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Jaedar

Arcane
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Project: Eternity Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 Pathfinder: Kingmaker
There are still some arbitrary win conditions like "conquer X number of settlements" which should be done away with imo. Each faction should have victory conditions that pertain to the lore.
I think those are fine as filler to prevent you from just beelining altdorf before reikland even declares war on you and taking a win on turn 10 after 3 battles fought. Especially since it's usually conquer/raze/sack x different settlements, which is something you are going to want to do anyway.

The type of wincons that always annoyed me the most were shit ones like "control these 10 random cities on the map which are super spread out", "gain 10k gold from raiding" or "construct 5x of this t5 building"(especially after the growth nerf).
 
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There are still some arbitrary win conditions like "conquer X number of settlements" which should be done away with imo. Each faction should have victory conditions that pertain to the lore.
As long as it's x number of settlements rather than specific settlements I think that's fine. Helps avoid being Brettonia and having max chivalry by turn 18. This is a game about conquering stuff and getting some reasonable amount of settlements to win isn't odd.

There are still some arbitrary win conditions like "conquer X number of settlements" which should be done away with imo. Each faction should have victory conditions that pertain to the lore.
I think those are fine as filler to prevent you from just beelining altdorf before reikland even declares war on you and taking a win on turn 10 after 3 battles fought. Especially since it's usually conquer/raze/sack x different settlements, which is something you are going to want to do anyway.

The type of wincons that always annoyed me the most were shit ones like "control these 10 random cities on the map which are super spread out", "gain 10k gold from raiding" or "construct 5x of this t5 building"(especially after the growth nerf).

I do hate most objectives and missions that require sacking or razing since often those are detrimental compared to capturing settlements. They are often up there with the "raid 10k gold" crap.
 

InD_ImaginE

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Pathfinder: Wrath
Remember you don't have to pay for any DLC. you can get the base game and edit creamapi to unlock all dlcs for free.
Why even bother with buying the base games then?

There are actually a lot from practicality perspective.

1. Well in case of WH3 in particular it has Denuvo.

2. In case of WH TW series at a whole, it is for Immortal Empire which require it to see that you have access to all 3 games in 1 storefront.

3. From update perspective: most pirated games rarely get updated to the latest version most of the time. Especially worse for Denuvo games.

4. Steam Workshop is the only way to get 90% of worthwhile mod for WH TW games.
 
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Oof that a huge ass nerf. Deserved (especially with the supply lines nerf, black arks would be able to pollute the seas like they are skaven slaves), but still sucks.
 

Jaedar

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Project: Eternity Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 Pathfinder: Kingmaker

Oof that a huge ass nerf. Deserved (especially with the supply lines nerf, black arks would be able to pollute the seas like they are skaven slaves), but still sucks.

The problem is really being able to stack slave decline all the way to 0. It is pretty balanced if not for that I think.

I had a lot of fun being able to run my entire Morathi campaign for the first 40 turns just from her starting campaign, due to infinite enemies bringing in infinite slaves (and black arks running around with 60% upkeep reduction and no supply lines, sacking as they went). Felt like a pretty unique way to play the game.
 

copebot

Learned
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Dec 27, 2020
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On one hand, the new system is even more passive and makes it so that you no longer have certain provinces which are much more important than others. On the other, now you get to use DE assassins and masters without massive opportunity cost. I liked the ability in WH2 for many factions in general to use heroes and ancillaries to super-boost up a single province even if it was not really a fluid or intuitive mechanic. You can sort of do it with Cathay and some other factions in the current game, but now it looks like you can't really do that with DE at all.

This was one thing that 3K did relatively well with the need to focus on core cities, with it not really being possible to built everything up to the highest possible tier due to food limits. 3K's administrators were also a good compromise with the older games that had governors with beneficial traits.
 

tabacila

Augur
Joined
Nov 2, 2011
Messages
326
Finally bothered to play around 40-50 turns of Kislev to unlock Boris. I also did a soul battle for the first time. The whole summon units thing is so weird in a TW context.
Bring on IE, I'm done with the Realms of Chaos. What a waste.
 
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Meanwhile, the High Elves' income maxxing became more difficult/interesting as you can no longer rely on the Entrepreneur mages and instead have to focus more on trade.


https://youtu.be/aMcMgmTSj5U

Honestly that strategy for income is shit, it takes an absurd amount of provinces to start getting trade overpowered at 5% per building. If you control all of ulthuan and more you're going to have huge income as anyone. I will point out that Dwarves have a +5% tradable resources on every province from a commandment (which also gives +15 growth so you're always using it because dwarves always need growth), their +public order building that you have to spam everywhere has dwarven beer as a resource, and their trade building gives +2%/+5% tradable resources and +2%/+5% income from trade factionwide at tier 2/4, meaning your average 3-size province gives +14% tradable resources and +9% income from trade, which equates to +24% more income per 3 settlement province and is way better than this high elf building. And no one is going on about how dwarves have overpowered income. His income is good because he's playing lmao easymode tyrion along with supply lines being nerfed, nothing more.

The point of the high elf and dark elf cheese (and skaven cheese, though they just break province growth rules rather than income rules) was that you could do it even on Very Hard/Legendary difficulty to skyrocket your strength and break out of the "I only have 1/2 provinces and can't expand because hard enemies keep sending a full stack at me every 5 turns and I also have rebel problems every few turns" rut that hard starts get in, like Teclis or Morathi. Also lots of races can do the recruit lord->unlock +5% global income bonus->disband lord, including dark elf, and its a strictly superior strategy since you effectively have infinite income over time with it.

I'm wondering how all the dark elf slave-affecting stuff will be changed. For example all your lords could get Slaver followers that gave +15% casualties captured and +5% income from all slave pens and slave markets. Stacking those made dark elves even more insane. Lokhir's special Black Ark could give +30% casualties captured. If slaves have no real use to stack then a lot of stuff for Dark Elves becomes useless. -5% construction cost and -10% construction time, even if it wasn't the highest tier in the dark elf video I linked, makes slaves seem completely fucking useless. I mean shit most buildings don't take more than 5 turns and I don't know any that take 10 turns so -10% construction time is effectively useless unless stacked with something else. If slaves don't give money then they need to give something like +global growth or a SUBSTANTIAL -construction cost benefit, like -50% not -5%.

Honestly Dark Elves are probably still fine though just because Black Arks + virtually no supply lines penalty = endless stacks of units at -90% upkeep able to endlessly sack every coastal settlement at +100% or more sack strength. They might in fact have the strongest economy in the game still thanks to this, and if you get lucky on a name of power they can have -110% upkeep on specific units like Dragons or War Hydras which is lols. Getting like 30-60k cash late game every few turns per black ark is pretty ridiculous. It was overshadowed by the easy mode slave cheese but if you got a good start with Dark Elves as someone like Lokhir (rushing Tyrion in Ulthuan from turn 1 was mad overpowered) you could happily sack all the other continents for mad loot before you were able to rank a settlement up to tier 4 for the slave building that gives -50% slave decline rate, or got the -15% slave decline rate tech.

EDIT: Also both Dark elves and High elves are going to be even more overpowered running Shades/Sisters of Avelorn. Melee being much better in WH3 means these top-tier ranged units that are also mid-tier melee units should be practically top-tier melee once you've got your red line + rank 9 on them. At least assuming they aren't nerfed, seems lots of units are being changed.
 
Last edited:
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dont your run out of cities to sack with the arks eventually? so the money/slaves you have accrued during high times will get you when you chill out.
Not really, with how the AI cheats on growth/upgrade cost on legendary by turn 75-100 and how big the world is. AI usually has enough gold and growth stored up to immediately start the upgrade to go back to level 5 as soon as you downgrade it to level 4. 3 or 4 Black Arks can pretty much just sack continuously running up and down continents. The only trouble in WH2 was when supply lines became so brutal that even Black Ark armies got so expensive that sacking only barely paid them off. That was easily countered by the massive amount of slaves you got, but supply lines are practically removed in WH3 which means Black Ark armies are close to free so the slave nerf won't change their effectiveness.
 

Fedora Master

STOP POSTING
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It starts to piss me off that every idiot Youtuber gets early access to IM. It's not like their feedback matters.
 

Jaedar

Arcane
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Project: Eternity Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 Pathfinder: Kingmaker
It starts to piss me off that every idiot Youtuber gets early access to IM. It's not like their feedback matters.
Consider it unpaid beta testing that is also meant to generate hype.

dont your run out of cities to sack with the arks eventually? so the money/slaves you have accrued during high times will get you when you chill out.
Not really. Iirc if you don't conquer any of Ulthuan, there's enough coastal cities there alone to sustain like 2 black arks gaining 20k+ gold for every sack. And there's lots of coastal cities elsewhere.
 

Lacrymas

Arcane
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Sep 23, 2015
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18,917
Pathfinder: Wrath
There are some broken stuff that people have brought attention to, like exploiting forging to get any blue item you want on turn 4 as dwarfs or Festus generally being op.
 

Tyrr

Liturgist
Joined
Jun 25, 2020
Messages
2,791
Consider it unpaid beta testing that is also meant to generate hype.
It's not beta testing or unpaid.
Youtubers also got WH3 1 month before release, CA ignored all the feedback. Because it's just a marketing campaign. The Youtubers get views and CA gets the hype.
 

copebot

Learned
Joined
Dec 27, 2020
Messages
387
If new entrepreneur is really 15% to province income, that's still really good stacked with ancillaries. It's just not as good as what it used to be. That's better than what most factions get. That's better than trying to trademaxx.
 

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