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Wasteland Wasteland 2 Thread - Director's Cut

Phage

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Weird, I have the special skill on my backer page, but no mention of backer portraits.
 

Phage

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Weird, I have the special skill on my backer page, but no mention of backer portraits.

Did you pledge $30 and up? (not including Codex fundraiser)

Nah, I was an EARLY BIRD!

To be fair, despite my bitching across numerous posts, I do feel the game is totally worth the $15 I threw down and I feel good knowing that's paving the way for Torment 2.
 

Blaine

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Grab the Codex by the pussy
This game is fucking amazing. I have no idea what anyone's complaining about.

Well, I do know what they're complaining about, and it's really stupid. Someone let the toad kill one of their dudes in the tutorial mission and got mad. Someone tried to dig up a town's recently-departed leader, then got mad when nearby townsfolk who already don't trust the Rangers attacked. You have to do a lot of reading and keep a sharp eye out to know what's going on, and there are no quest markers, which is guaranteed to make some people mad. It's not Fallout® 3 with the Mothership Zeta™ DLC, and you can't bumble into combat and use an invulnerable slo-mo function to immediately win each battle, and I can definitely understand why people are mad about that.

I found a Top Hat clothing item recently. I really think it should be included in default character creation clothing, since there are at two portraits (including a backer-exclusive portrait) that incorporate top hats. It's nice to be able to match models with portraits, even if only approximately.

Only females have a yellow mining hat or gas masks, for example, but the portrait of a guy in thick raggy armor wearing a yellow mining hat and a gas mask is for males only. I feel like schizophrenic monkeys were in charge of organizing the character creation bits and pieces. :lol:

There are a lot of missing, mismatched, overlooked, and even duplicate bits and pieces in character creation in general.
 

Grunker

RPG Codex Ghost
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It's not Fallout® 3 with the Mothership Zeta™ DLC

0/10 shit game, didn't read the rest of your post

How are you finding combat so far Blaine? It's my main complaint currently, but I haven't played enough to tell whether I'm just a prejudgmental asshat. Rest is dandy.
 
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kain30

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This game is fucking amazing. I have no idea what anyone's complaining about.

Well, I do know what they're complaining about, and it's really stupid. Someone let the toad kill one of their dudes in the tutorial mission and got mad. Someone tried to dig up a town's recently-departed leader, then got mad when nearby townsfolk who already don't trust the Rangers attacked. You have to do a lot of reading and keep a sharp eye out to know what's going on, and there are no quest markers, which is guaranteed to make some people mad. It's not Fallout® 3 with the Mothership Zeta™ DLC, and you can't bumble into combat and use an invulnerable slo-mo function to immediately win each battle, and I can definitely understand why people are mad about that.
amen brother!. "gamers" don´t want a challenge anymore...:negative:
 

Blaine

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How are you finding combat so far Blaine? It's my main complaint currently, but I haven't played enough to tell whether I'm just a prejudgmental asshat.

It's pretty damned good. It's not JA2 or TFTD, but it's enjoyable and rewarding, and your team's positioning, choice of gear/skills, and tactics do matter.

Hey, do you remember Arcanum? Do you remember the combat in that game? Yeah? What the fuck were you expecting, here? Fuck's sake, the combat in a cRPG just not being total shit is a rare accomplishment. Wasteland 2's combat is eminently playable, and best of all, it's old skool enough to troll nineteen-year-old console morons who've been trained to expect victory on a platter.

I'd call WL2's combat about as serviceable as Fallout's combat overall, though in different ways. Actually, I think it's probably superior in a tactical sense.

Edit: Different marching formations are sorely needed. I don't mind creeping up to the enemy and then fervently arranging my dudes as best I can before either being spotted or firing the first shot myself, but the gridiron huddle crap is ridiculous.
 
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Grunker

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Hey, do you remember Arcanum? Do you remember the combat in that game?

What's your point?

What the fuck were you expecting

Any sort of tactical variety, really. Like I said, just the most basic different maneuvers or something would do. As is, it seems more basic than even Conquistador, and that was the most basic of the basic.

Still, I like the planning that goes into some encounters, at least.

I'd call WL2's combat about as serviceable as Fallout's combat overall, though in different ways.

You'd call Fallout combat "servicable"? Well, I guess that's where we differ then.

Wasteland's combat is definetely tighter, but it lacks even the most basic options that even Fallout has. Anyway, I was just curious.
 

Blaine

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Bro, I have a fucking doctorate in Fallout at this point, with at least three dozen collective playthroughs of 1 and 2 since 1997. I have no idea what you're on about with "the most basic options" that are purportedly missing.

The biggest apparent omission is the lack of wireframe aimed shots. WL2 has a few features the Fallouts didn't even have though, like ambush, take a knee, and uh... fuck, what was it? A couple other things.
 

Grunker

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The biggest apparent omission is the lack of wireframe aimed shots

Well, it's not an "omission" in the sense that Wasteland didn't have them. But any kind of system with tactical options would have been fine as a replacement, if InXile didn't like aimed shots for some reason.

As for "basic options", I was indeed talking about aimed shots. Just some basic options to choose from instead of just clicking attack, moving or using a consumable.
 

circ

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Bro, I have a fucking doctorate in Fallout at this point, with at least three dozen collective playthroughs of 1 and 2 since 1997. I have no idea what you're on about with "the most basic options" that are purportedly missing.

The biggest apparent omission is the lack of wireframe aimed shots. WL2 has a few features the Fallouts didn't even have though, like ambush, take a knee, and uh... fuck, what was it? A couple other things.
I dunno. How about aiming elsewhere than the head.

I wish it had targeting as well made as Jagged Alliance 2. No unnecesarry clicking. Just pick legs, torso or head, clickety click.
 

Phage

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This game is fucking amazing. I have no idea what anyone's complaining about.

Well, I do know what they're complaining about, and it's really stupid. Someone let the toad kill one of their dudes in the tutorial mission and got mad. Someone tried to dig up a town's recently-departed leader, then got mad when nearby townsfolk who already don't trust the Rangers attacked. You have to do a lot of reading and keep a sharp eye out to know what's going on, and there are no quest markers, which is guaranteed to make some people mad. It's not Fallout® 3 with the Mothership Zeta™ DLC, and you can't bumble into combat and use an invulnerable slo-mo function to immediately win each battle, and I can definitely understand why people are mad about that.

Nah, that's not why I'm complaining. I've been whining over a few things:

- Everything takes forever. Dozens upon dozens of skill checks that take like 6 seconds each to perform in each map. Every map also has a shitton of combat encounters that play out quite similarly per region. As a result you have these ridiculously bloated playtimes after covering very little ground.
- Some attributes are fucking useless while others are absolutely mandatory to do well. On that same page, ten quadrillion skills that all do the same thing - this just leads to more micromanagement, not more depth or even complexity.
- Randomized loot. Shit sucks when you think you're so clever for having a lvl 4 safecracker in the AG fungus cave only to open it up and find some junk worth less than what was in an unsecured crate nearby.


Other stuff too.

Having said that I'm kind of compelled to restart my playthrough with further minmaxing so I can go to highpool first (AG center sucked pretty hard) and skip the injun camp aside from maybe picking up the companions there.

So, in that sense, the game is compelling. I really just wish they tightened up balance/character creation and cut down on the ass-rapingly high amount of clicking on shit and watching icons fill up.


I actually haven't had any real difficulty with the game. My AR girl combined with Deth equipped with Famases made everything pretty cake. To be fair, if I were to continue I'd be entering the location where you lose Deth so maybe it'd get tougher.
 

Blaine

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Well, it's not an "omission" in the sense that Wasteland didn't have them. But any kind of system with tactical options would have been fine as a replacement, if InXile didn't like aimed shots for some reason.

As for "basic options", I was indeed talking about aimed shots. Just some basic options to choose from instead of just clicking attack, moving or using a consumable.

I dunno. How about aiming elsewhere than the head.

I wish it had targeting as well made as Jagged Alliance 2. No unnecesarry clicking. Just pick legs, torso or head, clickety click.

Well, this game is highly moddable. Since mere head and body shots constitute a horrible lack of basic options, we'll mod in eye shots, finger shots, hand shots, scalp shots, ear shots, elbow and armpit shots, upper arm shots, forearm shots, shoulder shots, knee shots, crotch shots, butt shots, teeth shots, thigh shots, upper leg shots, foot shots, lower leg shots, and four different quadrants of torso.

Game of the century right there. :5/5:

My experience with aimed shots in the Fallouts especially is either you're an eyeholing turbosniper, or you don't bother (or better yet, get Fast Shot). Classic illusion of choice stuff right there.
 

cvv

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Enjoy the Revolution! Another revolution around the sun that is.
The biggest apparent omission is the lack of wireframe aimed shots

Well, it's not an "omission" in the sense that Wasteland didn't have them. But any kind of system with tactical options would have been fine as a replacement, if InXile didn't like aimed shots for some reason.

As for "basic options", I was indeed talking about aimed shots. Just some basic options to choose from instead of just clicking attack, moving or using a consumable.

ikd, what exactly, smoke/flashbang/chem grenades for example? Would be nice, sure, but it's not like they'd be the difference between a terrible/fantastic combat. As for aimed shots, there's a headshot for assaults/snipers. Used it once, never since. Maybe if inXile changes up the numbers a bit but right now headshots are not worth it.

What would be great tho is a leg shot, to cripple down the freaks who can cross half the map in one turn.
 

Blaine

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- Randomized loot. Shit sucks when you think you're so clever for having a lvl 4 safecracker in the AG fungus cave only to open it up and find some junk worth less than what was in an unsecured crate nearby.

Yeah, the randomized loot definitely blows ass.
 

Grunker

RPG Codex Ghost
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Well, it's not an "omission" in the sense that Wasteland didn't have them. But any kind of system with tactical options would have been fine as a replacement, if InXile didn't like aimed shots for some reason.

As for "basic options", I was indeed talking about aimed shots. Just some basic options to choose from instead of just clicking attack, moving or using a consumable.

I dunno. How about aiming elsewhere than the head.

I wish it had targeting as well made as Jagged Alliance 2. No unnecesarry clicking. Just pick legs, torso or head, clickety click.

Well, this game is highly moddable. Since mere head and body shots constitute a horrible lack of basic options, we'll mod in eye shots, finger shots, hand shots, scalp shots, ear shots, elbow and armpit shots, upper arm shots, forearm shots, shoulder shots, knee shots, crotch shots, butt shots, teeth shots, thigh shots, upper leg shots, foot shots, lower leg shots, and four different quadrants of torso.

Game of the century right there. :5/5:

My experience with aimed shots in the Fallouts especially is either you're an eyeholing turbosniper, or you don't bother (or better yet, get Fast Shot). Classic illusion of choice stuff right there.

Did you ignore "any basic system with tactical options would do to add some variety" on purpose in your eagerness to make it look like I was defending the pretty boring and indeed highly unbalanced variant of aimed shots in Fallout, or was it just an oversight?

You seem awfully upset about a post that can be summarised as "I like everything so far but combat seems meh".
 
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Cyberarmy

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Only females have a yellow mining hat or gas masks, for example, but the portrait of a guy in thick raggy armor wearing a yellow mining hat and a gas mask is for males only. I feel like schizophrenic monkeys were in charge of organizing the character creation bits and pieces. :lol:

This is some unacceptable bullshit, dunno what they were thinking here... Had to do some surgery on my sniper so he she can use gas masks...
and forgot to change his her name, not sure if Zagor suits female snipers.
 

Phage

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I've been kind of absent from Codex the past couple years. Why does anyone hate Sawyer? To the best of my knowledge he's a pretty cool dude who put a lot of time and effort into turning Bethesda's mess of a game into something relatively balanced. Also is willing to question mechanics that RPGs have used 'just because' and seek out a better alternative. Maybe he'll fail, but at least he tries.

I feel like I'm missing something here.
 

Blaine

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As for "basic options", I was indeed talking about aimed shots. Just some basic options to choose from instead of just clicking attack, moving or using a consumable.

Conversations with you always end up in Bizarro World. Recap:

  • "Blaine, combat is my biggest gripe. What do you think of it?"
  • "I think it's enjoyable enough, pretty serviceable, not off-putting."
  • "I think it lacks some basic options."
  • "What, like aimed shots?"
  • "Yep, that's exactly what I meant by 'basic options.'"
  • "That's silly. Additional aimed shot options aren't the drop of fairy juice that magically transforms an otherwise simplistic system into an amazing and tactically complex one." (paraphrasing just a tad here)
  • "BRARGH! That was only an EXAMPLE of what I meant by 'basic options,' I left it open ended! It could be anything, just there's something basic missing grh!" (not a direct quote)

What I think is that aimed shots or something similar are very important to you for whatever reason, important enough that only having headshots and torso shots available outweighs the ability to take a knee, take (non-total) cover, use the high ground, overwatch/ambush, get jams and clear them, see and manually aim AoE cones and such, use the environment (shoot an oil barrel, etc.), and even creep into position and cover before a battle begins... hell, the cool-as-fuck range meter for each weapon that shows enemy dots on the minimum/optimal/max display is fucking outstanding.

All that stuff that wasn't in Fallout is somehow outweighed by a few less fine-aim locations that no one used anyway. I think it's lame to be bummed about the entire system because there are a few less aimed shot options.
 

DeepOcean

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Anyone that got to California, anyone is willing to tell if there is any major difference from Arizona but not fill the post with spoilers?
 

Zed

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Codex USB, 2014
I thought I was super smart to lure the prison guards into Red's defense turrets... but the turrets were sleeping. Only if I attacked them did the turrent go active, and then they'd hit only me.
Still, kiting the prison guards proved a good tactic as they would come 2 and 2 - easy pickings for my crew.
 

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