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Baldur's Gate Baldur's Gate 2 is vastly overrated

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Lilura

RPG Codex Dragon Lady
Joined
Feb 13, 2013
Messages
5,274
"mage duels"

BG invented spellcasting duels, not BG2. They're spellcasting duels, not mage duels, because we can duel clerics, druids and bards as well, not just mages.

mage duel is ignorant misnomer; a thoughtless parroting.
 

Falksi

Arcane
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Feb 14, 2017
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Nottingham
Can only speak from my POV, but:
  • " no atmosphere or single plotline in the game. Anything to hold interest? No."
    • Rescue Imoen, get revenge on Johnny boy for killing Khalid. I thought there was atmopshere, just more cosmo as you say.
  • "Side quests are too numerous, one dimensional, and completely unrelated to the plot."
    • I agree here. It always got on my tits how you'd escape the first dungeon, and have a plethora of quests thrown at you. But unrelated to the plot? Doesn't bother me at all. You're an adventurer adventuring, and the game doesn't set up any need for urgency in the progression of the main plot.
  • "Story writing, Minsc's humorous parables, and quality of dialogue is very mediocre."
    • Matter of taste methinks. I found Minsc & the talking Sword fucking brill.
  • "Compare Icewind Dale, Dragon Age for better gaming experiences, and smaller but more compact stories."
    • It's been too many years since I played Icewind Dale, I just remember it being a combat slog & never finished it. However I'm a big DA:O fanboy, so won't argue there. But that to me's just coz DA:O is a classic game, not coz BG2 is poor.
  • "People hate Diablo 1 and 2 for their "lack of roleplaying" but they are pretty solid games for a very limited world."
    • Between this & Icewind Dale, it sounds like you just prefer combat over roleplaying.
  • "BG1 had a tighter storyline and a better unfolding of lore"
    • Again, agreed. But That just makes it a different type of game, much like Shadowrun Returns is the appetiser to Shadowrun Dragonfall.
I really like both BG1 & BG2, and there's a lot about BG1 I prefer. But BG2 is probably still my fave overall, and still a classic IMO.

Worst aspect about both you haven't mentioned - the fucking God awful pathfinding. That's the only thing which makes me halt playthroughs.
 
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Lilura

RPG Codex Dragon Lady
Joined
Feb 13, 2013
Messages
5,274
"Story writing, Minsc's humorous parables, and quality of dialogue is very mediocre.

Matter of taste methinks. I found Minsc & the talking Sword fucking brill.

95% of BG2's writing is shit. Nothing on par with Durlag's Tower and main quest of BG1.

minsc%2Bpirate%2Blord%2Bdialogue.jpg


jan%2Bjansen%2Bpuns.jpg


irenicus%2Bthen%2Bthe%2Bmemory%2Bof%2Bthe%2Bmemory%2Band%2Bthen%2Bnothing.jpg

yawn..
 

smaug

Secular Koranism with Israeli Characteristics
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Insert Title Here
Re:

In case the horse hasn't been beaten enough yet:

I'm just in the middle of BG1 run (with SCS) - second one, the first was like a decade or so ago, and since I can't remember shit, it's almost like a virgin playthrough.

While I can definitely see the charm of low level DnD adventures, it's clear as fuck that unlike BG2, the first one did not stand the test of time. I'm around level 5-6, have cleared out all of the areas up to the bandit camp, and I already feel burned out, with desire to continue being close to none.

- writing/dialogues are so bare bones that it hurts - most of the conversations boil down to either accepting the quest or not, or just choosing between goodie/asshole answer. Sometimes you don't even get any choice, as npcs just throw at you some short text about their lost ring/cloak/boots/etc, and the quest is auto added to your journal.
- quest design - again, mostly bare bone kill X/return with his dagger etc shit. No multiple choices, no branching, no nothing. Rewards are shit, both gold and XP-wise - you're better off clearing the ankheg area then doing majority of micro-quests in Nashkeel/Beregost/wilderness.
- encounters - 95% are trash mobs in the empty wilderness areas, where it's the clunky pathfinding you are fighting with. Nashkeel mines are a chore comparable to arcanum's BMM, but thankfully they are significantly shorter.
- itemization is piss poor - you can find endgame weapons after first few hours (varscona, composite longbow +1, warhammer +2 with shock dmg, light crossbow of speed etc).
-wilderness areas - there is certain fun in free exploration, but there's just there's too goddamn many of them, mostly without any points of interest.

SoA has huge replayability factor to this day. With BG1 I can't fucking push myself to finish it after sinking more than dozen hours, even though I was stoked to give it a try with SCS, after putting in on a shelf for so long so it could feel fresh.
 

octavius

Arcane
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Bjørgvin
I thought BG2 was very good until you could genocide Beholders and Mind Flayers without breaking a sweat, so my first couple of plays were abandoned (I wasn't lifting anything heavier than burgers back then) in the Underdark.
Improves quite a bit with the right mods, but Throne of Bhaal was very exhausting, especially when you were forced to play along with Melissan's plan, even if she was nearly as obvious a lying cunt as Almalexia was in Tribunal.

So overall mixed feelings, and it's one of the game I like less now than I did 5-10 years ago.
 

Lilliput McHammersmith

Guest
I thought BG2 was very good until you could genocide Beholders and Mind Flayers without breaking a sweat, so my first couple of plays were abandoned (I wasn't lifting anything heavier than burgers back then) in the Underdark.
Improves quite a bit with the right mods, but Throne of Bhaal was very exhausting, especially when you were forced to play along with Melissan's plan, even if she was nearly as obvious a lying cunt as Almalexia was in Tribunal.

So overall mixed feelings, and it's one of the game I like less now than I did 5-10 years ago.
Just play the "Enhanced" editions, they "re-balanced" the Mind Flayer encounters......

(Do NOT play them lol)
 

Drowed

Arcane
Joined
Dec 28, 2011
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Core City
BG invented spellcasting duels, not BG2. They're spellcasting duels, not mage duels, because we can duel clerics, druids and bards as well, not just mages.

mage duel is ignorant misnomer; a thoughtless parroting.

I don't remember quoting BG2. Apparently, "spellcasting duels" is the authoritative term, it seems.

By the way Lilura, didn't you block me before? I remember that I even commented on that day that I felt honored. You had a change of heart, or something? :)
 

anvi

Prophet
Village Idiot
Joined
Oct 12, 2016
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Kelethin
Baldur's Gate 2 is vastly overrated. It's a complete mess.
You know it is 20 years old right? I don't think it is overrated, most people playing games today would have never even heard of it. In neckbeard communities then yeah it is going to be popular but that doesn't mean much. The sad fact is though, RPGs are not that big of a genre even at the best of times. GTA gets $250m or whatever, and the next big RPG is getting a small fraction of that. And in the 90s especially, that was a really small budget with not great tech. TL-DR: RPGs are generally gimpy and cheap and crappy and under developed and under funded, but there are still some worth playing. I like the high level spells so there aren't many options for that in gaming.
 

NJClaw

OoOoOoOoOoh
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Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture
Baldur's Gate 2 is vastly overrated. It's a complete mess.
You know it is 20 years old right? I don't think it is overrated, most people playing games today would have never even heard of it. In neckbeard communities then yeah it is going to be popular but that doesn't mean much. The sad fact is though, RPGs are not that big of a genre even at the best of times. GTA gets $250m or whatever, and the next big RPG is getting a small fraction of that. And in the 90s especially, that was a really small budget with not great tech. TL-DR: RPGs are generally gimpy and cheap and crappy and under developed and under funded, but there are still some worth playing. I like the high level spells so there aren't many options for that in gaming.
Man, what the fuck are you doing? The TL;DR can't be half your post. That's illegal.
 

Falksi

Arcane
Joined
Feb 14, 2017
Messages
10,538
Location
Nottingham
"Story writing, Minsc's humorous parables, and quality of dialogue is very mediocre.

Matter of taste methinks. I found Minsc & the talking Sword fucking brill.

95% of BG2's writing is shit. Nothing on par with Durlag's Tower and main quest of BG1.


yawn..

See I find the Minsc one funny, and John's coldly interesting.

Gnome boy's I agree on, bit shit.

But again, it's all down to taste.
 
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Thac0

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I'm very into cock and ball torture
I am the only commentator in existence that says BG1 > BG2. Everyone else says the opposite, and it's always been that way.

Meh, BG1 > BG 2 is a semi common opinion, and one that I share. Its much more of a story than a themepark, and low level 2e takes a lot longer to break than high level 5e.


Just play the "Enhanced" editions, they "re-balanced" the Mind Flayer encounters......

Made easier?
 

Lilliput McHammersmith

Guest
I am the only commentator in existence that says BG1 > BG2. Everyone else says the opposite, and it's always been that way.

Meh, BG1 > BG 2 is a semi common opinion, and one that I share. Its much more of a story than a themepark, and low level 2e takes a lot longer to break than high level 5e.


Just play the "Enhanced" editions, they "re-balanced" the Mind Flayer encounters......

Made easier?
No they made it “harder” by removing the immunity that Skeleton Summons have to mind flayers. The main danger with Mind Flayers is that they do the Eat Brain, which in BG, if successfully rolled they zap you of 5 Intelligence. If your Intelligence drops to 0, then you die. Skeletons, in the rule books, and in the original BG games, are immune to such an attack because they don’t have brains. But Beamdog decided that such a strategy was too “cheesy” so they “fixed” it, and now they too are vulnerable to being devoured by Mind Flayers, despite it making no sense at all.
 

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