Divinity Divinity: Original Sin - Enhanced Edition

[Hyperion]

I think my biggest gripe with the game was that Sword and Board Man-At-Arms builds felt mostly useless compared to a two-hand build, which just dominated in terms of damage yet remained sufficiently tanky for the entirety of the game. My typical strategy for Braccus was to wait for him to walk to the far side of the room, for more space and time to position the group. 3 of the 4 would go towards the steps leading to the Ghoul with the beefcake Warrior off to the side. Always cast Rain before initiating the battle, this weakens the fire guy before the fight starts, saving your Water magic user a turn.

Then, it becomes a mix of luck, and a race against time to cast a fire elemental as close to the center as possible in hopes of it eating the brunt of the Meteor Storm, and distracting the Twins. Or just have some fire resist on your Man-At-Arms guy, drink a Fire Resist potion, and hope for the best. The archer fires an explosive arrow at the Ghoul, mangling him, and destroying the poison goo in the process. If casting Rain at the start of the fight functioned properly, the Twins should be easily frozen and taken out of commission with a Freezing Arrow, or Ice Shard spell. Another option is to fire Water Arrows to create a pool, and one of the many forms of electrifying to stun it.

Beefcake off to the side Charges right at the Baron and 1v1's him. If you're lucky (the game likes making you miss at 85%+ chance to hit), he'll go down before the Ghoul. Main job is to weaken him while your ranged guys take out Lighthouse Ghoul, who's fairly pathetic at this point. Once those 2 are down, the Twins should be a free kill as it should never take a turn.

If you manage to survive the bullshit fusillade of Meteor Storm, it's one of the game's better fights.

I recall there being at least 2 healing water spells and 2 'whirlwind' style man-at-arms skills. I like the change, and having few but important skills with good synergies is better than just fire bolt->fire ball-> fire orb -> fire storm.

Funny, I miss having the old skill set, double whirlwind included. Man-At-Arms feels a lot more boring now that those can't be used back to back for a sweet dervish combo. The Beginner, Intermediate, and Master tiers sucked a lot of fun out of it as well. Abilities that you could have by the middle-end of Act I now can't be gotten till you unlock the Elemental stores in your base.

 

[DavidBVal]

Another annoying thing is the odd mix of turn based combat while everything else is in real time. Opening your char screen, or the options menu, doesn't pause the game which feels real odd in a TB game, as you can get dragged into a fight while doing inventory management. I don't like to be hurried when I am playing a TB RPG. Does D:OS 2 also work like that?

 

[Murk]

Hyperion you can pseudo-sequence break by going to advanced areas, as the NPC vendors will have higher tiered skill books. I do this usually in Silverglen, for how easy it is, but you can also go to Hunter's Edge (assuming you don't die to the spiders on the way.)

You can also get some easy money by stealing some of the better "loot on tables" in the advanced areas too.

 

[Baron Dupek]

I don't get the devs' problem with animations boost, I played D:OS EE with speedhacks because fuck me enduring this slugfest (they're also p.handy in games with a lot of walking).
Nothing broke, time saved.
srsly lazy devs
almost as bad (if not worse) than unskippable cutscenes or forced QTE becase "we devs love this shit"

 

[Murk]

The movement speed thing is a pain, yeah. I found myself using haste more as a utility of going from point A to B than for bonus AP in combat.

Though it is pretty infuriating how when not in combat you lose buff duration because your character is still in the skill animation, and you cannot walk yet.

 

[DavidBVal]

The movement speed thing is a pain, yeah. I found myself using haste more as a utility of going from point A to B than for bonus AP in combat.

Though it is pretty infuriating how when not in combat you lose buff duration because your character is still in the skill animation, and you cannot walk yet.

Yeah they should have gone the Fallout route and allow the player to enter TB mode when out of combat.

Also, there's an annoying UI glitch I experience, although it may be just me. I click on a quickslot and instead of activating skill/using item, I drag it with the mouse. Happens to me like 1 in 15 times I click on a slot.

 

[Murk]

That happens to me too. I found if I click near the bottom of the quickslot, I avoid that problem entirely (or just use keyboard shortcuts).

 

[Bubbles]

The competition for the Codex backer NPC is now open:

http://www.rpgcodex.net/forums/index.php?threads/d-os-2-fundraiser-design-the-codex-npc.112212/

Fabulous prizes await!

 

[DavidBVal]

Just finished the game yesterday (Tactician). Combat and character design made this game very fun for me, for the most part. However I can see how people that has played through it twice ends up a bit sick of it. Combat animations are slow, Inventory management is hell, there is simply too much useless stuff dropping, and you are not sure if you'll need the money in endgame, you waste lots of time identifying and selling crap. Which makes you feel stupid when you end up with 100K gold you have no idea what to spend on. Overall this is a great game, which does right the important things. Game system is well designed compared to other cRPGs, and *not* obsessed over balance. Combat is tactical, mistakes make you die, and there's little inflation. Story was a bit meh, writing was mixed, and the pacing was awful in the beginning, but who cares about that when mechanics work.

Also, this, lol. http://www.gamespot.com/articles/there-was-a-secret-reward-hiding-in-divinity-origi/1100-6431879/

 

[Roguey]

After all the post-release balance tweaks and much-maligned nerfs (they go way too far, even for me) I don't know how you can say they're not obsessed with balance.

 

[Aenra]

I don't know how you can say they're not obsessed with balance.

Because the game's still fun to play?

 

[DavidBVal]

After all the post-release balance tweaks and much-maligned nerfs (they go way too far, even for me) I don't know how you can say they're not obsessed with balance.

I've only played the EE in tactician so I don't know how it was before, but many things feel mega-powerful and you can get them early, like Rapture skill. Also, the ability to inflict mass damage from late Expert Marksman skills surprised me greatly. AEs with decent range and damage around 700-800 per enemy, it made me release endorphins every time I used Rain of Arrows, or especially Arrow Spray when in point blank range. My archer became my most fun character to play in the endgame thanks to them.

 

[DragoFireheart]

Alright I got some issues with this game.

Combat? Great, lots of fun even if it's somewhat slow at times. Easily the high point of the game. +2
Crafting is sorta a pain, not a huge issue. +0
I also like that doors aren't made of titanium diamond rock and you can actually destroy them instead of having to be slave to a thief to lockpick everything. +1
Dungeon crawling is fun too. Another +1.

By biggest beef is with the story. -2

I'm about level 15 and in the forest and... I just don't find it compelling. And I am not finding the lore compelling either.

The game tries to present itself as something big and grand but for whatever reason after you kill that first major boss it kinda... falls off. I half-expected him to have a more major and the fight WAS challenging but... it was kinda anti-climatic that he just died.

I don't find Leandra interesting at all. She's like a boring Saturday morning cartoon character.

None of the side quests or general pace of the story interests me.

The Void Dragon as presented doesn't inspire me to go fight it.

I found the initial quest of investigating the Councillor Jake much more interesting and was kinda sad that it just turned into a red herring.

 

[Serious_Business]

Pretty much the reason I couldn't get through it as well, Dragon Fire Heart (I don't remember who this is except this shitty user name... yeah I don't remember who I am and my shitty user name either so fuck it). Narrative is bad, but what is has going on for it is that it plainly accepts its own superficiality. This is not something that pretends being very deep. You might say otherwise - the story has dramatic tones - but eh, these tones are all based off tropes. You just expect them, you're not meant to invest in them or question them. It's all bullshit and having a good time, pretty much. It can still be unnerving, no doubt, but again, at least it doesn't really pretend being more. There is no depth to be found, no coherent social forces, no psychological, moral or religious conflicts, no detailed history. I'm hoping the second game will go KoTOR2 on all of this and deconstruct that shit to no end. Depth can come out of breaking down superficiality, perhaps. If only through pain - the writing has to suffer, and you too have to suffer, you little shit

 

[DavidBVal]

Pretty much the reason I couldn't get through it as well, Dragon Fire Heart (I don't remember who this is except this shitty user name... yeah I don't remember who I am and my shitty user name either so fuck it). Narrative is bad, but what is has going on for it is that it plainly accepts its own superficiality. This is not something that pretends being very deep. You might say otherwise - the story has dramatic tones - but eh, these tones are all based off tropes. You just expect them, you're not meant to invest in them or question them. It's all bullshit and having a good time, pretty much. It can still be unnerving, no doubt, but again, at least it doesn't really pretend being more. There is no depth to be found, no coherent social forces, no psychological, moral or religious conflicts, no detailed history. I'm hoping the second game will go KoTOR2 on all of this and deconstruct that shit to no end. Depth can come out of breaking down superficiality, perhaps. If only through pain - the writing has to suffer, and you too have to suffer, you little shit

It is as it should be. A story and writing behind an RPG. Emphasis on *behind*. It's true that a few games have managed to build story & characters that were memorable, and made games greater. But once writing becomes relevant, the dangers of taking yourself too seriously are infamous... I'd rather have a light-hearted story that I can pretty much ignore than risk turning a good RPG into yet another lacrimogen pseudo-novel with scripted-romance lurking behind every corner.

My only two real problems with this (otherwise excellent) game are:

Pacing: 2-3 fights, then fucking HOURS of walking around and talking because trying to fight anything out of town is impossible. "Okay" I think. "Let's put aside fighting for a while and let's focus into this murder mystery thingie, it should be fun". But no. I suddenly find myself teleported to the end of time dimension to find out I'm Jesus and must avoid creation itself from being retroactively unmade. Still once I'm back to the normal world, can't defeat 3 skeletons. Confusing, to say the least. Other "broken" pacing times that made the game boring happened in Hiberheim and in the mines.

Slow combat due to animations: really, a fight with 4 goblins that can in no way be a threat shouldn't take me 25 minutes of watching the same animations over and over. They should be skippable.

Minor issues like inventory, the huge amount of useless junk everywhere etc are not important. Combat is good. Character building is fun. Solid game.

 

[Lacrymas]

Can you provide an example of RPGs which take themselves too seriously in the writing department and become drab because of it? I see this argument very often but I haven't seen any examples.

 

[DavidBVal]

For instance:

Spoiler

 

[Lacrymas]

Right, PoE... I kinda block the traumatic experience that it was. Maybe they should've read Descartes and not bother with that line of thinking that is in the screenshot :p

 

[Murk]

Shout out to ma boy Dakkon in option 6.

 

[Endemic]

Sounds like something MCA would write

 

[DraQ]

Pretty much the reason I couldn't get through it as well, Dragon Fire Heart (I don't remember who this is except this shitty user name... yeah I don't remember who I am and my shitty user name either so fuck it). Narrative is bad, but what is has going on for it is that it plainly accepts its own superficiality. This is not something that pretends being very deep. You might say otherwise - the story has dramatic tones - but eh, these tones are all based off tropes. You just expect them, you're not meant to invest in them or question them. It's all bullshit and having a good time, pretty much. It can still be unnerving, no doubt, but again, at least it doesn't really pretend being more. There is no depth to be found, no coherent social forces, no psychological, moral or religious conflicts, no detailed history. I'm hoping the second game will go KoTOR2 on all of this and deconstruct that shit to no end. Depth can come out of breaking down superficiality, perhaps. If only through pain - the writing has to suffer, and you too have to suffer, you little shit

It is as it should be. A story and writing behind an RPG. Emphasis on *behind*. It's true that a few games have managed to build story & characters that were memorable, and made games greater. But once writing becomes relevant, the dangers of taking yourself too seriously are infamous... I'd rather have a light-hearted story that I can pretty much ignore than risk turning a good RPG into yet another lacrimogen pseudo-novel with scripted-romance lurking behind every corner.

My only two real problems with this (otherwise excellent) game are:

Pacing: 2-3 fights, then fucking HOURS of walking around and talking because trying to fight anything out of town is impossible. "Okay" I think. "Let's put aside fighting for a while and let's focus into this murder mystery thingie, it should be fun". But no. I suddenly find myself teleported to the end of time dimension to find out I'm Jesus and must avoid creation itself from being retroactively unmade. Still once I'm back to the normal world, can't defeat 3 skeletons. Confusing, to say the least. Other "broken" pacing times that made the game boring happened in Hiberheim and in the mines.

The thing here is that DOS' pacing problems follow directly from its narrative problems.

The simple fact that you're spending a lot of time NOT braining cultists, undead, ORKZ and all sorts of wildlife or setting them on fire forces you to become invested in the story, it's themes, etc. just to follow the plot and do the quests, so the story, and themes, etc. - which as we have already have established are kind of crap and nauseatingly infantile at times - come to the front and become blockers of gameplay you want. Even though structurally, on purely abstract level most quests are expertly crafted (let's just never speak of two guys one stone, though, especially when you can get two stones at this point), you are not playing abstract structures, you're playing very concrete quests using those structures and if you can't care for the content due to its quality, it becomes the time you are forced to waste before you can teleport ooze barrels on top of guys you've set aflame again.

*IF* DOS story was engrossing, its pacing would be near perfect.
If.

The "suddenly the End of Time" twist was actually VERY welcome as it broke the monotony and introduced some story elements that weren't worn out cliches or saccharine overdoses.

I wouldn't say that DOS took itself too seriously as opposed to being more humorous, nor would I claim the opposite.
No - sadly, it somehow managed to do both at the same time, with wit and drama mutually diluting each other into irrelevance.
Compare Divinity 2 which provided both more poignant (if hammy) story and drama:

Spoiler

AND far stronger humour:

Spoiler

(Not to mention art direction and such).

It doesn't matter whether you're aiming for comedy, drama or just dispensing phat lewt - you need contrast (and thus moderation) in what you're trying to do. Valve understood this (albeit in the context of launching headcrabs at crowbar wielding physicists out of various dark openings), Larian managed to fail consistently on all three fronts in DOS.
It makes it just plain difficult to keep playing and finish DOS, despite it's numerous highlights including various mechanics, beyond awesome music (as usual) and so on.

Can you provide an example of RPGs which take themselves too seriously in the writing department and become drab because of it? I see this argument very often but I haven't seen any examples.

I wouldn't say that seriousness in and of itself is a problem, however, when combined with mediocrity and blandness of story elements it can nuke an otherwise perfectly salvageable or even great game.

 

[SniperHF]

Can you provide an example of RPGs which take themselves too seriously in the writing department and become drab because of it? I see this argument very often but I haven't seen any examples.

D:OS 2's act 1 gets close to that. I don't think it's over the line to where it's a 100% negative for everyone but man they get close. They way over-corrected. I'm hopping the later acts we haven't seen yet reorient a bit due to setting changes.

 

[anvi]

I hate stories and dialogue.

 

[gaussgunner]

Can you provide an example of RPGs which take themselves too seriously in the writing department and become drab because of it? I see this argument very often but I haven't seen any examples.

Avadon.

 

[anvi]

Can you provide an example of RPGs which take themselves too seriously in the writing department and become drab because of it? I see this argument very often but I haven't seen any examples.

Every RPG ever? I have to think way back to stuff like Eye of the Beholder to remember a game that didn't bore the shit out of me with amateurish writing posing as something worthwhile.