Diablo IV

[Kjaska]

Too bad there is a nigga who joins in at 50% and muddies the kill. Deservingly he loses his character. Too bad you won't be able to replicate this on launch due to forced multiplayer. Speaking of which, I noticed that I don't get matched with anyone in relays in Warframe while using my VPN, but I can still play the game just fine. Might be something you could utilize to force yourself into a solo instance.

 

[spectre]

Is this shit? My dad is going to play w/friends and me if I decide to get it. Watched a video and it seems very deterministic in regards to items and skills. Can monsters posit unique challenges and how is class variety?

I was disappointed with the server slam beta and find it unbelievable it's being released in this state. I played a Druid, you basically choose a basic (free attack skill) and a mana cost attack skill, a defensive skill, and then a couple of attacks on cooldown. But the skills are not fun at all and even the animal companion skills feel anemic. The enemies are zombie trash mobs with basic simple AI no different than PoE and the bosses are just dodge patterns and hp sponges just like PoE. We basically only played the first act but there were only two tilesets- a snowy tundra overworld and a mine/ cavern dungeon, with no real distinguishing landmarks like mountains, forests or rivers.

Sadly, I couldn't compare it to other classes cause the slam ended rather abruptly on me, but I had pretty much the same experience with the druid. Not sure why I picked this one first, could it be that it was the magic of finally feeling included and represented in a vidya game? But I digress... I recently had a fresh go with a melee werewolf in D2R and in this context it compares rather favorably because you can now fluidly change between forms and a few abilities trigger off it when you do, so at least the new approach promises to be more involved (D2R melee druid is basically LMP for main attack, RMB to rack up life and mana leech, recast werewolf when needed, recast buffing spirit if it dies). Then again, the game has moved on a bit in the years since D2 came out.

Considering that, I could say that dodge patterns are actually an improvement over the D2 formula where the bosses were JUST damage sponges. Games in the genre really struggle to make melee interesting. Some higher tier mobs also have telegraphed attacks you have to dodge, this spices things a little bit. Though I hate the modifiers introduced by D3 with a passion, especially wallers feel redundant with all the narrow corridors. Was a really unpleasant surprise to see it in D4.

To be fair, trash mobs with no AI is basically the genre's staple at this point. Very few games dare to do anything with it. For some perspective, I recommend trying Last Epoch which really shat the bed with monster design as far as I am concerned (shame, cause the skill system, redability and other mechanics are really great). Seriously, most games in the genre compare poorly even to D2, which at least had some most basic interactions down, like devilkin running away on kill and being raised by shamen, some ranged enemies keeping their distance, you start missing simple things like that.

Regarding the limited tilesets and landmarks, I think the game opens up at a later point when we get horses and stuff. Hopefully this will also do away with sausage-corridors (coincidentally, I also had my fill of this shit in Last Epoch).

 

[Zurat-Yarkuch]

Too bad there is a nigga who joins in at 50% and muddies the kill. Deservingly he loses his character. Too bad you won't be able to replicate this on launch due to forced multiplayer. Speaking of which, I noticed that I don't get matched with anyone in relays in Warframe while using my VPN, but I can still play the game just fine. Might be something you could utilize to force yourself into a solo instance.

Is there any way to turn off the warnings that you are out of mana or a skill is on cooldown? Cause just from watching the video that got really annoying really fast.

 

[Crispy]

That is not something I'd go around bragging about.

Yet you freely admit to spending money that you don't have on a product that you'll never use, and for a game that you never intend to play (Fallout).

Dumbass.

 

[zerotol]

Why in godsname is this in RPG, should be general gaming -> hack & slash

Anyway this has the same flaws as D3 drawing from the MMO influence i absolutely detest.

I will buy and play it, be disappointed, complain and move on

 

[zerotol]

Blizzard is but a mere shell of the great innovative company it used to be

 

[Justinian]

D3 had lvl scaling for 10 years and now it's a surprise D4 has it... somehow.

That's because leveling in D3 = tutorial. There's no scaling with Paragon and there are twenty difficulty levels so you can adjust monster strength to whatever you want. It just makes you fork out some mats to buy new gear once in a while for the first hour or two of a new season.

It makes 0 sense in D4 and it is arguably the worst part of the game.

 

[ArchAngel]

Why in godsname is this in RPG, should be general gaming -> hack & slash

Anyway this has the same flaws as D3 drawing from the MMO influence i absolutely detest.

I will buy and play it, be disappointed, complain and move on

You are not a true codexian. To be that you need to not buy it or pirate it, then complain for years and when you think you are ready to move on, you complain a bit more.

 

[Kjaska]

Is there any way to turn off the warnings that you are out of mana or a skill is on cooldown? Cause just from watching the video that got really annoying really fast.

It would be so easy to just code the trigger for the voice line to only fire if a set amount of time has passed after the ability was fired, like 0.5-1 seconds. I understand having a voice line for when you run out of your ressource, because it informs you of something you don't know without looking. But if you press a button and the ability doesn't fire, pretty sure it's on cooldown. Completely obsolete function.

 

[KIss My Ass]

That is not something I'd go around bragging about.

Yet you freely admit to spending money that you don't have on a product that you'll never use, and for a game that you never intend to play (Fallout).

Dumbass.

I never intended to play Fallout. Stop bringing it up.

I will use my steam deck when System Shock remake is available as long as it's Deck verified.

 

[Fedora Master]

You gladly eat shit but scoff at caviar.

 

[KIss My Ass]

You gladly eat shit but scoff at caviar.

Eating fish eggs is not totally unlike consuming semen or menstruation. Is that really what you want to compare your beloved Fallout to?

 

[UglyBastard]

D3 had lvl scaling for 10 years and now it's a surprise D4 has it... somehow.

That's because leveling in D3 = tutorial. There's no scaling with Paragon and there are twenty difficulty levels so you can adjust monster strength to whatever you want. It just makes you fork out some mats to buy new gear once in a while for the first hour or two of a new season.

It makes 0 sense in D4 and it is arguably the worst part of the game.

Has it been confirmed, that the game scales infinitely with Paragon levels?
So far we have only seen Act 1 of the campaign in the leveling phase. Their concept is that you can complete the campaign in any order (probably to get that "open world" feel) and the level scaling is there to make sure that this is possible. The system as we have seen it is exactly like D3: In the leveling phase, mobs scale with you to make sure you get XP and adequate loot from them.
I assume this effect gets capped in the endgame and you can get ahead of the curve with paragon boards, gear synergy etc.
This can even be seen in the beta at Kor Dragan stronghold, which is always lvl 30 regardless of your own level.

Btw. the comment from this thread that you are strongest when you get your first core skill is BS. You can get weaker during leveling when you don't get adequate drops for your level, but when you farm good stuff and get some synergies online you were BY FAR the strongest in the beta when you were lvl 20.

So far this seems like fighting a strawman because no one knows if they are so retarded to level scale the endgame overworld in an obnoxious way. Level scaling during leveling can be debated as shit, but it is what it is and is nothing new.

 

[abija]

That's because leveling in D3 = tutorial. There's no scaling with Paragon and there are twenty difficulty levels so you can adjust monster strength to whatever you want. It just makes you fork out some mats to buy new gear once in a while for the first hour or two of a new season.

It makes 0 sense in D4 and it is arguably the worst part of the game.

Are you actually deluding yourself D4 won't be an "endgame focused" game ? It will just be 90+ or 95+ wherever they trigger the hard xp fallof.

Has it been confirmed, that the game scales infinitely with Paragon levels?
...
So far this seems like fighting a strawman because no one knows if they are so retarded to level scale the endgame overworld in an obnoxious way. Level scaling during leveling can be debated as shit, but it is what it is and is nothing new.

Was confirmed paragons are finite in d4 (0-50 skill points, 50-100 paragon points, + whatever extras). At release at least, though the system is designed with finite points in mind.

Endgame overworld will be scaled. That's the whole point, to have ALL content available at "endgame".

 

[UglyBastard]

That's because leveling in D3 = tutorial. There's no scaling with Paragon and there are twenty difficulty levels so you can adjust monster strength to whatever you want. It just makes you fork out some mats to buy new gear once in a while for the first hour or two of a new season.

It makes 0 sense in D4 and it is arguably the worst part of the game.

Are you actually deluding yourself D4 won't be an "endgame focused" game ? It will just be 90+ or 95+ wherever they trigger the hard xp fallof.

Has it been confirmed, that the game scales infinitely with Paragon levels?
...
So far this seems like fighting a strawman because no one knows if they are so retarded to level scale the endgame overworld in an obnoxious way. Level scaling during leveling can be debated as shit, but it is what it is and is nothing new.

Was confirmed paragons are finite in d4 (0-50 skill points, 50-100 paragon points, + whatever extras). At release at least, though the system is designed with finite points in mind.

Endgame overworld will be scaled. That's the whole point, to have ALL content available at "endgame".

What I meant was that it should (and probably will) be feasible to reasonably outscale the overworld content through synergies, paragons etc. so that generic content will get easier (ergo you feeling more powerful) over time and with character progression.
Bad level scaling like vanilla Oblivion makes you feel weaker with more level ups because opponents become HP sponges while you have limited options to boost your power and your own gain from levels is relatively limited compared to opponents. I don't think this will be the case (and it wasn't the case in Beta and Server Slam, with good gear and skill synergies you were able to roflstomp generic mobs that once posed some challenge despite them being scaled and giving you a hard time during leveling).

Level scaling done right can even be beneficial for a loot grinder aRPG like this, as can be seen in D2R with the introduction of terror zones. In Diablo 2 (no level scaling at all), with higher charlevels fewer and fewer areas are worth farming until from lvl95+ only three mobs even give noticeable XP: Diablo, Baal and maybe Nihlatak.
To minmax XP from these (the only way to move your XP bar forward), you need some convoluted procedures involving a team of ideally 7 other players sitting in the game to provide XP scaling and prepare those bosses for you to last hit (leaving the party before you do). Killing only Diablo and Baal over and over again with a full party that is supporting you and does not interfere with you lasthitting those bosses is the only way to progress (because only these mobs have a high enough level to be worth XP). Coincidentally, the areas of Diablo (Chaos Sanctuary) and Baal (Throne of Destruction) were part of the select few that could drop high end unique items. There were some other areas that could possibly drop those uniques but would't give any noticeable XP at high level, so doing DiaBaal-Runs over and over again was also competing for the best loot strat.
-> There were very limited options besides just doing the same shit all day if you want any progress at all.

D2R introduced terror zones. Every full hour a randomly selected overworld zone is declared a terror zone and mobs in this zone are scaled to your level without limit. This means that they are considerably tougher, give noticeable XP and can drop good loot. I found this to be quite refreshing, because farming the terror zones takes you through different areas in all acts and gives a sense to visiting them and fighting the various mobs with enhanced challenge (and not only Diablo and Baal).
In my opinion, the only "drawback" with these is that you can now reach lvl 99 as a normie who does not have a clan supporting and preparing bosses for you, so high charlevels lose some "elite" status. I personally couldn't care less, as I am certainly not 24/7-ing Diablo and Baal over weeks to move my XP bar at a snail's pace.

Diablo 4 is not a choice and consequence cRPG with hand crafted and carefully balanced combat encounters, it's a hack'n'slash lootgrinder, so level scaling done right could be fine and provide a more diverse experience (as more areas are worth visiting). Roflstomping low level areas in D2 and not having any chance for decent loot or XP gets old really fast. The game just has to give you enough options to get an upper hand over the enemy besides just char level.
Real endgame content is probably OVERscaled anyway (mobs being max. level in e.g. nightmare dungeons)

 

[ADL]

Why is D4 in RPG but D3 Reaper of Souls is in MMORPG? This one's far more MMO-y than D3 was.

 

[Decado]

This pretty much sums up that shitty world boss fight.

During the Server Slam, everyone had one goal in mind—to kill the world boss, Ashava, and claim their exclusive cosmetic. But the great beast only ended up being the perfect capstone to Diablo 4's problems. As Fraser discovered (opens in new tab), fighting it was just a long, tedious slog that made every part of your character feel meaningless. Playing a tanky build? Pointless, because you die in one hit from one of its enormous AoE attacks. Playing DPS? Enjoy watching an enormous healthbar achingly slowly tick down while you spam one spell that it has no visible reaction to. Playing support? No, you aren't—that doesn't exist. Playing a Necromancer? Sorry, all your skeletons got banished to Double Hell and they ain't coming back. All of that slow, tedious grinding of getting to level 20 culminated in an even slower, more tedious grind of a fight.

https://www.pcgamer.com/class-balan...diablo-4but-the-game-has-far-bigger-problems/

I'm confused, why is this person talking about "playing support," and then sarcastically reminding us is doesn't exist? Of course it doesn't exist, this is Diablo. Every class is a DPS class, the whole game is DPS. The only variation is whether you are melee DPS (and therefore need to be more tankish) or ranged DPS (and therefore need to focus on movement and/or unique skills to mitigate damage).

Do these people understand what Diablo is? It's not World of Warcraft.

 

[mediocrepoet]

Do these people understand what Diablo is? It's not World of Warcraft.

It's like when people reference the holy trinity. It's like do you guys play anything that aren't MMOs?

 

[taxalot]

I was midly interested then I noticed the game was 70 euros and Diablo Immortal is free.

If I want a quality game shouldn't I play Path of Exile instead ?

 

[Reinhardt]

i'm using dutch vpn and diablo immortal banned there.

 

[Late Bloomer]

If I want a quality game shouldn't I play Path of Exile instead ?

Grim Dawn

 

[ind33d]

Why is D4 in RPG but D3 Reaper of Souls is in MMORPG? This one's far more MMO-y than D3 was.

auction house would have made it an MMO the same way Destiny is, allegedly

 

[ArchAngel]

I was midly interested then I noticed the game was 70 euros and Diablo Immortal is free.

If I want a quality game shouldn't I play Path of Exile instead ?

Path of exile is extreme grind game with 1000 badly explained mechanics that you will need to learn. If you enjoy that, it is best on market. Double so because it is free.

 

[zerotol]

I was midly interested then I noticed the game was 70 euros and Diablo Immortal is free.

If I want a quality game shouldn't I play Path of Exile instead ?

just buy an overpriced RTX 4XXX like me and you get the game for free with it

 

[Multi-headed Cow]

just buy an overpriced RTX 4XXX like me and you get the game for free with it

I've been seriously considering that. I'm well due to upgrade my computer as it is since the old 970 doesn't make dead woman porn nearly fast enough with image generation to keep up with my insatiable demands and a 4070's a relative sweet spot for going over 10 gigs of VRAM and being good for AI bullshit as well as being a massive leap forward for gaming. Only problem is I'd be upgrading the whole machine, and then I gotta ask myself if I really want to spend $1,500 now to save $70 on Diablo or just wait a few months and see if a sale or black friday or some damn thing knocks the price down. In fact there's even the question about the 4060s coming out since I know there's one that goes over 10 gigs of VRAM there. Since I do AI bullshit more than game though it does color my decision making when it comes to video card.