Warhammer Warhammer 40,000: Rogue Trader - turn-based Warhammer 40k RPG from Owlcat Games - Void Shadows DLC coming August 8th

[Fedora Master]

Aaaaand Ch4 is broken. The bridge crew stands around, not returning to their actual posts and events won't fire. Great job Owlscat. Amazing.

 

[ArchAngel]

Who THE FUCK designed Ulfar? I mean seriously. He has Second Skin, which works with Medium Armor, which he will never ever even wear.

A retard.

Build him as a Soldier/Archmilitant: he's an inferior Argenta with half of his stats wrong, half of his talents wrong, crappy equipment. He can work but he does exactly the same thing as Argenta, only shittier. Also, Dogmatic, so redundant.

Get Toybox, rebuild him as a Warrior/Archmilitant or Warrior/Vanguard. Now he does exactly the same thing as Abelard, he's only inferior to him. Not even rebuilding him from the ground up can salvage him from the in-built maluses that he has. Between the space, the shitty equipment lock-outs, the horrid starting stats and ..... he doesn't even have the blessing of a "origin" that could give him something, he has the generic Death World or something that gives him bonuses on primitive axes an' shit, things he can't even use.

Ulfar has been probably sent to the Expanse to die being the runt of the litter, an embarassment to Russ and the Emperor.

You made him worse lol. Vanguards are shitty. My Ulfgar tanks in melee, kicks enemies down and then uses Concentrated fire to MultiMelta or Plasma pistol area overcharge (I got him that one recently) whole groups to death.
I could give him Argenta's Heavy Bolter instead and he would be almost as good. He uses Heavy Stubber but that one has worse Armor pen and worse talents.

 

[Harthwain]

What is literally the point of this talent? I can't select it on any character.

Sounds like something for the Rogue Trader psyker. Some equipment requires Unsanctioned Psyker. But can Sanctioned Psyker Unsanction himself?

BTW, I really, really hate this generic ass opening.

Screw the opening. The entire role-playing aspect of the game is virtually non-existent. Some people shit on Disco Elysium, but at least it had a ton of reactivity that depended on your build, even with all the fallings inherent to a heavily-narrated storytelling.

He explains it, maybe you failed a skill check in conversation. He says he has ability to eat flesh of his enemies and learn information from it. So he was killing xenos and gathering info to come up with a real plan to get away.

That sounds... really stupid.

 

[Cyberarmy]

Who THE FUCK designed Ulfar? I mean seriously. He has Second Skin, which works with Medium Armor, which he will never ever even wear.

Just like any other late game companion Owlcat designed TBH. Even mid game ones, like Sosiel, are not safe from bad builds, they "fixed" him after a year I think. And his brother Trevor is even worse, useless beyond normal difficulty. Still not fixed.
Then there is Kestoglyr, an undead companion came very late in the game, is level 3 and customizable to an extent. Much more then Greybore or other undead companions.

 

[Zariusz]

How do Owlcat expansions generally work? Are they making alternative acts that lead to new endings, completly separate adventures that you can access mid game, post ending scenarios where we can import our characters or make new ones? While i didnt had any interest in their other titles, even i noticed that they kept pumping DLCs for WotR so i wonder what stuff i should expect from them here.

 

[Fedora Master]

Who THE FUCK designed Ulfar? I mean seriously. He has Second Skin, which works with Medium Armor, which he will never ever even wear.

Just like any other late game companion Owlcat designed TBH. Even mid game ones, like Sosiel, are not safe from bad builds, they "fixed" him after a year I think. And his brother Trevor is even worse, useless beyond normal difficulty. Still not fixed.
Then there is Kestoglyr, an undead companion came very late in the game, is level 3 and customizable to an extent. Much more then Greybore or other undead companions.

And we know they can design characters, enemies in Kingmaker and Wrath don't have these problems.

The entire role-playing aspect of the game is virtually non-existent.

Yep, very sub-standard for Owlcat.

 

[ArchAngel]

You guys complain about quests and narrative but I am not a storyfag like you. I play games for combat, it is why I never complained about "too much" combat in their previous games. I got over 1000h in Path of Exile and over 2000h in various Diablo like games.

And as such I am not enjoying this combat from Act 3 and onwards (Act 4 balance is already worse, I can already imagine how Act 5 will be stupid)
All combat is enemy gets initiative and wipes one or more of your guys with broken burst fire (90% of cases) before they get to act. And if they do not you wipe them out in 2 turns.
There is no fun tactics or strategy around this shit.
At best you can leave everyone behind and trigger combat with one guy, put that one in high cover and pray he lives 1st turn, worst case is you just lost one and if it is Ulfar he comes back in turn 3 to finish up the stragglers.
But then you get battles where they forcibly move you into area, the spawn enemies with burst fire all around and give them initiative.. such fun and tactical gameplay..
Owlcat_Eyler
I really hope your designers have any plans to balance this stupid system as this is not making me want to finish or replay the game in the future.
It was fun in Act 1 and 2 where nobody was one shotting anyone and battles lasted for 5 turns but this is now just bad and stupid

 

[Dayyālu]

I play games for combat

See, there's not much to discuss about combat. Apparently this is the FOURTH version of their system, and it is fundamentally broken at higher levels. It's essentially "nuke them before they nuke you", the worst practices of tabletop gaming built to be even more obtuse.

All my combat now is essentially focused on making Argenta or Cassia finish the fight faster. All the others are accessories. This is not fun.

Add to that that the "story" gets torpedoed after Chapter 3, the entire narrative becomes schizo: the Imperial Cult guy Doloso in Chapter 4 starts SCREAMING when i enter Footfall IT IS ME I KILLED ALL THE MEMBERS OF THE CHORDA ROGUE TRADER DINASTY AND MINDBROKE THEIR ROGUE TRADER IT WAS ME IT WAS ALL ME, all of this as I enter a public plaza. What the fuck, there are so many chunks of content missing, we're reaching Xenogears levels now.

Probably no-one that isn't playing the game will read this, but KOTOR II feels positively complete compared to what I'm experiencing now in Chapter 4. The entire game is collapsing around itself in a desperate attempt to cobble together something.

How do Owlcat expansions generally work? Are they making alternative acts that lead to new endings, completly separate adventures that you can access mid game, post ending scenarios where we can import our characters or make new ones? While i didnt had any interest in their other titles, even i noticed that they kept pumping DLCs for WotR so i wonder what stuff i should expect from them here.

This game doesn't need an expansion, it needs to be finished. Owlcat has guaranteed that I will never buy another one of its products at full price until the end of time.

 

[Tyranicon]

Owlcat games don't have roleplaying, the story just drags the player around. While the PC might think they have some semblance of power, they really don't and the story just kind of shits on you through the entire game.

Was true for Kingmaker, true for about 50% of Wrath because I couldn't be bothered to finish that crap, is true here.

 

[bayoubilly]

If you decide not to kill all the servitors in act 1, does the bridge crew ever shut up about them? Almost done with act 2 and apparently the only people who feel comfortable issuing commands to a rogue trader are the high lords, the inquistion, and junior officers on your ship. Is that just another QA fail or does that decision ever bear fruit?

 

[likash]

You guys complain about quests and narrative but I am not a storyfag like you. I play games for combat, it is why I never complained about "too much" combat in their previous games. I got over 1000h in Path of Exile and over 2000h in various Diablo like games.

And as such I am not enjoying this combat from Act 3 and onwards (Act 4 balance is already worse, I can already imagine how Act 5 will be stupid)
All combat is enemy gets initiative and wipes one or more of your guys with broken burst fire (90% of cases) before they get to act. And if they do not you wipe them out in 2 turns.
There is no fun tactics or strategy around this shit.
At best you can leave everyone behind and trigger combat with one guy, put that one in high cover and pray he lives 1st turn, worst case is you just lost one and if it is Ulfar he comes back in turn 3 to finish up the stragglers.
But then you get battles where they forcibly move you into area, the spawn enemies with burst fire all around and give them initiative.. such fun and tactical gameplay..
Owlcat_Eyler
I really hope your designers have any plans to balance this stupid system as this is not making me want to finish or replay the game in the future.
It was fun in Act 1 and 2 where nobody was one shotting anyone and battles lasted for 5 turns but this is now just bad and stupid

If you play RPG's for combat then you are special kind of retard. I'd say that you are more retarded than the brainless shooter crowd. At least they stay in their lane.

 

[Dayyālu]

If you decide not to kill all the servitors in act 1, does the bridge crew ever shut up about them? Almost done with act 2 and apparently the only people who feel comfortable issuing commands to a rogue trader are the high lords, the inquistion, and junior officers on your ship. Is that just another QA fail or does that decision ever bear fruit?

The "ambient" interactions never, ever stop, not even when it's explained from where the disturbances come from.

Q U A L I T Y

And don't worry, they add randomly more shit to make your Bridge experience even more garish. The fucking Imperial Cult memorabilia I got would make a Frateris Miles bleed from the eyes.

 

[AwesomeButton]

I play games for combat

See, there's not much to discuss about combat. Apparently this is the FOURTH version of their system, and it is fundamentally broken at higher levels. It's essentially "nuke them before they nuke you", the worst practices of tabletop gaming built to be even more obtuse.

All my combat now is essentially focused on making Argenta or Cassia finish the fight faster. All the others are accessories. This is not fun.

Add to that that the "story" gets torpedoed after Chapter 3, the entire narrative becomes schizo: the Imperial Cult guy Doloso in Chapter 4 starts SCREAMING when i enter Footfall IT IS ME I KILLED ALL THE MEMBERS OF THE CHORDA ROGUE TRADER DINASTY AND MINDBROKE THEIR ROGUE TRADER IT WAS ME IT WAS ALL ME, all of this as I enter a public plaza. What the fuck, there are so many chunks of content missing, we're reaching Xenogears levels now.

Probably no-one that isn't playing the game will read this, but KOTOR II feels positively complete compared to what I'm experiencing now in Chapter 4. The entire game is collapsing around itself in a desperate attempt to cobble together something.

How do Owlcat expansions generally work? Are they making alternative acts that lead to new endings, completly separate adventures that you can access mid game, post ending scenarios where we can import our characters or make new ones? While i didnt had any interest in their other titles, even i noticed that they kept pumping DLCs for WotR so i wonder what stuff i should expect from them here.

This game doesn't need an expansion, it needs to be finished. Owlcat has guaranteed that I will never buy another one of its products at full price until the end of time.

I've been thinking something very similar with regard to this game. In forum discussions we are often asked to overlook simplistic narratives in RPGs because supposedly the story is just a vehicle for some supposed stellar RPG gameplay.

Then when it turns out that the RPG systems are unbalaced and untested to the point of the game being unfinished system-wise, the question surfaces what's supposed to be a player's motivaton to continue past the mid game or even past the initial ~20-30 hours.

 

[Tyranicon]

I've been thinking something very similar with regard to this game. In forum discussions we are often asked to overlook simplistic narratives in RPGs because supposedly the story is just a vehicle for some supposed stellar RPG gameplay.

Then when it turns out that the RPG systems are unbalaced and untested to the point of the game being unfinished system-wise, the question surfaces what's supposed to be a player's motivaton to continue past the mid game or even past the initial ~20-30 hours.

Why the fuck would anyone play something with this much text if the text is shit?

 

[Dishonoredbr]

Warhammer 40,000: Rogue Trader Dev Discusses Future Plans And Cut Content

 

[Mortmal]

40 hours in, and I am still in Chapter 2. There are RPGs that end way before that amount of hours. Clearly, they have not been given enough time. Baldur's Gate 3 took many years, and the last act was not in good shape at release. So, there's no way Owlcat's game can possibly be in good shape with such a low amount of development time. Then, they get trapped by making their own RPG system, once again reinventing the wheel when a well-tried simple D20-like system or copying the PnP game could have worked. So, Archangel says past Act 3 it's a one-shot in the first round. Well, I could already finish fights in two rounds in Act 2 with Officer's Chain giving extra turns and extra mp to Argenta or Cassia, with the modifiers' bloat, with Cassia's Archmilitant Versatility adding up. It's possible to devastate the battlefield so fast.

 

[Zariusz]

Warhammer 40,000: Rogue Trader Dev Discusses Future Plans And Cut Content

Question: Aside from the restrictions on “romance” in Rogue Trader for reasons you have mentioned a few times, what other features were you unable to implement in the game?

Shestov: Compared to the original plan, a sufficient number of systems and content were cut from the game at different stages. Here are some examples: the use of military vehicles, mass battles, craftworld, a full-fledged system of morality and fear like in the desktop prototype, changing the voidship, decorating the voidship, the production of goods and items in a trading empire, the trading system itself.

So they cut trading... from the Rogue Trader...
Not to mention gutting voidships... lol just lol. This decision was probably made quite late in development since ship list from character creation menu looks like it was supposed to be a lot bigger, and that decision to restrict the unique looking ship to DLC and enforcing some generic ass ship on everyone else is just...

 

[Shaki]

Warhammer 40,000: Rogue Trader Dev Discusses Future Plans And Cut Content

Question: What were some of the major challenges you encountered while creating Rogue Trader?

Shestov: Volume and detail. The game came out noticeably larger than initially planned, primarily because, at each moment, we found individual elements of the setting that required additional disclosure in the environment, narrative, and mechanics.

Just another proof that Owlcat really need a strong hand, to keep the scope of their games in check. I really doubt they ever plan to make a 120+ hours long epic fucking RPG with multiple paths in 2 years, but that's always where they end up, and it's a big problem.

Combat system. We did not have a direct reference that could be used one-to-one in Rogue Trader, neither among tabletop RPGs nor among video games. What players got in the game was the fourth iteration of the mechanics.

Oh boy, I'd like them to release details of the previous iterations at some point, if this is the fourth then I really would like to see first one, must've been a fucking monstrosity

 

[Dishonoredbr]

Oh boy, I'd like them to release details of the previous iterations at some point, if this is the fourth then I really would like to see first one, must've been a fucking monstrosity

They had to rework Operative 3 times between Alpha , Beta and Full Release alone.

 

[Rhobar121]

Warhammer 40,000: Rogue Trader Dev Discusses Future Plans And Cut Content

Question: What were some of the major challenges you encountered while creating Rogue Trader?

Shestov: Volume and detail. The game came out noticeably larger than initially planned, primarily because, at each moment, we found individual elements of the setting that required additional disclosure in the environment, narrative, and mechanics.

Just another proof that Owlcat really need a strong hand, to keep the scope of their games in check. I really doubt they ever plan to make a 120+ hours long epic fucking RPG with multiple paths in 2 years, but that's always where they end up, and it's a big problem.

Combat system. We did not have a direct reference that could be used one-to-one in Rogue Trader, neither among tabletop RPGs nor among video games. What players got in the game was the fourth iteration of the mechanics.

Oh boy, I'd like them to release details of the previous iterations at some point, if this is the fourth then I really would like to see first one, must've been a fucking monstrosity

It's funny they had 4 iterations and none of them worked.
I have the impression that they would be able to ruin even such a simple system as 5e.
For now, if it continues like this, Owlcat will end up like Obsidian or worse like Black Isle.

 

[Shaki]

Oh boy, I'd like them to release details of the previous iterations at some point, if this is the fourth then I really would like to see first one, must've been a fucking monstrosity

They had to rework Operative 3 times between Alpha , Beta and Full Release alone.

They should just hire one of the autists playing their games, it seems they lack people who actually know how combat and character building should work, with Pathfinders a lot of their work was already done by PnP, they just had to implement it, but here where the changes required were bigger, the incompetence is really showing. It's like they don't have anyone who actually is into this shit, and instead have some blue haired storyfag trying to guess what people actually liked about Pathfinders system and how to recreate that. I feel like any autist who's into the buildfaggotry in these games, given full creative freedom could easily redo this system and make it 10x better in few weeks.

 

[Jermu]

There are no children in the game, no torture, no genocide or suicide.

I knew it even devs did not play this game

Among the sources of inspiration were Last Spell, XCom, Jagged Alias, Wasteland, Battlefleet Gothic, Mechanicus, and – as with any project in our studio – the golden fund of classic RPGs.

 

[Dayyālu]

Why the fuck would anyone play something with this much text if the text is shit?

The writing is functional. There's no vomit dialogue like Wrath. The problem is that the developments are utterly retarded, make no sense, and characters act like utter morons. Then you reach Chapter 4 and the game bursts from the seams and nothing makes sense anymore, things happen because they need to happen. The vast majority of Chapter 4 content outside the Main Quest is dumped on you with the Rumours mechanic, and of course it's broken and doesn't register what you checked and what you did not.

Not to mention gutting voidships... lol just lol.

The interface is already a spoiler, but your ship is supposedly a Big Deal and then you find the rival Rogue Traders having Cruisers an' shit. They could have at least have some decency and give us a Cruiser.

I knew it even devs did not play this game

The management must be utterly retarded. Utterly. Again, I'd pay to see what were the first versions of the combat system, what we got is the retarded child of Dark Heresy and Bloatmaster 40k.

Hell, if they followed slavishly Dark Heresy they would have a better system: it has problems but it's not utterly broken.

 

[Dishonoredbr]

It seems we won't see a new pathfinder game from their from a long time. They all but confirmed their next game is Warhammer related.

Shestov: Warhammer is so voluminous and multifaceted that stories in it can be told endlessly. We already have an idea of the next story we want to tell the world, but any details on this issue are still premature.

 

[Parsimonious cook]

Fuck Pathfinder, fuck D&D. Warhammer is love, Warhammer is life.