in in English in German on YT, it was pretty lame.

 

[Deleted member 7219]

When you're walking through the camp and three absolute pig-fucking cunts keep on screaming "ODRIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIN", you find yourself not giving a shit about the actual quest. Like Phelot, I just wanted to get it over with.

 

[Phelot]

^

The best part is when you do the whole thing without saving and then fuck up the dialogue choices

Especially considering it was just a random choice IIRC. There wasn't any logic as to why one dialogue or another would lead to getting that coin.