Might and Magic Might & Magic X Pre-Release Thread

[theSavant]

I don't think so. It was NOT written "Leaving a *shop* places you on a square-grid map", but "leaving a *town* places you on a square-grid map". That means a town is not integrated into the square-grid map, and therefore not a place, where you can navigate. In fact we have now this hint from strategyinformer and the one from the french preview - which both say the same. Don't want to crush dreams, but we have it black on white on 2 different places.
The third hint is: the utterly dumbed down interface, classes, overall presentation... it would just fit to it.

If I am wrong then both previewers have written their text utterly stupid.

 

[Broseph]

I don't think so.It was NOT written "Leaving a *shop* places you on a square-grid map", but "leaving a *town* places you on a square-grid map". That means a town is not something where you can navigate. In fact we have now this hint from strategyinformer and the one from the french preview - which both say the same. Don't want to crush dreams, but we have it black on white on 2 different places.

That could just mean that towns have separate maps from the overworld, like the 2D games.

 

[J_C]

I don't think so.It was NOT written "Leaving a *shop* places you on a square-grid map", but "leaving a *town* places you on a square-grid map". That means a town is not something where you can navigate. In fact we have now this hint from strategyinformer and the one from the french preview - which both say the same. Don't want to crush dreams, but we have it black on white on 2 different places.

That could just mean that towns have separate maps from the overworld, like the 2D games.

Yes, I think (hope) that on the overworld grid, there is a small town "portrait" which you have to click on. This takes you another grid, which is the town itself. So you have to enter and exit the town not just roam into it.

 

[Black_Willow]

I'm not so sure there will even be an audience for this on consoles though.

If there is an audience for Wizardry on consoles (it's niche but it's there), then I assume there is an audience for Might and Magic too.

There's a plethora of Japanese console-only Wizardry games, and the series is well known in Japan as good old school RPGs.

 

[RK47]

Sales target anyone?

 

[theSavant]

Yes, I think (hope) that on the overworld grid, there is a small town "portrait" which you have to click on. This takes you another grid, which is the town itself. So you have to enter and exit the town not just roam into it.

Hmmm, that could be the case, and would also make sense on how these previewers wrote their (weird) phrases e.g. "temples show as static screens". It would be very strange if a full temple was only a static screen. Btw., remembers me of Lands of Lore 2 which was also in 3D, but many places still had this picture as an entrance for subsections. Nice oldschool feature.

(I was not so sure though, because if you remember the HoMM6 demo, they completely removed the town-view and replaced it with a cheap 2D picture. So Ubisoft often "rationalizes" and you never know...).

 

[Dorateen]

Good grief. D.W. Bradley's Wizards & Warriors had towns that were static screens, clicking on locations of interest. And the Gold Box games introduced "utility" towns on their overland maps that had Inns, temples, training halls, and taverns.

Yes, this is a Might & Magic game and should have some standards. But it's not the end of the world.

 

[hoverdog]

Betrayal At Krondor also had its (bigger) towns as static images with points of interest to click on, and no one complained. In fact, it's sometimes a better way to simulate large cities than creating them in full - which means whole 10 civilian houses and a few shops and taverns.

 

[theSavant]

Good grief. D.W. Bradley's Wizards & Warriors had towns that were static screens, clicking on locations of interest. And the Gold Box games introduced "utility" towns on their overland maps that had Inns, temples, training halls, and taverns.

Yes, this is a Might & Magic game and should have some standards. But it's not the end of the world.

True, true. However in Wizards & Warriors you never felt being at a safe spot, the town didn't give any "homey" feeling at all, because - well - it was just a picture and you were outside this picture... and couldn't get "in"... Once you were out of this town you just saw barred doors, nothing more. Always barred doors. Basically you had the feeling of always being outside in the wild, nowhere to rest safely

 

[narupley]

I posted this on the Ubi forums regarding that preview:

First, unless I'm mistaken, no Might & Magic game has ever had a single static picture for an entire town. They have static pictures for individual shops and houses within the town, and that's exactly what I would have expected from this game. If instead entire towns are condensed into a single static background/menu, that is SEVERELY breaking down one of the major exploration / open-world aspects of the series. Make me look for the guild of fire, or the apothecary, or whatever else. Put secret doors on the not-often-noticed second floors of buildings. Force me to wait until I can fly/levitate in order to get certain places. Let monsters invade the town, and let me either defend the peasants or watch it all crash and burn. Do some real town planning, with a central market/hub, alcoves for aristocrats, and other miscellaneous suburbs like the houses near the Temple of the Moon in Free Haven. That is a major part of what Might & Magic is all about.

Limbic / Ubisoft, let me put it to you this way: If what was said in this preview is actually true, you might as well change the title, because there's no way it upholds the Might & Magic legacy.

P.S.: One other thing, please put a flee option in as well, I know melee-locking was in earlier games, but the ability to run away if need be (while still getting pelted by arrows/spells mind you) was a major step forward in MMVI+.

 

[HobGoblin42]

By the way, good ol' Phantasie introduced those 2D interface-only cities for the first time (afaik):

And this was at a time, when Ultima already had walkable villages with shops and NPCs ! This is just one example how incredible ambitious Lord British has been.

 

[Grunker]

Betrayal At Krondor also had its (bigger) towns as static images with points of interest to click on, and no one complained. In fact, it's sometimes a better way to simulate large cities than creating them in full - which means whole 10 civilian houses and a few shops and taverns.

The point about exploration still stands. Finding the right trainers in cities felt very rewarding in M&M7, for example. Or other goodies in the full-fledged cities.

I have no problem with 2D cities at all, I'm just questioning the need for trainers if they're just going to be part of the windows

 

[Excidium]

Betrayal At Krondor also had its (bigger) towns as static images with points of interest to click on, and no one complained. In fact, it's sometimes a better way to simulate large cities than creating them in full - which means whole 10 civilian houses and a few shops and taverns.

The point about exploration still stands. Finding the right trainers in cities felt very rewarding in M&M7, for example. Or other goodies in the full-fledged cities.

Yes, I think it's the way it's meant to be for a Might and Magic game.

 

[narupley]

Betrayal At Krondor also had its (bigger) towns as static images with points of interest to click on, and no one complained. In fact, it's sometimes a better way to simulate large cities than creating them in full - which means whole 10 civilian houses and a few shops and taverns.

The point about exploration still stands. Finding the right trainers in cities felt very rewarding in M&M7, for example. Or other goodies in the full-fledged cities.

Yes, I think it's the way it's meant to be for a Might and Magic game.

Agreed. I think we all understand that a M&M town obviously isn't going to be representative of a real town as far as the sheer complexity or number of buildings/people goes, so the "why build a whole town when it's not going to mirror reality perfectly" argument is moot. We're not asking for hyper-reality/detail, we're asking for a M&M game. And exploring / searching throughout a town is certainly the way it's meant to be.

 

[Mortmal]

Might and Magic 3-5 had SNES ports that controlled almost identically to the PC version AFAIK. Might and Magic isn't so complex that it can't be ported to consoles.

Yes might and magic games never been complex, they are good games i played them all, but its not as sophisticated than wizardry wich got excellent console ports as well . I understand the complaint about the wallz in grimrock, but i cant say might and magic did much better, especially not after world of xeen, 6-7-8 was sometime playing like shooter with pause,especially in 8 with its overpowered dragon party member .

 

[octavius]

Betrayal At Krondor also had its (bigger) towns as static images with points of interest to click on, and no one complained. In fact, it's sometimes a better way to simulate large cities than creating them in full - which means whole 10 civilian houses and a few shops and taverns.

I agree completely.
Few things are more tedious than walking around in huge, mostly empty cities looking for a few places of interest. I quit both Magic Candle 2 and Disciples of Steel due to this.

The towns in M&M were always interesting to explore, though.

 

[Grunker]

^ and that's pretty much the gist of it, ain't it?

 

[Cyberarmy]

I don't really mind static town screens, if done properly and as long as game is open world with full'o adventures like they said. But Heroes 6 s town screens were medicore at best which done by same developer.
Also I don't really trust those previews, most of them sound clueless and never played a blobber before. Maybe something getting lost in translation.

- In terms of life, Might and Magic X s should extend over fifteen hours of play

Gameplay was 25 hours before and now it is 15 o_O? Main quest only methinks.

- Cities, temples and armories are in the form of static screens.

So temples and armories are out of cities?


And €20 is good if it is actually a decent blober with some replatability. I hope classes differ some, I'll be dissapointed if there is only 1-2 skill difference after picking a race.

 

[Kem0sabe]

Also I don't really trust those previews, most of them sound clueless and never played a blobber before. Maybe something getting lost in translation.

Considering this developers pedigree, i would trust Kotaku (not really) more than i would them in terms of gameplay. Remember that they have been making mediocre games for 10 years now, it's not something new, it's what they do.

If they won't do an extended demo there is no way i'm buying this, much less pre-order. Heck... i might even be forced to pirate it before i buy it.

 

[Cyberarmy]

There is no need to pre order this one, yet All we got is some not very reliable info and a very basic gameplay video. If I know Ubisoft, we will get best and true info only after the game is released.

 

[Krraloth]

The wording of the previews is strange at best, somehow I doubt anyone can extract data from that messy way of writing.
I salute Sceptic and Luzur and hope they will be admitted to the VIP forum and talk sense into the devs if they can.

M&M II was my first real crpg and I really want to believe in this.

 

[Xenich]

Betrayal At Krondor also had its (bigger) towns as static images with points of interest to click on, and no one complained. In fact, it's sometimes a better way to simulate large cities than creating them in full - which means whole 10 civilian houses and a few shops and taverns.

The point about exploration still stands. Finding the right trainers in cities felt very rewarding in M&M7, for example. Or other goodies in the full-fledged cities.

Yes, I think it's the way it's meant to be for a Might and Magic game.

Agreed. I think we all understand that a M&M town obviously isn't going to be representative of a real town as far as the sheer complexity or number of buildings/people goes, so the "why build a whole town when it's not going to mirror reality perfectly" argument is moot. We're not asking for hyper-reality/detail, we're asking for a M&M game. And exploring / searching throughout a town is certainly the way it's meant to be.

Exactly, for MM searching for the right trainer was always a huge part of the game. In World of Xeen, where you could go and what you could do was initially limited by what skills you had trained. You had to go out and explore in limited fashion (no swimming across rivers, climbing mountains or entering forests) without the associated skill which was in other towns and locations. It wasn't just that the skills were important, it was that you had to seek them out and obtain them. If that has been removed or "simplified" in this game, well... it isn't just a lack of feature, it is missing the entire point of game play.

 

[Luzur]

I posted this on the Ubi forums regarding that preview:

First, unless I'm mistaken, no Might & Magic game has ever had a single static picture for an entire town. They have static pictures for individual shops and houses within the town, and that's exactly what I would have expected from this game. If instead entire towns are condensed into a single static background/menu, that is SEVERELY breaking down one of the major exploration / open-world aspects of the series. Make me look for the guild of fire, or the apothecary, or whatever else. Put secret doors on the not-often-noticed second floors of buildings. Force me to wait until I can fly/levitate in order to get certain places. Let monsters invade the town, and let me either defend the peasants or watch it all crash and burn. Do some real town planning, with a central market/hub, alcoves for aristocrats, and other miscellaneous suburbs like the houses near the Temple of the Moon in Free Haven. That is a major part of what Might & Magic is all about.

Limbic / Ubisoft, let me put it to you this way: If what was said in this preview is actually true, you might as well change the title, because there's no way it upholds the Might & Magic legacy.

P.S.: One other thing, please put a flee option in as well, I know melee-locking was in earlier games, but the ability to run away if need be (while still getting pelted by arrows/spells mind you) was a major step forward in MMVI+.

looks good to me, was there any response?

 

[narupley]

I posted this on the Ubi forums regarding that preview:

First, unless I'm mistaken, no Might & Magic game has ever had a single static picture for an entire town. They have static pictures for individual shops and houses within the town, and that's exactly what I would have expected from this game. If instead entire towns are condensed into a single static background/menu, that is SEVERELY breaking down one of the major exploration / open-world aspects of the series. Make me look for the guild of fire, or the apothecary, or whatever else. Put secret doors on the not-often-noticed second floors of buildings. Force me to wait until I can fly/levitate in order to get certain places. Let monsters invade the town, and let me either defend the peasants or watch it all crash and burn. Do some real town planning, with a central market/hub, alcoves for aristocrats, and other miscellaneous suburbs like the houses near the Temple of the Moon in Free Haven. That is a major part of what Might & Magic is all about.

Limbic / Ubisoft, let me put it to you this way: If what was said in this preview is actually true, you might as well change the title, because there's no way it upholds the Might & Magic legacy.

P.S.: One other thing, please put a flee option in as well, I know melee-locking was in earlier games, but the ability to run away if need be (while still getting pelted by arrows/spells mind you) was a major step forward in MMVI+.

looks good to me, was there any response?

Well, just a few people stating that it's probably more likely that the preview was poorly written than it is likely that the static town rumour is actually true. http://forums.ubi.com/showthread.php/765166-Limbic-Please-tell-me-this-preview-is-not-true

 

[theSavant]

Hmm... the ubisoft thread looks quite desolated, although someone stated that the developers read this forum. I don't know if we'll get an official answer from there...