World of Darkness Vampire: The Masquerade – Bloodlines 2 from Hardsuit Labs

[Black]

Vicissitude is so cool

Said every tranny ever.

 

[Lambach]

Ok, I think I found the real reason they went with thin bloods:

https://whitewolf.fandom.com/wiki/Thin-Blood_Alchemy
Powers

• 
  • Far Reach: Lesser telekinesis
  • Haze: Creates a field of mist
  • Profane Hieros Gamos: User can change their gender

• 
  • User can develop formulae to counterfeit level 1 Disciplines
  • Envelop: Blinds a target through mist

• 
  • User can develop formulae to counterfeit level 2 Disciplines
  • Defractionate: Makes fresh blood out of bagged medical blood

• 
  • User can develop formulae to counterfeit level 3 Disciplines
  • Airborne Momentum: User can fly

• 
  • User can develop formulae to counterfeit level 4 Disciplines
  • Awaken the Sleeper: User can awake other vampires from torpor

Holy fucking lmao, I didn't even realize how powerful Thin-Bloods are in V5. They can fly, which is something only Gargoyles can do without shape-shifting and they get to imitate up to 4th level Disciplines. Any goddamn Discipline.

Why are they considered a weaker breed again?

 

[ArchAngel]

Humanity is for losers that want to be made fun of for being thin-bloods

"humanity is overrated" indeed. But this is why I think that such a choice would probably be at the end of the game.

Also, would getting a higher generation remove thinblood perks like being able to get the powers of other clans?

There is nothing preventing one vampire from learning all disciplines from all clans if he finds teachers for them all.

 

[Storyfag]

Vicissitude is so cool

Said every tranny ever.

Vicissitude is a gimmick. Nice to have, but not much more. The koldunic powers enabling a Tzimisce to become a veritable genius locii on the other hand, are a thing of beauty. When storm and the land anwser to your anger, when you can see into the heart of any in your domain, when the children of the night anwser your call... THAT is true greatness.

 

[Herumor]

*laughs in Lasombra*

Don't laugh just yet, apparently they've turned Obtenebration into something else in V5 from what I've heard, they call it Oblivion. Apparently they thought to combine Obtenebration and Necromancy (Giovanni) into one Discipline. Which makes no sense, given that the Abyss had very little to do with Wraith stuff, but I haven't read V5 so I have no idea how they thought to pull this one off. By the looks of things from the wiki, Oblivion seems to be weaker than Obtenebration. And I was really hoping for some Abyss Mysticism too.

I'm going to wet my panties if we can play Sabbat in this.

The thing is, you have to wonder how they'll actually implement that into the game. Can you expect a more nuanced view into Sabbat and whichever Path of Enlightenment you choose to help you stave off the Beast? Or will it be just the very shallow stuff that we had in Bloodlines, with Andrei as the figure-head and the shovel-heads who were just grunt-tier enemies for you to go through? Andrei is very memorable, yes, but he didn't really make a case for ever joining the Sabbat. He merely commented on your humanity counter, whether it was high or low, and the potency of your blood that had strengthened in between the two encounters. Personally, I'd enjoy going through the rites of Sabbat, learning their traditions, but I honestly doubt that the developers will devote that much time to it, because it wouldn't be very fair if Sabbat got so much focus, while the other suffered for it. That said, fuck being fair, I want Path of Night now.

There is nothing preventing one vampire from learning all disciplines from all clans if he finds teachers for them all.

Except other vampires.

 

[a cut of domestic sheep prime]

Why are they considered a weaker breed again?

Because they can't go above level 4 Disciplines. Also:

https://whitewolf.fandom.com/wiki/Thin-blooded

Vampires with Thin Blood Syndrome possess exceptionally diluted vitae. A character with Thin Blood Syndrome must expend twice the number of Blood Points necessary when using Disciplines and other vampiric abilities, cannot form blood bonds, and have a portion of their blood pool which can only be used to wake each evening. In addition, thin-blooded vampires generally have great difficulty Embracing others, and more strangely, those who do survive the Embrace often do not awaken as a vampire until minutes or hours later.

The rules for thin-blooded characters of the 14th and 15th generations are expanded upon in the Time of Thin Blood supplement. Despite being definitively weaker than other vampires, they do possess some advantages.

 

[a cut of domestic sheep prime]

There is nothing preventing one vampire from learning all disciplines from all clans if he finds teachers for them all.

It actually sounds like that may be possible i this game too, as Clans don't appear to be something you're locked into and you can piss them off to the point that they don't want to work with you.

 

[Zero Credibility]

All this jealousy of the Tremere, tsk, tsk... But seriously now, I like Tremere for two reasons, first, they are the closest you can get to a flexibility of a wizard, especially with rituals. And second, Strauss. He alone is the reason Camarilla ending works for me in Bloodlines.

 

[Zombra]

Grunker, finally a post in the thread actually worth reading instead of just killing time to, thank you. I want to agree specifically with what you said about the music. In general I don't like goth music and it doesn't "speak" to me. When something from the soundtrack comes up on shuffle my immediate reaction is usually "What is this garbage? Oh wait, I recognize this, it's from that one part of Bloodlines" ... and then I genuinely enjoy and appreciate it as part of the incredible atmosphere you were talking about.

---------------------------

Unrelated: everybody stop speculating about "How is it going to be possible for the player to level up???????? Thin bloods can't become more powerful!!!!!!!!!!" Exactly like in the first game, the devs are going to ignore the rules as written, which were designed for campaign tabletop play over the course of real life years, and throw in something else that makes sense for a 30 hour video game. I mean if you like giving yourselves headaches, go ahead, but you're being dumb if you expect P&P and CRPG to use interchangeable rules.

 

[rusty_shackleford]

Grunker, finally a post in the thread actually worth reading instead of just killing time to, thank you. I want to agree specifically with what you said about the music. In general I don't like goth music and it doesn't "speak" to me. When something from the soundtrack comes up on shuffle my immediate reaction is usually "What is this garbage? Oh wait, I recognize this, it's from that one part of Bloodlines" ... and then I genuinely enjoy and appreciate it as part of the incredible atmosphere you were talking about.

---------------------------

Unrelated: everybody stop speculating about "How is it going to be possible for the player to level up???????? Thin bloods can't become more powerful!!!!!!!!!!" Exactly like in the first game, the devs are going to ignore the rules as written, which were designed for campaign tabletop play over the course of real life years, and throw in something else that makes sense for a 30 hour video game. I mean if you like giving yourselves headaches, go ahead, but you're being dumb if you expect P&P and CRPG to use interchangeable rules.

I'd prefer if they just threw the rulebook in the trash and simply used the lore.

 

[Orma]

Tremere is the master race of Bloodlines.

 

[Grunker]

Unrelated: everybody stop speculating about "How is it going to be possible for the player to level up???????? Thin bloods can't become more powerful!!!!!!!!!!" Exactly like in the first game, the devs are going to ignore the rules as written, which were designed for campaign tabletop play over the course of real life years, and throw in something else that makes sense for a 30 hour video game. I mean if you like giving yourselves headaches, go ahead, but you're being dumb if you expect P&P and CRPG to use interchangeable rules.

Spot on. Every great game of P&P I've ever played had a GM who scultped whatever setting we were playing to his needs. Yet in a cRPG that's haram. I guess some of it is PTSD from devs who made retarded and unnecessary changes to stuff, but some of it also seems to come from the purists who think the point of settings are the formal and undying, unchanging words written down on the page rather than what themes they facilitate and how.

 

[a cut of domestic sheep prime]

How is it going to be possible for the player to level up

what? thinbloods can increase in power. generations aren't the same as levels, even without diablerie.

other than that, I sort of agree.

 

[Storyfag]

Exactly like in the first game, the devs are going to ignore the rules as written, which were designed for campaign tabletop play over the course of real life years, and throw in something else that makes sense for a 30 hour video game.

The beauty of Bloodlines is that the devs mostly did stick to the rules as written. The PC is simply an 8th or lower generation Vampire coming into his powers. That is why Domination worked on him early in the game, but did not later. That is why Andrei commented on the potency of his blood being greater. The 'sire' decapitated by the Sheriff was a mindwiped dupe. The real sire is now hanging out with Jack and Caine the Cabby.

 

[Prime Junta]

The PC is simply an 8th or lower generation Vampire coming into his powers.

That needs some explaining. Your sire would be 7th-gen. Here's a description of what that means:

Younger than the Methuselahs and Antediluvians, many of the vampires of the sixth and seventh generation are still elders of Cainite society. While few Cainites ever cross paths with a fourth generation vampire, most encounter the self-styled lords of the sixth and seventh generations. Although they are not as powerful as the Methuselahs, these Cainites are still formidable opponents, who gladly sacrifice mystical and spiritual power for temporal influence. These Cainites rule over vast kingdoms, donning the crown of monarchs and commanding armies of younger Cainites and mortal thralls.

How would someone like that allow themselves to be meekly executed by LaCroix? How would they do something as colossally stupid as siring you in the first place?

Spoiler

A line of speculation could be opened by considering the possibility that your supposed sire was not, in fact, your real sire, but merely a pawn used by the 7th generation Elder. Go ahead, knock yourself out.

 

[Lacrymas]

Or the PC was a centuries old ghoul that was mindwiped and embraced. Perhaps the ghoul of the one who kept sending you chess metaphors.

RE: Thin-blood power - you have to expend a lot of xp to learn disciplines, much more than any other vampire, so you can't just "learn everything" like it's nothing. In the PnP, getting to high levels of a discipline means you are a master and have spent considerable amount of time honing that particular discipline. It would take probably tens of thousands of years for a thin-blood to master every discipline, and they still wouldn't master it because the high levels are barred for them.

 

[rusty_shackleford]

Exactly like in the first game, the devs are going to ignore the rules as written, which were designed for campaign tabletop play over the course of real life years, and throw in something else that makes sense for a 30 hour video game.

The beauty of Bloodlines is that the devs mostly did stick to the rules as written. The PC is simply an 8th or lower generation Vampire coming into his powers. That is why Domination worked on him early in the game, but did not later. That is why Andrei commented on the potency of his blood being greater. The 'sire' decapitated by the Sheriff was a mindwiped dupe. The real sire is now hanging out with Jack and Caine the Cabby.

If they stuck to the rules as written then Grünfeld Bach would have made you his bitch

 

[Grunker]

Exactly like in the first game, the devs are going to ignore the rules as written, which were designed for campaign tabletop play over the course of real life years, and throw in something else that makes sense for a 30 hour video game.

The beauty of Bloodlines is that the devs mostly did stick to the rules as written. The PC is simply an 8th or lower generation Vampire coming into his powers. That is why Domination worked on him early in the game, but did not later. That is why Andrei commented on the potency of his blood being greater. The 'sire' decapitated by the Sheriff was a mindwiped dupe. The real sire is now hanging out with Jack and Caine the Cabby.

An excellent example of assigning grave importance to details that don't matter in the slightest, mate

 

[ArchAngel]

Maybe Smiling Jack is your sire, that would explain why he takes interest in you so early.

 

[Volrath]

The Ravnos antediluvian was killed by the Technocracy, so they aren't omnipotent and indestructible. Tremere master race (after the Tzimisce).

Wasn't that retconned in 5th edition? Tremere clan isn't all powerful anymore either, they got splintered into 3 factions.

 

[Prime Junta]

Maybe Smiling Jack is your sire, that would explain why he takes interest in you so early.

Smiling Jack is 10th gen. https://whitewolf.fandom.com/wiki/Smiling_Jack

 

[Storyfag]

Exactly like in the first game, the devs are going to ignore the rules as written, which were designed for campaign tabletop play over the course of real life years, and throw in something else that makes sense for a 30 hour video game.

The beauty of Bloodlines is that the devs mostly did stick to the rules as written. The PC is simply an 8th or lower generation Vampire coming into his powers. That is why Domination worked on him early in the game, but did not later. That is why Andrei commented on the potency of his blood being greater. The 'sire' decapitated by the Sheriff was a mindwiped dupe. The real sire is now hanging out with Jack and Caine the Cabby.

If they stuck to the rules as written then Grünfeld Bach would have made you his bitch

That entirely depends on how high was high True Faith.

 

[Maculo]

Interesting, I assumed that the PC's power was due to the "will of the blood" referenced by Caine at the end of the game, rather than the sire's actual generation. I thought that would be fitting that there is yet another force or hierarchy beyond the generation tier system that the vampires were completely ignorant about.

 

[alyvain]

IMO, these inconsistencies urge everyone to rethink exactly how truthful Troika's adaptation of WoD was instead of going for half-cooked theories. I honestly believe that writers went like "fuck this shit, let's just make some cryptic remarks about his blood power growing", any other explanation is simply wishful thinking

 

[Delterius]

any other explanation is simply wishful thinking

caine did it