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Why is Gothic series so culty?

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Played it both in Polish and English - dialogues are so simple and bare bones, that I don't think it's a matter of losing something in translation.

I didn't notice anything particularly bad with dialogues. And I like that characters aren't running their mouths for extended periods of time. You must be one of those people who actually enjoy Witcher 3 "let me tell you my entire life story because you asked me for directions" dialogue.
 
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Codex Year of the Donut
Also, while nobody is going to praise the quests, they are a result of the setting. Of course they're going to give a nobody the most shit, repetitive or boring jobs.
Any other game this would be criticized, these people are flat out brainwashed.

"Yes german government, I do love backtracking...."
"Yes german government, I do love picking turnips...."
"Yes german government, I do love killing color coded dragons..."
 

Jasede

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Insert Title Here RPG Wokedex Codex Year of the Donut I'm very into cock and ball torture
You might be a lost cause as you're not even willing to entertain the other point of view.

What do you want? Fast travel? NPCs asking your level 2 mook to save the kingdom?
Rainbow dragons?

What I mean is, you only criticize but don't actually counter any of the points we've brought up. You just make a quip and walk away, as if that were some argument. But it isn't! If you're going to criticize the game you should bring up some examples of how what you criticize could be solved better without destroying the essence of the game.
 
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Codex Year of the Donut
You might be a lost cause as you're not even willing to entertain the other point of view.

What do you want? Fast travel? NPCs asking your level 2 mook to save the kingdom?
Rainbow dragons?

What I mean is, you only criticize but don't actually counter any of the points we've brought up. You just make a quip and walk away, as if that were some argument. But it isn't! If you're going to criticize the game you should bring up some examples of how what you criticize could be solved better without destroying the essence of the game.
I'm here to discuss RPGs, not action games with RPG elements.
 
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Yes both the setting and your status in Gothic justify the quests. Of course you're going to pick turnips if you ask a farmer how to make yourself useful, of course you're going to buy a frying pan when you talk to the housewife. And it's in the player best interest to complete these menial tasks because behind the illusion that you're the nameless hero, there are still mechanics and skill points and so on.. You don't end up with the royal paladins without experience, you have to level up. When you commit yourself to the mercenaries you get asked to whack the city guard coming to rob the farmers under Onar's protection, not to work the fields.. It makes total sense.

The more experienced you are, the better your status and with great power comes greater responsibilities like "Dragons threatening everything" or something call "the Sleeper". You don't get sent to take 'em on like as a nobody with your stick and goodie two-shoes attitude. I don't know what else to add really.
 

OSK

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Codex 2012 Codex 2013 Codex 2014 PC RPG Website of the Year, 2015 Codex 2016 - The Age of Grimoire Make the Codex Great Again! Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 BattleTech Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire
These dense woods and swamps saved us from the Mongols.

Hy3Ocsh.jpg


"Please, take these offerings of woods and swamps."
Quoth the Belarusian, the Lithuanian, and the Novgorodian?

You no longer consider them white Europeans?
 

bloodlover

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The first two Gothic games and Homm3 were staple video games of my generation. For some reason everyone around me played them and knew about them regardless of their preferred gaming genres. I remember going to internet cafes and on almost every PC there was a copy of Gothic 1 right there next to Counter Strike or UT.

Like it was mentioned before, Gothic game were given away with magazines at some point but I would not attribute that to the game's popularity. Most kids and teens at the time were not really into RPG games and gaming as a whole was so much different than today. I think that the games are still so well seen because of the atmosphere and worldbuilding. Yes, some nostalgia is still at play and yes, some things like graphics and controls (lol) maybe have not aged well but even if you consider these to be minuses, Gothic games do almost everything else so much better than most games do today.
 

Doktor Best

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Gothic games are unfinished, that's why Bethesda is more popular. Both games just fall apart halfway through and just decline to the end with constant backtracking and repetitive filler tasks. I replayed g1&2 last year, 7/10 at best.

If Gothic 1+2 are 7/10 then Morrowind is a 5/10 at best and Skyrim 3/10 since those games are filled with repetitive filler tasks from the start.

I mean i am not sure i'd even argue with those scores...
 
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7/10 is a fair score for the best of PB games when taken shitty end games into account. What we actually love them for, however, is everything that comes before that.
 

JDR13

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Hilarious that someone would say it's a 7/10 in 2022. Those games are 20 years old.

It's like someone playing U7 or System Shock 20 years later. You can still recognize why they were great in their time, but few people are going to rate them that high if they didn't play them back in the day.

Sure, Gothic 1 & 2 have been surpassed by now, but few games even came close to the level of immersion they offered back then.

*Edit* I have a feeling some of you idiots took that the wrong way.
 
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Konjad

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People writing that Gothic is average at best are probably the same people who didn't give Prelude to Darkness a try because graphics are bad.

But spent dozens or hundreds of hours in Skyrim or Twitcher 3.
 

Reina

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immersion

I think that's the key word in the discussion. In altar of this immersion (or even better, 'vibes'), Gothic series makes many sacrifices that don't gel well with certain crowd. It's ultimately a matter of expectations. People who grew up on American tradition of fantasy and role-playing games must find early eurojank games extremely jarring, because it almsot purposefully goes against their sensibilities.

Take, for example, criticism of writing. If someone expects vibrant and extensive dialogue trees, written by masters of the written word, Gothic would be a disappointment for them. But the almost simplistic, down-to-earth, unembellished style is there on purpose. This is, ultimately, a primitive prison (or backwater, largely insignificant town), not a fantasylandia of wonder and high adventure. You're among the lowlifes, not bards and minstrels, and the best locale you can find on the map is dilapidated fortress, not some whimistical city of elves/Telvanni. In that setting, it works, it serves to underline the setting. Even when the plot rises the stakes, it (setting) never breaks with limitations it imposed at itself, creating largely coherent experience.

The quests and associated running around are just pretexts to immerse player more into this world, not the main source of fun itself. I'll admit that at least first game takes this a bit too far (Ulu-mulu, god I hate that questline), but the reason why many players remember the game fondly is not because of the amazing questline, but because mine valley/isle of Khorinis imprinted itself into their psyche, it left lasting impressions with its handcrafted locations. How many open-world games can boast such achievement?

I loved both Morrowind and Gothic as a kid, but while I vividly remember only a few locations from the first one, I can probably draw world from first two Gothics from memory. And it's not like Morrowind didn't have striking 'vibes', or visually appealing locations - especially comapred to competetetion, even 20 years after release. However, Gothic was much more successful at making even seemigly mundane locales memorable. In any other game 'orc axe cave' from G2 would be forgettable, minor stop, but I bet any Gothic affecionados on Codex immediately not only recognized which place I am talking about, but also recalled the layout and features of that ultimately small location. And it functionally serves only as an optional stop on a fetch quest.

Funnily, I think Piranha Bytes partially didn't understand this appeal of those games, hence not only problerms with replicating Gothic magic in their later titles, but also abyssmal endgame of both Gothic 1&2. What's the common part of both? They throw Nameless One into a new locale (Orc Temple/Irdorath) with which we have no connection. And the magic goes away...
 
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Harthwain

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Hilarious that someone would say it's a 7/10 in 2022. Those games are 20 years old.

It's like someone playing U7 or System Shock 20 years later. You can still recognize why they were great in their time, but few people are going to rate them that high if they didn't play them back in the day.

Sure, Gothic 1 & 2 have been surpassed by now, but few games even came close to the level of immersion they offered back then.
Some game are classics for a reason. Also, some games age differently than others.
 

agentorange

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It's the best written German game I know, what's so boring about the writing?

Literally searched on youtube and clicked the first result. Yep, still as terrible as I remember it...


I haven't even played Gothic but uh... this isn't the writing's fault.

the english voice acting for Gothic 1 and 2 are perfect. it's full of humor and character; feels like it is about a bunch of average lowbrow guys and ruffians that have to deal with a world ending threat even though they'd rather sit around drinking and smoking weed. there's no other RPG that has the same kind of tone (though very recently Brigand had something similar).

Sure, Gothic 1 & 2 have been surpassed by now
by what
 

Jasede

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Insert Title Here RPG Wokedex Codex Year of the Donut I'm very into cock and ball torture
nostalgia.

there, i solved this thread.
But we played Archolos just last year and loved it. And I replayed them recently as well and they hold up fine.

This nostalgia argument is what dismissive 20-29 year olds try to use who haven't played enough games yet and think using this word will save them having to discuss using coherent arguments.
 
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Codex Year of the Donut
nostalgia.

there, i solved this thread.
But we played Archolos just last year and loved it. And I replayed them recently as well and they hold up fine.

This nostalgia argument is what dismissive 20-29 year olds try to use who haven't played enough games yet and think using this word will save them having to discuss using coherent arguments.
Right, he's only partially correct. It's not nostalgia, it's brainwashing.
 

Reina

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gothic 2 is an amazing game because it was the first immersive turnip picking simulator


I understand some folks like to start the game by fighting dragon with ultra-mega-legendary-mithril blade +12 to light radius, but in Gothic, even those early minor quests serve a purpose: to show MC's place in the world and his position in social hierarchy AS WELL as establish certain socioeconomic facets of the setting (farmer's rebellion being one of the main plotpoints - yes, farming is important shit in G2). Also, that turnip quest takes what, two minutes to complete?

Funny that one the one hand you criticize Gothics as 'TPP action games', and then lash on one of the quests that has no action whatsoever.

BTW both Third Person Perspective AND action also serve putposes of 'immersion'. It would be much harder to immerse player into the game if it was presented f.e. from isometric perspective (too impersonal), or if he didn't directly control action of the main character.
 

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