Metroid Appreciation Thread

[JDR13]

Ash once again showing his oldfag butthurt.

 

[Casual Hero]

I've only beaten the original Metroid; I should really play the rest of the series, because I know I'll love it.
Metroid is one of my favorite NES games, for sure. I was amazed at how much fun I had with it, and the only negative thing I can think of is that you only start with 30 ENERGY if you die. I only died a handful of times while playing though, so it is really not a huge deal.

I mapped it out on paper, and it was extremely rewarding.

Spoiler

 

[Great Deceiver]

Came for the map, stayed for the faded doodles

 

[Jinn]

Faded silt-strider doodles no less!

At least that's what it looks like to me.

 

[SharkClub]

In my younger days I was quite the Nintendrone, specifically for Metroid. I started with Fusion when it released and I was 8 years old, bought Metroid 2 on Ebay as that was the only other handheld one available at the time, got Zero Mission when it came out, ended up caving and buying a SNES pretty much just to play Super Metroid (but ofc got some of the other heavy hitters aftwards). Bought the NES Classic re-release of Metroid 1 for GBA because I didn't own an NES and I wanted a physical copy of it (at the time the exact same version of the game was available inside of Zero Mission and Prime 1 as unlocks). Got a Gamecube for Prime and Prime 2, a DS for Prime Hunters, a Wii for Prime 3 and then Trilogy (for the waggle aim), got a 3DS when Samus Returns got announced. The only ones I haven't played are Other M, Federation Force and I guess Pinball. I've done my due diligence in paying out the ass for a series I love 90% of the games in, even if I emulated Dread on Yuzu because I don't own a Switch.

Spoiler

I did just order a copy of Federation Force off Amazon for like £10 so I could give that one a fair shake, seeing as I've got the 3DS to play it with anyway.

 

[The Dutch Ghost]

I largely agree that the meta-plot has become unnecessarily recursive and self-referential, to the point of near parody. To be fair though, Prime is the game that largely started that, and it’s one of the best games in the series, so I can’t blame devs for trying to emulate it.

Here I feel the differences between both Western and Japanese writing mentalities come in to play, but also the skill of writing and imagination.
Both Westerners and Japanese writers can sometimes be very 'overdone'. Sorry, I have no better description.
Too much plot elements, or increasing the stakes, adding all kinds of new stuff (I know stuff sound rather vague) such as in this case Samus suddenly being some hybrid now with various genetics (a retcon too as it was said that after Fusion she lost all her Metroid DNA when she absorbed the Core X from the SA-X)

Or the focus and development of Samus's personality.
As some poster here mentioned in an earlier post, perhaps there should not have been so much focus on that part of the Metroid franchise.
World building, the various creatures and factions in it, but not trying to go too much with a story that has all kinds of emotional twists. That is how we got into this current situation.

I really think Sakamoto is not a good writer.
He got lucky with Fusion, in which he really wanted to introduce a story and show a bit more of the main character's personality.
The SA-X and the X parasites worked out well, but the translation which was perhaps a bit too literal went rather meta for me when suddenly the subject of the soul was brought up. (I know to Japanese, the soul is interchangeable with consciousness/self awareness/personality)
Where did that come from?

Metroid Zero Mission in general worked out well, but even that game had some retcons which came from that Manga. Or did the Manga came after Zero Mission.
Chozo being the creator of the Metroids (we really needed 'ultimate warriors'?), and the Mother Brain computer.
Samus growing up on Zebes after being rescued by the Chozo from a space pirate attack on her home colony.
I am now wondering if that stuff was really needed.

In Other M we saw his writing chops. And even if it had been translated better it would still not have been a good Metroid game compared to the others.
I don't need to go into detail that this title was primarily made to make more Japanese fans of the franchise.

Sakamoto was a little more hands off in MSR I think, though his influence could still be felt in the rectons that set up what would follow on upon in Dread.

I spoiled Dread for myself and I don't have a problem with that. Dread is better than Other M, but I still think that plotwise it is very average. Especially some of the cliches could have been done without, I am not going to spoil them.

I really think that it is time that Sakamoto either moves on, or has to work together with other writers on any future games in this franchise.
I know Metroid is more about gameplay than story telling. But if Nintendo wants there to be more story in the Metroid games then let it be decent to good.

I'd much rather see the Prime games remastered than something like Other M which wasn't very good even when it was new.

There were some elements in it that I liked, but storyline, character portrayal, and how the gameplay worked regarding power ups, health and ammo pick ups, and closing parts of the map until the near end of the game definitely weren't.
Oh, and definitely that scan mechanic which was a poor copy of the Prime games can go to hell.

Other M doesn't deserve half the bad rep it has gotten.

It deserves twice as much.
I feel this one nearly killed the Metroid series.

I did just order a copy of Federation Force off Amazon for like £10 so I could give that one a fair shake, seeing as I've got the 3DS to play it with anyway.

Neato. I started with Super Metroid myself after I bought a SNES from a retro games store and wanted to have some of my old favorites for it.
But I got Fusion the day it was released in my country, and later on decided to get a Gamecube to play Metroid Prime.

There are some painful memories with Metroid Zero Mission. Not the game itself, but the circumstances during which I got it (it is when I left my mother's home permanently as it was clear things would not get better there any more).

Bought Prime 2 as soon as it was released, and I bought a Wii to play Prime 3 (got scammed along the way by an online seller when I wanted to get a cheaper Wii, may you rot in hell you bastard!). And later on Metroid Prime trilogy from a game store that had been in my current home city for years, but which closed not long after.

Metroid Other M again on the day of the release. What a damn disappointment.


Federation Force for which I got a 3DS.
Being a bit disappointed with it at the time I intended to sell both together, but I decided to keep them.
That turned out a better choice in the long run as I have been picking up various 3DS titles since, including Metroid Samus Returns.

My opinion on it: Federation Force can be enjoyed. It is clearly more a shooter than the Prime games, and I do wish the controls had been different (still better than Hunters). Or that the Switch could run 3DS games as I would prefer to use a stick for aiming.

The biggest issues I think is that this is really a game that I think is best enjoyed with other players. It can be played solo, but that mode seems to have been an afterthought.
There is the graphics which are much simpler than that of the Prime games, perhaps too chibi. I do like the design of the Pirates however and I am curious how they and their ships would have looked like if they had been upscaled to Prime standards.
The game limits and restraints. This game is really intended to be played in short quick sessions, and the annoying part is that the time limit can prevent you from unlocking things such as extra storage space for ammo. (ammo is a thing in this, only your standard beam is unlimited)

And finally, the time period Nintendo had decided to release this title.
Metroid fans had been waiting for new on Metroid for ages since M: OM nearly buried the franchise. Either a new title such as set after Fusion or Prime 4, or a remake like MSR.
Nintendo could not have done a worse decision to announce this title at the time without any accompanying main Metroid title. And also putting so much emphasis on that mini sports game that could also be downloaded. Blast Ball I think.

Had this title been released next to MSR or Dread (but with better graphics, perhaps on the Switch), as a less expensive game it would perhaps not drawn so much ire from fans.

I still don't hate it and I wish it would be part of a Metroid Prime collection. Much more than Metroid Prime Hunters.


Metroid Prime Hunters. Some people swear by it.
I bought a DS to play it and I rapidly became disappointed with it because of its design, controls, and campaign.
It is not pleasant to hold in your hand, having to use the stylus to aim and jump.
The campaign is bare bones, and I think it was only added because Nintendo realized that there also had to be a single player mode.
Or perhaps a dedicated single player mode had been planned, but was scrapped and the developers just repurposed the multiplayer maps.

Whatever is the truth, Hunters is basically Prime done half assed.
Yeah, it is Prime on the go, but barely a scaled down experience of that game. It lacks interesting places, good puzzles (this game has instant death spots), and a good campaign.
Basically you go around collecting weapons and things in order to unlock a thing in order to defeat a boss, and then get another thing for which you have to defeat seven more bosses I think (of which there are only two types), in order to unlock the final map, where you must fight the final boss.
And in the meantime the other space hunter NPCs will periodically attack you in order to steal your thing. So when you respawn you must hunt them down in order to fight them and get the thing back.

Nintendo should not even have bothered with a single player campaign on this.

Sure, it introduced Sylux, Samus Aran's other new nemesis after Ridley, Dark Samus, and the SA-X.
I like the concept of the character but we have yet to see why he is so interesting a villain to fight.
After Hunters his ship made a guest appearance in Metroid Prime 3's secret ending, and he appeared mostly of screen in the secret ending of Federation Force.

I think he is going to be the main villain or a main villain in Prime 4.


Oh, and before I forget. I also have Metroid 2.
I bought it after I played Super Metroid when I had to be on the train for several hours.
I had hoped it would have been a similar experience to Super Metroid.

Ages ago I also owned Metroid for the NES. But I sold it on again after I realized I was never going to do anything with it and had the game already with Prime and Metroid Zero Mission.

 

[DJOGamer PT]

 

[The Decline]

I remember renting the first Metroid for my NES a few years after it came out and not getting far because I was just 5 or 6 years old. I didn't get into the series until the first SNES emulators appeared in the late 90s and I played through Super Metroid. I remember getting stuck at the one part with the disappearing floor because I didn't realize there was a run button.

 

[SharkClub]

I remember renting the first Metroid for my NES a few years after it came out and not getting far because I was just 5 or 6 years old. I didn't get into the series until the first SNES emulators appeared in the late 90s and I played through Super Metroid. I remember getting stuck at the one part with the disappearing floor because I didn't realize there was a run button.

Yep, I got stuck at the same part. Had no idea Super Metroid had a dedicated run button because I played Fusion before it and when I bought it I only got the cartridge with no manual. That specific part right before red tower is lovingly called "noob bridge" by the Super Metroid speedrunning community. I remember I also got stuck in Metroid 2 once I found the first red hatch before you get bombs (was playing on a gameboy advance so it had the default M2 color palette), I thought I had to find some sort of unlocking mechanism like in Fusion to let me in the red hatches, turned out you just needed to pop them with 5 missiles (which was the standard in every Metroid EXCEPT Fusion). 10 year old me managed to figure it out eventually and ended up beating the game of course, but it's a funny little memory to look back on.

Back in the day literal children were figuring shit out for themselves. Nowadays retarded dumbfuck game journo/ex-game dev spastics instead decide to rage online and write hitpieces about how Metroid Dread is impossible to beat because it's too cryptic because they got stuck for literally 1 minute without having their hand held.

 

[Gastrick]

I remember renting the first Metroid for my NES a few years after it came out and not getting far because I was just 5 or 6 years old. I didn't get into the series until the first SNES emulators appeared in the late 90s and I played through Super Metroid. I remember getting stuck at the one part with the disappearing floor because I didn't realize there was a run button.

I got stuck there too but by the time I played the internet was there to explain everything. It's unfortunate though because it is much better to figure out what to do on your own. Especially in adventure games and related genres.

 

[Gastrick]

Metroid Prime > Super Metroid > Metroid Prime 2 > Metroid Prime 3 > Metroid Fusion > Metroid II > Metroid (nes) > AM2R

I'll need to replay Metroid Other M and play until the end, but otherwise it is last. The GBA remake of Metroid 1 for some reason I remember being bad but it should be above the original. Metroid 1 comes near the last because of steep competition but it has a good difficulty to it that none of the other games have (almost). Didn't play pinball or federation force.

 

[J1M]

A premise I offer for a future Metroid game:

-New character that idolizes Samus a bit.

-Mission is to track down Samus who is on a mission that's taking longer than planned. Samus is initially unaware of the player and player needs upgrades from local creatures to follow.

-New biological suit. Absorbs "genetic" abilities from boss enemies to unlock exploration. Every upgrade is represented on the character visually.

-Non-boss enemies can also be "genetically harvested" for temporary enhancements similar to a Kirby game. Useful for combat and environmental puzzles. Limit of one at a time.

-Embrace exploration and non-linear gameplay. Allow players to tackle the first 3 bosses that grant abilities in any order. Require all 3 to advance to the next major area. Repeat.

 

[Ivan]

Metroid Prime 1

Mostly brilliant design. Metroid Prime excels in exploration, particularly ability-based progression. It's amazing, after so many years since my first playthrough, how often Metroid Prime evokes the feeling of progression over and over again. First it starts with the morph ball, then the speed ball, then you remember there was that one gap WAY back in the beginning, and boom you're rewarded with the double jump. You never know when a side path will lead to a new mechanic that adds another verb to your arsenal. Even the "boring" rewards are useful, as the alt fire for your different beams have a hefty cost. I had a blast exploring Tallos IV all over again, that is until I forgot that the game pulls a Wind Waker and right before you can enter the endgame, it forces you to complete a scavenger hunt. You're tasked to collect 12 macguffins spread throughout the world, and the gave provides you with hints as to their location, and what to look for. These are pretty damn cool, some are hidden behind walls or pilllars that don't LOOK interactive, but they're detailed in the notes. I'm not even bothered by it since it makes in-game sense that the Chozo would take great care to hide their artifacts, so I'm not so peeved that you can't use your scanner to deduce which wall/pillar is hiding something. What did bother me was having to zig zag back and forth across the map to net these artifacts. I wish the game let you confront the endgame prior to acquiring all 12 artifacts, perhaps with a handicap added. This reminds me of how Breath of the Wild handles its endgame and how it lets you do just that. I also wish it had done a better job of alerting you to the fact that there's an artifact in a room you're in. Perhaps an audio cue, that way it could have cut down on the backtracking at the end. Speaking trading familiar ground, you can bypass almost all of the combat encounters, and at the very least, you can use your new exploration verbs to backtrack more swiftly (double jump, grappling hook). I do wish there was a smarter warping/fast travel system, e.g. letting the player warp to an elevator of a zone whose boss you've already toppled. Another issue I noticed this time around are the boss fights. Most of them were either HP inflated, or failed to take advantage of your tools. I dug that the final boss made you switch to specific visors/beams, but not enough of the ones before that one did that all. Fighting Meta Ripley was a bore, as the game is very finicky as to when you're allowed to inflict damage.

I must also mention that for this playthrough I used PrimeHack and the game was a joy to play. I remapped the beams to the number keys, and remapped the visors to convenient keys near WASD or on the mouse. I truly don't remember what it was like playing this on a controller, but switching to the tool I needed, or the visor I needed was quick, efficient, and very satisfying.

TLDR: the level design, the item-based world progression, the continual feeling of opening new avenues for exploration is as brilliant as I remember. PC controls via PrimeHack made this a wonderful experience. The game struggles with its combat, especially the later boss fights. Also, the forced scavenger hunt at the end pads out the length a bit.

PrimeHack installation for those who'd like to give it a shot:

Spoiler

questions I will be keeping in mind as I start Prime 2 (my favorite of the 3 when I first played them):

-How does the world design feel? did the team have different goals? is there more interweaving of areas

-how is the endgame handled: scavenger hunt?

-How are the boss fights? Do they take greater advantage of your powers and abilities throughout the adventure?

 

[Ivan]

Metroid Prime 2

Metroid Prime 2 retains the crown as my favorite of the trilogy (I still have 3 to replay, but I recall clearly liking that one the least). It's the level design that really sways me to give it such recognition over the first. Prime 1's map feels more stretched out, such that when you have to complete the scavenger quest, it becomes a chore to retread so much ground to net the macguffins. Prime 2's world design is tighter, with a more interconnected feel. In fact, I had totally forgotten that each of the game's 3 dungeons include convenient shortcuts not just to each other but to the overworld. These are especially satisfying to unlock b/c they coincide with some endgame abilities, one rekindled memories of the first time we found the Undead Burg shortcut from Dark Souls .

Prime 2 includes better boss fights than the first, but some still suffer from the same problem of having very specific moments of vulnerability, which can make those fights drag out. The bosses that make specific use of your abilities are clearly the best: the flying insectoid that calls for the grapple and mutli-missile, the spider mech that calls for the spiderball and boosting. The ones where you have to target specific hitboxes, or wait for them to open up for attacks, not so much.

Something I had completely forgotten is how the endgame is handled. You're tasked to collect 9 macguffins this time instead of 12, each sprinkled throughout the overworld and the 3 dungeons. The neat thing is that they call exist in the Dark version of the world. You're given clues as the Room names in the Light world, so you have to cross reference the "Light" world map to the "Dark" world map to set your objective, THEN you have to map out your route because the exits and layouts across the worlds are not one for one. I had a blast going back to the dungeons with all of the endgame abilities. In fact, my favorite moment of this playthrough was a completely option puzzle. I had acquired a new verb that changed the way I read the layout of the room, I noticed something I could engage with, and worked out the puzzle. This is when Metroid Prime is at its best. It slowly grants you new verbs that alter the way you read the world. Often, it's this evolving engagement with the playspace that is the true reward for exploring than the pick-ups.

Minor complaints:
-enemies still respawn way too soon, perhaps not upon exiting the room, but close to it. You'll hear the annoying "Pirate Combat" theme over and over and over again, but thankfully the times the game forces you to engage in battle before you can reach an exit are super rare
-clearly a design choice: I found it annoying that you had to re-watch the stationary teleporters turn on every single time you used them. You can easily activate the portals, I don't see why they didn't give the larger exits the same treatment
-Prime 2 does a poorer job of tutorializing some of its toggleable items that are important in exploration. I got stuck early on b/c I had forgotten about the utility of the Dark Visor. That said, the game still retains the hint system from the first game, but I definitely felt its presence far less this time around. Almost as if the game is encouraging you to figure things out for yourself. I.E. the game won't tell you where to go should you be blind to the next logical route, it just points to the more obvious "boss" or "treasure" rooms

TLDR: I think I love Prime 2 b/c it's one of those rare sequels that not just gives more to the player, but it asks more from the player too. The map is more complex, the level design is more compact, but has greater layers. It challenges you to think about the playspace across two timelines, and rewards you continually as you acquire new methods with which to engage with the playspace. Definitely one of my favorite games and one whose design philosophy I will be keeping in mind should I take a stab at developing a game of my own

Questions I will be keeping in mind for Prime 3:
-did they give more love to the screw attack, its use is pretty limited in Prime 2
-what were the goals for the level/world design
-is there more "story" / "narrative" that obstructs gameplay?

 

[The Dutch Ghost]

-did they give more love to the screw attack, its use is pretty limited in Prime 2

As a way to move around? Somewhat. I think it is on par with its use in Prime 2.
As a means to attack? No.

-is there more "story" / "narrative" that obstructs gameplay?

Oh, I really think you are not going to like Prime 3 as it is probably the most 'cinematic' of the three main games.

 

[Louis_Cypher]

I haven't updated this thread in a while, but there is hardly any Metroid news to report that people don't already know.

• After the sales success of the Metroid Prime 1 remaster on Switch, there is rumors of Metroid Prime 2 next year.
• There are rumors swirling around for a Metroid Prime 4 release in 2024, but I don't put much stock into them.

Wonder where Metroid Prime 4 would come in the timeline?

 

[The Dutch Ghost]

I haven't updated this thread in a while, but there is hardly any Metroid news to report that people don't already know.

• After the sales success of the Metroid Prime 1 remaster on Switch, there is rumors of Metroid Prime 2 next year.
• There are rumors swirling around for a Metroid Prime 4 release in 2024, but I don't put much stock into them.

Wonder where Metroid Prime 4 would come in the timeline?

Nice!

Well I assume between MP3 and Metroid Samus Returns, building on the secret ending of MP3. I don't think the developers will move post Dread. Not even sure if they are allowed.

 

[lightbane]

Dread pretty much locked the franchise story-wise by making Samus way too OP. Besides prequels and interquels, it's hard to justify her losing her stuff AGAIN when now she got fancy tricks that do not depend on her suit (and she killed all of the major big bads of the setting).
Perhaps yet another alien species depower her remotely upon stepping into a trap tile?
One thing they could try would be to have her start with most of her arsenal, but then for plot reasons force Samus to switch to a limited selection of abilities/gear she can mix-and-match at certain locations, as well as unlocking new ones, kind of like that Zelda game for the 3DS where you could swap Tools at will.

 

[Elthosian]

Dread pretty much locked the franchise story-wise by making Samus way too OP. Besides prequels and interquels, it's hard to justify her losing her stuff AGAIN when now she got fancy tricks that do not depend on her suit (and she killed all of the major big bads of the setting).
Perhaps yet another alien species depower her remotely upon stepping into a trap tile?
One thing they could try would be to have her start with most of her arsenal, but then for plot reasons force Samus to switch to a limited selection of abilities/gear she can mix-and-match at certain locations, as well as unlocking new ones, kind of like that Zelda game for the 3DS where you could swap Tools at will.

You can be fucking sure they will depower her again, and I don’t really care. After spending almost 20 years with this series I can’t say I care about the plot and honestly prefer entries where it’s very low key like Super Metroid and Prime/Prime 2. Fusion is the only heavy plot I enjoyed. Anyway, as I said, some of them are very engaging individually but they have can hardly be put together to create an interesting whole.

Speaking of which, obligatory ranking:

Metroid Prime 2 > Super Metroid > Metroid Prime > Metroid: Zero Mission > Metroid > Metroid Prime 3 > Metroid Fusion = Metroid Dread >>>>> Hunters > Other M.

If it comes to level design only, then Super Metroid, ZM and original Metroid would move up to the top with the rest of games keeping their relative position.

Btw, I like Dread and Fusion but the funneled progression hurts a bit. Still 7+/10 games I got a lot of fun out it.

PS: haven’t tried/finished neither 2 nor the official nor the fan remake, but will probably do AM2R this year.

 

[lightbane]

I finished the fan-remake of 2. MUCH better than the official version, which I found a pain to play due its awkward controls. I recommend the fanmade one.

 

[Elthosian]

I finished the fan-remake of 2. MUCH better than the official version, which I found a pain to play due its awkward controls. I recommend the fanmade one.

Yeah, I tried it years ago and from what I played it was extremely non-linear despite being constrained to the kill X Metroids gating. Dunno why Gastrick rated it that low compared to others

 

[The Dutch Ghost]

Dread pretty much locked the franchise story-wise by making Samus way too OP. Besides prequels and interquels, it's hard to justify her losing her stuff AGAIN when now she got fancy tricks that do not depend on her suit (and she killed all of the major big bads of the setting).
Perhaps yet another alien species depower her remotely upon stepping into a trap tile?
One thing they could try would be to have her start with most of her arsenal, but then for plot reasons force Samus to switch to a limited selection of abilities/gear she can mix-and-match at certain locations, as well as unlocking new ones, kind of like that Zelda game for the 3DS where you could swap Tools at will.

Well one suggestion that has been mentioned by fans is that a new character takes center stage with Samus taking more of a backseat/mentor role. And most of the major bads are now dead. Ten to fifteen years ago Nintendo could still have done the 'evil' faction within the Federation as antagonists but I think it is too late for that. And I am not sold on an evil Chozo faction as the main antagonists for the next couple of games as evil brothers of the ancients is such a tired trope. Same goes for the X parasites, the idea so far has been that if these things break containment and spread that it is basically over for galactic civilization. I guess that leaves evil mystery aliens from outside.

As for limiting her starting arsenal. The original Prime 2 had this idea of jamming or inhibitor fields that prevent certain tech from functioning in select areas until the player tracked down the field generators and destroyed them. I myself had this idea that Samus now had to collect special DNA to mutate the organic parts of her suit to be suitable for certain areas and that this would also affect her skills. Selecting one collected genetic code making her more agile but weaker. Another making her more armored but slower. More powerful weapon shots but at the cost of spending health.

Btw, I like Dread and Fusion but the funneled progression hurts a bit. Still 7+/10 games I got a lot of fun out it.

I think this hampers both games' replayability. I used to pick up MZM whenever I was in the mood for a quick Metroid experience.

I finished the fan-remake of 2. MUCH better than the official version, which I found a pain to play due its awkward controls. I recommend the fanmade one.

I did not like the forced melee attack or having to switch between the regular beams and the ice beam constantly.

 

[Elthosian]

Sadly, nothing else in the Metroidvania genre comes close to Super Metroid

Hollow Knight

And Rain World. I might go as far as saying RW reaches the heights of Super Metroid’s level design and free exploration but I have to finish it to make a more objective assessment.

Hollow Knight though, what a fucking gem. It lacks some of the skill-based sequence breaking, but it’s still too open for a game released this century.

 

[L'ennui]

Just replayed a bit of Metroid Prime, mostly as a way to test emulation on a new Xbox. Man, that game really holds up even today.

 

[Louis_Cypher]

Has anyone played "Aliens: Infestation" for the Nintendo DS?

As I understand it, they made a Metroid game out of Aliens.

It's on my play next list. Metroid owes a lot to Aliens.