future voting format for Best RPG list

[Twiglard]

The Codex Top RPG list 2024 has been published and it led to some dubious results.

First — the participation rate is low compared to the GOTY vote because in order to vote for the top RPG, one has to recall the preferred titles from 40+ years worth of games (or copy-pasting text from a list in a separate tab, which is only slightly less tedious). It can be improved by making a voting script letting users pick and reorder games from a list, much like the GOTY voting script except with better UX.

Second — perhaps it would be better to let users vote for more than 10 games — I think most GRPG posters have at least 20 games to list. But without better ergonomics it's going to drive the participation even lower and/or bias the results.

Third — negative voting for controversial titles. Negative voting as proven by the GOTY is already heavily gamed, but using it as a secondary indicator not affecting the actual ranking might be an improvement.

You probably have your own share of ideas on how to slow the Decline so let's have at it.

Pinging Butter and Infinitron.

 

[Infinitron]

I think the results as is are reasonable. Maybe they could have been better.

Butter shouldn't have started the GOTY poll without talking to us.

 

[lukaszek]

look deep within and answer few questions first. Why are we doing those polls?

Is it to annoy most people at the same time? Clearly need to go anonymous, allow non codexers and negative voting.
Is it to find 'hidden gems'? For whom? We are talking in here about past 20+ yrs. Codexer likely is aware of most titles anyway. In my experience even writing a review and have it sticked for a while doesnt drive codexers into it really.
Or is it just to show our prestige/codex consensus? If so does form matter that much anyway? Can just go minimal effort with popularity context which was done few times anyway


As for voting itself Id prefer it to be tied to username, with either binary vote or -1/0/1, rate as many titles as you want. There are people who played only 1 game each year and vote it to max, why make their vote stronger by punishing those who play more? Also ban those who are proud for rating gaymz based on youtube vids.

how to slow the Decline

Especially ban those yt gaymers

 

[Blutwurstritter]

I think introducing a few sub-categories wouldn't hurt. Seeing games like Nioh:Automata (I haven't played it but it does not look like a rpg to me to be honest) in the same list as Knights of the Chalice is weird.

 

[Abu Antar]

I don't think that there is anything wrong with how the voting is done. There are more games coming out, and the user demographic of the site are getting younger. A lot of people have probably never played, or heard of some of the games that I voted on. I'm not "the old man yelling at clouds" yet, but I'm not that far away.

 

[luj1]

The Codex Top RPG list 2024 has been published and it led to some dubious results.

I disagree 1000%. This is one of the better lists, possibly the least offensive one since 2014 (which I think was the best: https://rpgcodex.net/content.php?id=9453)

 

[Sigourn]

What's the point of these lists?
The most use I get out of them is to find new games to play. May as well make a poll that omits well known games altogether...

 

[Gregz]

I don't think that there is anything wrong with how the voting is done. There are more games coming out, and the user demographic of the site are getting younger. A lot of people have probably never played, or heard of some of the games that I voted on. I'm not "the old man yelling at clouds" yet, but I'm not that far away.

It's one thing to showcase the best cRPGs ever made, but current year Codex isn't capable of creating such a list by vote.

 

[Tyranicon]

We should give my vote x100 weight.

 

[Sigourn]

I don't think that there is anything wrong with how the voting is done. There are more games coming out, and the user demographic of the site are getting younger. A lot of people have probably never played, or heard of some of the games that I voted on. I'm not "the old man yelling at clouds" yet, but I'm not that far away.

It's one thing to showcase the best cRPGs ever made, but current year Codex isn't capable of creating such a list by vote.

Why not make multiple polls then?
"Best RPGs of the 80s, 90s, 2000s", etc.

Barely any butt will be hurt.

 

[Abu Antar]

I don't think that there is anything wrong with how the voting is done. There are more games coming out, and the user demographic of the site are getting younger. A lot of people have probably never played, or heard of some of the games that I voted on. I'm not "the old man yelling at clouds" yet, but I'm not that far away.

It's one thing to showcase the best cRPGs ever made, but current year Codex isn't capable of creating such a list by vote.

In that case, the only way is using a committee of users who have played most rpgs.

No matter how we spin it, you'll always see some questionable picks.

The question is also the intent of the list. At first, I agree that it was to showcase the best crpgs ever made. But now, I see it more as a list of recommendations. If you made the best crps ever made list once, is there a need to redo it every five years?

 

[SlightlyRadioactive]

I don't think that there is anything wrong with how the voting is done. There are more games coming out, and the user demographic of the site are getting younger. A lot of people have probably never played, or heard of some of the games that I voted on. I'm not "the old man yelling at clouds" yet, but I'm not that far away.

It's one thing to showcase the best cRPGs ever made, but current year Codex isn't capable of creating such a list by vote.

Why not make multiple polls then?
"Best RPGs of the 80s, 90s, 2000s", etc.

Barely any butt will be hurt.

You would be surprised

 

[Reality]

Id prefer simple lists - 10 games for user, all votes are 1 points.

no extra categories or weighted votes needed. I don't need or care about the ordered top 10 of all other voters

The most important thing is just visibility and announcing the thing properly.

 

[Fedora Master]

Cut out the weebshit

 

[GentlemanCthulhu]

TBH the list is completely useless. It doesn't reflect any sort of objective criteria besides the current day consensus of the users who participated in the vote. As for recommendations, why not just start a recommendation thread or refer to the CRPG book instead?

Instead of this, I think there should be a poll for hidden gems, but for only those released in the past 5 years or so.

 

[Reinhardt]

it's full of not rpg games, and not games at all.

 

[Late Bloomer]

Whatever method would keep out non-rpg's is the method that should be used. These games taint this list, not because they are bad games, but because they aren't RPG's.

Disco Elysium
Dark Souls
Diablo 1 & 2
Elden Ring
Nier

 

[TwoEdge]

If you need to keep a standard, then an elite should be formed to vote on the exact criteria. Suppose the idea is to have the codex's list be the most prestigious and curated of all, according to strict parameters. In that case, voting would need to be restricted by some kind of authority based on technical excellence or prestige. As we are all internet randos here I don't think there's a good way to do that except with an iron fist and many arbitrary decisions. The alternative is to open the poll to everyone and then shit will inevitably pop up and results will disappoint, that's the ugly truth of democratic processes, which I think is absolutely fine, given the circumstances.

That said, maybe polls should be a two-stage process, one to restrict which games should be on the list, to veto unsavory games (non-RPGs, trolls, etc), and then a proper poll, to rank the titles accordingly.

 

[BosanskiSeljak]

Keep the list strictly cRPGs to root out games which completely destroy the cohesion of list (NieR, Elden Ring, Disco Elysium, Dark Souls, etc.)

Allow downvoting to counteract rabid, passionate fans who will focus on shit and recency bias. This won't effect less popular gems making it in because people won't focus on downvoting those.

As for the article, do something new each time. The mini reviews have been done 3 times already (and reused for the current one). In true Codex fashion, there should be 1 proper mini review outlining why you should play, and a second one for why it's shit and shouldn't be in it's position.

Either way, I see so much talk about this year's list from people who didnt vote and/or didn't write a mini review. Show up or don't talk about the results, even 1 vote could've swayed many placements (I'm still salty Space Rangers just barely missed out on both Top & Hidden Gems)

Mini-reviews were going so slowly that I spent 5mins writing one for Disco Elysium, a game I didn't vote for, just to piss people off. A game voted into top 20 which struggled to have a single person write about it. I still see it as a success considering it triggered vic into making a long post i didnt spend a second reading and a ruskie website to quote it talking about how it's shit

One more thing: restrict who can vote. The criteria was accounts which were created before the original post. This let a retard who made a total of 20 posts and then cried on Site Feedback (Skyflyer72 of some shit) to have his account deleted be able to influence placements on the list.

 

[S.torch]

The previous 101 Top List had a fair vote system. You were given 25 points and you distribute them freely. If you wanted a game to end up higher you give it more votes. This made people to vote for what they liked instead of epic troll votes to fuck with the contender.

Restriction of you can't vote X game because is a port from X years is a joke. Used only to benefit the DENUVO baby that is Dragon Dogma. Either ban ports or allow all of them.

 

[Dedicated_Dark]

Separate crpgs and jrpgs. Jrpgs are rpgs in a way that is antithesis of crpgs.
Compare Planescape/Fallout to Final Fantasy/Chrono trigger. The criteria is conflicting.

 

[Russia is over. The end.]

These games taint this list, not because they are bad games, but because they aren't RPG's.

Disco Elysium
Dark Souls
Diablo 1 & 2
Elden Ring
Nier

Make a poll about whether they're RPG or not.
If they're voted RPGs, forever keep your peace.

 

[Infinitron]

As you can see, discussions such as these run into the problem of users who think that the main problem with the rules is that they don't disqualify games that they don't like.

 

[BosanskiSeljak]

As you can see, discussions such as these run into the problem of users deciding that the rules should be changed to disqualify games they don't like.

Retarded and incorrect take.

I like some games that don't belong on the list.

I dislike or hate many games voted in but have no problem with them being there.

 

[Strange Fellow]

I personally don't really care about the list, and yet it exists. It just doesn't make any sense.