Underrail: The Incline Awakens

[Gay-Lussac]

FYI there is now a reason to go and assasinate gerhard page
https://www.stygiansoftware.com/wiki/index.php?title=Commando_Belt

I was always doing it and Im happy there is actually a reward now.

I was theorizing in past that even on dominating versatile lazor pistols >> expose weakness on stabby builds. This run Im validating that indeed it is the case even without any extra investment(besides versatile feat and being able to craft lazor pistol - because afaik you cant buy/obtain one with better crit multiplier). Now crafting is even easier since few unique items received a boost, also commando belt and tesla armor give you nice improvement.

I just killed Gerhard Page and he didn't have a Commando Belt on his loot. What gives?

I was on the experimental branch before I killed him. Do I have to restart a whole new game on the new patch for it to change his loot?

 

[Gay-Lussac]

Yep, just looted his whole camp and no belt in sight. I'm actually doing a versatility build. Very sad.

Styg lend a hand, please, my lord

 

[lukaszek]

one should always start anew with each patch

btw: huntsman merchant in junkyard no longer offers knife throwing glove. Sort of confirmed by spamming merchant refresh. Im confident that he used to, I guess now throwing builts cant get one before metro is opened

 

[Gay-Lussac]

Don't think I have it in me to go through the early game yet another time

 

[lukaszek]

always learning new things

you can peek behind closed courtain door, essentially like with that wired camera thingy
electric lantern helps in silent isle
never cared for guns before so wasnt aware that wyat carries one. And such sweet sweet one that for knife versatile characters basically mean free action powerful shot
doctor feat is no longer enough to save cliff

 

[Beans00]

I made a music video about killing tchort


jebsmoker


also it was my first playthrough so only normal difficulty

 

[epeli]

No official modding tools at release, but we develop the engine so it has some mod possibilities, not to go into details, styg has the last word on that.

Also pinging Styg and epeli.

If you decide to do a closed release for Underrail: Expedition modding tools, I can polish them up and maintain them as per used bug reports and feature requests. For free. I have over 10 years of programming experience, including an open-source project with 50k+ users. Programming experience with C89, C++17, C#, Java, F#, Common Lisp and Scheme. Incidentally, also some XNA experience: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ie0Il8UYU6I

If further verification is needed, I helped some well-respected individuals here with 2 projects of theirs. It's been finalized and everyone's satisfied as far as I'm aware.

Hate to crush your optimism, but I think you might be just giving Styg second thoughts about releasing modding tools in the first place.
Here's a public chatlog of a prospective modder and Styg that explains his position quite well. He wants more control over it than that.

Styg on modding

re: the question I have is if [modding is] specifically unwanted?

like, actively discouraged by styg

---

Styg: I'll rather not comment as I don't know if and what legal implications my statement might have in the future, if situations arise

Styg: I obfuscated the code for a reason and I'm not generally comfortable with people decompiling it

Styg: I wish we added more built-in modding support, but that would be a huge project at this point

---

then I guess a follow up would be... to what degree does it meat your criteria for decompilation?

e.g. Loading the assembly as a reference in another assembly? Looking at the IL? Reversing the IL to pseudo-code/C#/other while maintaining obfuscation? Reversing the IL and deobfuscating?

I have experience with ethical clean-room reverse engineering, I don't do anything illegal.

(due to parts of my job)

---

Styg: Well, I'll point you back to my first sentence. I purposefully will not state any official position.

---

So if I make something you don't like, you reserve the right to legal action? You know that's default, right?

You make a cease and desist and that's the end of it (in the US)

Ok, so - let's take legal implications off the table for you...

I completely cede to you full legal authority over all modification/etc. and create a license that literally gives you total control over anything derivative no matter how separate it is/could be. All additional parties would have to accept the license too granting you full rights too.

Given that, what would your position on modding be? You can be hypothetical if you don't want to say for sure.

---

Styg: My feelings on the modding in general? I'm not interested in having people do ad-hoc free development for us, which sounds like what you're describing. I wish we took modding into consideration from the start and could release tools for people to add their own stuff in the game. But, no, I do not like the idea of people changing the game engine/mechanics and spawning different builds of the game.

---

There would be no different builds, no modification to game exe/content/files. Could be completely separate, layered.

If you don't want people changing certain things, you can outline what you want sacred and it can be part of the license.

Could add an online whitelist/blacklist kind of deal too.

Right now mostly I make mods on my own machine for my personal use and it's entirely something that is my personal experience - what I'd be doing by this ad-hoc free development is enjoying sharing that experience.

---

Styg: I have no interest in managing anything like that.

---

No to the whitelist/blacklist? (I guess that's a good thing)

So skipping that bit... the rest, same sentiment, no comment?

---

Styg: I don't think you get what I'm saying, you're dealing with technicalities now, even if something is not technically a different build of the game but a wrapper of the .exe it makes no difference to me. I don't like it, I will not endorse it, even unofficially, and I retain the rights to the maximal extent provided by the law to prevent it if I so feel.

Styg: If you're hoping to work out some sort of an official or unofficial deal with me here, I'm not interested.

Styg: I appreciate that you like the game so much that you'd go to the these lengths to develop it, but so do I and I'd like to keep the development for myself.

Styg: The way I would, ideally, set the perimeter for people of what's "allowed" for modding and what's not and in what ways is through the tools I'd release.

Styg: And I don't have time for that, unfortuntely.

Styg: Does this explain my position well enough?

---

Yeah.

Way more clear.

In summary, no 3rd party content for Underrail until 1st party tools for such are released.

---

Styg: Pretty much.

tl;dr key points

Styg: My feelings on the modding in general? I'm not interested in having people do ad-hoc free development for us, which sounds like what you're describing.

Styg: I appreciate that you like the game so much that you'd go to the these lengths to develop it, but so do I and I'd like to keep the development for myself.

Styg: The way I would, ideally, set the perimeter for people of what's "allowed" for modding and what's not and in what ways is through the tools I'd release.

 

[lukaszek]

would save styg some time just saying he will not allow romances in

 

[Parabalus]

No modding is a good position, this way you aren't tempted to selectively reverse changes.

 

[Whisper]

Anyone solved 2 new puzzles in new quest?
How is new quest itself?

 

[Zeem]

Maybe someone who knows Styg (inner circle), can ask him?

Also, ask him who is 3rd Godmen and what exactly Cube for?

He'll just tell you to play the game and think about it for yourself. Styg doesn't like divulging story information outside of the game.
As players we know nothing about the third Godman outside of the fact that he exists (or has existed in the past). Everything else is pure speculation. The Cube is pretty explicitly a power source of massive proportions - likely the output socket of the Godman interstellar energy harvesting network.

Also visions from Monoliths are from past, present, future?
This reality, another reality?

Most likely past.

 

[lukaszek]

if you save scrappers(even though you will lose 1 oddity xp) by ratting eels, will it affect protectorate ending slides?
In past I recall wiping fort apogee, embassy, siding with free drones and still seeing protectorate having foothold due to them helping eels in past.

 

[thesecret1]

Scrapper questline always felt like a dead end. It kind of just cuts off and ends with no resolution

 

[pizza_microwave]

I assume the TC option is so you can hide your association with Oculus and how they are the mystery organization that probably stole the Cube in the first place. I was always super bummed out when the Faceless found out about them, like I was letting the boys down.

Where was it implied that the Oculus was responsible for stealing the Cube in the first place? They're pretty much close associate of Six, who's hunting down Tanner, who in turn the real mastermind behind stealing the Cube. Unless I missed the part where Tanner even managed to manipulate the Oculus? Was it post-DC conversation with Azif?

Spoiler

Six appeared to Azif one day and told Azif that one day Tanner will come to him with a mission (stealing the cube), Six ordered Azif to accept the mission and send the PC (who is PC from the future, time travelling to the past). It's all in the post DC Azif dialogue.

 

[Major_Blackhart]

The Cube is pretty explicitly a power source of massive proportions - likely the output socket of the Godman interstellar energy harvesting network.

I wouldn't go that far. I would say the Cube is similar to ACORN in its origins. If you take Acorn to Ezra, he explains as much. It was built by humanity, the design for it is clearly human, BUT the ability to build or craft such a thing was outside our capabilities at our zenith on the surface. Specifically, Ezra mentions the mind within hidden behind the quantum locking mechanism, the slumbering AI. That intelligence was outside our ability to create, and while we thought it up, we could only do so with the help of outsiders. If you've discovered enough, gone through the monoliths, seen all that jazz, you can guess it's the Godmen.

One of the things that I love especially about this game is Ezra himself, and a few other remnants of Old Biocorp, the ruins, all of it. It's like a nightmarish Indiana Jones adventure in some ways, raiding lost temples and such. Also, I love how Ezra will drop hints about things via exposition dump, but only in relation to certain things and at specific times, such as during the Foundry Beast questline or post Expedition. But it's not really an info dump, more like an explanation to obvious questions. And then it's never enough to really reveal anything further that might put him in danger.

 

[pizza_microwave]

The Cube is pretty explicitly a power source of massive proportions - likely the output socket of the Godman interstellar energy harvesting network.

I wouldn't go that far. I would say the Cube is similar to ACORN in its origins. If you take Acorn to Ezra, he explains as much. It was built by humanity, the design for it is clearly human, BUT the ability to build or craft such a thing was outside our capabilities at our zenith on the surface. Specifically, Ezra mentions the mind within hidden behind the quantum locking mechanism, the slumbering AI. That intelligence was outside our ability to create, and while we thought it up, we could only do so with the help of outsiders. If you've discovered enough, gone through the monoliths, seen all that jazz, you can guess it's the Godmen.

One of the things that I love especially about this game is Ezra himself, and a few other remnants of Old Biocorp, the ruins, all of it. It's like a nightmarish Indiana Jones adventure in some ways, raiding lost temples and such. Also, I love how Ezra will drop hints about things via exposition dump, but only in relation to certain things and at specific times, such as during the Foundry Beast questline or post Expedition. But it's not really an info dump, more like an explanation to obvious questions. And then it's never enough to really reveal anything further that might put him in danger.

Too bad we couldn't see his face when he realized that he was thought-controlled by Tanner all along.

 

[Zeem]

I wouldn't go that far. I would say the Cube is similar to ACORN in its origins. If you take Acorn to Ezra, he explains as much. It was built by humanity, the design for it is clearly human, BUT the ability to build or craft such a thing was outside our capabilities at our zenith on the surface. Specifically, Ezra mentions the mind within hidden behind the quantum locking mechanism, the slumbering AI. That intelligence was outside our ability to create, and while we thought it up, we could only do so with the help of outsiders. If you've discovered enough, gone through the monoliths, seen all that jazz, you can guess it's the Godmen.

It's explicitly described as a xenoartifact by the Coretech facility logs. It has no markings in human languages, but plenty of Godman symbols - similar to the ones on Glowing Canine. It is incredibly valuable to Godmen themselves, and I highly doubt that would be the case if the tech within was simple enough to be reproduced by humans.

 

[lukaszek]

kukri weak expose weakness cant be applied when enemy got proper one from feat.

Ive equipped 5 charms at once, kissed them all and went to range. Couldnt see any difference

 

[Zeem]

Ive equipped 5 charms at once

There's your mistake. You're not supposed to equip more than one charm at the same time, Coral explicitly says so.

 

[lukaszek]

Ive equipped 5 charms at once

There's your mistake. You're not supposed to equip more than one charm at the same time, Coral explicitly says so.

and exactly why I wanted to try and see what would happen. 1vs5, no diff

 

[Major_Blackhart]

Too bad we couldn't see his face when he realized that he was thought-controlled by Tanner all along.

He wasn't thought controlled. Just blocked. Very effectively. Which says to you he stuck around out of curiosity (he's a scientist after all) as well as to confirm his suspicions. I have no doubt he knows of the Godmen.

It's explicitly described as a xenoartifact by the Coretech facility logs. It has no markings in human languages, but plenty of Godman symbols - similar to the ones on Glowing Canine. It is incredibly valuable to Godmen themselves, and I highly doubt that would be the case if the tech within was simple enough to be reproduced by humans.

Coretech is a clusterfuck of an organization. The Oligarchs themselves and their organizations are that. Just attempting to ape the past, and Coretech is the biggest example. They wouldn't know their assholes from a hole in the ground, and I have no doubt they lack the knowledge of the archives of Old Biocorp (i.e. their secret projects, their hidden histories, knowledge of the Apex Technocrats, etc.). If they had, they would have made expeditions to DC AND taken on the Tchortists to take over the old University and learn its secrets.

Fuck Coretech. They're not even a shadow of Biocorp's technological prowess, which would be fit to wipe my ass.

 

[Whisper]

I assume the TC option is so you can hide your association with Oculus and how they are the mystery organization that probably stole the Cube in the first place. I was always super bummed out when the Faceless found out about them, like I was letting the boys down.

Where was it implied that the Oculus was responsible for stealing the Cube in the first place? They're pretty much close associate of Six, who's hunting down Tanner, who in turn the real mastermind behind stealing the Cube. Unless I missed the part where Tanner even managed to manipulate the Oculus? Was it post-DC conversation with Azif?

Spoiler

Six appeared to Azif one day and told Azif that one day Tanner will come to him with a mission (stealing the cube), Six ordered Azif to accept the mission and send the PC (who is PC from the future, time travelling to the past). It's all in the post DC Azif dialogue.

How are you sure about PC being from future?

 

[pizza_microwave]

I assume the TC option is so you can hide your association with Oculus and how they are the mystery organization that probably stole the Cube in the first place. I was always super bummed out when the Faceless found out about them, like I was letting the boys down.

Where was it implied that the Oculus was responsible for stealing the Cube in the first place? They're pretty much close associate of Six, who's hunting down Tanner, who in turn the real mastermind behind stealing the Cube. Unless I missed the part where Tanner even managed to manipulate the Oculus? Was it post-DC conversation with Azif?

Spoiler

Six appeared to Azif one day and told Azif that one day Tanner will come to him with a mission (stealing the cube), Six ordered Azif to accept the mission and send the PC (who is PC from the future, time travelling to the past). It's all in the post DC Azif dialogue.

How are you sure about PC being from future?

Yes, because IIRC time-traveling PC mutilates himself to look like the Faceless, and it’s hard going back from that. Also it wouldn’t make sense for the PC to know he stole the cube and then bother getting it back

 

[Major_Blackhart]

LET THE SILVER HAND RISE FROM THE TRASH OF THE DROP ZONE!!!

 

[Tygrende]

I wouldn't go that far. I would say the Cube is similar to ACORN in its origins. If you take Acorn to Ezra, he explains as much. It was built by humanity, the design for it is clearly human, BUT the ability to build or craft such a thing was outside our capabilities at our zenith on the surface.

This heavily reminds of what Pasquale has to say when you ask him how psi came to be - it's a mutation so complex it's near-impossible it developed naturally, but it's also beyond what humanity could possibly engineer.