Metal Gear Solid V: The Phantom Pain

[ultimanecat]

I'm about mission 15.

I randomly found a character who is supposed to be dead hanging out in a room in my medical platform. Is this actually plot critical or some weird hallucination?

 

[Drakron]

You mean Paz?

Spoiler

Its a hallucination that is also a hint about you not being Big Boss, I suppose its also a signal that he starting to remember what happened when Paz died, this is spelled out entirely to you in the "true" ending that is when you run out of "story" missions.

 

[Deleted member 7219]

Spoiler

You mean Paz?

Its a hallucination that is also a hint about you not being Big Boss, I suppose its also a signal that he starting to remember what happened when Paz died, this is spelled out entirely to you in the "true" ending that is when you run out of "story" missions.

Fuck, I wish I hadn't clicked that spoiler. Thought you were just

Spoiler

talking about Paz being in the room in the first place

I'm at a similar point in the game to ultimanecat - mission 15 or 16. Ignoring the side ops now, following TorontRayne and J_C 's advice. I will still do side ops to get skilled soldiers and interpreters, but will leave the rest until after I've completed the main missions.

The main missions are pretty good. Each one feels different.

 

[Drakron]

You get some of hints about that, some not very obvious ... like when you "rescue" Huey pay a bit attention when you meet him if you know Peace Walker, you get even more later but I think you can beat Metal Gear before that triggers, at that point you know something is up.

 

[Vaarna_Aarne]

Pro tip: get yourself the Legendary Gunsmith ASAP. If you got that one you can customize your weapons, so you can get stuff like the silenced tranquilizer sniper rifle way early. At this point clearing outposts is only a matter of timing and figuring out the order in which I have to take enemies down, and taking out groups of heavy troopers is just a matter of sneaking up on them and CQCing them into submission one by one.

I find it most fun to CQC everyone whenever possible, setting up baits and distractions to facilitate this. Guns are just the last resort when I can't figure out the whole "now how am I going to beat up, interrogate, and either shank or Fulton everyone in this base" to me.

Of fun note is that CQC can be used to stealth beat up at least four dudes at once, at least if it's four dudes walking along a lone Afghan road.

Watching snake crawling just near enemy like mothefucking speed snake making noise everywhere and not getting caught is idiotic.

The noise from your actions is a gameplay audio cue for the player (or flavour from detail in case of the clinks and other sounds made by your equipment moving), not something the enemy hears in-game. A good example of this is that Sneaking Suit does not affect those audio cues, but its gameplay effect does change enemy ability to detect you by hearing (ie, crouch-walking is almost never detected by sound when wearing the Sneaking Suit, which is why it's a CQC dream tool). The game is pretty good at explaining what noises you make that the enemy will detect (with basic rule being that crawling makes the least noise).

 

[Deleted member 7219]

Of fun note is that CQC can be used to stealth beat up at least four dudes at once, at least if it's four dudes walking along a lone Afghan road.

I did not know that. I've been quickly tranquilising groups of enemies I find clustered together because when I tried CQCing them, one or two of them always managed to raise the alarm by calling out or firing his weapon. How is it done, then? A special skill like in Deus Ex: Human Revolution?

 

[J_C]

Too bad the game does a shit job about explaining some of the mechanics to you, and there is also no manual included.

Because interesting shit like this should be pointed out:
http://mgstpp-app.konamionline.com/manual/pc/eu/en/pc_14.html

This is cool, enemies reacting to your playstyle.

 

[CptMace]

Well too bad they actually tell you the state of enemy preparation in the menu, does it depend on the Intel team level ?
Although I witnessed the enemy raising his protections step by step and it's probably the thing the game handles the best. I didn't know it happens in reaction to the player though, that's pretty well done.

 

[TheHeroOfTime]

I think I'm the only who likes the credits at the beginning of the mission.

"Boss, this will be a simple mission, just go in and out."

STARRING:

-Russians
-Skull Face
-Skulls Attack
-Chopper
-Man On Fire
-20 Metal Gears

 

[J_C]

Well too bad they actually tell you the state of enemy preparation in the menu, does it depend on the Intel team level ?

Yeah, it is pretty sad that in this day and age, you have to point out everything for the players, because god forbid, in the end they have to use their brains.

 

[Ebonsword]

And yes, the characters are odd. I played the majority of Metal Gear games, but even the ones in there that I know and love are acting so... bizarre and off-putting. As if they were not allowed to be themselves for this game.

I played a bit of MGS3 over the weekend and got to the point where you first meet Ocelot.

Holy Christ, now I know what people are talking about when they say his character in MGS5 makes no sense. In MGS3, he seemed like the sort of character that might be played by a young Dolph Lundgren. But in MGS5, he's suddenly become Sam Elliott.

 

[Jick Magger]

I think part of the issue is that since they essentially turn Snake into a blank-slate protagonist, and the real character stuff is between Miller and Ocelot, with Miller being the real Ahab of the story. The issue is that there's no catharsis moment for the character, no real point where it's shown that his desire for revenge has gone too far, and that he needs to be reeled back.

Spoiler

He and Ocelot subject Huey to some pretty horrific torture, but as the game proceeds and it becomes clearer and clearer that Huey is guilty as sin of nearly everything they accuse him of, though he keeps denying it in the most delusional, cowardly way possible, culminating with him trying to murder all of Mother Base and then denying it when undeniable evidence that he did it is shoved in his face, that Miller was justified in doing so. His treatment of Quiet is also pretty horrific, but then it's revealed that she was also exactly what he accused her of; a double agent sent in specifically to kill everyone on Mother Base with a vocal parasite, and the only reason she didn't was because she fell in love with Venom Snake, which is a pretty nebulous thing that Miller had no real way of trusting or relying on, especially since she had no way of actually expressing it. Then during the post-credit sequence, he vows to help Solid Snake at some point down the line to stop Big Boss, purely because he hates the asshole now. Sure, right for the wrong reasons and all that, but Solid Snake does eventually manage to stop both Big Boss and The Patriots, so it all turned out fine in the end.

In fact, the one group that he does decide to ease up on; Eli and the child soldiers, blows up spectacularly in his face when they end up stealing a nuclear apocalypse machine right under their noses, along with one sample of the English vocal parasite, not to mention the fact that Eli would have Miller murdered twenty years down the line. So what is the game trying to tell us here? That being a grumpy asshole who tortures people is actually a good thing because you're right to suspect everyone of trying to double cross you?

 

[Perkel]

Well too bad they actually tell you the state of enemy preparation in the menu, does it depend on the Intel team level ?
Although I witnessed the enemy raising his protections step by step and it's probably the thing the game handles the best. I didn't know it happens in reaction to the player though, that's pretty well done.

heh i noticed it myself. I mostly do missions after dark and using tranq to head.
Now most of my missions are harder because most of dudes use nv and wear a helmet.

 

[Declinator]

Spoiler

In fact, the one group that he does decide to ease up on; Eli and the child soldiers, blows up spectacularly in his face when they end up stealing a nuclear apocalypse machine right under their noses, along with one sample of the English vocal parasite, not to mention the fact that Eli would have Miller murdered twenty years down the line. So what is the game trying to tell us here? That being a grumpy asshole who tortures people is actually a good thing because you're right to suspect everyone of trying to double cross you?

How about this: the game is not trying to tell us jack shit by that and you are reading into it too much.

 

[Drakron]

Kaz is always wrong, also ... dont click on this for end game spoilers.

Spoiler

Cipher meet with Big Boss in Cyprus and made peace since ... well guess who also have English vocal parasites? and talked with Ocelot and Miller, now Ocelot certainly knew about Big Boss shadow since well the ending, now Miller was enjoying some Soviet hospitality but here is the thing, Ocelot doesnt really goes about taking down Cipher but Miller certainly does, at best Ocelot talks about Skull Face and XOF but I guess he knows that Cipher is out and no longer a enemy but Miller ... he does talk about taking out Cipher

So Miller is wrong and Ocelot is right.

 

[TheHeroOfTime]

Is sad. I think this game have a very decent story but it was told in a very poor manner. Especially in the Chapter 2. The events on that chapter feels totally disconnected.

The most weird character in the game is Ocelot by far. He just doesn't look as Ocelot.

 

[Drakron]

No, the story is shit ... there is no saving it, as I sad the best ones were I and III and still get really bad at times, its just helped the bullshit tends to be contained in certain sections were the plot happens and then we go back to gameplay.

V suffers from being a Peace Walker sequel were they try to use the exact same mechanics of Peace Walker (Mother base, R&D, mission selection, etc ...) so it have the same structure of Peace Walker but somehow it simply comes off worst, I guess because Peace Walker story was just BETTER even if dumb as bricks at times.

 

[Jick Magger]

How about this: the game is not trying to tell us jack shit by that and you are reading into it too much.

So the obvious Id/Super ego dynamic between Ocelot and Miller means nothing, all the Moby dick references are just there to make the game look cool? Or are we actually not supposed to care about the characters and focus on the broken, incohesive mess that is the main plot, despite the game giving waay more attention to the characters in the few cutscenes that it has than the plot?

 

[Rupuka]

Too bad the game does a shit job about explaining some of the mechanics to you, and there is also no manual included.

Because interesting shit like this should be pointed out:
http://mgstpp-app.konamionline.com/manual/pc/eu/en/pc_14.html

This is cool, enemies reacting to your playstyle.

I have no idea what key is in the keyboard but [Help] mode explaining that and more

 

[Drakron]

Ultimate, no because MGS4.

Its sad because we had people in that timeline that are absent, like Frank Jaeger, and instead we got ... this.
We had Peace Walker, we dont need more idiotic version of Peace Walker ... its a entry that adds nothing, expands nothing and ultimate could be removed entirely and nothing of value would be lost because storywise and characterization wise NOTHING was added.

 

[Luka-boy]

No, the story is shit ... there is no saving it, as I sad the best ones were I and III and still get really bad at times, its just helped the bullshit tends to be contained in certain sections were the plot happens and then we go back to gameplay.

V suffers from being a Peace Walker sequel were they try to use the exact same mechanics of Peace Walker (Mother base, R&D, mission selection, etc ...) so it have the same structure of Peace Walker but somehow it simply comes off worst, I guess because Peace Walker story was just BETTER even if dumb as bricks at times.

I agree with the game coming off as worse than Peace Walker in the aspects it inherits from it.

I freaking loved Peace Walker for what it was, a Metal Gear game for handhelds that often didn't take itself too seriously and felt almost like a parody, or a comic version of Metal Gear. Still, it told a complete story that felt relevant enough (though definitely not critical) to the Big Boss story, and you certainly could see Kojima's influence when it came to both eccentric Japanese humour and making cutscenes with pseudo-intellectual stuff in them. Hell, even the conversation tapes were way more entertaining to me than the ones in Phantom Pain simply because there were a ton more and there was so much variety in them that you could just listen to the serious ones or the funny ones depending on your mood.

Gameplay wise, the base management aspect I can't help but think was much better in Peace Walker just because it was in some ways more simple. For example, in Peace Walker you only had to manage your GMP, and even then that just meant making sure the Combat Team generated enough of it automatically to keep it in the red. You didn't need to buy facilities as they were improved automatically as the different teams increased in size and quality. Reseach progressed every time you finished a mission (even side ops) instead of in real time. You also had your gear always at your disposal, never needing to switch from the gear you feel like using because you are low on money or some resource or herb because you just researched or built something. Peace Walker also had more balance and variety in side ops, and I liked how those were also rated just like the main ops, though that's a subjective thing as ratings in PW often depended heavily on not killing anyone ever and some players may prefer the freedom in PP's side ops.

Ultimately I think like the addition of resources and real time building was a poor decision. To me they don't seem to add anything but a layer of tedium, and even if they rarely get in the way because you can just farm some containers and send your combat team on some plant gathering missions, or let the game run idle in the ACC, that also makes it feel to me like it's even more pointless.

And I really can't stomach how Phantom Pain's story is left hanging like that. I honestly believed it was like Peace Walker where when you think it's over, after some time it turns out it wasn't the end and new events pop up. Which is what kinda happens about two thirds into the game and why I got my hopes up.

When I started playing I was ecstatic because I thought it would have been Peace Walker on steroids, but in the end it only clearly surpassed its predecessor in the tactical gameplay aspect. I would kill for a game with Peace Walker's tone and simple base management with Phantom Pain's tactical action. Well, perhaps with maps a third or a quarter the size of Afghanistan and Africa but having more of them in more varied locations.

 

[KK1001]

The decision to remove most/a huge chunk of Venom's lines was a bad decision. Kojima has just confirmed what we all knew: he is a hack. Left to his own devices, he'll piss away money and make boneheaded decisions off of impulse. Even the legion of drooling Kojima Kucks have finally realized this.

 

[Drakron]

V story would be better served if it was Peace Walker from the Russian side instead ... dont you find it amusing that in Peace Walker Huey pretty much used Granin blueprints and then the Soviets that build Shagohod in the first place never managed to create anything besides that, sure Snake Eater pretty much set them back to the start but still, its not as if Granin research just vanished until it was found so Huey could copy them.

They missed all the opportunities that Peace Walker had by simply switching sides from American Project to Soviet Project showing the other side of the coin and the funny thing is, IT WOULD THEMATIC WORK, you could even make Skull Face a reverse of Cipher and the story would be much better served.

As for Kojima being a hack ... I think Kojima gets too distracted by stuff he sees and wants to put them in, like Old Snake was old because "clone" and because the Sheep Dolly died so he got the idiotic notion that since Dolly died of "old age" then the Clones must have ACCELERATED AGING! and so we got Old Snake that is old because a clone sheep died, also he gets too focused on some weird shit ... its kinda like the George Lucas effect, he is someone that needs to be reign in and dont have full control or he just ends up doing wierd shit that doesnt really work.

 

[Adon]

I played a bit of MGS3 over the weekend and got to the point where you first meet Ocelot.

Holy Christ, now I know what people are talking about when they say his character in MGS5 makes no sense. In MGS3, he seemed like the sort of character that might be played by a young Dolph Lundgren. But in MGS5, he's suddenly become Sam Elliott.

He's a really theatrical character in the other games. So now it seems like there was period in his life where he was just drab until MGS1 where he just randomly went back to his cowboy showmanship antics. But yeah, it makes no sense why his personality is like that.

Spoiler

I think one of the worst parts is that despite being a genuine triple agent/double crosser/deceiver through most of the games, in MGSV he's relegated to using hypnotherapy to be good at it. Almost as if he was too shit to do it convincingly.

 

[TheHeroOfTime]

The real time building is probably the worst decision in terms of gameplay design. Is completely pointless. Why didn't they added a cinematic with Big medic smoking a phantom cigarrete with the OOOOOOOUOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOUOUOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO in the background skipping the time?