KickStarter Vampire Syndicate: Gangs of MoonFall

[The Wall]

Devs and programmers in the 90s competed who would be the first one to succesfully lower the camera to first person and connect it with gameplay systems. It was and remains huge selling point. I personally like all camera angles. Depends on mood

 

[Luka-boy]

Well fuck me and suck me dry.

I sure wasn't expecting THAT. You're one hell of an interesting dev, that much I can say

 

[RaggleFraggle]

Nigga! I can't stop laughing. Your "bewilderment" that people actually prefer FPP when most played games are either FPP or close up TPP is so funny

I’m not bewildered. I’m disappointed.

Video games allow for so much creativity, but humans discard it for stupid reasons.

 

[The Wall]

Nigga! I can't stop laughing. Your "bewilderment" that people actually prefer FPP when most played games are either FPP or close up TPP is so funny

I’m not bewildered. I’m disappointed.

Video games allow for so much creativity, but humans discard it for stupid reasons.

Agreed

Isometric games from 90s and early 2000s grew so much on me. Grand strategies as well. Young me would never give them my time of day. Most people never grow their taste for beauty & fun. 0 curiosity

 

[The Wall]

Well fuck me and suck me dry.

I sure wasn't expecting THAT. You're one hell of an interesting dev, that much I can say

Rockstar Indie Dev. Only one today true to original meaning of word Rockstar: "music/art, women, money". Well, he's for the time being missing the last part but 66.6% Rockstar is not bad!

 

[Lord_Potato]

I applaud the change of engine Tyranicon . I felt like Memoirs were already trying to break the limits imposed by RPGMaker, that you were trying to create a richer experience than the one allowed by it. I think moving to Unreal or Unity would allow you to spread your wings wider and free yourself from low limit of animation frames or a rigid division between exploration and combat phases.

However... moving into FPP is a risky move. What you showed in this sneak peek looks absolutely fantastic, but I'm afraid for the possibility of delivering a whole game in this style, being a solodev of modest means. Isometric view allows you to keep a lower level of visual fidelity, because the camera is more distant from the action.

I can only wish you luck on this journey and hope you'll make the right decisions. I enjoyed Memoirs very much, despite the obvious limitations and hope to one day play Vampire Syndicate.

 

[Spectral Pontifex]

I applaud the change of engine Tyranicon . I felt like Memoirs were already trying to break the limits imposed by RPGMaker, that you were trying to create a richer experience than the one allowed by it. I think moving to Unreal or Unity would allow you to spread your wings wider and free yourself from low limit of animation frames or a rigid division between exploration and combat phases.

However... moving into FPP is a risky move. What you showed in this sneak peek looks absolutely fantastic, but I'm afraid for the possibility of delivering a whole game in this style, being a solodev of modest means. Isometric view allows you to keep a lower level of visual fidelity, because the camera is more distant from the action.

Agreed. You suddenly have to pay way more attention to visual fidelity, including animations and stuff.

 

[RaggleFraggle]

You could try going the cartoony anime route with the character models in order to offset the increased attention to detail.

How do you feel about using AI voice filters?

 

[Tyranicon]

WTF My Dude? Which engine and programming language is this?

Don't go full first person. Mix perspectives like Archaelund[...]

Unreal 5 and C++. I avoided it for the longest time because Unreal is highly complex and a little too beastly for a solodev. But after spending a few weeks in it, it's honestly much easier than I remember. I think it's just 'cause my brain has rewired itself to know how certain things work.

Also yes, the basic format of this game is similiar to Archaelund. That explains why I was asking some questions regarding FPP/overhead turn-based hybrids a while back.

However... moving into FPP is a risky move. What you showed in this sneak peek looks absolutely fantastic, but I'm afraid for the possibility of delivering a whole game in this style, being a solodev of modest means. Isometric view allows you to keep a lower level of visual fidelity, because the camera is more distant from the action.

Yes, but not as much of a change as you'd think.

1. I clearly use marketplace assets. There's no way I'd ever have the time or talent to do 3D modelling myself, although if I get the budget I will hire out for some custom work.
2. The previous isometric maps were built in DAZ, which is more or less the same way that I'll build maps in Unreal. Actually it's much easier in Unreal because the amount of tools and plugins available.

Although you can't see it, the isometric maps in the old demos and screen shots are at an acceptable quality for FPP. I just didn't have an engine to showcase it.

How do you feel about using AI voice filters?

I'm currently trying it in my BG3 parody and to be frank, I think AI still has a way to go before it'll lose its uncanny valley status, which means it's only usable for droids/robots/ai, etc.

Which means the alternative is hiring real human VO for any voicework, and I don't currently have the bandwidth or the budget to handle that.

Although, I think my budget problems may be alleviated soon, because a high-quality, turn-based RPG in this style, from a semi-reputable developer... I think that is a recipe for success.

I was hoping this is going to be my breakout hit.

 

[Mortmal]

If you're saying "holy shit" I'm right there with you.

Is this April Fools? This is quite a drastic change from isometric view to FPP with a strong cyberpunky feel. Wouldn't the latter mean more work? What's going on? Why the sudden change?

I'm not ready to fully announce/commit on it, but the honest answer is that the deeper I try to break the RPGmaker engine to do what I need to do, the more frustrated I am with it. And the version of the engine I'm using is basically impossible for anyone else to understand but me, with a thousand different bandaid solutions.

So I am contemplating switching engines.

There will still be isometric (well, overhead free camera) perspectives, especially during combat.

Yes, it's a lot of work.

Yes, it's insane.

I'm not in this line of work because it's easy or because I'm altogether sane.

And this will bring the game much more in line with my vision than RPGmaker ever will.

The demo looks good for sure, but it's madness; you can't pull off a whole RPG in 3D like that alone. It's far too ambitious. There's an easier way to tackle this. Look at all the successful Kickstarter campaigns; RPG books are gathering ten times more money and faster than a game like Swordhaven, which is already not so easy to make for a small team. What is the reason for their success? They are selling pretty pictures and dreams. You could more easily manage a 2D CYOA like cyberpunk game with some RPG elements and good story. Unless you have a team behind you and unlimited cash, it's unreasonable and you are running into a wall.

 

[Tyranicon]

The demo looks good for sure, but it's madness; you can't pull off a whole RPG in 3D like that alone. It's far too ambitious. There's an easier way to tackle this. Look at all the successful Kickstarter campaigns; RPG books are gathering ten times more money and faster than a game like Swordhaven, which is already not so easy to make for a small team. What is the reason for their success? They are selling pretty pictures and dreams. You could more easily manage a 2D CYOA like cyberpunk game with some RPG elements and good story. Unless you have a team behind you and unlimited cash, it's unreasonable and you are running into a wall.

My last game probably would've made more money if it was a visual novel with a string of DAZ sex scenes. It would've been much cheaper and much easier.

By now, I think people get the point that I'm a true believer. I want to do things that are far too ambitious. I want to climb the mountain. I want to make this really good RPG with all this cool shit.

But I don't do it knowing I'll fail. I think I have a fairly good chance actually. Plus, this isn't a solodev recreation of CP2077 or something. The game's still mostly reading and combat.

 

[Spectral Pontifex]

My last game probably would've made more money if it was a visual novel with a string of DAZ sex scenes. It would've been much cheaper and much easier.

By now, I think people get the point that I'm a true believer. I want to do things that are far too ambitious. I want to climb the mountain. I want to make this really good RPG with all this cool shit.

But I don't do it knowing I'll fail. I think I have a fairly good chance actually. Plus, this isn't a solodev recreation of CP2077 or something. The game's still mostly reading and combat.

People underestimate how many resources are poured into things like VA, 3Dmodels and animations - all of which you are bypassing one way or the other.

 

[kangaxx]

This is the Leroy Jenkins of game development, but you have to applaud the balls. I must say though I was looking forward to isometric.

 

[Immortal]

If you're saying "holy shit" I'm right there with you.

Is this supposed to be impressive?

If there's an entire 60 hour game like this - okay fine but what was shown in this trailer could be made in 20 minutes and that camera is jank as fuck - did you just attach it to the head bone? It's fucking wobbling around with every walk cycle like I'm drunk or something.

 

[Tyranicon]

Is this supposed to be impressive?

If there's an entire 60 hour game like this - okay fine but what was shown in this trailer could be made in 20 minutes and that camera is jank as fuck - did you just attach it to the head bone? It's fucking wobbling around with every walk cycle like I'm drunk or something.

You're not wrong but I could probably say the "this trailer could be made in 20 minutes" about every teaser. That's why it's a teaser, because I'm still working on a lot of stuff.

Head sway will need to be reduced though. It's not attached to the head bone, but instead some mathematical blueprint fuckery that accounts for head sway.

 

[Immortal]

Is this supposed to be impressive?

If there's an entire 60 hour game like this - okay fine but what was shown in this trailer could be made in 20 minutes and that camera is jank as fuck - did you just attach it to the head bone? It's fucking wobbling around with every walk cycle like I'm drunk or something.

You're not wrong but I could probably say the "this trailer could be made in 20 minutes" about every teaser. That's why it's a teaser, because I'm still working on a lot of stuff.

Head sway will need to be reduced though. It's not attached to the head bone, but instead some mathematical blueprint fuckery that accounts for head sway.

"I agree with your post but also REEE EDGY!!!"

It's just a fact. This demo looks exactly like a pre-packaged asset bought off the store. Again, if there's an entire game there great but I can only imagine that if I walk straight down that rainy shady allyway I'm gonna drop off the edge of the world.

Is this actually a teaser for a mid-development game or just the first area you made as a POC?

 

[The Wall]

How would rich list of side activities and faction warfare system play out? In first person or top down? Make a contraversy, refuse to feature trans vampire cyber hookers and when asked why answer on twitter with because. Let YouTubers and others pick up "drama" and you'll get your marketing budget for 0$. I can make tranny bot twitter account and prepare it for time around Kickstarter

My 2% Jewish genes have been: activated. HaHa, but seriously don't think shit like this ain't done daily

 

[Tyranicon]

"I agree with your post but also REEE EDGY!!!"

It's just a fact. This demo looks exactly like a pre-packaged asset bought off the store. Again, if there's an entire game there great but I can only imagine that if I walk straight down that rainy shady allyway I'm gonna drop off the edge of the world.

Is this actually a teaser for a mid-development game or just the first area you made as a POC?

Like I said in previous posts right above yours, I'm not even comfortable fully announcing the project's migration from RPGmaker to Unreal. So no, this is nowhere near anything close to "mid-development."

It's simply a teaser for the look and feel that I'll going forwards with if I do switch to Unreal (which at this point is 90%+ likely).

I also don't hide the fact that I use assets, even in their default demo states. The previous versions of this game's demo did the same thing with DAZ environments. As a solodev I have neither the time, budget or talent to do otherwise.

A lot of dev work is really just applying common sense.

Also you were being edgy, and that's fine. It's codex after all, and this thread started with a multipage fight about whether or not I was plagerizing VtMB.

How would rich list of side activates and faction warfare system play out? In first person or top down? Make a contraversy, refuse to feature trans vampire cyber hookers and when asked why answer on twitter with because. Let YouTubers and others pick up "drama" and you'll get your marketing budget for 0$

Most of the side activities is going to be related to fucking. There may be some minor management/building elements like in my last game. Also one thing I do want to implement is managing your crew, or band of criminals, outside of just your companions.

I'm not interested in drama. I just want to make a game.

 

[The Wall]

I'm not interested in drama. I just want to make a game.

Understood. First person perspective and steam/twitter bot farm parroting this is CYBERPUNK KILLER and CYBERPUNK 2069 iiiiincoming

 

[The Wall]

Kidding aside, I'll think seriously how your game can be marketed most efficiently. Interesting challenge

 

[The Wall]

How much money would you need to comfortably work on game like this? Be brutally honest, not Kickstarter honest. North of 100k $?

 

[Spectral Pontifex]

Is this supposed to be impressive?

If there's an entire 60 hour game like this - okay fine but what was shown in this trailer could be made in 20 minutes and that camera is jank as fuck - did you just attach it to the head bone? It's fucking wobbling around with every walk cycle like I'm drunk or something.

Obviously, this is more of a proof of a concept that the game could feasible be made in FPP. Tyranicon's games are focused on story, worldbuilding and C&C. Nobody is expecting a technical marvel.

 

[Immortal]

Tyranicon's games are focused on story, worldbuilding and C&C.

Has he finished a game yet?

 

[Tyranicon]

How much money would you need to comfortably work on game like this? Be brutally honest, not Kickstarter honest. North of 100k $?

I'm usually honest. Don't mistake me for some conman scumbag that gets $200k off crowdfunding and then goes begging around for a big publisher, only to cancel their game a few years down the line and abscond with all the money. I've ran five successful kickstarters before (all really small of course).

To be brutally honest, I can do it with as little as $20k USD. It won't even pay for my living expenses, much less any part of development. I'll front a large part of the project out of pocket and hope I make it back when the game starts to sell.

It's painful, and I've done it before, and I don't want to do it again but I will if I have to.

$45k was my last Kickstarter goal, and it's a fairly low budget for what I want to do, but it'll pay my bills for a little bit and give me some breathing room.

$100k is closer to ideal and I can start properly hiring contractors for level design and programming as needed, the project will see significant improvements.

$200K and above is gravy and the ideal budget. At this point I will be fully competing with AAA as what they will no doubt view as some upstart with no connections on a shoestring budget. But I'll fucking crush them.

If I reach this mark, I'll be turning heads and people will take notice.

Tyranicon's games are focused on story, worldbuilding and C&C.

Has he finished a game yet?

Here's my steam developer page, you'll have to sign in or you won't see half my games:

https://store.steampowered.com/search/?developer=A Memory of Eternity LLC

 

[RaggleFraggle]

Have you considered releasing the game in episodes?