Pathfinder Pathfinder: Kingmaker - Enhanced Plus Edition - now with turn-based combat

[Desiderius]

Question for peeps who played this for +1,5k hours: would a playthrough without a dedicated healer/buffer be very painful?

It’s not worth it. Cleric is a strong class. Don’t dedicate it to healing/buffing. In-combat healing is poor action economy. Your main contribution is either offensive spell-casting or wrecking house with weapons, sometimes both.

 

[Desiderius]

worth speccing into longswords for perfection?

I have yet to find a decent one, let alone good one, prior to Pitax. So, no.

 

[razvedchiki]

so if someone makes tristan a theurge is it ok to take a cleric merc for that sweet archons aura?

 

[Desiderius]

so if someone makes tristan a theurge is it ok to take a cleric merc for that sweet archons aura?

No. Get to level six on Tristian before going Theurge. In general mercs are bad. You have the tools you need.

 

[razvedchiki]

I have yet to find a decent one, let alone good one, prior to Pitax. So, no.

using the craft mod to craft some of my own?

 

[Delterius]

buff mercs, i want my custom party of cooler edgelordy peeps

 

[Daidre]

so if someone makes tristan a theurge is it ok to take a cleric merc for that sweet archons aura?

Properly built melee-capable cleric - area where both Tristian and Harrim are lacking - could easily complement Mystic Theurge in the party. Pet from Animal Domain, reach weapon, teamwork feats, spontaneous summons from Herald Caller... there are lot of flavors.

 

[razvedchiki]

its just one merc

 

[Desiderius]

its just one merc

Use all the mercs you like, you just don’t need one to have Aura up.

 

[Desiderius]

so if someone makes tristan a theurge is it ok to take a cleric merc for that sweet archons aura?

Properly built melee-capable cleric - area where both Tristian and Harrim are lacking - could easily complement Mystic Theurge in the party. Pet from Animal Domain, reach weapon, teamwork feats, spontaneous summons from Herald Caller... there are lot of flavors.

Meh. Harrim isn’t optimized for pure DPS but he’s not lacking in melee by any reasonable measure. You don’t need max DPS in every slot. I’ve even had him doing DPS with his Companion Quest Urgrosh (two-bladed weapons work well with Enlarge/Lead Blades) late game using Freebooter (Booter 10/Cleric 8) Combat Style to get to seven base attacks but that’s really over the top.

 

[Desiderius]

I have yet to find a decent one, let alone good one, prior to Pitax. So, no.

using the craft mod to craft some of my own?

Just think you’re making it harder than you need to. If you want to use Perfection late, sure go for it. I play unmodded for now.

 

[Daidre]

Harrim isn’t optimized for pure DPS but he’s not lacking in melee by any reasonable measure.

Are you trying to reason that
STR 14
DEX 8
CON 16
Cleric with Chaos and Destruction domains are some underappreciated Titan of Melee Might?

I mean, I can make it work, you can make it work, but there are lot of shades between Serviceable and Excellent and lot of room for improvement.

 

[ArchAngel]

Question for peeps who played this for +1,5k hours: would a playthrough without a dedicated healer/buffer be very painful?

In early game ch 1-2 - yes, Channeling, Heals and Communal Resist Energy/Delay Poison spells are very useful and replacing them scrolls + potions is too costly. Having one full divine caster (Cleric/Druid) is really nice and convenient.

Later, even hybrids like Alchemist, Bard and Inquisitor could cover party healing/buffing needs and combine it with some decent CC/Offence, without being buff-bots.

You can make do with scrolls if you got good tanking party and don't take lots of damage. It will cost a bit yes. The bigger problem is once you hit Womb and later and all up to when your capital gets upgraded and you get access to Heal and Mass Heal scrolls.
This part of the game is biggest pain because you will run out of scrolls and other healing sources. You will need to go back to capital all the time to do any bigger healing (which is not a big problem once you get teleporters everywhere but that can be a while as well).
Inquisitor or Bard can be a help with healing, alchemist is a shame as he got too many good buffs for the whole party.

 

[razvedchiki]

desiderius uses tristan to melee

 

[razvedchiki]

also in order to hit rank 4 in loyalty/community should i

- take the random stat nodes in my kingdom?
- build shit that add to the stats?(im avoiding bulding much this time to have at least 700k when i hit the tournament for that sweet sweet ring and all those +4 +5 shit).

 

[Desiderius]

Harrim isn’t optimized for pure DPS but he’s not lacking in melee by any reasonable measure.

Are you trying to reason that
STR 14
DEX 8
CON 16
Cleric with Chaos and Destruction domains are some underappreciated Titan of Melee Might?

I mean, I can make it work, you can make it work, but there are lot of shades between Serviceable and Excellent and lot of room for improvement.

The difference between 18 STR and 14 STR is +2 to hit and +2 damage. For better or for worse that's chicken feed in this game. DEX is falling off trees too so you get to 12 which is all he needs with Heavy.

And yes Chaos and Destruction are both off the chain. Touch is no save -5 on everything on average and Destructive Aura is a huge damage boost if you're playing right, certainly way more impactful than a few STR here or there.

+4 AC vs Giants and + 4 Saves vs Spells. Yeah, he's just fine in the middle of melee Fearing shit or whatever. Maybe I'm spoiled by Preacher's Warhammer showing up early each of my last three games.

 

[Daidre]

Touch is no save -5 on everything on average and Destructive Aura is a huge damage boost if you're playing right, certainly way more impactful than a few STR here or there.

I am just not a kind a player that spends cleric's turn to... touch someone in melee with a 8 DEX cleric for a single target debuff. And Destructive Aura affects your own party so... no, thanks.

What I do like though is 13 DEX to get Precise Strike Team Feat early on all my meeles.

 

[Desiderius]

Touch is no save -5 on everything on average and Destructive Aura is a huge damage boost if you're playing right, certainly way more impactful than a few STR here or there.

I am just not a kind a player that spends cleric's turn to... touch someone in melee with a 8 DEX cleric for a single target debuff. And Destructive Aura affects your own party so... no, thanks.

What I do like though is 13 DEX to get Precise Strike Team Feat early on all my meeles.

Destructive Aura -> if you're getting hit you're already losing. Melee Touch attacks use STR. Try it and look at the combat log, you hardly ever miss. If you'd take a second to do the math you'd see what a difference making a boss reroll everything (i.e. both saves and attacks) makes, especially for a tank. 5% becomes .25%, 1/400 crit becomes 1/16,000. 8 DEX would matter if the game weren't giving out stat boosts like candy. You're still playing PnP.

Precise Strike = 3.5 conditional damage. Don't know what to tell you. You're profoundly outgunned. Not by me, by the other options.

 

[Daidre]

If you want to melee touch bosses, instead of, I do not know, Vinetrap/Chain of Light'ing them it is your right, don't let me change your mind.

 

[Delterius]

How stable is the eldritch arcana mod?

 

[Desiderius]

If you want to melee touch bosses, instead of, I do not know, Vinetrap/Chain of Lighting them it is your right, don't let me change your mind.

He’s got Vinetrap too. On the difficulties I play I like letting the bosses take two rolls on that Reflex save instead of one. But yeah, if you’re focusing on casting you’re using Touch less.

It’s more of a standard action opener (combined with move into position) for melee that helps other casters get their spells to stick/prevents Harrim from getting hit. It’s almost unique in Domain abilities in that it doesn’t care at all about levels in the class that gave it to you, so it’s still fully powered if you make Harrim something completely different, like a Slayer to focus on that Urgrosh.

 

[Daidre]

How stable is the eldritch arcana mod?

Eldritch arcana updated is pretty stable, would not guarantee that every obscure trait works, but current state is top notch (new icons!).

 

[Desiderius]

desiderius uses tristan to melee

The pics are coming soon, very soon, to make all you haters rue your silly ratings. You’ll see. I think. Forgot he’s Blind late too.

If you’re running Tristian midgame STR belt + Enlarge get him to 16 and he’s still a 3/4 class. Main reason for melee is positioning for Aura/spells but he chips in with all the ridiculous two-handers in this game.

 

[Delterius]

You’ll see.

 

[Desiderius]

You’ll see.

They also serve who only stand and wait.