Baldur's Gate Baldur's Gate 3 Early Access Thread [GAME RELEASED, GO TO NEW THREAD]

[Nerevar]

Jan does not get a slot in my party sorry.

 

[MerchantKing]

Jan does not get a slot in my party sorry.

You should try. He's the strongest companion in the game.

 

[Darth Valer]

To be honest I actively plan to rotate my speaking characters according to who makes more sense in a given situation according to theme and context, not skill points. It'd only be a problem for me if the speaking character is actually too much random and out of control at times, but this idea of always having the best skilled fellow to maximize the chance of passing all skillchecks seems childish to me. They even said they want to create interesting scenarios when you fail in dialogues, and there's proof of this in the EA.

 

[Pizzashoes]

What is Kaelyn going to do with this abstract ending?

 

[Gradenmayer]

To be honest I actively plan to rotate my speaking characters according to who makes more sense in a given situation according to theme and context, not skill points. It'd only be a problem for me if the speaking character is actually too much random and out of control at times, but this idea of always having the best skilled fellow to maximize the chance of passing all skillchecks seems childish to me. They even said they want to create interesting scenarios when you fail in dialogues, and there's proof of this in the EA.

Yeah, Redditards are complaining, that If companion gets a last hit on the enemy- enemy will beg specifically them for mercy and not player hero. But to me it seems quite reasonable, since you are not distinguished leader of the brainwormed retards running alongside you.

 

[AwesomeButton]

@AwesomeButton does appear to intuitively know Larian's writing is in fact shit

I know Larian's writing is shit from experience, not from intuition.

 

[Shrimp]

Looks like not even the most stalwart zealots on the core target audience's website can defend the all-but-confirmed lack of an option to let the entire party handle interactions and skill checks in dialogue:
https://www.reddit.com/r/BaldursGat...we_just_assume_we_could_switch_dialogue_host/

This is probably another reason why Larian frequently controlled one character at a time whenever they wanted to show off dialogue based skill checks during their presentations.

This seems to be one of the more reasonable takes or am I misunderstanding here? They want to decide who in the party is doing the skill check or talking in a given situation? I mean that makes sense if you run around with a party to pick the best man for the job, because I assume it's going to be same issue if you run only hirelings.

There's nothing wrong with picking the right man for the job given whatever situation you find yourself in. The problem is the game will some times arbitrarily make the decision for you resulting in situations that make no sense and have no reason to unfold. You can check the replies to the linked thread for various examples.

 

[Orud]

Jan Jansen after you get the use any item hla.

Does that Turnip snorting midget even have the strength to equip that?

 

[Reinhardt]

Jan does not get a slot in my party sorry.

You should try. He's the strongest companion in the game.

nah, he's ugly and stinky.

 

[Kiste]

There's nothing wrong with picking the right man for the job given whatever situation you find yourself in.

So when you're out drinking with your mates do you check everyone's CHA ability score before deciding who gets to talk?

 

[CodexTotalWar]

who are these fanboys

me and everyone i knew who playing ad&d at the time had bg1 as their favourite game and absolutely loved #2

the same was true about just about every online bg community at the time

though i was a retard kid back then, i used to like tob more than bg2

This wasn't right at release but it's one of the earlier threads about it I can find.

https://rpgcodex.net/forums/threads/why-was-bg2-subpar.1935/

 

[AwesomeButton]

I'm replaying the bg-series in prep for 3, and one thing that's funny about doing that while reading this thread on the side is how lulzily memeish the majority of bg1's writing is. it changes a lot in 2, but a lot of 1's actual writing besides the main plot is everything from fastest dart thrower in the west to siding with druids on the promise of aloe vera balm rewards

Totally true. Lamenting BG3's writing while contrasting it to previous BGs is ridiculous.

If something is worth the regret it is that games today, because of the better "production values", dictate too much about the environment and characters and leave very little room, if any, for the player's imagination. This is regretful, because utilising your audience's imagination is both cheap for you, and "perfect" for the audience, in terms of everyone being satisfied with what their mind presents them with.

Low production values and limited medium through which to develop characterisation lead to simpler characters revolving around well known tropes, because they are easier to communicate to the player.

How was Jaheira characterized in BG - portrait, text, some voiced lines, selection/command sounds and that was it. That was quite enough to characterize the stereotypical nagging wife. Nowadays every writer strives to make every character into an Oscar-worthy Dostoyevski-grade amalgamation of drama, tragedy, personal issues, romantic aspirations, and whatnot, or at least so it seems to the doofus who wrote that character.

I guess the conclusion is that if you remember old games for having good writing, it's likely not the writing, but it's your mind having been better at filling the blanks. Nowadays there's no blanks - you are watching interactive TV, not playing a game.

 

[Drakortha]

You unironically said FA3 -> FA4 introduced more innovation than DoS:2 -> BG3. At that point nothing you say can be taken seriously.

It fucking did though.

Same game engine, sure. But fidelity was way higher in Fallout 4. The introduction to crafting and weapon and armor modding, and how every item in the game can be salvaged, the way power armor was no longer just a change of clothes but an entire vehicle. Fucking diagonal running animations, WAY better gunplay, full settlement building system. The list goes on.

What the fuck does BG3 offer someone who played DOS2 that they haven't already experienced? Not much, honestly. Same turn based, identical graphics (yes they are fucking identical, or at the very least VERY comparable. changes to shaders and post processing effects don't count). Same lack of day / night cycles. Same small party sizes. The only innovation they did was combine the DnD ruleset and added cutscenes. Cutscenes that already exist in Fallout 4 and Dragon Age. So where's the innovation to be found? The sex scenes? They seemed pretty proud of that, didn't they? I guess that's it.

I'm not a fan of either game, it's just a fact. Just because you don't like it doesn't make it not true.

 

[AwesomeButton]

Nerevar In the event you are unaware, Baldur's Gate 2's Paladin companion, Keldorn, has the side quest where you figure out his wife has been engaged in a sexual affair with a noble while Keldorn has been busy executing the duties of the Knights of the Radiant Heart. You, the Party Leader, due to your status and influence have the unenviable duty of persuading Keldorn to either stick with his family or stick by his honor. This Choice and Consequence is infamous and well-loved by the community.

BTW how come a paladin is married? Stupid idea.

 

[copebot]

I'm replaying the bg-series in prep for 3, and one thing that's funny about doing that while reading this thread on the side is how lulzily memeish the majority of bg1's writing is. it changes a lot in 2, but a lot of 1's actual writing besides the main plot is everything from fastest dart thrower in the west to siding with druids on the promise of aloe vera balm rewards

Totally true. Lamenting BG3's writing while contrasting it to previous BGs is ridiculous.

If something is worth the regret it is that games today, because of the better "production values", dictate too much about the environment and characters and leave very little room, if any, for the player's imagination. This is regretful, because utilising your audience's imagination is both cheap for you, and "perfect" for the audience, in terms of everyone being satisfied with what their mind presents them with.

Low production values and limited medium through which to develop characterisation lead to simpler characters revolving around well known tropes, because they are easier to communicate to the player.

How was Jaheira characterized in BG - portrait, text, some voiced lines, selection/command sounds and that was it. That was quite enough to characterize the stereotypical nagging wife. Nowadays every writer strives to make every character into an Oscar-worthy Dostoyevski-grade amalgamation of drama, tragedy, personal issues, romantic aspirations, and whatnot, or at least so it seems to the doofus who wrote that character.

I guess the conclusion is that if you remember old games for having good writing, it's likely not the writing, but it's your mind having been better at filling the blanks. Nowadays there's no blanks - you are watching interactive TV, not playing a game.

This is also reflected in terms of raw time spent while the game is running. BG1 has the best ratio of gameplay:reading. Even BG2's most voice and dialogue heavy scenes in which Irenicus is doing something and laughing evilly take less time to experience than a routine interaction with an inanimate object in BG3 which includes fully voiced narration and pointless skill checks. The writing could be workaday-servicable in those games and not have a major negative impact on the experience.

With the current "RPG" paradigm, you are also watching multiple season's worth of badly animated television with CYOA elements in addition to playing a game. This is why I can't even contemplate replaying Cyberpunk: I know that I will have to laboriously skip through enormous amounts of dialogue to "play" the "game." This puts more pressure on the writing than any team is likely going to be able to live up to.

 

[Swen]

You unironically said FA3 -> FA4 introduced more innovation than DoS:2 -> BG3. At that point nothing you say can be taken seriously.

It fucking did though.

Same game engine, sure. But fidelity was way higher in Fallout 4. The introduction to crafting and weapon and armor modding, and how every item in the game can be salvaged, the way power armor was no longer just a change of clothes but an entire vehicle. Fucking diagonal running animations, WAY better gunplay, full settlement building system. The list goes on.

What the fuck does BG3 offer someone who played DOS2 that they haven't already experienced? Not much, honestly. Same turn based, identical graphics (yes they are fucking identical, or at the very least VERY comparable. changes to shaders and post processing effects don't count). Same lack of day / night cycles. Same small party sizes. The only innovation they fucking did was combine the DnD ruleset and added cutscenes. Cutscenes that already exist in Fallout 4 and Dragon Age. So where's the innovation to be found? The sex scenes? They seemed pretty proud of that, didn't they? I guess that's it.

I'm not a fan of either game, it's just a fact. Just because you don't like it doesn't make it not true.

Just letting you know DOS2 is the highest rated RPG on metacritic

https://www.metacritic.com/browse/games/genre/metascore/role-playing/all?view=detailed


(pls ignore platform thx)

 

[Kiste]

With the current "RPG" paradigm, you are also watching multiple season's worth of badly animated television with CYOA elements in addition to playing a game.

That's pretty much on point and I think BG2/NWN was when the scales began to tip . Then came KotOR and that has essentially become the formula for that type of RPG ever since. That was 20 years ago.

 

[Drakortha]

Just letting you know DOS2 is the highest rated RPG on metacritic

https://www.metacritic.com/browse/games/genre/metascore/role-playing/all?view=detailed


(pls ignore platform thx)

Whoa, metacritic?

I guess that settles it. If metacritic says it's great, it must be. Thinking for myself is so tiring, anyway. Why form my own opinion when I can let the hivemind do it for me? Safer that way. Staying and feeling safe at all times is important.

 

[AwesomeButton]

Why the fuck are Dragonborn a thing?

I had this in multiquotes but I forgot about it. Human, dwarf, elf and halfling should be the only playable races, I'm serious. Dragonborn contribute nothing while diluting the setting further. But the worst shit I've seen is the "Goliath" - race of "competitive" non-giants and the "Fir-Bolg", which don't even know if they have anything characteristic about them. But why not ape Irish mythology for a cool sounding two-syllable name, for no reason whatsoever.

It's interesting that your examples for great writing are games that barely have any.

You should look up my posts in the IWD thread. I've done some thinking out loud on what makes its writing so classic and timeless.

 

[Drakortha]

Why the fuck are Dragonborn a thing?

I had this in multiquotes but I forgot about it. Human, dwarf, elf and halfling should be the only playable races, I'm serious. Dragonborn contribute nothing while diluting the setting further. But the worst shit I've seen is the "Goliath" - race of "competitive" non-giants and the "Fir-Bolg", which don't even know if they have anything characteristic about them. But why not ape Irish mythology for a cool sounding two-syllable name, for no reason whatsoever.

They did it for the brainless masses who can't separate Dragonborn from Skyrim. Larian know you're all retarded and are just telling it to you bluntly.

 

[Kiste]

They did it for the brainless masses who can't separate Dragonborn from Skyrim. Larian know you're all retarded and are just telling it to you bluntly.

Dragonborn have been a playable race in the DnD PHB since 4th edition, years before Skyrim was released, you dolt.

 

[Larianshill]

Dragonborn have also been in 3.5, but the brainless retard who only wants to endlessly bitch about things he knows nothing about is not aware of it.

 

[Ibn Sina]

I would rather they add the half Yuan Ti snake people from NWN 2 expansions than the dragonborn.

 

[Drakortha]

They did it for the brainless masses who can't separate Dragonborn from Skyrim. Larian know you're all retarded and are just telling it to you bluntly.

Dragonborn have been a playable race in the DnD PHB since 4th edition, years before Skyrim was released, you dolt.

I already knew that. Larians target audience doesn't know it. That was my point.

Pay attention to what I say before you respond to me, you child.

Once again, comprehension skills are at an all time low for Larian fags. They spend too much time thinking about dicks.

 

[Larianshill]

Sometimes it's better to close your mouth than yap. You should consider it, imbecile.