Eador Genesis

[DakaSha]

sher wtf I have a weird blue question mark on a neighbor province.. what is that?

You probably built one of the buildings that lets you see hidden resources in a province. I.e. if a hill has ore or a forest has trees. They show as question marks once you have the required building.

Ah thanks


Anyways im loving this BUT currently all my fights are me placing my scout or mage behind a line of spearmen and spamming either attack spells or bow shots :-/
Hoping this doesnt become the entire combat gameplay

 

[Malakal]

Unlikely, have you seen higher level spells? Well, I didnt but I found a level 4 scroll that gave all troops another turn after they used theirs. Crazy. For other heroes I guess tactics dont change that much, especially archers and warriors always fight the same way. But there are many different types of units at least.

 

[DakaSha]

My problem is that i see no reason (currently) to even use anything besides the spearmen when i use my mage or my scout. Make a line... spam on enemy charging at you. Lose like 2 25 gold spearmen. One of my spearmen is level 9 or 10 now.

Maybe it will change when the battles get harder. I do have to admit that I'm turtling like an asshole and may just not be challenged because I'm destroying things at leisure. In fact i'm completely surrounded by some asshole (that wont attack me)

 

[Borelli]

At my second shard i had encountered a local lord having minotaur guard in his stronghold, 6 of them.Holy shit. They are like tier 3 units you are not supposed to have more than 2 of them but SIX?! At the very beginning of the game?!

My main hero was a scout>scout and even though his dmg was great they would simply chop his way to him in no time, so in order to win that map i first conquered every single province then hired a warrior, then grinded him to >lvl 10, attacked with my scout killed 2 minotaurs, in the same turn attacked with warrior killed 1.5, 5 turns later rezzed both attacked again and finally won. At the end score screen showed like 300 turns passed, got explorer and conqueror medals. Bottom line - AI is a bastard.

I have experimented with various starting "build orders" and the most successful for me was forge > swordsmen school. At first i would buy 3 swordsmen (may need extra gold at the beginning from astral energy for this to work) but then i wouldn't have enough money for healers and then i would have to spend time just exploring so now i switched to 1 swordsman+starting militiaman+slinger, when those 2 die (and they will) i add a second swordsman by that time i have gathered 200 gold needed for a single healer, after that early game for me is set.
I have given some thought to building library>spell school that gives you cure so that my hero could take the role of a healer(library+school is only 100 gold) but haven't tried that yet.
I don't want to build militaman building because they suck and take away 1 precious slot for something else, they give garrison but that garrison also sucks.

If he moves and attacks in same round he spends additional stamina point.

I did not now that (don't remember if this little piece of information was in the tutorial), this makes the tactic of just retreating 1 step and letting enemy attack very viable for tiring him out.

 

[Ashery]

Spearmen don't seem to have great survivability, though, even compared to other T1 units. They also don't benefit as much from medals due to their low stats and cost. Those two points are critical for quick expansion in the early game as you're otherwise relying purely on the level of your hero to break through the second ring of provinces (For skirmish games, at least).

I will say, though, that level fifteen horsemen are fucking beasts. About the only thing my Wiz->Com can't handle right now is a dragon due to their magic immunity.

 

[william blake]

My problem is that i see no reason (currently) to even use anything besides the spearmen when i use my mage or my scout. Make a line... spam on enemy charging at you. .. In fact i'm completely surrounded by some asshole (that wont attack me)

lets see what will happen.if those asshole attack and destroy you,next time your task is:build more veterans,pass easy fights and seek for a hader ones to keep the tempo,reach tier2 units asap.
with some unit/hero combo this haste leads to the complex and tricky fights

 

[william blake]

Spearmen don't seem to have great survivability, though, even compared to other T1 units.

some say they better than swordsman at higher levels personally i prefer barbarians . sometimes they get +3 attack at level 7-8 already

I will say, though, that level fifteen horsemen are fucking beasts. About the only thing my Wiz->Com can't handle right now is a dragon due to their magic immunity.

nealy any tier2 units are fucking beasts at level 15.wiz->com thats the real beast.

I found a level 4 scroll that gave all troops another turn after they used theirs. Crazy.

yes,many level 4 spells are ultimate weapons.and considering that building your own mage guild to level 4 its like an impossible task,find those scroll as a loot is some sort of luck
..
can you guys read my scribble?google translate sucks.

 

[Trash]

Had a gruelling game against two Expert AI opponents. One had almost half the map and the other about a quarter. Managed to isolate the smaller one and grinded away at the bigger one. Problem was, smaller dude had massive Militias and bigger AI as well. Fought I was going to lose for a while but finally managed to get the upper hand on the bigger one. From then on a grind.

Love how the game forces you to adapt all the time.

 

[sher]

sher wtf I have a weird blue question mark on a neighbor province.. what is that?

You probably built one of the buildings that lets you see hidden resources in a province. I.e. if a hill has ore or a forest has trees. They show as question marks once you have the required building.

Oh, THOSE question marks? :D

I was too confused by "weird" word. There's nothing "weird" about them - it's just a resource icon with question within it above resource image. I thought it was obvious. If such sign is red and without question mark then you need to defeat location guard to get resource and you can build buildings for each terrain type to reveal hidden resources (question marks). It's all in building descriptions. I've imagined large blue question marks in a size of a province - that would be weird indeed.

Hoping this doesnt become the entire combat gameplay

If you have no one to compete with, to deliver you your judgment day then you can grind all the map in such manner. But purpose is to win shard not to grind. Or you can attack several dragons, some cult, lands of giants and so on :D

If he moves and attacks in same round he spends additional stamina point.

I did not now that (don't remember if this little piece of information was in the tutorial), this makes the tactic of just retreating 1 step and letting enemy attack very viable for tiring him out.

Tutorial teaches only basics. But there is no too much hidden information it's not ADOM though creator definitely values rouge like approach.

 

[Ashery]

If he moves and attacks in same round he spends additional stamina point.

I did not now that (don't remember if this little piece of information was in the tutorial), this makes the tactic of just retreating 1 step and letting enemy attack very viable for tiring him out.

Tutorial teaches only basics. But there is no too much hidden information it's not ADOM though creator definitely values rouge like approach.

The more roguelike approach is probably one reason I'm enjoying it as much as I am. DCS

Spearmen don't seem to have great survivability, though, even compared to other T1 units.

some say they better than swordsman at higher levels personally i prefer barbarians . sometimes they get +3 attack at level 7-8 already

As you're relying on google translate, are you talking about the spearmen (brown, no resource) or is there a mistake in translating pikemen (silver, iron required)? I wouldn't be surprised if the pikemen had better survivability, but spearmen just don't seem to have enough initial defense to pull it off.

I will say, though, that level fifteen horsemen are fucking beasts. About the only thing my Wiz->Com can't handle right now is a dragon due to their magic immunity.

nealy any tier2 units are fucking beasts at level 15.wiz->com thats the real beast.

The thing is, though, that horsemen have a relatively easy time obtaining such a high rank. I had my horse archers for a significantly longer period, but they had yet to break the teens.

can you guys read my scribble?google translate sucks.

It's good enough XD

Oh, and Borelli, building the recruitment center for militiamen isn't a terrible investment for the early game. If you're going for a good route, you only really need three (Healer, crossbow, sword/pike)

 

[KoolNoodles]

Has anybody managed to play this multiplayer or does it even have that? I guess I'll find out soon enough. Just that my bro and I tried to play some Age of Wonders and also Warlock, with limited success in multiplayer, and this looks like it might be a fun one to try out.

 

[sher]

Pikeman is stronger than Swordsman but only when he is developed enough to have high counterattack. He has one huge tactical advantage over swordsman - he can hold back enemies preventing them from attacking and forcing them to be an obstacle to their friends reducing number of effective melee attackers based on their remaining HP not on their attack strength. Thus he can hold back even T3-T4 units if they are wounded or/and winded enough. Swordsman relies on his Armor and Parry so only T1 and some T2 units will not attack him because it's hopeless to deal any damage. But Pikeman is more fragile and have no shield => low ranged defense which is his huge disadvantage early and since T1 role is to develop first heroes, to gain initial power... It's all balanced

 

[Lightknight]

Pikeman is stronger than Swordsman but only when he is developed enough to have high counterattack. He has one huge tactical advantage over swordsman

meh, that's not a huge advantage. The advantage is pikeman can't be one-shotted without at least some consequences for the attacker, but as for enemy distraction you can do the same with swordsmen by just leaving an open path through the ranks to your hero/healer, weaker units will go out of their way to get there and avoid swordsmen.

 

[DakaSha]

My problem is that i see no reason (currently) to even use anything besides the spearmen when i use my mage or my scout. Make a line... spam on enemy charging at you. .. In fact i'm completely surrounded by some asshole (that wont attack me)

lets see what will happen.if those asshole attack and destroy you,next time your task is:build more veterans,pass easy fights and seek for a hader ones to keep the tempo,reach tier2 units asap.
with some unit/hero combo this haste leads to the complex and tricky fights

The thing isnt that its easy to win fights. The problem is that i win them all exactly the same way. Early game i had to really think and use the mechanics to win. Now I dont.

BUT i can imagine that when the fights are harder that i will have to resort to 'tricky' tactics again

 

[sher]

-----
GREAT STUFF !!!

Game can be tweaked to run faster to spend less time to watch unit movements and such things.

In main folder there is file Eador.cfg. Within there are useful settings. This works fine for me right now:
Refresh delay (default 40): 25
Poll mouse delay (default 25): 20

Much faster and responsive.
-----

Pikeman is stronger than Swordsman but only when he is developed enough to have high counterattack. He has one huge tactical advantage over swordsman

meh, that's not a huge advantage. The advantage is pikeman can't be one-shotted without at least some consequences for the attacker, but as for enemy distraction you can do the same with swordsmen by just leaving an open path through the ranks to your hero/healer, weaker units will go out of their way to get there and avoid swordsmen.

You need space for that and this will not prevent some Сannibal to kill your veteran Swordsman with Crushing strike of his giant club. But Pikeman will turn crippled Сannibal into obstacle preventing other brawlers to deal damage to your line. Pikemen also can be used dispersed to lure enemies behind front lines in earlier described manner. Veterans are not for just dealing some damage before they'll die. Pikemen are too expensive to be used as untrained expendables.

I have experimented with various starting "build orders" and the most successful for me was forge > swordsmen school. At first i would buy 3 swordsmen (may need extra gold at the beginning from astral energy for this to work) but then i wouldn't have enough money for healers and then i would have to spend time just exploring so now i switched to 1 swordsman+starting militiaman+slinger, when those 2 die (and they will) i add a second swordsman by that time i have gathered 200 gold needed for a single healer, after that early game for me is set.

You can try this build order on Expert:
Turn 1. Hire Warrior (or other hero), build that thing that sells chainmail and first shield and weapons. Buy chainmail and some shield and/or weapon if starting ones are not good enough. Attack either first circle province with Free men (I don't know translation) or Goblins or easy location in your main province (like goblins) with starting troops.
Turn 2. Usually only your hero will survive with few HP. Build stuff to hire Swordsmen. Return to your main province or start plundering it right away.
Turn 3. Build Altar. Start or continue plundering your main province.
Turn 4. Build stuff to hire Healers. If you have enough money to hire 2 Swordsmen + 1 Healer then do it if not then you can plunder for 1 more turn or hire 1 Swordsman + Healer if you have some easy location in your main province to clear and hire second Swordsman after that.

After that you'll have your main army for some time and negative balance but it doesn't matter. Citizens will be pissed off but it's for their own good and in main province you'll get many options to please them in time.

BUT i can imagine that when the fights are harder that i will have to resort to 'tricky' tactics again

Exactly. You're not risking => more daring opponent started to win or to gain advantage over you.

 

[sher]

My main hero was a scout>scout and even though his dmg was great they would simply chop his way to him in no time, so in order to win that map i first conquered every single province then hired a warrior, then grinded him to >lvl 10, attacked with my scout killed 2 minotaurs, in the same turn attacked with warrior killed 1.5, 5 turns later rezzed both attacked again and finally won. At the end score screen showed like 300 turns passed, got explorer and conqueror medals. Bottom line - AI is a bastard.

:D AI was just lucky to get rare guard contract somewhere. It could be no sweet minotaurs but Army of Light with a lot of healers which regenerates quickly or Armada with 5 Elephants.

 

[Malakal]

My main hero was a scout>scout and even though his dmg was great they would simply chop his way to him in no time, so in order to win that map i first conquered every single province then hired a warrior, then grinded him to >lvl 10, attacked with my scout killed 2 minotaurs, in the same turn attacked with warrior killed 1.5, 5 turns later rezzed both attacked again and finally won. At the end score screen showed like 300 turns passed, got explorer and conqueror medals. Bottom line - AI is a bastard.

:D AI was just lucky to get rare guard contract somewhere. It could be no sweet minotaurs but Army of Light with a lot of healers which regenerates quickly or Armada with 5 Elephants.

Worst I had was 6 ogres but those are not as bad as minotaurs (who seem to be higher level berserkers with insane attack power and good hp). But as I said I personally found phoenix guard contract so it CAN get worse. Way worse.

My problem is that i see no reason (currently) to even use anything besides the spearmen when i use my mage or my scout. Make a line... spam on enemy charging at you. Lose like 2 25 gold spearmen. One of my spearmen is level 9 or 10 now.

Maybe it will change when the battles get harder. I do have to admit that I'm turtling like an asshole and may just not be challenged because I'm destroying things at leisure. In fact i'm completely surrounded by some asshole (that wont attack me)

With spearmen any kind of advanced unit will decimate your ranks. Ogres, trolls, minotaurs once they reach your troops will make short work of them and your hero alone wont stop them. So its all good for early games, becomes infeasible later on.

 

[DakaSha]

Good. I was hoping that would be the case.
Does it stay feasible to stay on the defensive every fight? I am hoping not. Obviously the AI is ueber aggressive making a defensive position stronger in most cases but maybe when they have some magic slingers in the back it will force me to actually go on a raging attack

 

[Ashery]

Good. I was hoping that would be the case.
Does it stay feasible to stay on the defensive every fight? I am hoping not. Obviously the AI is ueber aggressive making a defensive position stronger in most cases but maybe when they have some magic slingers in the back it will force me to actually go on a raging attack

It depends on the terrain, your hero, and the composition of your army. I'm still dabbling with various hero starts on an expert sandbox game, and my warrior, pike, healer group can fucking decimate pure melee groups, but I have trouble with groups of casters that my wizard or scout would typically steamroll.

In general, though, defense tends to be better if only because of fatigue.

For minotaurs, etc., Wiz->Com will utterly destroy them with sleep.

 

[DakaSha]

Well yes the early game is interesting because it takes work. Just in that game i was talking about, the mid game became a game of spearmen walls. maybe it was just the way i had built

edit: what do i need to do to successfully negotiate with barbarians?

 

[Bulba]

For minotaurs, etc., Wiz->Com will utterly destroy them with sleep.

Wiz->Com gets smng like +4 to spell length and an extra lvl 3 creature? I always thought that that's the weakest wiz build, since as a normal build you get +2 to spell length anyway, plus with extra +2 to magic penetration it kinda balances out, being able to cast two spells in one go is madly superior to one extra lvl 3 creature.

 

[Borelli]

Return to your main province or start plundering it right away.

Plunder my own people? Never.

Also i just found out that when in a province with un-disbandable guards the plunder icon turns to "attack guards" icon that's cool.

 

[william blake]

As you're relying on google translate, are you talking about the spearmen (brown, no resource) or is there a mistake in translating pikemen (silver, iron required)?

no its only my fault.some guy whith stick in hands,you know?pike,spear..just stick in hands.i totally forgot these crappy spearmen

The thing is, though, that horsemen have a relatively easy time obtaining such a high rank. I had my horse archers for a significantly longer period, but they had yet to break the teens.

ah,yes
more damage inflict,more damage receive-more expirience obtain
with melee troops its simple-just stay in battle
and ranged troops reqire more attention

Has anybody managed to play this multiplayer or does it even have that? I guess I'll find out soon enough. Just that my bro and I tried to play some Age of Wonders and also Warlock, with limited success in multiplayer, and this looks like it might be a fun one to try out.

sadly,but hotseat only.and its fun for sure.
just learn not to die on neutrals before going hotseat.this is important.

edit: what do i need to do to successfully negotiate with barbarians?

afair,there is no way to negotiate with those bastards.

 

[william blake]

being able to cast two spells in one go is madly superior to one extra lvl 3 creature.

wiz->com its a pure buffer/debuffer.and sometimes mass debuff is better than doublecast damage-dealing spells
mass desease and mass slow next turn-and wait till your opponent die.cheap and effective.
and between 10->20 level wiz->com grows a bit faster

 

[Trash]

That massive militia contract the AI tends to get at the start of the game is a bitch when you're up against it. 14 units of peasants, spearmen and some archers can ruin your day real quick. Irritating is when the AI dumps them on every province it has as taking them out will usually cost you quite a bit of your force. Meaning you have a good chance of losing vets while the militia are all level 11-14. Spells to take out archers quickly, healers to keep your frontline intact and a good solid line of melee backed up by own misile units seemed to give me best results. Also never, ever forget to build a line of stables from your stronghold to the frontlines for quicker resupply. Especially when you don't have the building yet that lets your heroes access the stronghold inventory. Oh, and build outposts to fortify the lines. Expensive but they'll mean the AI won't be able to overrun you.