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Torment Are you going to play Torment?

Are you going to play Torment?

  • Yes, this is my most anticipated game!

  • Yes, I'm not a big fan, but I'm moderately interested.

  • Not sure, maybe.

  • No, because the latest news (console release, Codex blacklisting, HP pool etc) pissed me off.

  • No, never cared about the game.


Results are only viewable after voting.

Prime Junta

Guest
As much as I want to find this 'acceptable', I just can't. The problem lies in choosing the Numenera setting (and thus, the system) in the first place. I can think of how the original system gonna come up; cRPGs were, after all, meant to be an emulation of PnP RPGs (at least to the best of the designer's ability to do so). And so the decision to use the Numenera setting and system should've followed by trying to emulate the tabletop's one to the best of the designer's ability, no compromise.

Then it would've been just a really bad game. The whole point of the Numenera system is to make it as fluid, fast, and easy to play around the table as possible, with a minimum of arithmetic and die-rolls, and rules that are so simple you can learn them in five minutes and then use them without having to refer to the books. The only "original" rules in it are there to facilitate player/GM interaction, improvisation, and storytelling -- GM interventions, player rules on spending XP in-play, that sort of thing. The combat round recognises a grand total of three different types of actions: move, attack, and "do something else" for crying out loud.

That works really well for a certain flavour of tabletop gaming.

It wouldn't work at all on a computer. With no GM, only one player, and no improvisation, the interesting part of the rules doesn't apply, and all you're left with is the barest skeleton of a mechanical system, and not a very robust skeleton at that.
 

Fairfax

Arcane
Joined
Jun 17, 2015
Messages
3,518
Everybody who's played the beta says the writing and C&C are fantastic. I like what I've seen of the art and music. Having played some of the P&P game, I like the setting. Even the change to a hit point system makes sense to me. Damn right I'll give it a shot.
Not everybody. I didn't play the entire beta so I didn't write a review or long impressions, but I thought what I saw of the writing was hit and miss, and the language in particular was extremely inconsistent.
 

Lady_Error

█▓▒░ ░▒▓█
Patron
Joined
Oct 14, 2012
Messages
1,879,250
It's good to know that all the butthurt in the Codex blacklisting thread represents just 10% of the Codex.
 
Joined
Jul 11, 2010
Messages
3,213
Location
Vostroya
Everybody who's played the beta says the writing and C&C are fantastic. I like what I've seen of the art and music. Having played some of the P&P game, I like the setting. Even the change to a hit point system makes sense to me. Damn right I'll give it a shot.
Not everybody, not even by a long shot.
Someone had, yeah, but it wasn't very descriptive. Remembering all this shenanigans with savegames, combat, bugs and beetles - heh, T:ToN beta looks like God-tier.

_____
As for me, I'm still playing it, will probably post more spoilery detailed impressions later, but right now I can say that the game is a big improvement from Wasteland 2, but, sadly, it's not the PS:T 2.0.

The Good
  • Some of game's writing is genuinely good, but you'll need to be patient to reach it. Right now the beginning is needlessly verbose, full of adjectives and prolonged for no good reason at all. The writing in the second location despite all its numenera and trying to be different, kinda failed to impress me, because it's still overly verbose and we're not given any narrative hooks why should we care about it, save maybe getting some cyphers. But when you reach Sagus Cliffs - well, there are some lovely quests with reactivity and C&C, interesting NPC dialogues and places descriptions. Quality varies though, as are writing styles. I don't know who did NPCs and quest in SC, but either it were multiple people and there was not enough unifying editing, or if that was one man/woman/tranny - he/she/xhe wrote it during a long period of time with long pauses, and it still needs to be edited for consistency.
  • Music is really good, though something is missing to make it truly great. Mark Morgan is very talented musician and composer, though I confess I like his earlier works (Fallout 2, PST) way better then the newer (Wasteland 2, Stasis). This time he delivered again, music is very good, it conveys various mood very effectively - but either I became old and cranky, or the main theme in particular, and overall soundtrack in general can't hold a candle to PS:T. Still, you'll hear some familiar motives reminding you of it, but overall music is distinct and stands on its own. It's just not a masterpiece.
  • Most quests are very interesting, if somewhat conservative. By conservative I mean that they are made in the same vein as PS:T, mostly through dialogue and some FedEx. So when the writing of some quest is good, it really reminds you of all good times in PS:T, but sometimes writing isn't up to task, and the quest then looks like it came out from BG. Still, most are good, they are reactive, they respect your choices (save some quest flag bugs, but it's beta), and there are some real, not cosmetic consequences of your actions. Still, there are boring FedEx elements as well.
  • Locations visual design is quite nice. It isn't a generic fantasy landscape #9000, like some feared, but, sadly, it can't compete with Planescape. It isn't coherent enough, it isn't as otherwordly and mysterious. All and all, it has some good elements, some bad, but definitely better than PoE, or (God forbid) W2. There are some technical problems, mostly with their overpaint, cobblegate wasn't as ridiculous as it sounded, the texture is p. shit and lowres, since it's overpainted 3d, it won't change with resolution, so it's not a LOD problem. Quite a few others have a similar rushed feeling. Still, some elements are genuinely different, interesting, and nice to look at.
The Bad
  • Locations are too small. If the demo is really one third of the game, it's real bad news for me. Sigil was quite big, not as big as Athkatla, but full of content (and way better designed). Sagus Cliffs is, well, maybe a third of Sigil, maybe less. Locations not only are small, they feel small (due to props and NPC placement), so there's no sense of discovery of some hidden map corner, or building, or other point of interest. It's better than empty PoE locations though, at least.
  • Combat is broken. It's not a complaint about it, at least not fully, but right now combat is almost unplayable. It's unintuitive, unresponsive and very slow even for TB. And I'm a fan of TB. Also combat interface hasn't got a grid, which is my main complaint right now, and movement points and combat points indicators are really need to be reworked for more clarity. Right now half of the cyphers doesn't seem to work, AI breaks all the time, turns are getting stuck, etc, etc.
  • There's too much handholding. Right when you enter the city, you will meet a kind soul, which explains you about the Sagus Cliffs free of charge, and the info is legit. NPC in general know too much what you need to do and some quest and make suggestions for your course of actions (go there, talk to this guy) even if they aren't quest givers themselves, or even if they are, but have no reason to even remember where to go, or who is to blame for their predicament, etc (Death-of-Self). Sometimes they give you clear directions. It's not bad in itself, and I already seen people asking for quest compass (probably not trolling even), so some hand-holding is a given. But I can't help but remember mage class quest in PS:T. And also nobody told you "Find Pharod. He's a criminal martermind, a fallen noble, has an adopted daughter and lives in Buried Village, you can get there from Ragpickers Square" right off the bat.
  • There's too little argot, or cant in NPCs speech. For me Planescape's argot was a really different experience. I'm not a native speaker, so I didn't know many UK slang words, not to mention Planescape specific ones, and was forced to research them. It only added to experience, and really helped the atmosphere. Granted, it's a highly subjective complaint, but it's sad that TToN has some unique words, but not a unified slang.
  • Character models are ugly as fuck, and also very tame in design. I'm not a graphix whore, I can even live with most of ridiculous portraits (which are mostly shit-tier, but it's again subjective opinion). But character models are fucking ugly. Especially fem!PC. She looks like a Chernobyl survivor or an extra from Wasteland 2 in her portrait, and also as a fucking mutant if we look at ingame model. She is ugly, and not "cool ugly" as TNO, she is pitiful ugly. Party members are sometimes better, but still, they are both ugly and somewhat boringly designed. I'm not even talking about Tumblr haircuts, but from all PST party members only half could've fit in BG's party, for example. Here all of them, save maybe Callistage could have easily fit into both PoE and W2, at least visually.
  • Interface is a mess. I know that it's a first iteration or something, but it really looks like some more ugly Vista themes, with gradient, bold lines everywhere and rounded edges. It's unresponsive, clunky, and, frankly, hideous.
  • Numenera game system. I don't like it. It's needlessly complex for newcomers, and for storyfag RPG in general too, but also not really fun to tinker with for systemfags. I couldn't test it in combat other than in tutorial battle with tentacled pieces of shitSorrow, but I don't think it would appeal either to combatfag or a systemfag. Also it doesn't punish realoding, so if you don't want to spend effort in many cases you can just save and reload until you pass attribute check in conversations. I'm not sold on Tides too, but I've seen too little of their effect in beta, so I don't have a final opinion on the matter.
The Neutral
  • Party members. I'm not sure I like them, but it's a Beta. OTOH they are way less talky and distinct then PST ones, on the other - they are better then most PoE companions already (save GM and Durance). Still - I want more interactions. If what I got during the beta is the full (or near to it) extent of their conversations - well, it won't do. Also my complaints about their visual design still stands. And I still find their portraits ugly and amateurish.
  • Interactions with the world consist of mostly using text interface. It's a PST thing, sure, but tech is marching forward, so I would have liked to see some more dynamic parts of the environment, changes matching text descriptions. It's a minor gripe though, and I'm mostly neutral on the subject.
  • CYOA parts. They could work, sure, but right now they fell awfully disconnected from player. Why should I care about the whale, for example, if I know that this is the past, and probably would be only mentioned once again in a minor conversation with clerk? Strongest PST memory stories were tied to TNO or to his party members, or to Deionarra. The whale though? Eh.

tl;dr Right now what I fear the most is the game's length. If the beta is really a 30 or so percent of the full TToN, then it would be shorter not only than PST, but also PoE and W2. Also in its current state it's not a PS:T 2.0 EE, it's a, well... If PS:T was a movie, then TToN is its basic cable TV series adaptation. It's a good game on its own, no mistake, but it's not a RPG genre saviour.
 

Abu Antar

Turn-based Poster
Patron
Joined
Jan 19, 2014
Messages
13,658
Enjoy the Revolution! Another revolution around the sun that is. Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth
I will play it on release. I'm interested in the game. I backed the game. I have already tried the game. I like what I played of the game.
 

Maculo

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Jul 30, 2013
Messages
2,548
Strap Yourselves In Pathfinder: Wrath
I spent money on it, and so I will try it. Wasteland 2 and Torment alpha dampened my hype for the gameplay. Granted, I did not play PST for the combat system, but Torment needs to have a good story. If they screw that up...
 
Self-Ejected

Harry Easter

Self-Ejected
Joined
Jul 27, 2016
Messages
819
I think the story will be alright, good even, maybe great. But PT had problems with it's gameplay and I would like to see, that Numenera does better. At the moment it's biggest problem is the combat.
 

Doctor Sbaitso

SO, TELL ME ABOUT YOUR PROBLEMS.
Patron
Joined
Oct 22, 2013
Messages
3,348
Codex 2013 Codex 2014 PC RPG Website of the Year, 2015 Grab the Codex by the pussy Serpent in the Staglands
I intended to make a day 1 purchase of Numenera until the kerfuffle over the cancelled Gamescom interview, the attempt to blame Infinitron for supposedly leaking information, and the controversy over Brother None.

Oddly enough, this isn't an option in the poll. :M

I have missed a lot apparently. links?
 
Self-Ejected

Bubbles

I'm forever blowing
Joined
Aug 7, 2013
Messages
7,817
I intended to make a day 1 purchase of Numenera until the kerfuffle over the cancelled Gamescom interview, the attempt to blame Infinitron for supposedly leaking information, and the controversy over Brother None.

Oddly enough, this isn't an option in the poll. :M

I have missed a lot apparently. links?

All in one handy, easy-to-read thread: http://www.rpgcodex.net/forums/inde...orment-gamescom-appointment-cancelled.110327/
 

Doctor Sbaitso

SO, TELL ME ABOUT YOUR PROBLEMS.
Patron
Joined
Oct 22, 2013
Messages
3,348
Codex 2013 Codex 2014 PC RPG Website of the Year, 2015 Grab the Codex by the pussy Serpent in the Staglands
127 pages!? I got through a few pages and understand the bullshit leak, corporatism.

Has there been any follow-up? Can someone TL;DR?
 

agris

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Apr 16, 2004
Messages
6,877
Everybody who's played the beta says the writing and C&C are fantastic. I like what I've seen of the art and music. Having played some of the P&P game, I like the setting. Even the change to a hit point system makes sense to me. Damn right I'll give it a shot.
I only played the first few incarnations of the beta, but the intro writing was pure
rating_prosper.png
. Also, they couldn't into why opening the area map in the tessellating room made the FPS lag go away, despite being 100% reproducible.
 

Haplo

Prophet
Patron
Joined
Sep 14, 2016
Messages
6,254
Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire
Guess so. I love PS:T.
Although Wasteland 2 was a huge dissapointment, I'm willing to give Inxile another chance.

I AM a bit worried about
You roll a virtual die to succeed at dialogue options. 45% chance, 60% chance, etc. Similar to Fallout 3.

But let's see how that works in the end.
 

Neanderthal

Arcane
Joined
Jul 7, 2015
Messages
3,626
Location
Granbretan
Aye I can't get me 10k back :argh: so i'll probably play Numenera at some point, looks like theres some really big flaws compared to Torment though, fuck knows why they wanna make protagonist so fuckin boring in comparison to Nameless. See why when I eventually play it though.
 

---

Arcane
Joined
Dec 19, 2015
Messages
1,724
Location
Italy
Interested, but very low expectations, especially after that shit of PoE, which destroyed forever my hype towards nuCRPGs :negative:
 

jaydee2k

Savant
Joined
Nov 3, 2016
Messages
449
Interested, but very low expectations, especially after that shit of PoE, which destroyed forever my hype towards nuCRPGs :negative:

PoE seems golden in comparison. By the way PoE 3.04 is solid!
 

Hyperion

Arcane
Joined
Jul 2, 2016
Messages
2,120
Picked the third option. No real rush. Maybe they'll get some wacky idea and release a Director's Cut...
 

Haplo

Prophet
Patron
Joined
Sep 14, 2016
Messages
6,254
Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire
Well, I do have very little trust in InXile after Wasteland 2.
But it's TORMENT, don't think I can resist that.
 

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