Star Wars Was KOTOR even worth a play?

[KörangarTheMighty]

KOTOR doesn't follow this philosophy. What's the impact of choosing to give the rakghoul serum to Davik instead of the clinic? What's the impact of having high intelligence or wisdom when talking to somebody? Beyond just picking a reward for quests and what role you play in combat, KOTORs C&C may as well be non-existant because the world is inflexible, static.

Maybe I'm just forgetting something obvious but of the Black Isle games that I played to completion (Both BGs and IWDs), I didn't see any deep or long-reaching consequences to practically anything. It is true that occasionally you got to flex a stat that wasn't persuade, rarely you had class-specific quests, but ultimately whatever it was resolved on the spot just the same. KotOR had a few instances where some of your choices changed certain things in the game. Certain NPCs would show up on other planets if you elected to save/spare them, but they were admittedly dick-deep into the game and few people ever see that content. I do wish it had some more class reactivity though, and that would be an area that a hypothetical remake could improve greatly upon, especially on Taris which is the portion of the game that actually has the most obvious differences in playstyle for the classes.

 

[luj1]

BioWare was making good games, once

NWN and KotOR were their last good games in my opinion.

 

[__scribbles__]

Maybe I'm just forgetting something obvious but of the Black Isle games that I played to completion (Both BGs and IWDs), I didn't see any deep or long-reaching consequences to practically anything.

I was referring more to Fallout/Planescape: Torment and less to Baldur's Gate/Icewind Dale, though they're all Black Isle games. Sorry for the confusion! Perphaps Black Isle/Troika would be a bit more accurate.

KotOR had a few instances where some of your choices changed certain things in the game. Certain NPCs would show up on other planets if you elected to save/spare them, but they were admittedly dick-deep into the game and few people ever see that content.

I don't recall seeing this in my playthrough. What would be the instances in which this happens?

I do wish it had some more class reactivity though, and that would be an area that a hypothetical remake could improve greatly upon, especially on Taris which is the portion of the game that actually has the most obvious differences in playstyle for the classes.

Agreed.

 

[BosanskiSeljak]

KOTOR is just comfortable Star Wars fun, like said previously, nothing earth shattering but definitely not bad. Very close to a video game equivalent of fast food.

Taris, Dantooine, Tatooine, Kashyyy, Manaan were all solid, there really isn't anything to complain about them. The only truly bad part of the game is the gameplay section of the Star Forge.

100% worth a play even if you end up not liking it, those saying otherwise are trying too hard to be unique and quirky.

 

[KörangarTheMighty]

I don't recall seeing this in my playthrough. What would be the instances in which this happens?

Yuthura Ban for one goes to Dantooine and rejoins the Jedi, typically most players will never see this because they don't do Korriban early enough before... well, you know.
If you kill Juhani, Belaya the stuck-up Jedi girl on Dantooine will turn up on Korriban as a Sith and try to enact vengeance upon you for doing it.
Another one was Sharina Fizark, the girl who you buy the Wraid plate from out of charity on the streets Tatooine, she likewise moves to Dantooine with the money you gave her. (This one is restored via a mod now that I think on it. Fully voiced, just forgotten in the game's files for whatever reason.)

I may be missing a couple, but those are the ones I remember off the top of my head.

Edit: As an aside, there are also a few NPCs scattered on some of the planets that will mention "current events" that you've been responsible for if you visit them during certain times of the game lending to the illusion that things aren't entirely static. IIRC, the weird looking Alien merchant in the hanger on Tatooine is one of them and I think some of the Czerka guys on Korriban as well will make mention of Kashyyyk being lost if that's the road you take.

 

[Frozen]

Kotor will always have right atmosphere because of great music and good (for its time) visuals. It has Star Wars feel. Its juvenile but so is original Star Wars. It's not content originally intended for grownup losers but for kids.

Actually, second one is worse because story is pretentious stupidity. There is no actual depth in Kotor 2 story, it's just like when edgy teen discovers philosophy and thinks he has all the answers, even more cringe than original.

 

[Butter]

Actually, second one is worse because story is pretentious stupidity. There is no actual depth in Kotor 2 story, it's just like when edgy teen discovers philosophy and thinks he has all the answers, even more cringe than original.

It's pure adolescent pretention thinking it's clever for deconstructing something. Rian Johnson probably loves KotOR 2.

 

[Frozen]

I don't even think about that part but in short, story of Kotor II is, Revan teacher turned evil to train you to fight evil LEL

And it's all dressed in fancy edgy wording that sounds cool if you are under 20

Teen Star Wars is far worse than kids Star Wars.

 

[Frozen]

Also, what Rian Johnson did was not deconstruction of SW, if that's what he wanted he just show how shitty of writer and director he is. Nor is Kotor 2.

By the end of that movie everything is in place as before- empire are the comical bad guys, rebellion the good guys.

Closest thing to deconstruction of SW was that Battlefront remake single player campaign, but only up until half of it when they chicken out and everything goes to same place.

Real deconstruction and mature take would be to present Rebels as terrorists and Empire as not 100% evil comical villains. Maybe Andor tried that, don't know haven't watched it.

 

[Eirinjas]

I don't even think about that part but in short, story of Kotor II is, Revan teacher turned evil to train you to fight evil LEL

And it's all dressed in fancy edgy wording that sounds cool if you are under 20

Teen Star Wars is far worse than kids Star Wars.

Been a while since I played KOTOR II, but if memory serves me, Kreia wanted to sever the Force from the universe because she felt it enslaved people and was a constant source of misery. She believed that no one could be truly free so long as the Will of the Force guided the actions of individuals. That is hardly juvenile stuff. Nowhere in any of the other Star Wars media that I have been exposed to has this ever been explored, but it's right there in the first movie when Ben Kenobi tells Luke that the Force "controls your actions".

 

[Serious_Business]

I fucking hate Bioware games, Reddit in the extreme.

I have no idea what that meant, but it was nice, I liked it. In the extreme.

 

[JarlFrank]

Maybe I'm just forgetting something obvious but of the Black Isle games that I played to completion (Both BGs and IWDs), I didn't see any deep or long-reaching consequences to practically anything.

I was referring more to Fallout/Planescape: Torment and less to Baldur's Gate/Icewind Dale, though they're all Black Isle games. Sorry for the confusion! Perphaps Black Isle/Troika would be a bit more accurate.

BG was published, not developed by Black Isle.

BG 1 and 2 were made by Bioware.
Black Isle was a division of Interplay which made RPGs. Interplay published Bioware's games under that label.
Bioware in turn licensed their engine to Black Isle.
Black Isle developed PST and IWD.

 

[Dr1f7]

yea kotor 1 has bastilla and shes a total babe
i think kotor 2 was made by a different team, bunch of cringe weirdo incels with granny obsession so it has no good hoes so consensus is skip that one

 

[Frozen]

I don't even think about that part but in short, story of Kotor II is, Revan teacher turned evil to train you to fight evil LEL

And it's all dressed in fancy edgy wording that sounds cool if you are under 20

Teen Star Wars is far worse than kids Star Wars.

Been a while since I played KOTOR II, but if memory serves me, Kreia wanted to sever the Force from the universe because she felt it enslaved people and was a constant source of misery. She believed that no one could be truly free so long as the Will of the Force guided the actions of individuals. That is hardly juvenile stuff. Nowhere in any of the other Star Wars media that I have been exposed to has this ever been explored, but it's right there in the first movie when Ben Kenobi tells Luke that the Force "controls your actions".

It's just hollow cringe mumbo-jumbo. It pretends to say something but has really nothing to say. Going in that road of nit-picking terminology and thinking its deep to question Jedi philosophy at its basics doesn't understand symbolism of original Star Wars.

Even Lucas did not understand it with his prequel trash, no Jospeh Campbell or his wife to save him again.

If Kotor II really wanted to subvert expectations as title says- Sith Lords, then Exile should be evil-you just decide how evil, and story of the game should justify that evil. Story as it is, it's just stupid emo cringe.

 

[PorkyThePaladin]

Remember when the world was young,
Before it all had turned to dung
Two doctors made a pretty game
And role playing Renaissance then came
And on an island devoid of light
Three men and their apprentice bright
Churned out three games to rule the lists
Oh how fate's irony sublimely twists
A mere two score years from then
Their descendants on corpses stand
For though the legends sowed the seeds
The present harvest is Honey, I shrunk the Kids
And Outer Turds, and Inner Ass (Effect),
It's best to leave the past in the past.

 

[gurugeorge]

KOTOR is a good once you get off Taris. That opening is a slog. The overall story is pretty good. The game mechanics regarding the force, light side/dark side, and lightsaber configurations were solid. There is no lack of character interaction. The NPCs were memorable. HK-47 had some gut-busting lines, easily my favorite character of the series. And the way the game crescendos feels appropriately like a Star Wars epic. The end boss fight was satisfying. KOTOR II is a better game in some ways, but the boss fights felt like a letdown compared to the first.

This is the correct opinion.

 

[MerchantKing]

Remember when the world was young,
Before it all had turned to dung
Two doctors made a pretty game
And role playing Renaissance then came
And on an island devoid of light
Three men and their apprentice bright
Churned out three games to rule the lists
Oh how fate's irony sublimely twists
A mere two score years from then
Their descendants on corpses stand
For though the legends sowed the seeds
The present harvest is Honey, I shrunk the Kids
And Outer Turds, and Inner Ass (Effect),
It's best to leave the past in the past.

It's like you gave up on the rhyming scheme halfway through.

 

[BosanskiSeljak]

KOTOR is a good once you get off Taris. That opening is a slog. The overall story is pretty good. The game mechanics regarding the force, light side/dark side, and lightsaber configurations were solid. There is no lack of character interaction. The NPCs were memorable. HK-47 had some gut-busting lines, easily my favorite character of the series. And the way the game crescendos feels appropriately like a Star Wars epic. The end boss fight was satisfying. KOTOR II is a better game in some ways, but the boss fights felt like a letdown compared to the first.

This is the correct opinion.

No, Taris best planet. That is the correct opinion.

 

[Skinwalker]

Kotor1 was worth a single play. Kotor2 is worth replaying multiple times.

 

[NecroLord]

KOTOR is a good once you get off Taris. That opening is a slog. The overall story is pretty good. The game mechanics regarding the force, light side/dark side, and lightsaber configurations were solid. There is no lack of character interaction. The NPCs were memorable. HK-47 had some gut-busting lines, easily my favorite character of the series. And the way the game crescendos feels appropriately like a Star Wars epic. The end boss fight was satisfying. KOTOR II is a better game in some ways, but the boss fights felt like a letdown compared to the first.

This is the correct opinion.

No, Taris best planet. That is the correct opinion.

I like Tattooine for the sake of tradition, it is an important planet in Star Wars, after all.
Korriban is especially difficult if it is your first planet.
Manaan is also pretty cool.

 

[BosanskiSeljak]

I like Tattooine for the sake of tradition, it is an important planet in Star Wars, after all.
Korriban is especially difficult if it is your first planet.
Manaan is also pretty cool.

I enjoyed all of the planets in KOTOR but with Taris being the longest out of all, it worked. I actually felt like I was getting settled in there, while the others felt more like "in and out". I would've loved to stay longer on Tattooine or Manaan.

 

[Ryzer]

BioWare was making good games, once

NWN and KotOR were their last good games in my opinion.

Dragons age Origins is better than NWN by quite a high margin but the toolset is nowhere near as powerful.

 

[janior]

KOTOR 2 is a certified hood classic and a must play

 

[NecroLord]

Name your favorite class combos:
Kotor - Scout 5 /Guardian 15. Free implant feats and the BAB of a Guardian will let you potentially steamroll Malak with a high Str score.

Kotor 2 - Consular 15 /Jedi Weaponmaster (or Marauder if Dark Side). Additional force powers AND strong melee combat capability provided by the Weaponmaster/Marauder feats and Light Side/Dark Side Maximum Alignment. Crazy powerful, with the ability to both buff and debuff AND destroy enemies in melee...

 

[Camel]

Yes.
KotOR is classic SW game. If you can ignore dated graphics and sometimes childish writing it provides great SW experience far better than the movie sequel trilogy. KotOR 2 is a classic with endgame ruined by Obsidian accepting an extremely short time frame to develop the game.

Kotor 2 - Consular 15 /Jedi Weaponmaster (or Marauder if Dark Side). Additional force powers AND strong melee combat capability provided by the Weaponmaster/Marauder feats and Light Side/Dark Side Maximum Alignment. Crazy powerful, with the ability to both buff and debuff AND destroy enemies in melee...

Consular 15 with Jedi Master/Sith Lord 5 is enough to electrocute all mobs with Force lightning. The game is far too easy.