Unreal Engine 5 - holy shit!

[rusty_shackleford]

Google earth is streaming geometry today.

and? That's not what nanite is about.
Unless they invented some voodoo compression schemes(hint: they haven't), there's going to be issues attempting to distribute games using models in the millions of polygons for a small object.

Even the documentation pretty much says this shit is going to bloat the shit out of your game.

Rendering highly detailed meshes efficiently is less of a concern with Nanite, but storage of its data on disk is now the key area that must be kept in check. Outside of compression, future releases of Unreal Engine should see tools to support more aggressive reuse of repeated detail, and tools to enable trimming data late in production to get package size in line, allowing art to safely overshoot their quality bar instead of undershoot it.

Thought 200GiB moviegames were bad? Enjoy your terribly optimized 2TiB moviegames.

I already can't tell the difference between 4k "SUPER HIGH DEF HDHD" textures and 2k textures 99% of the time and wish I could opt out of downloading them, this shit is just going to keep getting worse.

 

[Wirdschowerdn]

Piss on Tim Sweeney all you want, but he transformed the game industry (for better or worse) more than anyone else. More than Carmack, Valve or Microsoft.

 

[Gerrard]

Yeah, into shit.

 

[Morenatsu.]

Unreal Engine used to be really cool.



In 1998.

 

[Reinhardt]

Fuck realism, if i want one i can look out of the window. I play games to forget about this shit.

 

[thesheeep]

I can appreciate more realistic graphics, of course.
But no renderer will ever be able to beat your own imagination, so I'll always prefer games that allow the mind to fill the blanks.

 

[tritosine2k]

Google earth is streaming geometry today.

(...) .

... it is compressing by definition objects are built from same tiny instances and those same instances get culled into the horizon in continuous fashion.
So there aren't even LOD levels. And matrix demo is apparently slow because they made shadows extend to horizon without preprocessing & that's kinda unheard.
So even if you dont use high poly you get the important aspect : LOD and culling to horizon - not close up detail(who cares) . And you can use pre process for distant shadows still. But lose on continuous ToD (who cares).

 

[tritosine2k]

I can appreciate more realistic graphics, of course.
But no renderer will ever be able to beat your own imagination, so I'll always prefer games that allow the mind to fill the blanks.

Maybe it's even incremental eg. if you play hours long with an FP game daily then it affects your dreams etc.

 

[Lyric Suite]

How much of that Matrix promo is a pre-rendered movie, and how much is actually live game?

Since it looks like shit i'm going to say it is ingame.

 

[Lyric Suite]

And games furthermore decline as a medium.

MEH.

Decline has nothing to do with technological progress.

In fact, decline affects technological progress as well, as graphic development has been stalled ever since consoles got involved and is here to say. All those cool visuals from the UE5 demos? You are not going to see any of that until consoles can push it that far and even then you'll be greeded with tons of the usual compromises.

 

[Jacob]

The gaming world at long last has cutting-edge, photorealistic graphics.

But it's wasted near exclusively on modeling ugly people.

Monkey's Paw finger goes down.

We've perfected the art of portraying beautiful people ages ago. But with this, we can accurately portray ugly people. Or perhaps you prefer people to live in this kind of delusion?

 

[Generic-Giant-Spider]

The gaming world at long last has cutting-edge, photorealistic graphics.

But it's wasted near exclusively on modeling ugly people.

Monkey's Paw finger goes down.

We've perfected the art of portraying beautiful people ages ago. But with this, we can accurately portray ugly people. Or perhaps you prefer people to live in this kind of delusion?

View attachment 22035

begins to envy Broseph

 

[Unkillable Cat]

but according to codexers 2d games from dos era looks so much better than this!

There are many 2D DOS games that look amazing. Y u hating?

Joined: Jun 27, 2021

hey Jaesun did i do it right?

Whose alt is dis?

 

[gurugeorge]

And games furthermore decline as a medium.

MEH.

Decline has nothing to do with technological progress.

In fact, decline affects technological progress as well, as graphic development has been stalled ever since consoles got involved and is here to say. All those cool visuals from the UE5 demos? You are not going to see any of that until consoles can push it that far and even then you'll be greeded with tons of the usual compromises.

Yeah, the decline is because of the changing audiences (or rather the drive by investors to broaden the market for games after they were discovered to be quite popular in the 80s). The decline is from a more specialized to a more general, lowest-common-denominator-serving product. The decline would have happened if graphics had remained pixelated.

Although it's probably fair to say that better graphics has enabled a particular kind of decline (influenced it along a certain track).

 

[Ol' Willy]

And people are wonder why games are shit nowadays.

Back in the time graphics comprised like 10-20% of development time and resources.
Then it rose to 40-50%.
Nowadays it's 70-80%.

There's no time to develop stuff that actually matters. And no need, though, a lot of chaps drool over graphics alone.

 

[Morenatsu.]

10%? For what, a text adventure? At least 40-50% is the expectation for any game with actual graphics in any era.

 

[DarkUnderlord]

Yay! Quick time events!

I'm glad I lived long enough to see the death of gaming, to be replaced with shitty "cinematic" ZOMG asplosions experiences. Press the R button now monkey! Oh, too slow, try again. Good good! Press R, that's it! Now press the right trigger, very good, here's some stimulus. Good monkey.

 

[Norfleet]

10%? For what, a text adventure? At least 40-50% is the expectation for any game with actual graphics in any era.

Yes, but actual graphics weren't an expectation of a game at all in the early eras. That 10% graphics was when people started doing ASCII-art scribbles.

 

[Norfleet]

Youngens used to be able to imagine anything in their minds, just a plastic army figure and you could imagine a whole battle. Now it needs to be spelled out so clearly it looks real. Imagination is dead!?

Bah, you kids are spoiled. We had to make do with plotting out our battles using news from the radio and blocks of scrap wood marked in pencil.

 

[Azdul]

And people are wonder why games are shit nowadays.

Back in the time graphics comprised like 10-20% of development time and resources.
Then it rose to 40-50%.
Nowadays it's 70-80%.

There's no time to develop stuff that actually matters. And no need, though, a lot of chaps drool over graphics alone.

It's not so straightforward.

Let's say you want to spend less time on graphics. You take existing textures and AI-upscale them, take existing models - and just smooth them out by adding more geometry. Then - let's buy 'Unreal Engine 4' license because Epic shown us how it runs smoothly on everything. Suprise - it's a huge pile of shit that runs like shit on consoles - but they've saved the effort. It's a story of GTA Trilogy Remaster in a nutshell.

And another story. Sony built 'most powerful console in existence' and is basically 'supercomputer for 600$'. Naughty Dog is owned by Sony, so they cannot tell Sony that PS3 cannot really do real-time realistic graphics. So they manually go over every scene and manually bake in lightning and shadows by working 80 hour weeks for 18 months. Objects moving in the environment still stick out like sore thumb - but if you point camera just right - it looks like real life - and Sony can create convincing trailer. Good doggie, Sony won't put you down just yet.

Doing realistic graphics on console hardware is like building pyramids - you can achieve ANYTHING if you have a will, talent and hundreds of disposable slaves. You just need to manually hardcode real light behavior in every possible scene from every possible angle.

It does not mean that graphics need to be that way. You can create quite convincing results in reasonable time if you give up spending 95% on 'smoke and mirrors', and pre-baking fake effects that limited hardware cannot achieve in real time.

 

[Bester]

Yeah, the decline is because of the changing audiences (or rather the drive by investors to broaden the market for games after they were discovered to be quite popular in the 80s). The decline is from a more specialized to a more general, lowest-common-denominator-serving product.

An astute observation. So how do you keep the quality at the level at which it was 20 years ago?

First of all, you have to decide to do it. For example, USSR had the mandate of the masses to make such decisions, it was part of the state ideology. This ideology was embodied by state censorship, and censorship in art is the only thing that can save art mediums in a market economy. There needs to be an adult in the room who can draw the line when it comes to stupidity. The kind of stupidity that makes other people even more stupid by consuming said product, i.e. stupidity detrimental to society.

The well-being of society was part of USSR's ideology, so it was natural to do it. The anglo-saxon elites, on the other hand, favor the protestant idea of "predestination" or that everything will happen as god wills it, e.g. "if one is destined to drown, he won't die in a fire". Meaning that the elites will give their children an elite education and shelter them from vices, while the plebs can be alcoholics, drug addicts, morons, marvel fans. It's all god's will.

Because of this, the west has no ideology and everything is allowed (with minor politically motivated exceptions). Talking of liberty, there are two kinds of freedom: "freedom from" and "freedom for" (called negative and positive respectively). USSR practiced the latter one. It gave art creators freedom to infuse works of art with the highest values that aim to elevate the man. The west practices freedom from -- from all restraints and sanity. Which results in absolute degeneracy and shit.

 

[Nifft Batuff]

Not impressed, even less when you realize that all of this is only inert backgrounds. And a bit scared that gaming is reversing back to pacman or Dragon's Lair.

 

[Morenatsu.]

10%? For what, a text adventure? At least 40-50% is the expectation for any game with actual graphics in any era.

Yes, but actual graphics weren't an expectation of a game at all in the early eras. That 10% graphics was when people started doing ASCII-art scribbles.

Who cares about crappy old PC games when you can go the arcade and play actual video games.

Not impressed, even less when you realize that all of this is only inert backgrounds. And a bit scared that gaming is reversing back to pacman or Dragon's Lair.

lol you wish. pacman is too complex for retards

 

[Wirdschowerdn]

Yeah, into shit.

This is not untrue. The rise of the UE and other commercial solutions have driven technical illiteracy across the industry and education sectors. This is why 90% of all game development is now so heavily art/animation driven. I.e. banal boring shit.

 

[rusty_shackleford]

they focus on GRAFX because it sells, if people stopped buying games based on eye candy there would be less emphasis on it