Pathfinder Pathfinder: Kingmaker - Enhanced Plus Edition - now with turn-based combat

[vibehunter]

It's been a while since I've played this, but I want to give it another go now that they've added in turn based mode. Apologies if this has been answered recently, but is the turn base implementation good? Or does it feel tacked on?

I just tried it myself and it's really well implemented and enjoyable. However, every encounter takes way longer, even if it's mostly trash mobs.

 

[moleman]

It's been a while since I've played this, but I want to give it another go now that they've added in turn based mode. Apologies if this has been answered recently, but is the turn base implementation good? Or does it feel tacked on?

I just tried it myself and it's really well implemented and enjoyable. However, every encounter takes way longer, even if it's mostly trash mobs.

You know that you can switch to RTwP anytime, even during combat.

 

[Desiderius]

It's been a while since I've played this, but I want to give it another go now that they've added in turn based mode. Apologies if this has been answered recently, but is the turn base implementation good? Or does it feel tacked on?

I just tried it myself and it's really well implemented and enjoyable. However, every encounter takes way longer, even if it's mostly trash mobs.

Once you adjust your playstyle to the Pathfinder ruleset this is less of an issue.

Git gud.

 

[gurugeorge]

It's been a while since I've played this, but I want to give it another go now that they've added in turn based mode. Apologies if this has been answered recently, but is the turn base implementation good? Or does it feel tacked on?

Yeah it's really good, and it's well-implemented, well-integrated, and feels nice to use.

But to get the best out of it, you really need to use the Bag of Tricks mod so you can spin the camera around and zoom in/out, and you also need to have the AI tweak mod (which I think requires Call of the Wild, and is by the same guy, "holic" something - but of course you don't have to use anything in CoTW if you don't want to, it's just a dependency), because otherwise it's way too easy because the AI out of the box is fairly simplistic and just attacks your guys who are closest to it. The proper flanking mod (the one that's also by the holic guy, not the other older one) also really livens up the turn-based mode.

What this nets you is gameplay where the mobs often (not always, but enough to keep you on your toes) make a beeline for your squishies, so your positioning is overall more important, and you have to actually position properly (on either side of a mob) for flanking bonuses, and you have the camera controls to give you the precision you need to do those things.

Then it's pretty fucking awesome.

 

[vibehunter]

It's been a while since I've played this, but I want to give it another go now that they've added in turn based mode. Apologies if this has been answered recently, but is the turn base implementation good? Or does it feel tacked on?

I just tried it myself and it's really well implemented and enjoyable. However, every encounter takes way longer, even if it's mostly trash mobs.

You know that you can switch to RTwP anytime, even during combat.

That's true, but I'm speaking from the perspective of someone who might hate RTwP and not want to touch it.

 

[LannTheStupid]

That's true, but I'm speaking from the perspective of someone who might hate RTwP and not want to touch it.

Then play another game. There are plenty of them; Colony Ship comes to mind. Or Wasteland.

Actually, the intent of some people to buy a game, and then use gazillion of mods to make another game from it, makes me long for GULAG and mass executions.

 

[NJClaw]

That's true, but I'm speaking from the perspective of someone who might hate RTwP and not want to touch it.

Then play another game. There are plenty of them; Colony Ship comes to mind. Or Wasteland.

Actually, the intent of some people to buy a game, and then use gazillion of mods to make another game from it, makes me long for GULAG and mass executions.

 

[LannTheStupid]

Well, exactly. If people are having fun by distorting an entity into something completely different then they should die quickly, but in extreme pain. And their relatives should burn alive.

P.S.: why this guy in the cartoon does not have an assault rifle? Or a flamethrower?

 

[NJClaw]

Well, exactly. If people are having fun by distorting an entity into something completely different then they should die quickly, but in extreme pain. And their relatives should burn alive.

You realize that the turn-based mode is in the game even without mods, right?

Or even the developers aren't allowed to "distort" their game?

 

[LannTheStupid]

You realize that the turn-based mode is in the game even without mods, right?

The post I was replying to was not about the turn-based mode, but about installing the whole lot of interdependent mods to make the turn based combat challenging. IMHO it was not the part of the game design.

But as I cannot persuade the Great and Wise President Putin to launch a massive nuclear strike on Italy, you are free to express your opinion. Thank you very much.

P.S.: and yes, I am absolutely sure that a person who "hates RtwP and does not want to touch it" has no business of playing any flavor of Kingmaker, including the built-in turn-based mode.

 

[Cryomancer]

Or even the developers aren't allowed to "distort" their game?

Yep. Also, many mods added things that would have been added if the devs had raised more money on KS. The most iconic example is the dhampir race which was added on the races unleashed. And the witch class on call of the wild.

I just don't get the "you should play the way that the devs intented" mindset. NWN2 is much better with spell fixes. The MOBA genre exists thanks to a WC3 mod. CS was initially a HL mod. Mods are great. The own devs of Kingmaker(OwlCat) said that they like the idea of mods.

 

[LannTheStupid]

I just don't get the "you should play the way that the devs intented" mindset.

And I don't get the mindset "I am using the game I bought (or stole) as the draft of the game I really want to play". Play the game that suits your requirements; there are so many of them.

 

[vibehunter]

...but about installing the whole lot of interdependent mods to make the turn based combat challenging.

Great idea, I'll do that now.

 

[Max Damage]

Imagine being vanilla purist about Kingmaker of all the games, where you can't even dismiss your AoEs and shit like Kineticist exists

 

[NJClaw]

I just don't get the "you should play the way that the devs intented" mindset.

And I don't get the mindset "I am using the game I bought (or stole) as the draft of the game I really want to play". Play the game that suits your requirements; there are so many of them.

Yeah, there are so many semi-faithful turn-based 3.x videogames out there. It's unreal, you can't move one step without stumbling upon one. There's The Temple of Elemental Evil, Knights of the Chalice 2, and... Dungeons & Dragons Tactics for the PSP. Definitely enough for an entire lifetime! Oh, wait: there's also the magnificent Pool of Radiance: Ruins of Myth Drannor! Really a cornucopia of possibilities!

But you're right, people should just play these four games forever without ever trying anything new, because it's actually illegal to enjoy videogames.

You really are one odd individual, Lann. Why do you hate people having fun so much?

 

[Nikanuur]

are you sure your other 5 attacks get lost?

Sadly, yes. No shots the first round, only one shot the second round while even being hasted. I had definitely clicked on the usual Ki Pool powers (more attacks, more strenght...) after which the ZA can still make a full round attack. I hope I didn't click anything more after that. I don't remember now tbh, I was tired after two hours of respecing with many options, so I've given up. I'll do some more experiments, and I'll let you know.

 

[Cryomancer]

t "I am using the game I bought (or stole) as the draft of the game I really want to play". P

Nope. Is more like "I really loved Pathfinder Kingmaker, but wish that I could play as a dhampir witch, ohh wait, someone modded it into the game, lets try after I finish my run". I prefer to play firstly vanilla and then mod the game on my second if not third run, but if someone wanna to play for the first time with call of the wild + races unleashed, how it affects me?

Knights of the Chalice 2,

KoTC is not that purist. For example, Warlocks and Sorcerers are completely different than the 3E base classes. Wiz specialization works differently, however, purists would hate it

"KotC 2 is much more than a CRPG. It is also a powerful, user-friendly set of tools for creating new and exciting OGL 3.5 CRPGs easily. You can create a stand-alone adventure, or you can allow your module to use the Saved Games of a previous module," https://www.heroicfantasygames.com/FWE/Pages/FWE_Features.htm

Just imagine people making Dark Sun : Shattered Lands and Dark Sun : Wake of the Ravager in KoTC2 engine.

 

[deuxhero]

I just don't get the "you should play the way that the devs intented" mindset. NWN2 is much better with spell fixes. The MOBA genre exists thanks to a WC3 mod. CS was initially a HL mod. Mods are great. The own devs of Kingmaker(OwlCat) said that they like the idea of mods.

I think it has merit that people should play a game with no mods (other than the unofficial patchs) for a first playthrough so you know what the base game is like and know how much the mods add. Doesn't need to be a full playthrough pure, just a chunk of it.

 

[Pink Eye]

I just don't get the "you should play the way that the devs intented" mindset.

And I don't get the mindset "I am using the game I bought (or stole) as the draft of the game I really want to play". Play the game that suits your requirements; there are so many of them.

Yeah, there are so many semi-faithful turn-based 3.x videogames out there. It's unreal, you can't move one step without stumbling upon one. There's The Temple of Elemental Evil, Knights of the Chalice 2, and... Dungeons & Dragons Tactics for the PSP. Definitely enough for an entire lifetime! Oh, wait: there's also the magnificent Pool of Radiance: Ruins of Myth Drannor! Really a cornucopia of possibilities!

But you're right, people should just play these four games forever without ever trying anything new, because it's actually illegal to enjoy videogames.

You really are one odd individual, Lann. Why do you hate people having fun so much?

And NWN 2. You forgot Neverwinter Nights 2. Great game, should go play it, if you haven't.

 

[NJClaw]

And NWN 2. You forgot Neverwinter Nights 2. Great game, should go play it, if you haven't.

I don't remember NWN 2 being turn-based. But, honestly, I barely remember anything about that game, so it's definitely possible.

 

[Pink Eye]

Neverwinter Nights 2 had a mod that allowed it to be played in Turn Based. If we're counting Kingmaker with the mod, then we're counting this too

 

[blachan]

Skip NWN2 and play MoTB straight away tbh.

 

[NJClaw]

Neverwinter Nights 2 had a mod that allowed it to be played in Turn Based. If we're counting Kingmaker with the mod, then we're counting this too

But... Lann's point was exactly that using mods is a crime against everything that's sacred, and that you should play only games designed exactly how you want them to be. "You don't need to play Kingmaker with its native turn-based mode because you can play NWN2 with a mod" doesn't sound like a great point.

Anyway, I didn't know about the existence of that mod. I will definitely give it a try in the future, maybe this time I won't drop the game before reaching Neverwinter.

 

[Pink Eye]

>You don't need to play Kingmaker with its native turn-based mode because you can play NWN2 with a mod" doesn't sound like a great point.
I thought we were listing turn based games that use the 3.x ruleset. Come to think of it, I can't think of any that come to mind besides the aforementioned games.

 

[LannTheStupid]

I am just drawing a line. If a person installs several (meaning more than 1) interdependent mods that change (meaning add, modify or delete) more than 10-20% of the game features, and the person thinks this set of mods is obligatory - then the person is playing a wrong game.

There could be huge content-heavy mods that are implemented as a standalone addition; so they can be uninstalled by 1 click and (in the best case) do not even make the saves incompatible. This is barely acceptable. If such a package has to be built by the player from scratch, adding mods separately and making sure the load order is correct, and it has to be done every time s/he wants to install the game - then, well, quit having fun and die, please.

Unfortunately, this is just my opinion which cannot be enforced; but at least I can call them names and have fun.