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Game News Divinity: Original Sin Kickstarter Campaign Begins + Hands-on Preview at RPGWatch

BobtheTree

Savant
Joined
Nov 22, 2011
Messages
389
All these kickstarters and Codex fundraisers are ruining my attempts to hoard money. I pay more for these campaigns than I do for games already released :retarded:
I hear you. I've easily spent 5x more money on Kickstaters than I have on games that are actually out in the past year.
 

Stabwound

Arcane
Joined
Dec 17, 2008
Messages
3,240
Damn, this makes me want to play Divine Divinity again. I didn't realize there's even an official widescreen and bugfix patch on the GOG version. I hope it's as good as I remember, because I haven't played it since it came out.
 

DarkUnderlord

Professional Throne Sitter
Staff Member
Joined
Jun 18, 2002
Messages
28,544
Wow - the things you have to do to get your password reset on this forum - my bank has less security. And really ? Forcing me to read Todd & Pete misspell ERgo Draconis to get my password back ? Kinda cool but still...
At the Codex, we value our members paranoia security.

Yes, we (well, I) did ruin it a little bit as detailed elsewhere in this thread, but we're scrambling, and we actually could use some feedback regarding what rewards you'd like to see.

I gathered from some posts you're not really happy with our rewards, but what I'd really like to know is, what is it that would make you... well, not happy... but ... well... less unhappy ? Honestly, we are making the type of game you guys (and occasional girl) should actually like, I think, so your thoughts actually do matter to us. (You cannot even start to imagine what this does to our psyche). So if you feel like offering some ideas, we'll pick them up (insert big disclaimer here)
Personally, they're too personal.

Starting with one of your lowest rewards, which has only 1 backer:

Kickstarter Potion: You will receive a unique personalized code that will unlock a Kickstarter potion in your game. Drinking this potion will do several things to the game showing you how much we appreciate your support. (Potion will not affect the game balance.)​

No detail on what the potion does. Are its effects unique to me - or does everyone who gets the potion get the same potion? For $10, the potion can't do much, otherwise you'll be making a lot of different effects.

Divinity Dragon Commander Digital Copy: Two games, two times the fun! You'll recieve a code for Dragon Commander as soon as it is released (ETA July 2013). You won't have to wait for your Divinity Fix with this package! Dragon Commander Digital Edition will be DRM-free, and will be localized in English, French, German, Polish and Russian. Additional languages may be added. The game will initially be available for PC. If Mac and Linux versions, and other languages, become available they will be free to owners of PC copies (digitally). Digital copies will have to be downloaded via your preferred digital retailer such as Steam or GOG.com if available. This low price is only available to those who help fund.​

Now we get reward tiers that include other games (other games which then seem to disappear from the later tiers). Is this a KickStarter for Divinity or a sales pitch for your other games? Why do I want Dragon Commander? Nowhere on the page does it say what "Dragon Commander" is. Is money for this KickStarter going to this "Dragon Commander" thing? Of course we all know it's a completely different game (an RTS) - but you aren't selling to those who know. Is Dragon Commander in jepoardy if this KickStarter is unsuccessful? Are you trying to pitch two games? Besides, I like RPGs so why would I want an RTS game too?

Message in a Bottle: You will receive a unique personalized code that unlocks a personal message in your copy of the game. You write the message! This message will be written on a scroll within a bottle, and will inconspicuously wash ashore in the beginning of the game. You can give the message to any person you'll be playing Divinity: Original Sin with.​

Now we get completely lame. I'm pretty sure I'll be able to mod any message I want into my own copy of the game. Whoop-dee-doo. $100 for that? If I contribute, I want to impact YOUR game. And I want OTHER PLAYERS to see it. Not just my friends who may play the game with me. I want the official wiki to have the explanation that "the message you find in xyz is from so-and-so who contributed to the $$$ tier". I want EVERYONE who plays this game to know I contributed something. Not just some other person I may happen to give it to when I'm in co-op with them. This is "too personal". It only affects me and my copy. I can affect my own copy myself. And I want to find other people's messages in my game. That's the point of crowd-funding isn't it? To see what the crowd can come up with?

Name the Undead: You will be able to name one of the undead creatures in the first area of the game. This name will only show up in your copy of the game by using a unique personalized unlock code. Near the starting village, there is a place known as the Black Cove. Within the black cove are a number of ghosts. You could be one of them! (Well, we mean, at least, one will carry a name you give them, you won't actually become a ghost, obviously.)​

Again, whoop-dee-doo. MY copy of the game has me fighting zombies called "Bob". Again I'm pretty sure I can mod that shit in and again, who gives a fuck? I don't want the wiki to say "Green Zombie: This green zombie will be named differently if you donated $125." Wow. Can it get lamer? I want the wiki to say "Borgen Storkmurkers are so named and attack you by peeing yellow acid on your face because DarkUnderlord of rpgcodex.net paid $1,000". And I want EVERYONE to fight them in THEIR copy of the game. Not just me.

After that I can name a pet (again, only in my copy), a dialogue that nobody else will see and a henchman no-one else can play with. And really, shit like this should be a default option. I can't name my own pet without paying for the privilege? Text fields are too hard?

The $1,000 for an item is good and $500 for a combo seems all right. But then for $5,000... I get to name a jailer. $5,000 for a text field update? Ok, so it will kind of look like me, maybe if I squint really hard but I don't get to design him myself? Same with the Committee.

And for other KickStarters we've had inns, locations and entire parties to encounter for $5,000.

And again for $10,000 I get... a name. Ok in that instance I can design him. Neat. But you focus on the name far too much. Mysterious Stranger seems more interesting by comparison.

My suggestions:
- Keep your other games separate. Focus on pitching the one product.
- Keep your rewards to benefits related to that one product (cloth map, box, digital assets, art book, original concept art prints etc...)
- Throw in special things I won't get elsewhere. We all know that digital shit's gonna be all over the internet the minute the game's released, so throw in some reward tiers with tangible stuff. You've done some of this but I'd put in T-Shirts, Special limited edition figurines etc...
- I don't want things that effect just MY copy, I want to have an impact on the Divinity world. If you want to name something, I want the bartender in the 2nd city in town to be named as I choose. Or I want the bar wench in the inn in the first city to be named as per my choice, or I want the evil zombies outside of that town named because I bought that. Not just my copy. And I want those names in EVERYONE'S game. I want everyone to know about my small contribution to the Divinity world, not just me.
- The codes would be more interesting if EVERYONE could use them. Being able to combine multiple codes, to share your code on the internet and unlock someone else's things (as well as your own) in the game would be semi-interesting but it's still a far cry from "everyone gets to find my message in the bottle".

Other than that, other points are:
- You went too early, Torment is still running. We've got no interest in promoting your KickStarter here until we complete our Torment fundraiser. That's less publicity for you (not much but means it gets lost in the wash - and we're fans here! If your fans aren't talking about your game, why would anyone else?).
- The fact that the game is already completed and at no risk of not happening if the KickStarter fails is a major disincentive. If we raise $1,000 for an option and your KickStarter fails, do we still get our thing in the game?
 

hiver

Guest
I never even checked the tiers above 35 in detail, because i simply dont have any more money at the moment. Just noticed there is only one 10K place.

But... all these things are for the player who backed those tiers only? Wha?
I though these pets and names and messages will be in the game for everyone...
All that should be changed as DU suggests. I mean... seriously.
 

Jestai

Augur
Patron
Joined
Mar 24, 2013
Messages
135
Design a dungeon with enemies named by your high tier backers. Get a $10,000 pledge for the Codex to have the area boss be an androgynous emo troll called Roguey.
 

hiver

Guest
Thats actually not bad. Except Roquey. How about codex makes its special troll then?
I mean... pretty obvious but ... hey.
 
Self-Ejected

Davaris

Self-Ejected
Developer
Joined
Mar 7, 2005
Messages
6,547
Location
Idiocracy
I have never played their games and the pitch video gives me the impression, it is a turn based hack and slash. So tell me guys, do they tell a story that fires the imagination? The story was mentioned at the end of the video, almost in passing.

The game does look amazing, but the pitch was a little dull, because all they talked about was features. As a player, I am not interested in feature lists, feature lists is something developers are interested in, because they worked so hard on them. As a player, I want to know who I will be, what my character will be doing in this world and why it will be fun. I also want to know what is so interesting about this game world.
 

Murk

Arcane
Joined
Jan 17, 2008
Messages
13,459
Based off the amount of potential combos from environmental (natural and player made) effects, crowd control, and placement of characters possible I didn't get a "hack and slash" vibe at all. The combat system looks REALLY good -- I'm hoping to hear more specifics from Gragt but so far what he's said sounds great.

Regardless of the KS's efficacy, I'm super stoked for this game -- I have been since hearing about it and my excitement as only increased.
 
Self-Ejected

Davaris

Self-Ejected
Developer
Joined
Mar 7, 2005
Messages
6,547
Location
Idiocracy
By hack and slash I mean, does this game consist of combat and little else, like Diablo 1? As someone who has never played their games and is interested in contributing, that is the impression the video is giving me. If the impression I am getting is wrong, they need to make a video that explains it better.
 

Zeriel

Arcane
Joined
Jun 17, 2012
Messages
13,963
Considering the majority of that video shows them clicking through dialogue trees & talking about the dialogue system which is a centerpiece of the entire game design, I'm not sure any video could convince you it's not Diablo 1.
 

Commissar Draco

Codexia Comrade Colonel Commissar
Patron
Joined
Mar 6, 2011
Messages
20,872
Location
Привислинский край
Insert Title Here Strap Yourselves In Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Divinity: Original Sin 2
Agree with ^ but Sapiens are Sapiens and need MOAR gratifications from this; you won't seduce them into paying by showing dull numbers and facts. Story in DD1 was good and with some twist or two inside and liked houmous dialogue from Divinity 2 but agree they must sell more hope and show some candy for story fags. Making good game is 10% of work selling her counts. Right?
:hearnoevil::balance:
 
Self-Ejected

Davaris

Self-Ejected
Developer
Joined
Mar 7, 2005
Messages
6,547
Location
Idiocracy
Considering the majority of that video shows them clicking through dialogue trees & talking about the dialogue system which is a centerpiece of the entire game design, I'm not sure any video could convince you it's not Diablo 1.

Yet almost nothing is said about the story and game world. I stopped the video just before the story was mentioned, because the discussion of features went on so long. The only reason I found out there was a story, is because I forced myself to watch the rest of the video. That should never happen, when you are trying to sell someone something.

The game looks good but the pitch needs improvement, is what I am saying.
 

Zeriel

Arcane
Joined
Jun 17, 2012
Messages
13,963
Personally I'd rather see them talk about objective things (turn-based, toolkit, co-op dialogue) than subjective things ("OUR STORY IS SUPER COOL HONEST"), but perhaps that comes from a place of having played their games in the past and trusting their content to generally be of an acceptable level. Lord knows I'm probably a weird creature, though, since my reaction to the Torment videos, which was kind of the antithesis of the Divinity one and exactly what you're asking for was... well...

"Oh, boy. Here comes the hype machine."

Story is ultimately art, and art is utterly subjective. For what it's worth, though, Larian generally trades in high fantasy with dashes of humor executed in a straight style reminscient of old school gaming, before Bioware infected high fantasy and made it deserving of loathing. If you hate generic fantasy, it probably isn't going to sell you, but it is always of worksmanship quality.

If I had to use one phrase to describe Larian's storytelling style it would be: "refreshingly earnest". It's no Torment, but that's okay.
 
Self-Ejected

Davaris

Self-Ejected
Developer
Joined
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Messages
6,547
Location
Idiocracy
Way to miss the point guys. I am showing the owners what people that have never played their games are thinking, when they see this pitch video. They want to sell to more than just the loyal customers they already have. This Kickstarter should be doing massive business.
 

Commissar Draco

Codexia Comrade Colonel Commissar
Patron
Joined
Mar 6, 2011
Messages
20,872
Location
Привислинский край
Insert Title Here Strap Yourselves In Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Divinity: Original Sin 2
Way to miss the point guys. I am showing the owners what people that have never played their games are thinking, when they see this pitch video. They want to sell to more than just the loyal customers they already have. This Kickstarter should be doing massive business.

Agree they must sell their pitch to those who didn't donated or even heard of them.
 

MicoSelva

backlog digger
Patron
Joined
Sep 10, 2010
Messages
7,520
Location
The Oldest House
Codex 2012 Codex 2013 Codex 2014 PC RPG Website of the Year, 2015 Codex 2016 - The Age of Grimoire Make the Codex Great Again! Grab the Codex by the pussy Insert Title Here RPG Wokedex Strap Yourselves In Codex Year of the Donut Codex+ Now Streaming! Enjoy the Revolution! Another revolution around the sun that is. Serpent in the Staglands Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Divinity: Original Sin 2 Bubbles In Memoria A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag. Pathfinder: Wrath I helped put crap in Monomyth
According to VGChartz Divinity II sold 350K units around the world. This is probably understimated, but even If only 10% of that many people donated to the KS, that would be more than enough (35,000 x $25 = 875,000).
 

MicoSelva

backlog digger
Patron
Joined
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Messages
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Codex 2012 Codex 2013 Codex 2014 PC RPG Website of the Year, 2015 Codex 2016 - The Age of Grimoire Make the Codex Great Again! Grab the Codex by the pussy Insert Title Here RPG Wokedex Strap Yourselves In Codex Year of the Donut Codex+ Now Streaming! Enjoy the Revolution! Another revolution around the sun that is. Serpent in the Staglands Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Divinity: Original Sin 2 Bubbles In Memoria A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag. Pathfinder: Wrath I helped put crap in Monomyth
According to VGChartz Divinity II sold 350K units around the world. This is probably understimated, but even If only 10% of that many people donated to the KS, that would be more than enough (35,000 x $25 = 875,000).

Unfortunately only around 4500 backers so far, and still not even 200 000$. :(
I think the numbers so far are enough to assume it will get funded, but I wouldn't expect reaching 250% funding level, or so. Let's hope they really only need 400K, and not a million or more.

Now we get completely lame. I'm pretty sure I'll be able to mod any message I want into my own copy of the game. Whoop-dee-doo. $100 for that? If I contribute, I want to impact YOUR game. And I want OTHER PLAYERS to see it. Not just my friends who may play the game with me. I want the official wiki to have the explanation that "the message you find in xyz is from so-and-so who contributed to the $$$ tier". I want EVERYONE who plays this game to know I contributed something. Not just some other person I may happen to give it to when I'm in co-op with them. This is "too personal". It only affects me and my copy. I can affect my own copy myself. And I want to find other people's messages in my game. That's the point of crowd-funding isn't it? To see what the crowd can come up with?

Again, whoop-dee-doo. MY copy of the game has me fighting zombies called "Bob". Again I'm pretty sure I can mod that shit in and again, who gives a fuck? I don't want the wiki to say "Green Zombie: This green zombie will be named differently if you donated $125." Wow. Can it get lamer? I want the wiki to say "Borgen Storkmurkers are so named and attack you by peeing yellow acid on your face because DarkUnderlord of rpgcodex.net paid $1,000". And I want EVERYONE to fight them in THEIR copy of the game. Not just me.

After that I can name a pet (again, only in my copy), a dialogue that nobody else will see and a henchman no-one else can play with. And really, shit like this should be a default option. I can't name my own pet without paying for the privilege? Text fields are too hard?
You're kind of right, but I don't want every schmuck with $150 able to induce my game with stupid memes. If these were global, they would have to moderated in some way, so we don't meet an undead party consisting of zombies named David Bowie, Mick Jaeger and Lady Gaga skeleton.

Ok, that would actually be kind of cool, but You get my point.
 

felipepepe

Codex's Heretic
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Joined
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Messages
17,310
Location
Terra da Garoa
I want the wiki to say "Borgen Storkmurkers are so named and attack you by peeing yellow acid on your face because DarkUnderlord of rpgcodex.net paid $1,000". And I want EVERYONE to fight them in THEIR copy of the game. Not just me.
Completly true, I also thought that was a very uninteresting way to do those rewards.

Also, we know know what DU will do with the D:OS fundraiser... :roll:
 

hiver

Guest
Way to miss the point guys. I am showing the owners what people that have never played their games are thinking, when they see this pitch video. They want to sell to more than just the loyal customers they already have. This Kickstarter should be doing massive business.
Thats exactly what i suggested to them already, as one of the major angles they need to cover in their updates.
 

krist2

Augur
Patron
Joined
Oct 5, 2009
Messages
164
Codex 2013 Serpent in the Staglands Divinity: Original Sin Wasteland 2 Codex USB, 2014 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2
Larian blog update

Personally, I think we can still have a campaign that can go way beyond our funding goal, though admittedly, we will need to fix a few obvious things (well, they’re obvious now
icon_wink.gif
) like the rewards, part of the story we tell (less features, more who and why), and what happens if we fail in this Kickstarter. Thank you to DarkUnderlord,Robcat and the rest of the gang for helping us get these insights btw.

Lets hope this one gets funded, almost certain that it will.
 

oldmanpaco

Master of Siestas
Joined
Nov 8, 2008
Messages
13,624
Location
Fall
Have they talked about the editor anywhere yet?
 

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