ELEX ELEX II - Jax is back

[Roguey]

Do you of any sales figures? Did elex 2 sell more than 1st?

Wondering what's gonna happen with the company.

Doesn't look like it, but if Embracer was going to shut them down I think they would have done so already?

They continue to post videos I have no intention of watching https://www.youtube.com/@PiranhaBytesOfficial/videos

 

[cvv]

One of their videos is "Creative Doldrums", in which Pankratz says right from the getgo "I'm in creative doldrums".

Dude, you've been there since you finished Risen 1.

 

[GloomFrost]

Do you of any sales figures? Did elex 2 sell more than 1st?

Wondering what's gonna happen with the company.

Doesn't look like it, but if Embracer was going to shut them down I think they would have done so already?

They continue to post videos I have no intention of watching https://www.youtube.com/@PiranhaBytesOfficial/videos

I don't know the actual numbers BUT...... it seams that releasing Gothic 1 (over 20 year old game) on Switch is more profitable then releasing DX12 patch for Elex 2. So yeah it did not sell well at all.

 

[Joyvankek]

So ...

Elex 2 > Starfield? Genuinely curious. Playing Elex 2 now (can't recall much from 1. Was a few years ago when I played it).

So far it seems most "issues of today" aren't in Elex 2. Or at the very least, Elex 2 isn't taking every single opportunity like Starfield to scream at the top of its lungs "LOOK HOW PROGRESSIVE WE ARE!"

Total honest, haven't played Starfield, but judging by the thread on the Codex, I don't think I really will.

The world in Starfield is fucking empty, the cities are meh, they did companions better(at least by the amount of lines of text they speak) that the ones in Skyrim.
The procedural generation of planets is shit, I encountered stuff like 3 the exact same buildings in a row, with the exact same items placed in the exact same locations as in building explored before. Then I went to another procedurally generated location on another planet, and guess what, I encountered the same building. Though with different items and enemies.

Ship customization is fun, but what's the point, when there is nothing to do in space. You mostly just fast travel.
If I want to fly ships, X4 is much better. If I want ship and planet exploration, No Man Sky would be my pick over this.

The storyline is yet another "you are the chosen one", the guilds are shit.
And you have a tranny niggress to boot in The Vanguard guild.

Elex 2 is much better.

 

[lukaszek]

The storyline is yet another "you are the chosen one"

do you start in prison/bunker?

 

[Joyvankek]

The storyline is yet another "you are the chosen one"

do you start in prison/bunker?

You start in a mining facility, that is in a bunker.

 

[Justicar]

PUT ELEXIT STRAIGHT INTO MY DICK.

 

[Baardhaas]

Finished it today. Fairly entertaining, but overall a forgettable experience. The writing towards the end was hilariously bad though. Especially every bit where your son, Dex's involved. My favorite part was when he gives you an amulet. But if you it view it in your inventory it reads something along the lines of 'this shiny bauble might fetch a nice price at a merchant'. His death felt like a weird plot device, the game didn't even bother to explain why he would die. Afterwards, when all is done his mother just congratulates you on a job well done. No mention of her son.

The constant reuse of the same monster models, just with a different texture and more hitpoints didn't impress me either. All in all I rate this game gothic/10. Entertaining in the beginning but begins to drag towards the end. It was fairly bug free though, that was nice.

 

[Lyre Mors]

gothic/10

Should probably be something more like Gothic III/10. Seems more appropriate.

 

[Baardhaas]

gothic/10

Should probably be something more like Gothic III/10. Seems more appropriate.

That actually crossed my mind while typing the post. But Gothic III's problems are of a different order than Elex II's. Back then, Piranha Bytes had ambition, they made an excellent map, beautiful music, enemies that weren't always hostile and interacted with each other. They overreached and didn't have time to fill the world with interesting quests and released the game in an unplayable state. Their custom game-engine didn't seem up to the task either, either due to a lack of time or skill.

Elex III doesn't lack polish, it's bland and uninspired. And the writing, while funny at times, completely misses the mark in the main story.

 

[Lyre Mors]

Elex II doesn't lack polish, it's bland and uninspired. And the writing, while funny at times, completely misses the mark in the main story.

Yeah, that's why if I was going to do gothic anything/10, it'd be Gothic III. Every Gothic game is better than ELEX II, but Gothic III comes closest to what ELEX II is in terms of quality. Either way, a massive disappointment. Still don't know how they could mess up that bad considering the beautiful semi-comeback that ELEX was. ELEX II isn't a gothic/10. It's just disappointment/10.

 

[Cyberarmy]

Because Elex 2 is more Gothic 2 than Risen 2

This aged like milk and the guy in front of is me, who got poisoned from that milk...

 

[thesecret1]

Risen was like that too. Good first game that seemed like a worse Gothic, followed by garbage that was completely different. Not sure what's so difficult about cloning their own games. Archolos modded Gothic 2 and was more successful than all of PB's games in the last decade - why can't they do that? Take that old as fuck engine, give it a facelift so people don't bitch about it being ugly, make another Gothic, and you have a hit on your hands.

 

[HoboForEternity]

elex 2 isnt like risen 2 at all, it still share the DNA of the previous game, but weird thing happenend to it.

for risen, the excuse is making the game multiplatform reduced the square miles and seamlessness of the old games made solely for PC. i can fully believe it because many games on this era compromise on the same aspect. (deus ex HR for example)on top of their budgetary concern.

for elex 2 idk it's really weird. maybe covid? or my biggest sus is how PB often put some trend-chasing aspect to their games that made it weird. everything of elex 2 reeks of chasing something like god of war ps4 / horizon. the father son subplot? check. weird, over the shoulder camera angle? check.

 

[Infinitron]

elex 2 isnt like risen 2 at all, it still share the DNA of the previous game, but weird thing happenend to it.

for risen, the excuse is making the game multiplatform reduced the square miles and seamlessness of the old games made solely for PC. i can fully believe it because many games on this era compromise on the same aspect. (deus ex HR for example)on top of their budgetary concern.

for elex 2 idk it's really weird. maybe covid? or my biggest sus is how PB often put some trend-chasing aspect to their games that made it weird. everything of elex 2 reeks of chasing something like god of war ps4 / horizon. the father son subplot? check. weird, over the shoulder camera angle? check.

As I've said before, I suspect that Piranha Bytes as a professional full-time studio doesn't really exist anymore. You've got the brand name, Bjorn and Jenny from the videos, and then a bunch of remote work contractors they hired to put together Elex 2. This is why Embracer haven't shut them down, because there's nothing to shut down.

 

[sosmoflux]

I was hoping that Myrtana would light a fire under Bjorn's ass

 

[thesecret1]

I was hoping that Myrtana would light a fire under Bjorn's ass

Did PB even acknowledge it exists yet?

 

[cvv]

gothic/10

Should probably be something more like Gothic III/10. Seems more appropriate.

That actually crossed my mind while typing the post. But Gothic III's problems are of a different order than Elex II's. Back then, Piranha Bytes had ambition, they made an excellent map, beautiful music, enemies that weren't always hostile and interacted with each other. They overreached and didn't have time to fill the world with interesting quests and released the game in an unplayable state. Their custom game-engine didn't seem up to the task either, either due to a lack of time or skill.

Elex II doesn't lack polish, it's bland and uninspired. And the writing, while funny at times, completely misses the mark in the main story.

I agree with that, mostly. In one way E2 is the very opposite from G3.

G3 was probably THE most ambitious game of its time. As if PB played Morrowind and thought "we're gonna make THAT but bigger and better". They likely bit more they could chew but we'll never know because their publisher ran out of money and patience and kicked the game out of the door half-finished.

E2 is a weird one. Despite some proclamations ITT it's not actually worse in any way than E1. The real problem is it's exactly the same. There's no change, no evolution, not even a limp-wristed attempt to improve on anything. Well, we have the forward moving jetpack which is actually dope but it's hardly an ambitious progress. Otherwise the game just oozes absolute apathy and disinterest. Just shit out the exact same game with the exact same assets in the exact same world and be done with it, our fans will slurp it up.

After E2 I thought I was just done with PB's played out formula but then I played Archolos and I had an absolute blast of a time. It's not the formula, it's Pankraz being washed up and burnt out.

 

[HoboForEternity]

They actually made all the assets from the ground up iirc. That's a mistake imo. The problem isnt the map design (believe or or not they are still pretty good, but lacking the variety elex 1 had)

However the art direction is a step down from elex. Everything is higher fidelity and detail, but (including the nightmare faces) they look like a downgrade from elex

The main problem is the technical issues it released it, more shallow faction and interaction. They sell it as having more choices and going independent like new vegas, but the factions are shallower than elex 1.

The story direction is completely fucked up too. They never had high brow story but the beats of elex 2 is awkward.

The combat is actually shallower than elex 1. It's my main beef with the game. In elex, jank as it is, the combo timer system is interesting, as it build up, allow you to perform powerful finishers, etc. Elex 2 use the tap for light attack, hold for heavy attack and stopped there. They took the most interesting thing about elex 1's combat instead of improving it.

 

[Latelistener]

elex 2 isnt like risen 2 at all, it still share the DNA of the previous game, but weird thing happenend to it.

for risen, the excuse is making the game multiplatform reduced the square miles and seamlessness of the old games made solely for PC. i can fully believe it because many games on this era compromise on the same aspect. (deus ex HR for example)on top of their budgetary concern.

for elex 2 idk it's really weird. maybe covid? or my biggest sus is how PB often put some trend-chasing aspect to their games that made it weird. everything of elex 2 reeks of chasing something like god of war ps4 / horizon. the father son subplot? check. weird, over the shoulder camera angle? check.

As I've said before, I suspect that Piranha Bytes as a professional full-time studio doesn't really exist anymore. You've got the brand name, Bjorn and Jenny from the videos, and then a bunch of remote work contractors they hired to put together Elex 2. This is why Embracer haven't shut them down, because there's nothing to shut down.

That's a shame if that's true (cannot even find Elex 2 credits). PB games are really one of a kind and there are very few games that work similarly and give the same vibes. Outward is probably closest from the recent ones. Ghost of a Tale is also sometimes gives off those vibes, but it's a different game and more of an adventure.

I highly doubt the Remake guys even played the first Gothic though.

 

[GloomFrost]

I was hoping that Myrtana would light a fire under Bjorn's ass

Did PB even acknowledge it exists yet?

LOL don't think so. It would be too embarrassing to admit that a free mod does EVERYTHING better then what they ever did after Risen.

 

[Lyre Mors]

Yeah, I don't know, cvv. ELEX II does a number of things worse than ELEX, as HoboForEternity illustrates in his post. And there's even more. They couldn't even stick to the formula well. The factions sucked and felt shallow, the game is ugly as sin, especially compared to some of the beautiful scenery in the first game, exploration feels much less rewarding as a whole, character and equipment progression is much more flat and ineffectual, and even the writing isn't as good. ELEX II is pretty much objectively worse than ELEX in most ways, and PB doesn't seem to care in the least. I have no hope for ELEX III. Someone else has to take up the mantle if we're going to see any more good games of this type in the future.

And yes, Chronicles of Myrtana is much better than ELEX, not to mention ELEX II. Blows my mind people like Roxor can hate on it despite it clearly being superior in almost every way. It's more of a PB game than PB has made in like 15 years.

 

[HoboForEternity]

PB Have always weird creative process where they throw away everything except the very core concept then adding on something popular or something that impressed them from other media that makes it feels like they take a 1 forward step, but 2 steps backwards.

But honestly it's more like this:

Game 1 has 4 design pillars. 2 of them good, 2 of them bad.

Instead of reiterating and reflecting on the pillars that doesn't work they threw it all out and shove whole new permutations.

So game 2 either can have 4 pillars, with 2 of them good, 2 of them bad or 3 bad one good, etc, etc.

What i think they still retain over the years is the very core of gothic open world formula covered with different organs and meats that are sourced from whatever ideas they have like frankenstein's monster.

Tho i will fight that their world and level design are generally still at the very least above average (not a high bar, but still) even risen 2's islands are still well designed. Risen 3 not as much mainly due to thay huge invisible wall on the island with volcano that feels so jarring.

Everything else, the plot, combat, story, progression all feel like they undergone this awkward creative process.

Lastly, why i think archolos works so much is because the iteration process. Maybe the act of self analyzing your work is harder than analyzing and reiterating other's work. Maybe bjorn are way over their own heads and does not know their strength, or obsessed with "innovation" or changes, but i think archolos works because it essentially it took gothic formula and analyze what can be improved, what to shave off and add.

Granted, some of the criticism toward archolos is valid, like the numbers of unkillable NPCs(that to PB's credit, they kept essential NPCs quite minimal in elex)

 

[thesecret1]

Lastly, why i think archolos works so much is because the iteration process. Maybe the act of self analyzing your work is harder than analyzing and reiterating other's work. Maybe bjorn are way over their own heads and does not know their strength, or obsessed with "innovation" or changes, but i think archolos works because it essentially it took gothic formula and analyze what can be improved, what to shave off and add.

They made another Gothic 2, brought many of the base game's vanilla mechanics to their logical conclusion (like what they did with cooking, for example) and gave it loads of attention to detail. That was it. It's really no rocket science.

 

[MadMaxHellfire]

so much changed, i swear on launch you people were saying this was the best thing ever.