What constitutes an RPG - and what makes a game not an RPG

[Max Damage]

You make a character or several, then make numbers/abilities grow big = RPG. Also, seconding the megathread proposal.

 

[rohand]

A rocket-propelled grenade (often abbreviated RPG) is a shoulder-fired anti-tank weapon system that fires rockets equipped with an explosive warhead. Most RPGs can be carried by an individual soldier. These warheads are affixed to a rocket motor which propels the RPG towards the target and they are stabilized in flight with fins. Some types of RPG are reloadable with new rocket-propelled grenades, while others are single-use. RPGs, with some exceptions, are generally loaded from the muzzle.

That's the only definition you'll ever need.

Source: interwebs

 

[Werdna's Revenge]

Delicieuxz you're triggering me with the misappropriated Cultösaurus Erectus avatar. Fuck Ork, and fuck Psygnosis: bunch of try-hard fags. The only good thing they ever did was Lemmings.

 

[Cassius Dio]

A game which seeks to approximate human attributes through abstractions, which are on equal footing with player action in terms of importance and which hinder or support certain actions and choices, is an RPG, if it is also mainly comprised of combat.

 

[Mr. Magniloquent]

1. All player actions moderated through a mechanic (dice/cards/etc.)
2. Intrinsic character customization with mutually exclusive choices.
3. Exploration

Those are the minimum requirements for an RPG. Everything else gets a hyphen.

 

[Funposter]

You make a character or several, then make numbers/abilities grow big = RPG.

Tony Hawk's Pro Skater 2 is an RPG

 

[tindrli]

when i think about it, there is rpg and THE RPG!

 

[aweigh]

For an answer to "what is an RPG?" look first to Wizardry and Ultima. The hallmarks of the genre.

 

[Valky]

Is it wrong that when I see a "what is an RPG" thread my first internal thought is "Oh no not another one".

 

[hexer]

Gygax's book "Role-Playing Mastery" has a lot to say about this.
It's an excellent book and if you get a chance, grab it.
This is how he defines RPG in it:

A game system that allows freedom of choice as to the type of character played, personalization of the player character, its actions, and its general activity.
Typically, characters’ actions in a role-playing game are limited only by very broad parameters, common sense, and imagination.

 

[Wayward Son]

There should be a megathread of "But what's an RPG?" and all those weekly made threads should be moved in there.

But what is a “But what’s an RPG” thread?

For an answer to "what is an RPG?" look first to Wizardry and Ultima. The hallmarks of the genre.

Seconded.

 

[Delicieuxz]

If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough.

Got you covered -> second sentence of the topic:

"An RPG is a game where player agency is created through the game world responding to the player’s unique thought-processes, choices, and actions, resulting in a dynamic narrative."

Delicieuxz you're triggering me with the misappropriated Cultösaurus Erectus avatar. Fuck Ork, and fuck Psygnosis: bunch of try-hard fags. The only good thing they ever did was Lemmings.

I wondered where it was from. Now I wonder no longer. Thank you.

 

[JarlFrank]

RPGs got stats
Games without stats aren't RPGs
The stats have to change at some point in the game, either during character creation or during levelups (theoretically a game with character creation but no levelups would also qualify as RPG, let's imagine Fallout but you're permanently at level 1)
The stats are permanent features of the player character and determine his/her abilities
Doom has stats (weapon damage, health, armor etc) but those are not inherent to the character: every player has the same max health, does the same damage with the same weapons, etc; therefore Doom is not an RPG

 

[mondblut]

Here's the only correct scale of RPGness, measured from 100 to 0:

Feel free to use it.

 

[laclongquan]

12 points of RPG-ness. 8/12 say it's a RPG.
(see the link in my sig)

1. Character creation has some form of in-game consequences
2. Statistics which define character(s) abilities are subject to change throughout the game
3. Character(s) have skills or abilities which may improve or be altered over the course of gameplay
4. Character(s) accrue experience which can be spent or result in gaining levels or abilities
5. Character(s) accumulate items in some form of inventory, which the player can actively use (equip, sell, destroy, trade, etc.), which enhance or otherwise alter gameplay
6. Character(s) accumulate currency which may be spent to enhance the character(s) in some way (items, guild membership, training, etc.)
7. Character(s) gain levels throughout the game which result in some form of mechanical change (not just a change in character title, or description)
8. Character(s) are able to explore over terrain, water, space, etc. ('explore' refers to free movement of main character(s))
9. The game has some form of puzzle solving, which is resolved through combat, problem resolution, or some choice made by the player
10. A choice made by the player alters the narrative, or some other significant part of the game (an item is found or lost, stats or skills are gained or lost, different ending, etc.)
11. Character(s) interact with NPCs in some form of dialogue which have in-game consequences depending on what the character(s) say.
12. Optional quests (defined here as some kind of task made available after the game has started, and which can be resolved by the player before the game ends, but is not required to complete the game) are available.

Arbitrary threshold of 'RPG'

1. Not an RPG (7 or less RPG elements)
2. Generally agreed upon as an RPG (8-12 RPG elements)

 

[hexer]

Points 4 and 7 are too similar.
Also, some adventure games could pass as RPGs if you go by "8 points makes a RPG" creed.

 

[Cat Dude]

Rpg is adventure game with battles and stats

 

[Citizen]

RPG is anything you want it to be

 

[laclongquan]

Fuck you, mondblut . You are a fucking lazyass who cant bother to articulate an opinion too~

 

[Sigourn]

1. An RPG has combat.
2. An RPG has skills/stats/traits, whatever.
   
3. An RPG let's you increase your character skills, permanently, through natural means.
   1. This makes games like Legend of Zelda not RPGs, because "skill" increases are gained through obtaining items and so on, not because your character naturally grows stronger.
   2. Likewise, having equipment in a game is not enough, and certainly not buying upgrades for your ship. That doesn't make a game an RPG.
4. Said skills/stats/traits influence how the game plays.
   
5. Everything else doesn't matter: choice and consequence vs linear storytelling, action vs turn-based, create your characters vs have them created for you, etc.
6. And fundamentally, all what I said earlier must be the bread and butter of the game. Not a secondary aspect. GTA V has combat, stats (increased naturally) and so on, but you could remove the stats and the game would play pretty much the same. That's because it is an afterthought. Remove stats from Wizardry and suddenly you remove one of the things that make it good: seeing your party grow stronger. This is the difference between an "RPG" and a game with "RPG elements". GTA V has races in it, but that doesn't make it a racing game.

I don't consider Wizardry IV to be an RPG, if your character (Werdna) cannot get naturally stronger. It sounds more like a survival game using a Wizardry skin. Oblivion and Skyrim, on the other hand, very much are RPGs.

 

[mondblut]

I don't consider Wizardry IV to be an RPG, if your character (Werdna) cannot get naturally stronger.

Poor Megatraveller, all dressed up as an RPG and nowhere to go.

What of those pesky games with level cap, do they change their genre dynamically?

 

[Bruma Hobo]

I don't consider Wizardry IV to be an RPG, if your character (Werdna) cannot get naturally stronger.

Poor Megatraveller, all dressed up as an RPG and nowhere to go.

What of those pesky games with level cap, do they change their genre dynamically?

You get to choose what kind of characters you play in Megatraveller, in Wizardry 4 you don't. That's a huge difference.

STOP THE LIES, START THE TRUTHS.

An RPG is an adventure game that focuses on repeatedly asking the player what kind of character(s) does he want to play, through stats and character driven choices (like moral dilemmas, dialogue options, alignment systems, and so on). Ideally, the game should acknowledge the choices made by the player and react accordingly (which is why turn-based gameplay and even RTwP are better than action gameplay, focusing too much on the player skills alone would overshadow his character's attributes).

This is true since the early days of Dungeons and Dragons.

Titles that qualify as role-playing games:

• Wizardry
• Ultima
• Pool of Radiance
• Sword of the Samurai (yes it does, shut up).
• Shin Megami Tensei (some JRPGs like this one or Uncharted Waters kind of care about letting the player create his own characters through stats and choices.)
• Glorious Realms of Arkania
  
• Planescape: Torment
• Expeditions: Conquistador
  
• Disco Elysium

There are some ambiguous cases, games that don't care that much about the question, but due to convention or heritage they kind of ask it from time to time. Many JRPGs end up here, as the inherited Wizardry/Dungeons & Dragons mechanics do offer some way to customize player characters, but usually only as power-gaming exercises.

• Dungeon Master
  
• Lands of Lore
• Diablo
• Many JRPGs like Dragon Quest III and Final Fantasy V that let you customize your party members.
• Dark Souls
  
• Fallout 4

If the game doesn't care about the question at all, then that's probably a tacticool game with stats, an adventure game with stats, or an action game with stats.

• Questron (it cloned the grinding parts of the early Ultimas, but it never allowed the player to make his own character or forge his own path, as it was deprived of everything that made the first 3 Ultimas good role-playing games).
  
• Final Fantasy IV, VI and VII, Chrono Trigger, Earthbound, Dragon Quest IV, and many other classic JRPGs that play more like graphic adventure games with random encounters, stats being there just to let the player grind.
  
• The Linear RPG
  
• Call of Duty and other action games that are just gamifying their systems.

Weeaboos and minmaxers will disagree with me, and I recognize this is a very Arnesian interpretation of what a role-playing game is, and that it is impossible not to offend Gygaxian goons. Nevertheless, this is what moved this genre forward, if you don't like it you can always play squad tacticool titles and wargames.

 

[Falksi]

This tag is most certainly wrong - "witcher 3 is great but it's action-adventure"

The Witcher 3 is not great in the slightest. It's a shit Assasins Creed game.

 

[JarlFrank]

I don't consider Wizardry IV to be an RPG, if your character (Werdna) cannot get naturally stronger.

Poor Megatraveller, all dressed up as an RPG and nowhere to go.

What of those pesky games with level cap, do they change their genre dynamically?

If you play through Fallout without ever spending any of your skill points on level up, it's not an RPG.

If you play through Pool of Radiance without ever going to the trainer to level up, it's not an RPG

 

[Sigourn]

I don't consider Wizardry IV to be an RPG, if your character (Werdna) cannot get naturally stronger.

Poor Megatraveller, all dressed up as an RPG and nowhere to go.

What of those pesky games with level cap, do they change their genre dynamically?

If you reach the level cap 2 hours into a 50 hour game? Yeah. Otherwise, no.

If you play through Fallout without ever spending any of your skill points on level up, it's not an RPG.

If you play through Pool of Radiance without ever going to the trainer to level up, it's not an RPG

They are RPGs, but you are no longer playing them like ones. Just like how you can play a racing game but not do any racing if all you do is play like a retard and drive against oncoming cars.

If I remove level ups in Fallout, what's left is pretty much your usual CYOA, i.e. there would be no difference between having the player choose between a predetermined set of characters to experience the game through.