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GarfunkeL

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now that I think of it, if this also prevents you from firing at other enemies who AREN'T close, then this is actually a pretty cool/interesting mechanic. "Sniper engagement".

It could block sniping, but then the rifle should have another firing mode (from the hip, or something) that still can be used, even if it is ineffective.
You know there's a reason why snipers carry a pistol, SMG or a carbine with them. When you have a high-powered scope system attached, you lose the use of iron sights in most gun-scope combinations. And shooting from the hip with a weapon that's not full-auto is completely pointless.
 

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now that I think of it, if this also prevents you from firing at other enemies who AREN'T close, then this is actually a pretty cool/interesting mechanic. "Sniper engagement".
It could block sniping, but then the rifle should have another firing mode (from the hip, or something) that still can be used, even if it is ineffective.
You know there's a reason why snipers carry a pistol, SMG or a carbine with them.
Apparently it is because they are physically unable to fire their sniper rifles when an enemy is too close, not because firing said sniper rifles would be ineffective.
 
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Not only does this limitation on rifle range seems silly to me, it is also easy to imagine a scenario where you would want to use the sniper rifle in close quarters instead of a pistol or an SMG. What if you come up against some heavily armored enemy, and only your sniper rifle has a chance to penetrate and do damage? Why not let the player take an unaimed shot with large penalty instead of forcing him to use ineffective weapons? But no, instead one moment you can reliably hit your opponent, then he moves one meter towards you and suddenly you cannot shoot at him at all? Seriously, why not just copy the way JA2 1.13 deals with this and be done with it. For that matter, do that for the rest of the combat system as well.
 
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What I'm saying is give me a choice of how I'm going to fight my battles - don't hide the choice behind some mechanic that doesn't make sense. You can still use a scoped weapon even if the target is too close - just point the barrel in the approximate direction of the enemy and pull the trigger. Hell, the rifle might have iron sights you can use instead. Don't just disable my weapon if the target is 1 meter inside some boundary.
 

undecaf

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Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2
A minimum range (say, four or five tiles) and an increasing penalty by tile when closing in could do the trick. With low skill the to-hit chance could even go negative (posing additional penalties). Didn't Fallout handle it somewhat similiarly? I thought it felt pretty organic and believable there.
 

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What if your weapon is one meter long?

sniper_iraq_50cal_800.jpg
specwarnetcom50pic.jpg
 

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I doubt Wasteland 2 snipers will be using the rifles shown above. I would rather expect something like these:

M24-Sniper.jpg

800px-Army_sniper_team_Afghanistan.jpg

images
 
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As a former M-24 sniper in the army i can assure you:
In real life, if someone attacks you in a close range there's no way in hell you can use your sniper rifle!
And if you try to shot someone close to you with M-24 than probably you'll die while trying to position the barrel between you and your enemy, while he fuck you up with a blunt hit to the head.

So i think, the decision to disable the use of a sniper rifle in a close range is pure realistic decision and a good one!!!

p.s. in the picture above - M-24: length approximately 1 meter.
 

Roguey

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Not only does this limitation on rifle range seems silly to me, it is also easy to imagine a scenario where you would want to use the sniper rifle in close quarters instead of a pistol or an SMG. What if you come up against some heavily armored enemy, and only your sniper rifle has a chance to penetrate and do damage? Why not let the player take an unaimed shot with large penalty instead of forcing him to use ineffective weapons? But no, instead one moment you can reliably hit your opponent, then he moves one meter towards you and suddenly you cannot shoot at him at all? Seriously, why not just copy the way JA2 1.13 deals with this and be done with it. For that matter, do that for the rest of the combat system as well.
For heavily armored enemies you should use melee or energy weapons.
 

Grotesque

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Divinity: Original Sin Divinity: Original Sin 2
by Johnny Wasabi » May 24th, 2012, 11:01 pm
"Ratboy drew my attention to this subject with his post on another thread: "Scripted time sensitive events - vote"

I thought I'd reply here since there are more participants on this thread. Ratboy was specifically asking about the use of time-based events that happen independent of player location and hence give rise to opportunities to split the party to handle simultaneous events in different locations. Here is my response:

Thanks for bringing this up and sharing your thoughts. Internally we have discussed using the game mechanic of time-based events. I agree it’s an effective mechanic for diversifying the story based on player choices, which is in line with the vision of the game. The mechanic of splitting the party is a separate mechanic but it can complement the time-based event system. This can work well within a level, since we already plan to be able to split the party within a level (i.e. in a contiguous space, say a town that is completely loaded in computer memory).

The time-based mechanic also works fairly easily at a large scale across levels (i.e. as in your example, something happens in town X at time Y whether the player is there or not). However it is a challenge to extend the party-splitting mechanic across levels, and it can create timeline conflicts.

In a multiplayer game (or MMO) different people could control each party member and their actions would occur simultaneously in real-time. But in our single-player game, you would have to time slice control of the party branches (i.e. take turns controlling each of the split groups), or assume default behavior for the one not being controlled.

Time slicing at any reasonable turn-interval leads to the potential timeline conflicts. For example, group 1 could return to group 2 in the middle of a time-span which has already played out for group 2. This could artificially be avoided by just assuming extra time passes when the splinter group enters the same level as the main group so that they always merge at the end of a time-slice turn.

However, the interface challenge remains. You would have a loading delay when transitioning back and forth (loading levels each time). Or we would have to build the levels so two (maybe three) can always fit in memory at once to avoid the loading time during transition. Then there is the matter of how long each turn should be? The longer it is the greater potential for time-loss when merging groups back together (for the timeline matching adjustment).

So there are trade-offs that have to be made to allow party-splitting across levels to work (and some significant implementation labor). At the moment, we think the trade-offs are too big. If we allow party splitting across levels, we currently would opt for default behavior (inaction) of one group. In other words you can split party members off and leave them behind in a level, and continue controlling the main group to other levels, but time passes for all groups while you control the main group, and the non-controlled group(s) are assumed to do nothing (stay put), or perhaps travel back to base. This avoids time conflicts and avoids the jumping back and forth and level loading issue.

This still leaves open the possibility that the mere passive presence of Rangers in a location could change the result of time-based events in a default way. So for example, say you leave behind a couple Rangers in town X while you take the main group to head off a major problem in town Y. The election could be influenced (or delayed) by the presence of the Rangers, even though you don’t control them.

So, yes, it’s a powerful mechanic, and I think it’s something we may adapt to the single-player focus of the game to further the effects of player choice on the unfolding story. Thanks again for your thoughts and suggestions."
 

Brother None

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As a former M-24 sniper in the army i can assure you:
In real life, if someone attacks you in a close range there's no way in hell you can use your sniper rifle!
And if you try to shot someone close to you with M-24 than probably you'll die while trying to position the barrel between you and your enemy, while he fuck you up with a blunt hit to the head.

So i think, the decision to disable the use of a sniper rifle in a close range is pure realistic decision and a good one!!!
This is pretty much what it is now, but like any mechanic it can be tweaked still while testing or during beta, but to clarify, it can't be used in melee range (adjacent square), it gets a penalty but can still be used in close ranges.
 

Outlander

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Divinity: Original Sin Wasteland 2 Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag.
What if you come up against some heavily armored enemy, and only your sniper rifle has a chance to penetrate and do damage?

Maybe in a 100+ years, when you'll be going up against terminators and battlemechs.

don't hide the choice behind some mechanic that doesn't make sense. You can still use a scoped weapon even if the target is too close - just point the barrel in the approximate direction of the enemy and pull the trigger. Hell, the rifle might have iron sights you can use instead. Don't just disable my weapon if the target is 1 meter inside some boundary.

Dismounting the scope to use the iron sights when an enemy is 1 meter away not only doesn't make sense, it'll get you killed. You can probably shoot it 'from the hip' once, that is, if he got you by surprise and you miraculously survived for 2 or 3 seconds.

Also most games forget excrement management, I always wanted to play a fighter that gets a huge urge to take a dump in the middle of firefight.

Seconded.

If you are in the 'middle of firefight' there's really nothing to manage, you just go in your pants if you really can't hold it and focus on staying alive.
 
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Dismounting the scope to use the iron sights when an enemy is 1 meter away not only doesn't make sense, it'll get you killed. You can probably shoot it 'from the hip' once, that is, if he got you by surprise and you miraculously survived for 2 or 3 seconds.
No, I meant if the gun has usable sights that can be used while the scope is still on. Doesn't matter anyway because from what Brother None said this mechanic is nowhere near as limiting as I though it would be. I thought you wouldn't even be able to use rifles on indoor maps.
 

St. Toxic

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If you are in the 'middle of firefight' there's really nothing to manage, you just go in your pants if you really can't hold it and focus on staying alive.

A constipation trait might give one interesting combat bonuses though. And what about various types of shit, creating different combat situations? Diarrhea would have a lesser impact on your character's mobility than solids, and a smelly shit might reveal your position while in stealth.
 

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